[DVC]DevCoin - Official Thread - Moderated - page 232.

sidhujag

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Quote from: Bittzy78 on January 20, 2014, 06:18:27 PM

Quote from: markm on January 20, 2014, 06:13:51 PM

I think the way that crypto coins currently work getting them is like playing World of Warcraft or whatever, it is all just theoretical points that might or might not actually end up being sold for something real.

So your earnings as a Devtome author aren't really earnings at all, they are just like Dragon Kill Points in an RPG, the Devtome uses them to measure the relative contributions of the team.

Your earnings however as a seller of devcoins for fiat on an exchange are earnings, as are your barter earnings if you barter devcoins for something real of real value such as a cup of coffee or a meal or rent or whatever.

I am not licensed to practice law on this planet though so check with your own local licensed practitioners.

-MarkM-

Yeah, that is my take on the whole matter. How would one even figure out a price on your holdings of Devcoins if the price is different on each exchange? Not to mention they could just disappear into thin air almost overnight.

I am only going to report my earnings that I convert to Bitcoin and cashout to my bank through Coinbase.

Remember fiat is the only thing taxed not crypto. If you sell back to crypto your taxed. Unless they make bitcoin legal tender and you can pay tax with it then depends where you live i think in Uk some placed wanted to do this.

markm

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Are any facts available re those commercial auction-scripts regarding actual websites using them, the Alexa ratings, visitors, earnings per visitor average, percentage of conversion of visitors to paying customers, retention rate and/or lifetime profits per customer, cost of aquisition per customer, actual sites we can go watch and see how well they are thriving, or anything at all along those lines?

Or are they just some unknown person selling a script with no sign anywhere that the scripts even work let alone are earning profits for those who have deployed them?

-MarkM-

Bittzy78

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I do not give financial advice .. do your own DD

Quote from: markm on January 20, 2014, 06:13:51 PM

I think the way that crypto coins currently work getting them is like playing World of Warcraft or whatever, it is all just theoretical points that might or might not actually end up being sold for something real.

So your earnings as a Devtome author aren't really earnings at all, they are just like Dragon Kill Points in an RPG, the Devtome uses them to measure the relative contributions of the team.

Your earnings however as a seller of devcoins for fiat on an exchange are earnings, as are your barter earnings if you barter devcoins for something real of real value such as a cup of coffee or a meal or rent or whatever.

I am not licensed to practice law on this planet though so check with your own local licensed practitioners.

-MarkM-

Yeah, that is my take on the whole matter. How would one even figure out a price on your holdings of Devcoins if the price is different on each exchange? Not to mention they could just disappear into thin air almost overnight.

I am only going to report my earnings that I convert to Bitcoin and cashout to my bank through Coinbase.

sidhujag

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Activity: 2044

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Quote from: Bittzy78 on January 20, 2014, 06:04:37 PM

Quote from: sidhujag on January 20, 2014, 04:15:50 PM

Quote from: markm on January 20, 2014, 04:04:09 PM

Quote from: sidhujag on January 20, 2014, 03:54:45 PM

Quote from: dalamar96 on January 20, 2014, 03:48:42 PM

Quote from: sidhujag on January 20, 2014, 03:44:34 PM

Seems awfully strange that when a round ends and payments begin that there are large dumps every time. Maybe not you but in general. There were not really many bounties before so we ruled out developers as noone even bothered developing when you can write yourself a share per hour and in a week have yourself more shares than a months worth of developement and testing.

I don't want to get in an argument about it right now as I am not thinking exactly straight. But, from what i have seen of the bounties here with the "months worth of work and testing" for things isn't quite there. The main thing I have seen for development is lets get an idea and throw code at it without thinking about it. I am not saying that the writing is of par either, there are a LOT of article I wouldn't have given 1/5th a share to that got 10, but the coding isn't on par either with the bounties that have been given out that i have seen. I am sure there are a few that have been worth it, just like some of the writing. Just as an example the way the auction bounty has been discussed (and now dropped it seems) was handled. Not interested in working on it at all, and do not think it would be worth the proposed bounty were it to come to light in the current form.

