Topic: Capitalism vs. Socialism - Make your argument here. - page 5. (Read 21337 times)

capitalism works for the capitalists,

those that are in the core of the system (central bank) always win because they just invest.

regards

Capitalism is pourly base on profits maximizing and at that ownership is in the central door way of capitalism. This economic system is base on private ownership but the state playing the regulation role and at the same time go into state overall ownership of all property but leaving it in the hands on individuals. But socialism on the other hand is full ownership of means of production by the state.

Especially ownership of property. Without that there is nowhere to build anything. You can't even plant your own food without owning your own property.

Capitalism isn't really about working hard, its about ownership.  That is the real path to obtaining wealth.  Working for a salary will never compete with capital.  Money makes money faster than you can even spend it.

i support both in some context. i think every single human being has right to get food, shelter, education and health related facilities but one who is working hard and giving day and night to work should get more money, more perks and privileges and better standard of life.

You aren't arguing for logical and logistics based reasons for Communism and Socialism. Your arguments as always rely completely upon emotionally based moralizing where all of your preferred ideologies are superior, moral, and good, of course only ever defined in the contrarian context of the inferior, immoral, evil Capitalism. Much like the Democrat party has zero platform except "Orange Man Bad!", Communists have one mantra "Capitalism Bad!" and of course by comparison of course "Communism Good!". Any time an analysis of the actual results of your insane ideology are examined even superficially your facade crumbles under the weight of ITS OWN contradictions. Communism is insane and is the preferred ideology of mentally ill people who think they are helping people when they are actually working to enslave them even further.

No its more about the power dynamic.  If the US was socialist, capitalist countries would not be able to assert their will over it because of the military power.  Obviously nothing works when it is crushed.  Whoever has the bigger stick gets to right the rules but that doesn't mean might is right.  Being decent towards other people's lives is not an impossible to meet standard and 100 years from now, people will probably look back on today and wonder how the world could have been so savage.

How evolved you have become! You are capable of having retarded delusions without being offended when they are challenged. MUCH SUPREMACY!

Your logic allows you to believe that ideology has no effect over these individuals, because you prefer to claim any positive aspects and disown any negative aspects of the ideologies you propagandize. I don't know how to help you realize ideology is the basis for all actions. Again, everything bad is the fault of capitalism, and everything good is socialism. Lets just ignore that socialism creates all of the factors needed for a dictatorship to take control. There are never socialist nations formed without other capitalist nations existing, therefore your analogy is bullshit because in order for it to be valid would require the total removal of capitalism globally in order for you to call socialism socialism. All you have done is told us that socialism requires impossible to meet standards in order to function.

I used to get offended but other topics have made me realize where this misconception comes from.  The same logic that allows  you to think a person calling themselves muslim and killing people makes islam bad also allows you to think this sort of thing makes socialism bad. 

I don't know how to help you understand that individual actions and ideology are not the same thing.

You need to understand that DPRK is not a product of natural 'degradation' but rather a direct creation from outside interference.  The PRK was the original, socialist government before the US murdered most of the leadership.   Some of them escaped to the north and the USSR coopted their movement and created the DPRK as a combative, oppressive counter against American/capitalist aggression. 

All you have done is told us that socialism doesn't work with capitalist interference or cooption.

Portland used to be a really nice place until socialism took over.


Collapse: Leftists have taken over Portland, Oregon, as cops are no longer responding to calls

And they can't. First thing that happens when socialists get the power, is dictate rules for everyone else to follow. No they don't ask everyone, and even if they do, the "minority" is irrelevant. Social struggle is their belief, not peaceful resolution as done in a free market society with every transaction...

A small group ends "leading". Its a natural transition from the communist party organization, they don't believe masses can "do revolution" without leaders, they HAVE to lead. And once they get into power, this thinking remains and is put in motion nationwide.

Which is how you end with, all the "failed" attempts in human history...

Yes, they would give you this fake rhetoric/facade: "power to the people", but we the people will follow our loved great leader... They "replace" the wealthy group they accuse of everything, and after taking all their possessions by force (sometimes distribute a bit but keep the best for them) take their place as the leading "nomenclature" or party officials or revolutionary whatever. And it always degrades into something resembling a monarchy, just look at north Korea: hereditary leadership like the absolute monarchies of the past (who ruled from that very city of Pyongyang).

They call themselves social scientists, and yet neglect to see that repeating the same experiment, again, and again and again produces the same results. When are they ever going to give up? Theory does not produce results, and practice has always shown the opposite results to what they promise.

They don't blame socialism, they blame the corruption. Oh, lets conveniently forget how corruption is instigated by their system, ok, they never experienced it beyond their own thinking, that is why they make such comments. Let them try socialism somewhere, and NOTHING they do can't prevent it from degrading into, the same thing the rest of humanity degraded into when they tried...

IT DOES NOT WORK.

You always end with something worse than what you had. Humans won't act like machines even with your enforced rules, they won't ever fit in your theories, people don't act that way.

In the US, the collective makes decisions by voting for their representatives. Everyone who votes for a particular person into office knows that these people follow the regulatory bodies that have been established for certain areas. In the medical area, representatives are expected to trust the medical establishment through the HHS and underlying agencies (these include things like FDA, CDCP, and others).

Since these things are run by humans you can expect human interference.

And what's to say people make good decisions as a collective? Why should anyone get to decide what medicines are legal for an unrelated third party to take? Especially when doctors might support giving it, even though the public has still voted to keep it illegal?

Experts in the field would still be able to write policy.  They just wouldn't be able to pass it without consent of the people. The people have full experience living under the laws so they can listen to expert opinion and make their own decision.

When you go to a doctor, they usually tell you the options and their expert opinion but ultimately you get to decide on the path of care.  That is what we are talking about here.

Why should the masses with no experience get to determine policy? Wouldn't policy better be determined by experts in a field? Should medical doctors write laws on oil and gas excavation? Or should oil and gas engineers get to write laws on what medical practice?

Or better yet... should experts in the field write the laws?

yup

How should everyone be able to show their power, through an individual vote?

200 individuals max.

Socialism = give power to ALL individuals. Not just 200 selected gods.

^^^ In common law, the government is composed of paperwork. Paperwork doesn't jump up and do anything. It just lies there.

In common law, government people are simply people. When they harm you, use the legalities of the paperwork to punish them just like they would punish you if you harmed them.

What is government composed of Captain Postmodern?