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Topic: Donetsk, Kharkov, Lugansk - way to Russia. - page 177. (Read 734937 times)

legendary
Activity: 3808
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September 02, 2014, 09:32:42 AM
Here is the latest map of the conflict situation:

https://slavyangrad.files.wordpress.com/2014/09/karta_ahartin_1_sep-1.jpg

#1. Situation remains highly volatile to the north of Volnovakha.

#2. The NAF has advanced in to the Zaporizka oblast, capturing a few villages.

#3. The Donetsk airport pocket of Kiev forces was exterminated.

#4. No change in Mariupol.

#5. Strategically important Panteleimonovka is now under NAF control.
legendary
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September 02, 2014, 09:18:02 AM
Allegedly, leader of the Right sector (extreme Ukrainian nationalist party and paramilitary group) Dmytro Yarosh has been found dead on the battlefields near Ilovaysk. This rumor can not be verified at the moment.

One can only hope.
sr. member
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September 02, 2014, 06:44:25 AM
Allegedly, leader of the Right sector (extreme Ukrainian nationalist party and paramilitary group) Dmytro Yarosh has been found dead on the battlefields near Ilovaysk. This rumor can not be verified at the moment.
legendary
Activity: 3514
Merit: 1280
English ⬄ Russian Translation Services
September 02, 2014, 05:12:25 AM
Joseph Dempsey, an analyst with the International Institute for Strategic Studies, told the BBC that one of the tanks is something called a T-72BM, a modern variant identifiable by its special "Kontakt-5 Explosive Reactive" armor, and one that Russia has not exported but uses heavily in its own military. That is a new development, and one that suggests not just that Russia is invading, but being increasingly brazen about it.

Dempsey told the BBC, "The Soviet-era tanks operated by the separatists have until now represented those that could have been potentially acquired internally within Ukraine, providing a degree of plausible deniability to any suspected third-party supplier." That degree of plausible deniability is now gone.

http://www.vox.com/2014/8/28/6078831/video-russian-tanks-eastern-ukraine?utm_medium=social&utm_source=facebook&utm_name=share-button&utm_campaign=vox&utm_content=article-share-top

This is T-72M1, an export modification of T-72 (or rather T-72M1M, which is T-72M1 upgraded to T-72B standard). These tanks are not in service in the Russian Army (see here for more info). In Europe the Czech Republic, Slovakia, Poland and Hungary (bought from Czechs) have them, that's where these tanks could probably get to Ukraine from (and then to rebells)... Cool







legendary
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sr. member
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September 01, 2014, 10:30:06 PM
Putin says he's not invading Ukraine. Here's a video of Putin's tanks invading Ukraine.

On Tuesday, several days after Russian self-propelled artillery moved into eastern Ukraine in what was clearly a hostile invasion that Vladimir Putin insists is not occurring, someone took a video of some very heavy tanks crashing around an eastern Ukrainian town near the rebel-held city of Luhansk. While they look suspiciously like Russian tanks sent as part of the invasion, Moscow and the pro-Russia rebels have all insisted that any heavy equipment was stolen from or abandoned by the Ukrainian military.

But now military analysts have taken a look at the video and say that at least one of the tanks could only come from the Russian military, apparently settling the issue of whether these are in fact Russian military forces.

Joseph Dempsey, an analyst with the International Institute for Strategic Studies, told the BBC that one of the tanks is something called a T-72BM, a modern variant identifiable by its special "Kontakt-5 Explosive Reactive" armor, and one that Russia has not exported but uses heavily in its own military. That is a new development, and one that suggests not just that Russia is invading, but being increasingly brazen about it.