But bounties are one-offs unless you think the mistakes are being repeated, then bring it up to the bounty admin and we should review how much a bounty should be worth. But at the same time we shoudl review how much each word is worth with bounties in mind as well?

I think the auction bounty of 50 shares is fine, its probably more alot more if we have to create it from scratch, I think 50 is good for starting from a template adding coin payments, setting up initial share offerings etc, all the ad banners and marketing. Its not just 1 person unless noone wants to do it. The benefits also outweigh the bounty as you have to think long term that if the business ends up being profitable that it will help anyone who holds the coins. Likewise with any business that we can come up with that would be funded via shares in some form or another.

It should take very little time to install an off the shelf auction system.

After that, maybe put four people on one share a round as admins for it, ten hours per month each, and let them gradually modify it fancy it up etc toward doing anything we want/need it to do that, off the shelf, it doesn't already do.

If that seems to be making progress but not fast enough, consider adding some more one share a round admins to it, to increase the number of hours a month being put into it.

-MarkM-

EDIT: It might even be that installing an off the shelf auction system is done simply by clicking one button in the cpanel or whatever panel the hosting company provides to the website admin. So maybe someone who already admins one of our domains and uses cpanel or other similar type of panel can click on each auction site the panel offers then we can all look and see if any of them have anything useful and if not which is closest to being able to be modified/forked to produce what we want?

I didnt know that, cool... I was actually looking at one that seems to be professional and better than the others I looked at... its $899 on ebay original price of $1200: http://www.ebay.ca/itm/171047705105?ssPageName=STRK:MESELX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1555.l2649

There are others like: http://itechscripts.com/quibids_clone.html which is $240 + $160 for source and $70 for SEO package. I think the first one has some better featurs, but the second one would do the job as well.

THe first one (if we plan to allow fiat) would have ability to set tax codes up or just simply enable it and the current tax rates would be applied to where you live... and the second one allows you to simply say hey, your in USA? Sucks to be you, you cant register.

An important thing to remember is that I suggested a penny auction, not just a normal auction. These style of quibids style auction sites generate insane profit and are easily organized since the company is the only one who is doing the selling. What we want to leverage is the share system so that we can buy things and put them up for sale and generate profit on the go. Report these profits monthly, and spend the profit either to buy up the exchange rate or on another resource like maybe funding bounties or something.

By leveraging the share system we actually seperate ourselves from a traditional business so you can answer the question, "Why dont I just start this business my self without the help of Devcoin?", well devcoin is funding it so unless you have a continous funding stream good luck, with Devcoin we have it and so we use it to try to bring in a profit.

Im not sure what the right number is, but we need for it to grow as demand increases. Either the price rises of devcoin to allow for this or the number of shares are increased and sold at market to buy the things needed to sell. Anyways I'll try to start a writeup.

This is all very interesting

Are you talking about incorporating Devtome so that income can be reported? It would be difficult to do it otherwise.

The auction templates have reporting features for what was sold and for how much... we also would know how many coins we used to purchase the item for ( an admin whos buys it tracks that ) So you would be able to derive profits from there..

If we stay away from fiat then I dont think we would need to incorporate anything.. However if we do then yea we would have to get all the legal things right and prove how much we make for tax.

markm

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Activity: 2940

Merit: 1090

I think the way that crypto coins currently work getting them is like playing World of Warcraft or whatever, it is all just theoretical points that might or might not actually end up being sold for something real.

So your earnings as a Devtome author aren't really earnings at all, they are just like Dragon Kill Points in an RPG, the Devtome uses them to measure the relative contributions of the team.

Your earnings however as a seller of devcoins for fiat on an exchange are earnings, as are your barter earnings if you barter devcoins for something real of real value such as a cup of coffee or a meal or rent or whatever.

I am not licensed to practice law on this planet though so check with your own local licensed practitioners.

