As to the self declared superiority claim, I'm claiming that the thousands of people who's job it is to do the analysis are superior to both of us at the task of advising on what our best course of action is. I'm just curious how many millions of hours you've spent sifting through the raw data, talking to individual business owners to see what losses they're experiencing, and where you've gathered your data that you're drawing all of your conclusions from? Unfortunately, I don't have the resources, ability, or personnel to do that personally, so I rely on others to do that for me, and hope that discrepancies found between Team USA and Team Canada for example would help to clear up any errors along the way.
I apologize for the ad hominem comments, stupid people don't frustrate me, smart people that act stupid do. I feel it absolutely unnecessary to explain why your claims about probable corona virus deaths and reporting is an outright lie because again, I don't believe that you believe what you are saying. You know as well as I do how pathologists do post mortem reports, they don't spin the wheel to decide what to write down as a cause of death. If you come into a hospital with a stab wound, cancer, seasonal allergies, and a cavity and you bleed out from your stab wound, your cause of death is not listed as seasonal allergies. Please look again at what your own CDC link says about the separation between probable and confirmed corona virus cases, as well as the part about data lagging up to a week and being constantly amended. If you die of pneumonia from the flu and it gets listed as probable corona virus death, what happens next week when you test negative? Ah, the number gets amended, fantastic.
That is absolutely reasonable, if it quacks like a duck and walks like a duck, and you call it a duck only later to find out it was a quacking waddling chicken, the record gets changed when you find out its a chicken. Hospitals have oversight committees, its a group of jackasses that represent the hospital and watch for lawsuit risks. If Coroner A is doing something that could get them sued, they cut that out.
This is literally a job people do every single day when they make forecasts on the economy. Calculus and computers make magic! My only point that I've now brought up literally four times now in this thread, is that while it might be asinine for me to claim that I've done all of these calculations personally, its business as usual for the people who's job it is to map out the correlation between how often people change their underwear and how well the economy is doing. Do you know how much more complicated predicting the weather is than this?
Just keep in mind that if you have a pet dog and you're eating a chocolate bar and refusing to give any to the dog, from the dog's point of view, you're just an asshole who doesn't want to share.
I apologize for the ad hominem comments, stupid people don't frustrate me, smart people that act stupid do. I feel it absolutely unnecessary to explain why your claims about probable corona virus deaths and reporting is an outright lie because again, I don't believe that you believe what you are saying. You know as well as I do how pathologists do post mortem reports, they don't spin the wheel to decide what to write down as a cause of death. If you come into a hospital with a stab wound, cancer, seasonal allergies, and a cavity and you bleed out from your stab wound, your cause of death is not listed as seasonal allergies. Please look again at what your own CDC link says about the separation between probable and confirmed corona virus cases, as well as the part about data lagging up to a week and being constantly amended. If you die of pneumonia from the flu and it gets listed as probable corona virus death, what happens next week when you test negative? Ah, the number gets amended, fantastic.
That is absolutely reasonable, if it quacks like a duck and walks like a duck, and you call it a duck only later to find out it was a quacking waddling chicken, the record gets changed when you find out its a chicken. Hospitals have oversight committees, its a group of jackasses that represent the hospital and watch for lawsuit risks. If Coroner A is doing something that could get them sued, they cut that out.
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Once again, this is not just about a 1 dimensional cost benefit analysis. The claim that these analyses factor in long term macro economic factors is not only asinine, but is factually impossible. There is NO WAY such a complex system of inter-dependencies were factored into this equation, because the market effects on a macro scale are not quantifiable in any reliable sense.
This is literally a job people do every single day when they make forecasts on the economy. Calculus and computers make magic! My only point that I've now brought up literally four times now in this thread, is that while it might be asinine for me to claim that I've done all of these calculations personally, its business as usual for the people who's job it is to map out the correlation between how often people change their underwear and how well the economy is doing. Do you know how much more complicated predicting the weather is than this?
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Your rights end when they infringe on the rights of others.