Dempsey told the BBC, "The Soviet-era tanks operated by the separatists have until now represented those that could have been potentially acquired internally within Ukraine, providing a degree of plausible deniability to any suspected third-party supplier." That degree of plausible deniability is now gone.

http://www.vox.com/2014/8/28/6078831/video-russian-tanks-eastern-ukraine?utm_medium=social&utm_source=facebook&utm_name=share-button&utm_campaign=vox&utm_content=article-share-top
full member
Activity: 238
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September 01, 2014, 10:22:41 PM
I think the end of the Anglo-American, Anglo-Zionist, or whatever name, is coming to an end. Finally. Not only has it has been losing its wars, not only has it been imploding economically into bankruptcy, not only has it lost its moral ascendancy... but now, its own minions are exposing its lies. The end days of the evil Western empire is near & good for the American people actually, the monster which has been sapping the strength of the US is finally being exorcized, thanks to the wisdom of the people of Russia.


Ex-NSA Director, US Intelligence Veterans Write Open Letter To Merkel To Avoid All-Out Ukraine War


Alarmed at the anti-Russian hysteria sweeping Washington, and the specter of a new Cold War, U.S. intelligence veterans one of whom is none other than William Binney, the former senior NSA crypto-mathematician who back in March 2012 blew the whistle on the NSA's spying programs more than a year before Edward Snowden, took the unusual step of sending the following memo dated August 30 to German Chancellor Merkel challenging the reliability of Ukrainian and U.S. media claims about a Russian "invasion."




MEMORANDUM FOR: Angela Merkel, Chancellor of Germany
FROM: Veteran Intelligence Professionals for Sanity (VIPS)
SUBJECT: Ukraine and NATO

We the undersigned are longtime veterans of U.S. intelligence. We take the unusual step of writing this open letter to you to ensure that you have an opportunity to be briefed on our views prior to the NATO summit on September 4-5.

You need to know, for example, that accusations of a major Russian "invasion" of Ukraine appear not to be supported by reliable intelligence. Rather, the "intelligence" seems to be of the same dubious, politically "fixed" kind used 12 years ago to "justify" the U.S.-led attack on Iraq. We saw no credible evidence of weapons of mass destruction in Iraq then; we see no credible evidence of a Russian invasion now. Twelve years ago, former Chancellor Gerhard Schroeder, mindful of the flimsiness of the evidence on Iraqi WMD, refused to join in the attack on Iraq. In our view, you should be appropriately suspicions of charges made by the US State Department and NATO officials alleging a Russian invasion of Ukraine.

President Barack Obama tried yesterday to cool the rhetoric of his own senior diplomats and the corporate media, when he publicly described recent activity in the Ukraine, as "a continuation of what’s been taking place for months now … it’s not really a shift."

Obama, however, has only tenuous control over the policymakers in his administration – who, sadly, lack much sense of history, know little of war, and substitute anti-Russian invective for a policy. One year ago, hawkish State Department officials and their friends in the media very nearly got Mr. Obama to launch a major attack on Syria based, once again, on "intelligence" that was dubious, at best.

Largely because of the growing prominence of, and apparent reliance on, intelligence we believe to be spurious, we think the possibility of hostilities escalating beyond the borders of Ukraine has increased significantly over the past several days. More important, we believe that this likelihood can be avoided, depending on the degree of judicious skepticism you and other European leaders bring to the NATO summit next week.

Experience With Untruth

Hopefully, your advisers have reminded you of NATO Secretary General Anders Fogh Rasmussen’s checkered record for credibility. It appears to us that Rasmussen’s speeches continue to be drafted by Washington. This was abundantly clear on the day before the U.S.-led invasion of Iraq when, as Danish Prime Minister, he told his Parliament: "Iraq has weapons of mass destruction. This is not something we just believe. We know."

Photos can be worth a thousand words; they can also deceive. We have considerable experience collecting, analyzing, and reporting on all kinds of satellite and other imagery, as well as other kinds of intelligence. Suffice it to say that the images released by NATO on August 28 provide a very flimsy basis on which to charge Russia with invading Ukraine. Sadly, they bear a strong resemblance to the images shown by Colin Powell at the UN on February 5, 2003 that, likewise, proved nothing.