-MarkM-

Bittzy78

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Activity: 1176

Merit: 1019

I do not give financial advice .. do your own DD

Quote from: sidhujag on January 20, 2014, 04:15:50 PM

Quote from: markm on January 20, 2014, 04:04:09 PM

Quote from: sidhujag on January 20, 2014, 03:54:45 PM

Quote from: dalamar96 on January 20, 2014, 03:48:42 PM

Quote from: sidhujag on January 20, 2014, 03:44:34 PM

Seems awfully strange that when a round ends and payments begin that there are large dumps every time. Maybe not you but in general. There were not really many bounties before so we ruled out developers as noone even bothered developing when you can write yourself a share per hour and in a week have yourself more shares than a months worth of developement and testing.

I don't want to get in an argument about it right now as I am not thinking exactly straight. But, from what i have seen of the bounties here with the "months worth of work and testing" for things isn't quite there. The main thing I have seen for development is lets get an idea and throw code at it without thinking about it. I am not saying that the writing is of par either, there are a LOT of article I wouldn't have given 1/5th a share to that got 10, but the coding isn't on par either with the bounties that have been given out that i have seen. I am sure there are a few that have been worth it, just like some of the writing. Just as an example the way the auction bounty has been discussed (and now dropped it seems) was handled. Not interested in working on it at all, and do not think it would be worth the proposed bounty were it to come to light in the current form.

But bounties are one-offs unless you think the mistakes are being repeated, then bring it up to the bounty admin and we should review how much a bounty should be worth. But at the same time we shoudl review how much each word is worth with bounties in mind as well?

I think the auction bounty of 50 shares is fine, its probably more alot more if we have to create it from scratch, I think 50 is good for starting from a template adding coin payments, setting up initial share offerings etc, all the ad banners and marketing. Its not just 1 person unless noone wants to do it. The benefits also outweigh the bounty as you have to think long term that if the business ends up being profitable that it will help anyone who holds the coins. Likewise with any business that we can come up with that would be funded via shares in some form or another.

It should take very little time to install an off the shelf auction system.

After that, maybe put four people on one share a round as admins for it, ten hours per month each, and let them gradually modify it fancy it up etc toward doing anything we want/need it to do that, off the shelf, it doesn't already do.

If that seems to be making progress but not fast enough, consider adding some more one share a round admins to it, to increase the number of hours a month being put into it.

-MarkM-

EDIT: It might even be that installing an off the shelf auction system is done simply by clicking one button in the cpanel or whatever panel the hosting company provides to the website admin. So maybe someone who already admins one of our domains and uses cpanel or other similar type of panel can click on each auction site the panel offers then we can all look and see if any of them have anything useful and if not which is closest to being able to be modified/forked to produce what we want?

I didnt know that, cool... I was actually looking at one that seems to be professional and better than the others I looked at... its $899 on ebay original price of $1200: http://www.ebay.ca/itm/171047705105?ssPageName=STRK:MESELX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1555.l2649

There are others like: http://itechscripts.com/quibids_clone.html which is $240 + $160 for source and $70 for SEO package. I think the first one has some better featurs, but the second one would do the job as well.

THe first one (if we plan to allow fiat) would have ability to set tax codes up or just simply enable it and the current tax rates would be applied to where you live... and the second one allows you to simply say hey, your in USA? Sucks to be you, you cant register.

An important thing to remember is that I suggested a penny auction, not just a normal auction. These style of quibids style auction sites generate insane profit and are easily organized since the company is the only one who is doing the selling. What we want to leverage is the share system so that we can buy things and put them up for sale and generate profit on the go. Report these profits monthly, and spend the profit either to buy up the exchange rate or on another resource like maybe funding bounties or something.

By leveraging the share system we actually seperate ourselves from a traditional business so you can answer the question, "Why dont I just start this business my self without the help of Devcoin?", well devcoin is funding it so unless you have a continous funding stream good luck, with Devcoin we have it and so we use it to try to bring in a profit.

Im not sure what the right number is, but we need for it to grow as demand increases. Either the price rises of devcoin to allow for this or the number of shares are increased and sold at market to buy the things needed to sell. Anyways I'll try to start a writeup.

