Topic: Do we want to continue to allow various vendor hate in here? - page 11. (Read 17316 times)

I have seen other forums follow this strategy. It seems to work pretty well. Take a bit of moderating though.

Hi,

the main problem I have as an (undelivered to) BFL customer is that I have to browse through endless threads to find the posts that Inaba/BFL_Josh pops up in. Mostly he just trolls the trolls, but sometimes useful info pops up. I'd propose that the public face of each of the mining hardware manufacturers starts a Reddit-style "Ask me anything" thread that they agree to answer the questions in. That way they can act as the magnet for the haters and genuine question askers in a single thread. It would be a great way for their potential customers to measure the accountability of the vendors in a useful way.

These threads should be moderated (there will probably be less than ten of them) by a reliable impartial community member. Only a single instance of each question by each poster should be allowed, to prevent the inevitable "Answer my question..." reposts.

I've previously asked direct questions to BFL on this forum and had a deflecting reply. Then the replies turn to picking fights with trolls. Then BFL disappear from the thread. This situation could be avoided via this proposal.

Cheers,
Donovan.

Bascily no - useless and non constructive wasted time.

I am a capitalist.  I'd prefer just to sell a unit directly to a person and have them report.  I'm happy to sell my first card to JohnK. 

Your approach ignores shipping time, damage during shipping, ineptitude of the receiver....  All of these could be VERY expensive delays and they do not benefit anyone.

Good rules are really difficult to make. 
This rule eliminates some productive DIY conversations.

It's out of control the way things are running right now. I hope you guys come up with a good solution. The "hate threads" are really dominating the forum and it's just to much. They are being posted in every section regardless if it belongs there or not

No. All I have done is propose a method for the community to protect itself from vaporware scams. If the product really exists, it makes no economic difference whatsoever to you or me who mines with it for a few days. It makes a big practical difference, however, to know or not know whether a product exists and performs as advertised. Would you rather have employees of the company secretly ot openly mine purely for profit, or a forum moderator mine and publicize the specs?

By the way, a company could also pay for the mod to visit them and test the finished product. Seeing your comment above, I suspect you would object to a moderator getting a paid trip, too.

+1 this idea.  With a vendor specific forum, combined with a rating system on each vendor it would solve alot of these issues.

Inaba and BFL should have been tagged and banned by this forum.  They've been able to keep the spotlight off them by shipping measley quantities to certain people.  Not to mention they are clearly spending money for advertising here.

If you want to cut back on the bad chatter, then the forum should have a set of standards it adheres too.

+1

I'm pretty sure the mods here are in a situation of Pot Meet Kettle.

The reason people are pissed around here is because you guys continue to support the vendors who abuse the community both verbally and monetarily.

You guys obviously care more about the money than the community, as it shows by your willingness to take money from companies who have decided to go down the path of being less than reputable in their business practices, so then we probably don't see this forum as anything different, and thus those who want to protect newbies from the scam that is BFL & Avalon, have to go to extraordinary lengths of being annoying and posting "service announcements" because you as moderators fail to do your job and remove the scum from the board.

I am glad that you are looking at this.  I am very glad I myself don't have to make it work.

I think that civil language is sufficient to construct clear and forceful complaints, requests for recourse, or warnings to others.  

I think you should remove the one post that bothers you the most each day, and give a reason why.  Wear fire resistant gear.

I see a big reason... what if the rig cost 50k and makes 10k per day. theymos should get to benefit from this for some reason?  If the site admin had any integrity he would tag inaba with the scammer tag inaba deserves.  All you've done is propose a method for theymos to make more money off the community.  Are you theymos sock puppet?

Yes, I assumed that was understood. The moderators here would receive a product and make sure it works as advertised. It makes sense for them to get compensated by keeping the coins mined during the test-drive (for bigger units) or by getting the unit for free (for smaller units, at the discretion of the vendor).

We would still have screaming related to backlogs, canceled orders, etc. - like any other product forum out there. Still, all the screaming related to vaporware, scams, and failed engineering would disappear. I see no good reason not to implement this.

Well you have a choice of smilies and exclamation marks available to position to the left of each thread title.

I would have thought a round circle with a colour code designated by mods would be easy enough.

Does SMF have a plug-in of this sort? I doubt we're going to get anyone to custom code
a forum upgrade.

How about a traffic light system for vendors with;

Purple                   Pre-orders
Green                   Shipped on time
Amber                  Late/Unreliable (+ 1 month)
Red                      Severe Delay/Dishonest/Incompetent (+ 2 months)
Black                    Scam (taken money and run, or blatant lie)

I think vendor hate needs to stay, or there needs to be a sticky topic where people can posts their experiences with the current vendors rather than create a new thread.  Maybe a "Vender Watch & Warning thread.  People need to be aware what they are getting into and how buying overpriced hardware that does not meet ROI because of shipping delays and poor customer service is pretty much a scam.  Its like a salesman at a store selling a pc worth $500 dollars for $2500 and the customer later finds out after the sale they were foolish in their buy.  I believe it is our responsibility as a community to educate everyone of bad investments and possible scams, bad shipping policies, bad customer service etc.  We are all representatives of bitcoin, companies that take advantage of customers is pretty much stealing in my opinion and we dont want to scare people away, bitcoin is supposed to be a alternative in our current practices with USD/fiat currencies.  Its our duty as a community here to educate people, help them make good decisions and be brutally honest with them and warn them that they could be making a mistake.  I think we need a forum review/vendor rating system in place.  Dont leave it to the mods to give them a scammer tag, let people rate each user/thread.  People need to be able to see problems/vender hate where they are selling.  I personally stay away from companies that dont have product reviews.

I suggest perhaps a couple of sub-forums under custom hardware:

• TECHNICAL DISCUSSION (ONLY)
• MARKET ACUMEN (ARENA OF MALICE)

There is a difference between threads that are of practical use to the community; threads that inform and share one another's research, and threads that exist to abuse, vent rage, or multiple threads concerning a sole manufacturer spamming for free advertising. The latter should be removed.

I don't believe there should be sub catagories for each manufacturer, I believe that will lead to smaller manufacturers being overlooked.

I don't think there should be the recent volume of threads concerning abuse directed toward Butterfly Labs. Those threads should be situated within Butterfly Labs own forum. I sincerely doubt there is anyone here not familiar with Butterfly Labs inability to deliver on time, or threats not to refund. Quite frankly if people have chosen to pre-order without third party consumer protection from a secure payment method, then as adults, that's their own stupid fault. Those that did use a secure payment means can get refunds irrespective of BFL's claims. BFL's incompetence is widely known, especially in this forum, that's why BFL rarely comments here aside to antagonise folks for kicks. Likewise multiple threads about them serves no purpose other than to spam their name throughout the forum.

I do think threads such as 'wtf Avalon ship the chips' and 'Avalon Batch 3 refunds' do serve a purpose, they approach the same manufacturer, but ask for different response, for different subjects and different products.

Finally Manufacturers themselves choosing to thread spam should be warned before being quarantined to a different childboard, or banned.

Certainly many threads from the last month need to be removed.

The hate for the ASIC vendors is all too natural, as they pretty much  have hijacked the
Bitcoin Market, financed by the Bitcoin community, except for Asicminer, but their
prices were never competitive.

Every other vendor has been working pretty much the same Ponzi scheme, take
pre-orders and then use the money to pursue their own financial gain - the verdict
on KNC is still out.  BFL and Avalon are obvious scams, if you do not see this, then
you must be blind.

And no, this should not be in a different subforum.

+1

this is the guy I post to help.
fuck inaba an the BFL long con!