That same day, we warned President Bush that our former colleague analysts were "increasingly distressed at the politicization of intelligence" and told him flatly, "Powell’s presentation does not come close" to justifying war. We urged Mr. Bush to "widen the discussion … beyond the circle of those advisers clearly bent on a war for which we see no compelling reason and from which we believe the unintended consequences are likely to be catastrophic."

Consider Iraq today. Worse than catastrophic. Although President Vladimir Putin has until now showed considerable reserve on the conflict in the Ukraine, it behooves us to remember that Russia, too, can "shock and awe." In our view, if there is the slightest chance of that kind of thing eventually happening to Europe because of Ukraine, sober-minded leaders need to think this through very carefully.

If the photos that NATO and the US have released represent the best available "proof" of an invasion from Russia, our suspicions increase that a major effort is under way to fortify arguments for the NATO summit to approve actions that Russia is sure to regard as provocative. Caveat emptor is an expression with which you are no doubt familiar. Suffice it to add that one should be very cautious regarding what Mr. Rasmussen, or even Secretary of State John Kerry, are peddling.

We trust that your advisers have kept you informed regarding the crisis in Ukraine from the beginning of 2014, and how the possibility that Ukraine would become a member of NATO is anathema to the Kremlin. According to a February 1, 2008 cable (published by WikiLeaks) from the US embassy in Moscow to Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice, US Ambassador William Burns was called in by Foreign Minister Sergey Lavrov, who explained Russia’s strong opposition to NATO membership for Ukraine.

Lavrov warned pointedly of "fears that the issue could potentially split the country in two, leading to violence or even, some claim, civil war, which would force Russia to decide whether to intervene." Burns gave his cable the unusual title, "NYET MEANS NYET: RUSSIA’S NATO ENLARGEMENT REDLINES," and sent it off to Washington with IMMEDIATE precedence. Two months later, at their summit in Bucharest NATO leaders issued a formal declaration that "Georgia and Ukraine will be in NATO."

Just yesterday, Ukrainian Prime Minister Arseny Yatsenyuk used his Facebook page to claim that, with the approval of Parliament that he has requested, the path to NATO membership is open. Yatsenyuk, of course, was Washington’s favorite pick to become prime minister after the February 22 coup d’etat in Kiev. "Yats is the guy," said Assistant Secretary of State Victoria Nuland a few weeks before the coup, in an intercepted telephone conversation with US Ambassador to Ukraine Geoffrey Pyatt. You may recall that this is the same conversation in which Nuland said, "Fuck the EU."

Timing of the Russian "Invasion"

The conventional wisdom promoted by Kiev just a few weeks ago was that Ukrainian forces had the upper hand in fighting the anti-coup federalists in southeastern Ukraine, in what was largely portrayed as a mop-up operation. But that picture of the offensive originated almost solely from official government sources in Kiev. There were very few reports coming from the ground in southeastern Ukraine. There was one, however, quoting Ukrainian President Petro Poroshenko, that raised doubt about the reliability of the government’s portrayal.

According to the "press service of the President of Ukraine" on August 18, Poroshenko called for a "regrouping of Ukrainian military units involved in the operation of power in the East of the country. … Today we need to do the rearrangement of forces that will defend our territory and continued army offensives," said Poroshenko, adding, "we need to consider a new military operation in the new circumstances."

If the "new circumstances" meant successful advances by Ukrainian government forces, why would it be necessary to "regroup," to "rearrange" the forces? At about this time, sources on the ground began to report a string of successful attacks by the anti-coup federalists against government forces. According to these sources, it was the government army that was starting to take heavy casualties and lose ground, largely because of ineptitude and poor leadership.

Ten days later, as they became encircled and/or retreated, a ready-made excuse for this was to be found in the "Russian invasion." That is precisely when the fuzzy photos were released by NATO and reporters like the New York Times’ Michael Gordon were set loose to spread the word that "the Russians are coming." (Michael Gordon was one of the most egregious propagandists promoting the war on Iraq.)