This is all very interesting

Are you talking about incorporating Devtome so that income can be reported? It would be difficult to do it otherwise.

sidhujag

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Quote from: novacadian on January 20, 2014, 05:56:30 PM

Re: Auction and other businesses

If you want to get some coins together than hold a raffle. Put up a shadow site that sells tickets. Try to keep it within the community as best can to keep New York State off your back. You can get a site for $100/month in the caribbean islands that will put you under their gambling license umbrella. As long as you do not know the purchase is coming from the USA because of a credit card you are not subject to their law. Got that from a high priced lawyer for another gambling project. DVC wallets would have no such trace.

No outlay of coins if you make it a 50:50 raffle. 50% for the winner and 50% for the house.

No risk, no outlay. Simple. Why over complicate things and distract from the mandate of this project?

If that works how about office pools on football games?

That code should be kicking round my backups somewhere if a bounty is put out for it.

Parents buy into such raffles all the time to support their children's interests. Schools do it. Churches do it. Asking money from their communities to fund said communities. Why not expect the same from this community?

There are people claiming ownership of millions of DVC. Why should we be looking outside of the community to raise funds?

- Nova

If you can get some coins together using that approach I would think thats just another business, and a profitable one at that. Just another way to spend your devcoins. I think all these things are great things we are discussing.

sidhujag

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Quote from: dalamar96 on January 20, 2014, 04:55:50 PM

Quote from: markm on January 20, 2014, 04:50:49 PM

I think the business model is indeed in question.

What will it take to convince people to use our actions instead of famous ones, ones that have lots more items up for sale at all times, ones that do not require muscking about with cryptocoins even maybe. Already people with bitcoins can supposedly use a widget in their browser that lets them buy anything at any normal (or major?) website, with the website only seeing the fiat it wants and the bitcoin user actually paying the magic card people (who make the browser plugin) in bitcoins. Cannot such services work on auction sites as well as retailing sites? If so, why not just use such a service and go to the real quibids or whatever and use your cryptocoins there?

Etc.

-MarkM-

Exactly,

What is stopping Quibids from using your coins at somepoint and having the user base and auctions already running compltely undermining your site. Even if they don't use coinbase and get the cash then go to quibids instead. it is a lot of work, and research that has to be done to make a site that can compete with quibids or the other one that does similar auctions and the advertising and what not to get seen and the acceptance of crypto. I don't think this is feasible for one person to take on (Even a small group of people unless they are in it heart and soul and care not about the chance of failure and no profit just to build it because they can like the open source community does. That is why I joined, way back. Because I could do it, why not.)

Hey if quibids accepts devcoins sweet, then that negates the need for such a site, I would call that a win.

novacadian

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Merit: 104

Re: Auction and other businesses

If you want to get some coins together than hold a raffle. Put up a shadow site that sells tickets. Try to keep it within the community as best can to keep New York State off your back. You can get a site for $100/month in the caribbean islands that will put you under their gambling license umbrella. As long as you do not know the purchase is coming from the USA because of a credit card you are not subject to their law. Got that from a high priced lawyer for another gambling project. DVC wallets would have no such trace.

No outlay of coins if you make it a 50:50 raffle. 50% for the winner and 50% for the house.

No risk, no outlay. Simple. Why over complicate things and distract from the mandate of this project?

If that works how about office pools on football games?

That code should be kicking round my backups somewhere if a bounty is put out for it.

Parents buy into such raffles all the time to support their children's interests. Schools do it. Churches do it. Asking money from their communities to fund said communities. Why not expect the same from this community?

There are people claiming ownership of millions of DVC. Why should we be looking outside of the community to raise funds?

- Nova

sidhujag

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Merit: 1005

Quote from: markm on January 20, 2014, 05:30:14 PM

You missed the (*) I added regarding my usage of the word "you".

Maybe Devcoin Venture Capital would be a more-great initial venture/project?

I will take a look at Devcorp and General Financial Corp to see if maybe either of those could actually serve in that role.