I could not agree with you more. Your right to enjoy a nice bowling game does not outweigh the life of the guy handling the ball after you. Everyone is dealing with this together, grow up, deal with it like an adult and not an angry kid that can't deal with being told what to do. We can all stay home for a month, or half of the population can stay home for a year while the other half disregards the order and takes up precious resources that they don't deserve.Just keep in mind that if you have a pet dog and you're eating a chocolate bar and refusing to give any to the dog, from the dog's point of view, you're just an asshole who doesn't want to share.
The self declared superiority claim has nothing to with anyone but you. You claim we don't need to attack or defend the president then instantly make ad homenim level attacks on him. This in on YOU, not experts. You.
Millions of hours? Again, you rest your haunches on appeal to authority and hyperbole. I don't need your apologies. I need you to stop being so fucking intellectually dishonest because you don't like the implications of the information I am presenting. I don't give a fuck what you believe. Your belief is not a retort.
You know as well as I do that I already presented evidence from not only the CDC but the Illinois Department of health directly stating that any death which occurs with a positive or even SUSPECTED case of COVID-19, regardless of it being the primary cause or not, is added to the COVID-19 death stats. No, pathologists don't spin the wheel, and there are supposed to be regulations around this sort of thing, but hose are being bypassed under emergency order aren't they?
"It is important to remember that death certificate reporting may not meet mandatory reporting requirements for reportable diseases; contact the local health department regarding regulations specific to the jurisdiction.In cases where a definite diagnosis of COVID–19 cannot be made, but it is suspected or likely (e.g., the circumstances are compelling within a reasonable degree of certainty), it is acceptable to report COVID–19 on a death certificate as “probable” or “presumed.”"
https://www.cdc.gov/nchs/nvss/vsrr/covid19/index.htm
There are many sources showing that this is in fact how the numbers are being reported, and so far your only response to this is "no that is not true". No refutation, no sources, just contradiction. I never claimed the numbers were "an outright lie", this is again a strawman on your part. I am however claiming the numbers are being artificially inflated in several ways, one of which I provided multiple sources to support this claim. Rather than looking at the facts presented and questioning your own conclusions, you again fall back on your appeal to authority and make the assumption based on your belief that all the normal procedures are being followed to the letter. Again, this is not an argument. This is the debate equivalent of telling me to let Jesus take the wheel. For you to pretend the same oversights and liabilities are in place during an emergency order is intellectually dishonest.
Since you are circling back again and not responding to what I actually wrote I will just start quoting myself since you are clearly trying to create topic slide here now that it is increasingly evident you don't have a logical retort to these points.
Once again, this is not just about a 1 dimensional cost benefit analysis. The claim that these analyses factor in long term macro economic factors is not only asinine, but is factually impossible. There is NO WAY such a complex system of inter-dependencies were factored into this equation, because the market effects on a macro scale are not quantifiable in any reliable sense. This is the whole point of price signalling as a core principal of economics, because there is no reliable way to dictate from a centralized top down position the most efficient priority and cost. Furthermore, even if you want to desperately cling to such an argument, there is no way they could have done a complete analysis of such effect in such a short period of time no matter how many experts you cram into a room. These are assumptions and projections AT BEST. And of course the totality of this argument relies completely on valid reporting of base statistics, which itself is clearly under dispute as referenced above. You crap out all the hyperbole you like, it changes none of this.
It is a weatherman's job to predict the weather. They are never wrong are they? So your point is these systems are SUPER complicated, and that is your argument to support the fact that they are correct in their assertions? It seems to me like you are making my quoted point above for me. This is the kind of half-assed argument you rely on over and over and over again. Appeals to authority, strawmans, ad hominem attacks, and telling me about what you believe.
[I couldn't agree more!... Grow up and accept your rights being stripped!] By the way your metaphors are shit just like the foundations of your arguments.
I'm fine with Tecshare being a prick, what gets to me is how you act like a prick, someone responds in kind, and then you pull the victim card and can immediately discredit anything anyone says because they had the audacity to criticize you (or others apparently). You would disagree with someone reading you the dictionary if they prefaced it with an insult.
I couldn't give less of a fuck if you or anyone else insults me. The problem is you are using ad hominem attacks in lieu of an argument. It is not about my feelings of being a "victim", it is about your inability to present a logical argument and instead relying on fallacy after fallacy to give yourself a sophistic veneer of having a point.
