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Topic: El Salvador has become the first country to make #Bitcoin legal tender! 🇸🇻 - page 99. (Read 38876 times)

legendary
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El Salvador President Nayib Bukele is quite strong and a hard believer of bitcoin. From his tweets and activities relative to bitcoin we can understand. Earlier he gave a small advice to the common people on the price decline of bitcoin as an opportunity to invest and never look upon the charts and get worried. With the present purchase of more 80BTC the reserve gets changed to 2381BTC

But his trend is rather strange, the lower the price of bitcoin, the fewer coins he buys. ) Perhaps there is not much free money now, as one would like, because crisis came, but on the other hand, perhaps he simply does not buy much because he is waiting for a further fall in prices. After all, when the market grows you expect growth, and when it falls, you expect a further fall, such a psychology.

It seems to me that the phenomena of buying less as the BTC price goes down exists in a lot of goods/assets.  It seems to be some kind of variation of the wealth-effect.. in which people buy more as a good/asset goes up and less as it goes down.

And, surely I doubt that the "wealth-effect" is merely psychological, because the HODLer does actually have more money as the price goes up.. and does actually have less money as the price goes down.

I did the something similar in bitcoin in 2014/2015 as the BTC price went down through 2014, I kept buying on the way down, but not only did I run out of money, at some point, I started to run out of confidence too regarding how long any bounce is going to take (or if it will even happen)... a gruelling effect (mentally and financially as the price is going down).  

One thing is to just HODL without selling on the way down (so that is an accomplishment - so long as the price goes back up at some point soon enough before you die or get reckt), and then another thing is to take that whole practice to another level in terms of buying on the way down - even if the amount bought is less - when no bounce comes, there is an ever pestering sound "why did you buy now?", and "why not wait for lower prices?" and "do you think that there is going to be a bounce, crazy?".  

One redeeming aspect for anyone having ongoing and incoming cashflow (which seems to be the case with El Salvador - coming also from BTC-related activities in the country) is that the ongoing buying (even at low prices) ends up serving as a kind of reluctant and worrisome form of DCA (that can also be characterized as buying on dip.. but buying on dip with less enthusiasm as compared with buying on dips when the BTC price is higher.. and regular UPpity bounces).  If the incoming cashflow dries up, that's another question (would likely cause more reluctance to continue to buy).

Edited to fix some wording and make some ideas more clear
sr. member
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<…> any one have details about how much bitcoin invests by El Salvador President Nayib Bukele ?
So far, the aggregate should be 2.381 BTCs. I’ve checked a bunch of bitcoin treasury sites, and none of them are up-to-date for the country, but my count coincides with that of local media, so I’m pretty confident it’s the figure resulting from the aggregate of all their past purchases.

The do have a government based transparency website, which would be a great place to have this information, taking into account that every purchase is tweeted, and that Salvadorians would likely like to have the detail easily accessible in an official site, as opposed to having people needing to track twitter tolls.

President Nayib Bukele still has a strong belief in bitcoin so far and it is precisely when the price crash hit crypto that he has again added to his digital foreign exchange liquidity by buying as much as 80 BTC, so currently the estimated total assets owned by El Salvador are around $103.9 million.
Although now many are worried about bankruptcy in the country of El Salvador, but it seems that President Nayib Bukele still believes in his principles and desires in turning El Salvador into a country that fully adopts Bitcoin financial, I agree that El Salvador should create a website or special authority that does hold the authority to make data transparency and value of bitcoin or other crypto assets owned by El Salvador, so that their people can access and see firsthand the value of assets owned by their government.
legendary
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<…> any one have details about how much bitcoin invests by El Salvador President Nayib Bukele ?
So far, the aggregate should be 2.381 BTCs. I’ve checked a bunch of bitcoin treasury sites, and none of them are up-to-date for the country, but my count coincides with that of local media, so I’m pretty confident it’s the figure resulting from the aggregate of all their past purchases.