-MarkM-

Why not use what we already have? You want people to fund coins initially, for how long? Did devtome do the same thing? Fund people for writing great material to drive up ad revenue until the target is reached?

No, so why would this be any different?

markm

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Activity: 2940

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You missed the (*) I added regarding my usage of the word "you".

Maybe Devcoin Venture Capital would be a more-great initial venture/project?

I will take a look at Devcorp and General Financial Corp to see if maybe either of those could actually serve in that role.

-MarkM-

sidhujag

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Activity: 2044

Merit: 1005

Quote from: markm on January 20, 2014, 05:18:52 PM

Quote from: sidhujag on January 20, 2014, 05:04:20 PM

Look at it this way:

with your way if no bids are sold, no auction. Everything stops.
with my way, if noone is buying bids, an auction still takes place, someone gets something for real cheap, people find out they make sure they are ready the next time. Forces people to come in.

The loss is eaten up as a CODB, its nothing different then assigning a share to anything else we give today. We are not earning profit from it, but it may help us out in the future.

That is exactly why I never started such a site myself, totally regardless of crypto vs fiat.

I figured what would happen would be people would keep it secret because they like the fact we keep trying to drum up business by in effect giving away stuff cheaper than what we paid for the stuff.

There is no incentive for them to tell anyone about it unless maybe someone they care about really likes something we offer that they don't want themselves and also don't want to pick up dirt cheap to give to that other someone as a present next present-giving-occassion.

(Heck they could buy all our stuff dirt cheap then go sell it on ebay at a profit!)

Frankly you strike me as being all about getting a bounty rather than about you running a profitable business which one way or another happens to benefit Devcoin.

If it is not a great enough idea that someone will do it anyway without a bounty maybe it is not a great enough idea to bother doing at all.

Devcoin was originally about rewarding them for great free open source they already did, not bribing people who aren't going to do it or aren't going to do it as free open source into doing something.

Seems like too many people are about creating bounties, preferably for things they themselves can do, instead of about just doing something that needs doing.

This auction site idea seems less and less like something that needs doing.

-MarkM-

I said it before I would be more pleased to get a profitable business up and running! I dont see how it is bribing at all, I dont see how you can correlate that with what I said. You don't seem to get the concept at all. Alot of people im sure buy stuff on quibids and resell it.. why are they still in business? If I was all about the bounty then wouldn't I also be the one to be dumping everything I earn? I told you I never sold any.

Yes people may keep it a secret sure, but its the same with any business at all, if your getting a deal keep it to yourself? Its up to us the admins of devcoin to get the word out, and eventually it will spread (like any other business that works). That seems to be a heck of a better problem then not having a profitable business in the first place is!

LOL now you are saying that its a bad idea because noone would do it without a bounty? cmon Mark get real! so writers should be given no coins then for writing? Lets see if they keep writing for the love of it because "its a good idea".. you want to pay people for open source for good will, but forget that its the business side of things that will help raise the exchange rate, not donations.

sidhujag

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Merit: 1005

Quote from: dalamar96 on January 20, 2014, 05:17:19 PM

Quote from: sidhujag on January 20, 2014, 05:15:10 PM

Quote from: dalamar96 on January 20, 2014, 05:12:21 PM

Quote from: sidhujag on January 20, 2014, 05:10:14 PM

Quote from: dalamar96 on January 20, 2014, 05:07:50 PM

Quote from: sidhujag on January 20, 2014, 05:04:20 PM

I get it and I know what you are saying, but just that I dont know how that would work and its another variable. Yes it would eliminate the need to have an upfront cost, but it also eliminates possible demand. Alot of people join up on quibids because they see that there is an auction to be started in 4 hours and it will last 2 hours and they can have a new TV for real cheap. With this model its not possible unless bids are always bought at a certain rate, especially for bigger things. I don't see this as viable long term, but it may be... if this was the way to go, im questioning why quibids has auctions all the time and they didn't go this route since this would eliminate need for captial upfront.