No Invasion – But Plenty Other Russian Support

The anti-coup federalists in southeastern Ukraine enjoy considerable local support, partly as a result of government artillery strikes on major population centers. And we believe that Russian support probably has been pouring across the border and includes, significantly, excellent battlefield intelligence. But it is far from clear that this support includes tanks and artillery at this point – mostly because the federalists have been better led and surprisingly successful in pinning down government forces.

At the same time, we have little doubt that, if and when the federalists need them, the Russian tanks will come.

This is precisely why the situation demands a concerted effort for a ceasefire, which you know Kiev has so far been delaying. What is to be done at this point? In our view, Poroshenko and Yatsenyuk need to be told flat-out that membership in NATO is not in the cards – and that NATO has no intention of waging a proxy war with Russia – and especially not in support of the ragtag army of Ukraine. Other members of NATO need to be told the same thing.

For the Steering Group, Veteran Intelligence Professionals for Sanity

        William Binney, former Technical Director, World Geopolitical & Military Analysis, NSA; co-founder, SIGINT Automation Research Center (ret.)
        David MacMichael, National Intelligence Council (ret.)
        Ray McGovern, former US Army infantry/intelligence officer & CIA analyst (ret.)
        Elizabeth Murray, Deputy National Intelligence Officer for Middle East (ret.)
        Todd E. Pierce, MAJ, US Army Judge Advocate (Ret.)
        Coleen Rowley, Division Counsel & Special Agent, FBI (ret.)
        Ann Wright, Col., US Army (ret.); Foreign Service Officer (resigned)


sr. member
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September 01, 2014, 09:07:22 PM
ruSSian Troops Reportedly Massacre Ukrainian Soldiers Waving White Flags

Russian troops reportedly massacred hundreds of Ukrainian soldiers after striking a deal to allow them to retreat.

Reports say that troops loyal to Kiev were trying to leave a beseiged city about 22 miles east of Donetsk. After their Russian enemies agreed to let the troops retreat, they reportedly reneged and opened fire, leaving hundreds of bodies littered along an agreed retreat route.

Lt Col Nikolai Gordienko, of the Ukrainian National Guard, said: “They were given the corridor to exit and they were shot.

“It is a violation of international conventions.”

Reports say that the soldiers were waving white flags when the Russian troops opened fire from all sides.

More than 1,000 Russian troops crossed the border into Ukraine this week, prompting outrage from the international community. World leaders have called for Russia to leave, while also enacting strict economic sanctions against Russia.

http://www.inquisitr.com/1445124/russian-troops-reportedly-massacre-ukranian-soldiers-waving-white-flags/
sr. member
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September 01, 2014, 04:36:40 PM
Novaya Gazeta: death certificate of RU soldier killed on 13.08.2014 in Ukraine







http://www.novayagazeta.ru/society/65075.html
sr. member
Activity: 252
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September 01, 2014, 02:09:56 PM
This works, slowly but surely.
Dozhd has changed its layout and both right and left are photos of Russian soldiers who were sent into Ukraine, got arrested or disappeared... It works like a drop of water on a stone. Drip...drip...drip... And all the time when Putin or Lavrov say their soldiers are not there their faces add one comment: YOU ARE LYING

sr. member
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Merit: 250
September 01, 2014, 01:50:11 PM
Mariupol versus Putin



The representatives of the so-called DNR aren’t concealing that one of their main aims is to seize Mariupol for the second time. This was stated by the “prime minister” of the so-called republic, Oleksandr Zakharchenko, in his interview to Reuters. While Oleh Tsarov explained that the seizure of Mariupol is also necessary due to the town’s strategical stock of grain. “There are no storehouses with food in the territory that is under our control,” complained Tsarov. Mariupol is located only 40 km from Novoazovsk, that was seized by the separatists on August 27, with support from Russia.