It isn't that that one auction will make them money, it is that overall the 100's they do / day will make them money. 1 bid being .6$ or 1020 DVC will give them enough income for that auction (even if the auction hit 10$ that is about 600$ for them which covers that TV easily, they order it and send it off to the winner. No big deal.

Yes and I am proposing we use ALL of the profits to help devcoin exchange rate, not to recycle in the business which takes away the whole point of why I wanted to do this.

except that the person that writes this site and does the work will not want to just put that money back into Devcoin (at least not all of it) and will keep it. Therefore not helping DevCoin in that manner, other then the auction site itself.

No no you dont get it, the profits will be visible to anyone. Just like share dispersion, admins can log in and see, all of the profits will be in a wallet with a known public key that you can see balance of on the blockchain. If there is corruption then it is shutdown or rectified simple as that... same goes for anything in devcoin.

No it won't, becuase the person will have to pay for the item after they win the bid, and that will most likely be in USD rather then DEV. Therefore there is no record in the wild of the transaction.

They pay for the item before they win the bid, the bid is the payment. We convert the coins used to pay bids we get back for devcoins via marketplace like vircurex. If its USD we go to btc first.

So if you need to see an audit, then thats why I said end of each month a report would be issues with what was sold for what etc, im sure these systems I mentioned offer that. From there you can see that if all the auction closing prices match, then this much profit was made, you can derive it yourself and see if that balance matches whats in the wallet.

markm

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Activity: 2940

Merit: 1090

Quote from: sidhujag on January 20, 2014, 05:04:20 PM

Look at it this way:

with your way if no bids are sold, no auction. Everything stops.
with my way, if noone is buying bids, an auction still takes place, someone gets something for real cheap, people find out they make sure they are ready the next time. Forces people to come in.

The loss is eaten up as a CODB, its nothing different then assigning a share to anything else we give today. We are not earning profit from it, but it may help us out in the future.

That is exactly why I never started such a site myself, totally regardless of crypto vs fiat.

I figured what would happen would be people would keep it secret because they like the fact we keep trying to drum up business by in effect giving away stuff cheaper than what we paid for the stuff.

There is no incentive for them to tell anyone about it unless maybe someone they care about really likes something we offer that they don't want themselves and also don't want to pick up dirt cheap to give to that other someone as a present next present-giving-occassion.

(Heck they could buy all our stuff dirt cheap then go sell it on ebay at a profit!)

Frankly you (*) strike me as being all about getting a bounty rather than about you running a profitable business which one way or another happens to benefit Devcoin.

If it is not a great enough idea that someone will do it anyway without a bounty maybe it is not a great enough idea to bother doing at all.

Devcoin was originally about rewarding them for great free open source they already did, not bribing people who aren't going to do it or aren't going to do it as free open source into doing something.

Seems like too many people are about creating bounties, preferably for things they themselves can do, instead of about just doing something that needs doing.

This auction site idea seems less and less like something that needs doing.

* Not sure exactly who, its a general impression garnered across the whole thread.

-MarkM-

dalamar96

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Activity: 70

Merit: 10

Quote from: sidhujag on January 20, 2014, 05:15:10 PM

Quote from: dalamar96 on January 20, 2014, 05:12:21 PM

Quote from: sidhujag on January 20, 2014, 05:10:14 PM

Quote from: dalamar96 on January 20, 2014, 05:07:50 PM

Quote from: sidhujag on January 20, 2014, 05:04:20 PM

I get it and I know what you are saying, but just that I dont know how that would work and its another variable. Yes it would eliminate the need to have an upfront cost, but it also eliminates possible demand. Alot of people join up on quibids because they see that there is an auction to be started in 4 hours and it will last 2 hours and they can have a new TV for real cheap. With this model its not possible unless bids are always bought at a certain rate, especially for bigger things. I don't see this as viable long term, but it may be... if this was the way to go, im questioning why quibids has auctions all the time and they didn't go this route since this would eliminate need for captial upfront.

It isn't that that one auction will make them money, it is that overall the 100's they do / day will make them money. 1 bid being .6$ or 1020 DVC will give them enough income for that auction (even if the auction hit 10$ that is about 600$ for them which covers that TV easily, they order it and send it off to the winner. No big deal.

Yes and I am proposing we use ALL of the profits to help devcoin exchange rate, not to recycle in the business which takes away the whole point of why I wanted to do this.

except that the person that writes this site and does the work will not want to just put that money back into Devcoin (at least not all of it) and will keep it. Therefore not helping DevCoin in that manner, other then the auction site itself.

No no you dont get it, the profits will be visible to anyone. Just like share dispersion, admins can log in and see, all of the profits will be in a wallet with a known public key that you can see balance of on the blockchain. If there is corruption then it is shutdown or rectified simple as that... same goes for anything in devcoin.

No it won't, becuase the person will have to pay for the item after they win the bid, and that will most likely be in USD rather then DEV. Therefore there is no record in the wild of the transaction. Not to mention that they are an entity of thier own and you can't shut them down, they jsut won't get shares from the project, by that time it is too late, they got their shares and put up a for profit site that is making them money either way.

dalamar96

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Merit: 10

Quote from: markm on January 20, 2014, 05:11:49 PM

Quote from: dalamar96 on January 20, 2014, 04:46:53 PM

Ok, this is a complete departure from the initial discussion. If someone were to build the site themselves and do the research and what not, what would be the motivation besides the "possible profits".

Why would any motivation other than a cut of (or all of) the profits be needed?

If it is not going to be profitable we don't want to finance it, surely?

If the person who will do it does not think it will be profitable ought we not know that about them instead of getting sucked in by some glib talker who offers to do it even though they themselves think it will not be profitable?

Maybe we should go about this a different way entirely:

Tell people that if they incorporate a corporation to startup such a venture, then Devcoin Venture Capital project or corporation will seriously consider investing in it when it reaches its proof of concept / first call for venture capital stage?

Maybe we would be better off setting up a Devcoin Venture Capital corporation than any particular type of project that might be worth venturing Devcoin capital on?

Devcoin Angels maybe could help with the startup, in an angel round, before the big venture capital firms such as Devcoin Venture Capital Incorporated are invited to participate in an 'A' round?

That seems to be the way Bitcoin is going.

-MarkM-

Now that i am 100% behind! DevAngles I can get behind!

sidhujag

legendary

Activity: 2044

Merit: 1005

Quote from: dalamar96 on January 20, 2014, 05:12:21 PM

Quote from: sidhujag on January 20, 2014, 05:10:14 PM

Quote from: dalamar96 on January 20, 2014, 05:07:50 PM

Quote from: sidhujag on January 20, 2014, 05:04:20 PM

I get it and I know what you are saying, but just that I dont know how that would work and its another variable. Yes it would eliminate the need to have an upfront cost, but it also eliminates possible demand. Alot of people join up on quibids because they see that there is an auction to be started in 4 hours and it will last 2 hours and they can have a new TV for real cheap. With this model its not possible unless bids are always bought at a certain rate, especially for bigger things. I don't see this as viable long term, but it may be... if this was the way to go, im questioning why quibids has auctions all the time and they didn't go this route since this would eliminate need for captial upfront.

It isn't that that one auction will make them money, it is that overall the 100's they do / day will make them money. 1 bid being .6$ or 1020 DVC will give them enough income for that auction (even if the auction hit 10$ that is about 600$ for them which covers that TV easily, they order it and send it off to the winner. No big deal.

Yes and I am proposing we use ALL of the profits to help devcoin exchange rate, not to recycle in the business which takes away the whole point of why I wanted to do this.

except that the person that writes this site and does the work will not want to just put that money back into Devcoin (at least not all of it) and will keep it. Therefore not helping DevCoin in that manner, other then the auction site itself.