Mariupol survived a month under the rule of the DNR, and now the number of the “people’s republic” supporters has decreased significantly. A rally in support of united Ukraine took place on August 28, attended by thousands [of people]. Right now, the citizens of Mariupol are preparing for the defense of their town by digging anti-tank ditches and fortifying the checkpoints together with the servicemen.

http://euromaidanpress.com/2014/09/01/mariupol-versus-putin/
sr. member
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Merit: 250
September 01, 2014, 01:16:02 PM
Breaking news! Sensational! NATO has just presented satellite recording which proves, beyound any doubt, that the Russian armored columns are crossing into the Ukraine:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OuMBniEfgbU
newbie
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Merit: 0
September 01, 2014, 11:49:56 AM
About battle on Ilovaisk

Victor Tregubov

........



THANK YOU for this info and analysis!
In addition with thoughts laid out in this text I will summarize the SUCCESS and FAILURES of Ukraine Army (UA) in Donbass:

1) At the very beginning it was clear that Separatists were supported by Russia, giving them weapons, so the first attempt was to "close the border", BUT nobody thought that Russia will cross the red line and will shoot over the border with GRAD, so that was the 1st. big FAILURE;

2) The next step of ATO was based on assumption that "no no... it can't be, that russian tanks and other heavy combat vehicles will cross the border in big streams night and day". So ATO forces started to surround one town and city after another. They were rather successful, BUT Russia crossed the 2nd red line.

3) Ukrainians struggled hard - bombed one caravan of tanks, but at the same time 3 new crossed the border. UA still was successful.. And then came the epopee of white trucks. Under cover of "white truck operation", another red line crossing operation was started - regular army units were prepared for massive offensive. This lead to retreating of UA.

So every time the imperia of evil is one step forward, because nobody in ATO headquarters and also in NATO is ready for such an insolence and cruelty.

WHAT's NEXT?
Ukraine, Europa and whole world should FINALLY understand, what are they dealing with!!!

Will there be Russian jets in Ukraine and bombing with even more powerful missiles? - YES
Will there be dominance of Russian warships over UA marine? - YES
Will they go further and take other cities? - YES

Will they bomb Kiev and go to other countries? - probably YES.
The whole WORLD should prepare for the worst.

Official Twitter account of RF foreign affairs (1:29 AM - 1 Sep 2014):
#Lavrov: The initiative of our President about creating space from Lisbon to Vladivostok is not taken away from the desk
#Лaвpoв: Mы ocтaвляeм нa cтoлe пepeгoвopoв инициaтивy нaшeгo Пpeзидeнтa o coздaнии пpocтpaнcтвa oт Лиccaбoнa дo Bлaдивocтoкa
https://twitter.com/MID_RF/status/506358102845693952

sr. member
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September 01, 2014, 10:55:46 AM
I think it's pretty obvious that any kind of federation won't be possible after all these massacres in Odessa & Mariupol, shellings and deaths. Even if DPR and LPR really want to implement such federative state, it won't be stable due to mutual trust issues. It's possible only in case of Poroshenko's resignation.

That is true, yet peace offer is again on the table and Kiev should think about it, and think good. This is not the first time Donetsk and Luhansk are asking for talks about autonomy and other issues, but so far Ukrainian officials were playing deaf and blind because they thought that they can solve all problems on the battlefield, by shelling cities and killing their own disobedient citizens. Now it's different: so called 'ATO' failed to defeat the uprising, rebels are growing stronger, and overall situation in central Ukraine is quickly deteriorating. I think Kiev is running out of time and this might be their last chance to save what can be saved.
legendary
Activity: 3108
Merit: 1359
September 01, 2014, 10:42:10 AM
Some guys from southern states of USA are donating equipment to Novorossiya.  Roll Eyes Packages from USA arrived. There were found kneecaps, clothing and Confederate flag. Cheesy

http://rusvesna.su/news/1409398647

It's really interesting that Flag of Novorosiya is very similar to used by Confederates.