No no you dont get it, the profits will be visible to anyone. Just like share dispersion, admins can log in and see, all of the profits will be in a wallet with a known public key that you can see balance of on the blockchain. If there is corruption then it is shutdown or rectified simple as that... same goes for anything in devcoin.

dalamar96

member

Activity: 70

Merit: 10

Quote from: sidhujag on January 20, 2014, 05:10:14 PM

Quote from: dalamar96 on January 20, 2014, 05:07:50 PM

Quote from: sidhujag on January 20, 2014, 05:04:20 PM

I get it and I know what you are saying, but just that I dont know how that would work and its another variable. Yes it would eliminate the need to have an upfront cost, but it also eliminates possible demand. Alot of people join up on quibids because they see that there is an auction to be started in 4 hours and it will last 2 hours and they can have a new TV for real cheap. With this model its not possible unless bids are always bought at a certain rate, especially for bigger things. I don't see this as viable long term, but it may be... if this was the way to go, im questioning why quibids has auctions all the time and they didn't go this route since this would eliminate need for captial upfront.

It isn't that that one auction will make them money, it is that overall the 100's they do / day will make them money. 1 bid being .6$ or 1020 DVC will give them enough income for that auction (even if the auction hit 10$ that is about 600$ for them which covers that TV easily, they order it and send it off to the winner. No big deal.

Yes and I am proposing we use ALL of the profits to help devcoin exchange rate, not to recycle in the business which takes away the whole point of why I wanted to do this.

except that the person that writes this site and does the work will not want to just put that money back into Devcoin (at least not all of it) and will keep it. Therefore not helping DevCoin in that manner, other then the auction site itself.

markm

legendary

Activity: 2940

Merit: 1090

Quote from: dalamar96 on January 20, 2014, 04:46:53 PM

Ok, this is a complete departure from the initial discussion. If someone were to build the site themselves and do the research and what not, what would be the motivation besides the "possible profits".

Why would any motivation other than a cut of (or all of) the profits be needed?

If it is not going to be profitable we don't want to finance it, surely?

If the person who will do it does not think it will be profitable ought we not know that about them instead of getting sucked in by some glib talker who offers to do it even though they themselves think it will not be profitable?

Maybe we should go about this a different way entirely:

Tell people that if they incorporate a corporation to startup such a venture, then Devcoin Venture Capital project or corporation will seriously consider investing in it when it reaches its proof of concept / first call for venture capital stage?

Maybe we would be better off setting up a Devcoin Venture Capital corporation than any particular type of project that might be worth venturing Devcoin capital on?

Devcoin Angels maybe could help with the startup, in an angel round, before the big venture capital firms such as Devcoin Venture Capital Incorporated are invited to participate in an 'A' round?

That seems to be the way Bitcoin is going.

-MarkM-

sidhujag

legendary

Activity: 2044

Merit: 1005

Quote from: dalamar96 on January 20, 2014, 05:07:50 PM

Quote from: sidhujag on January 20, 2014, 05:04:20 PM

I get it and I know what you are saying, but just that I dont know how that would work and its another variable. Yes it would eliminate the need to have an upfront cost, but it also eliminates possible demand. Alot of people join up on quibids because they see that there is an auction to be started in 4 hours and it will last 2 hours and they can have a new TV for real cheap. With this model its not possible unless bids are always bought at a certain rate, especially for bigger things. I don't see this as viable long term, but it may be... if this was the way to go, im questioning why quibids has auctions all the time and they didn't go this route since this would eliminate need for captial upfront.

It isn't that that one auction will make them money, it is that overall the 100's they do / day will make them money. 1 bid being .6$ or 1020 DVC will give them enough income for that auction (even if the auction hit 10$ that is about 600$ for them which covers that TV easily, they order it and send it off to the winner. No big deal.

Yes and I am proposing we use ALL of the profits to help devcoin exchange rate, not to recycle in the business which takes away the whole point of why I wanted to do this.

You need the items to be available to be bid enough in a timely manor that is convenient to the users, any user. So thats why I said we should start with a few and stagger them across the week. That way we have like one good auction a day to start. Later as we grow we can have more and more.. and all profits go to the right proceeds.

Topic: [DVC]DevCoin - Official Thread - Moderated - page 232. (Read 1059181 times)