legendary
Activity: 3108
Merit: 1359
September 01, 2014, 10:14:31 AM
I think it's pretty obvious that any kind of federation won't be possible after all these massacres in Odessa & Mariupol, shellings and deaths. Even if DPR and LPR really want to implement such federative state, it won't be stable due to mutual trust issues. It's possible only in case of Poroshenko's resignation.
sr. member
Activity: 334
Merit: 250
September 01, 2014, 09:48:12 AM
Ukrainian leadership is (again) receiving loud and clear signals from rebels that they are willing to negotiate and, hopefully, bring this dangerous conflict to an end. What was requested is a special status for Donetsk and Luhansk regions within the Ukrainian borders. Very reasonable demand. Ball is in the Kiev's court - if they wish, they can stop this bloodshed as soon as tomorrow. Unfortunatelly, I am not so sure that their foreign sponsors would agree.
legendary
Activity: 1680
Merit: 1014
September 01, 2014, 07:34:05 AM
Donetsk, Lugansk Republics ready to remain part of Ukraine, seek special status
http://rt.com/news/184236-lugansk-donetsk-kiev-talks/

Quote
At talks in the Belarusian capital, the self-proclaimed Donetsk and Lugansk People’s Republics have urged Kiev to acknowledge their autonomy within Ukraine, but said they wish to remain an integral part of the country.

LNR and DNR representatives urged the Ukrainian government to end their military operation in the country’s east so that parliamentary and local elections can take place freely.

“The president, government and [parliament] Verkhovna Rada should accept… decrees granting immediate recovery from the humanitarian catastrophe, acknowledging the special status of the territories under the control of the People’s Republics, creating conditions - first of all stopping the ‘anti-terror’ operations - for free elections of local authorities and MPs,” the document with the republics' position reads.

And now we can sit back and watch as some high-ranking US official will fly to Kiev, after which the peace initiative will be rejected (again) and genocide will intensify (again).



Russia-led military bloc ready to send peacekeepers to Ukraine
http://rt.com/politics/183644-russia-csto-peacekeepers-ukraine/

Quote
The head of the CSTO says its peacekeepers are ready for any operations, including in Ukraine, but their deployment requires the go-ahead from leaders of all member-countries.

"Deployment of the CSTO peacekeeping force can be ordered only by the Collective Security Council – the supreme body formed with heads of state of the member countries. By a joint decision these leaders can order the use of peacekeepers both on the territory of the member-states and also outside their borders,” General-Secretary of the Collective Security Treaty Organization Nikolay Bordyuzha, stated on Friday.



Meanwhile Ukraine gets IMF loans:

IMF throws Ukraine $1.4bn lifeline
http://rt.com/business/183832-imf-loan-ukraine-risks/

Quote
The International Monetary Fund has given a green light for Ukraine to receive the second tranche of financial assistance totalling $1.39 billion, meaning more austerity measures for the already struggling economy.

Lifeline indeed...



Ukrainian refugees to receive Russian pensions - minister
http://rt.com/politics/183564-ukraine-russia-pensions-refugees/

Quote
All Ukrainian refugees of pension age will receive their pensions in Russia, Deputy PM Olga Golodets has said in a radio interview.
sr. member
Activity: 334
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September 01, 2014, 02:36:18 AM
Looks like on of the most annoying 'boilers' located in general area around Luhansk airport doesn't exist any more. Roughly 2/3 of men who have been stationed there for months (80th brigade mixed with some paramilitary gangs and foreign mercenaries) managed to escape to Ukrainian territory, the rest is lost for Kiev.
sr. member
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Books by Crimean tatar leader Mustafa Cemilev have been removed from the shelves in bookstores in the Crimea.
The persecution of Crimean Tatars is gathering speed quickly. Indeed, Soviet Union 2.0

http://ru.krymr.com/content/article/26558987.html
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