The do have a government based transparency website, which would be a great place to have this information, taking into account that every purchase is tweeted, and that Salvadorians would likely like to have the detail easily accessible in an official site, as opposed to having people needing to track twitter tolls.
sr. member
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Looks El Salvador President Nayib Bukele  as diamond hands because he can waiting with bitcoin price until nowadays, we know how many time he spent money for investing in bitcoin trough still on higher price, if keep true with holding bitcoin assets until nowadays we can't expected with how much losing until right now. Ever bough bitcoin when price still up above $40,000 before several months ago he spent and invested on bitcoin still have price above $30,000. But depending with twitter El Salvador President Nayib Bukele he try to invested again 80 bitcoin on $19,000 right now any one have details about how much bitcoin invests by El Salvador President Nayib Bukele ?
legendary
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El Salvador President Nayib Bukele is quite strong and a hard believer of bitcoin. From his tweets and activities relative to bitcoin we can understand. Earlier he gave a small advice to the common people on the price decline of bitcoin as an opportunity to invest and never look upon the charts and get worried. With the present purchase of more 80BTC the reserve gets changed to 2381BTC

But his trend is rather strange, the lower the price of bitcoin, the fewer coins he buys. ) Perhaps there is not much free money now, as one would like, because crisis came, but on the other hand, perhaps he simply does not buy much because he is waiting for a further fall in prices. After all, when the market grows you expect growth, and when it falls, you expect a further fall, such a psychology.
hero member
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El Salvador did not sell any of their bitcoins. And El Salvador announced today they just bought another 80 bitcoin at $19k.
It confirms that they had a well-thought-out plan before investing in bitcoin. Bitcoin price drop has never made them difficult but a huge opportunity for El Salvador.
I believe Nayib Bukele has been doing the right thing all along.


Good Luck
Duke
El Salvador President Nayib Bukele is quite strong and a hard believer of bitcoin. From his tweets and activities relative to bitcoin we can understand. Earlier he gave a small advice to the common people on the price decline of bitcoin as an opportunity to invest and never look upon the charts and get worried. With the present purchase of more 80BTC the reserve gets changed to 2381BTC
With the purchase of 80 Bitcoins the average value is $19,000 then the amount ($1,520,000) according to Wacher.guru.
President Nayib Bukele has consistently believed in bitcoin, so he is buying continuously at lower prices, what he has now is good hope for the future so I think he will continue to add bitcoins if prices are still low.
According to the German bank (Deutsche Bank) that the price of bitcoin will return to $28,000 by the end of 2022 it is possible that what President Nayib Bukele has during his buying low will see the expected payoff.
legendary
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El Salvador did not sell any of their bitcoins. And El Salvador announced today they just bought another 80 bitcoin at $19k.
It confirms that they had a well-thought-out plan before investing in bitcoin. Bitcoin price drop has never made them difficult but a huge opportunity for El Salvador.
I believe Nayib Bukele has been doing the right thing all along.





Good Luck

Duke
El Salvador President Nayib Bukele is quite strong and a hard believer of bitcoin. From his tweets and activities relative to bitcoin we can understand. Earlier he gave a small advice to the common people on the price decline of bitcoin as an opportunity to invest and never look upon the charts and get worried. With the present purchase of more 80BTC the reserve gets changed to 2381BTC
legendary
Activity: 1974
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El Salvador did not sell any of their bitcoins. And El Salvador announced today they just bought another 80 bitcoin at $19k.
It confirms that they had a well-thought-out plan before investing in bitcoin. Bitcoin price drop has never made them difficult but a huge opportunity for El Salvador.
I believe Nayib Bukele has been doing the right thing all along.





Good Luck

Duke
sr. member
Activity: 1330
Merit: 289
This doesn't age well. Is it just me or feel like they're going too fast and too forceful with all the transit and implementation the Bitcoin in El Salvador's economy. Not taking into account the bear market and high volatility from it pushes normal citizens to stay out. Only use it to the bare minimum to keep their fiat value stable.
despite that I have not digest and understand this nehru you pass as information towards your statement and your comment I know quite well that the market of cryptocurrency cannot be comparable to the value of a Fiat currency so therefore both of them have a different thing in common especially the way they are values runs. So the area of converting cryptocurrency or converting whatever to stable from what I understood the longer it stays and shorten it stays did not contribute or add any value to it since it is a stable if we experience a bearish market it will not reflect to it since you place it in stable.
hero member
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El Salvador 🇸🇻 Bitcoin adoption have been the topics of discussion in various quarters and some of the objections to the Bitcoin adoption are on the ground of citizens not having adequate knowledge and information about Bitcoin.
And inline with El Salvador government quest to educate it citizens, the first batch of the diploma certificate in Bitcoin study have successfully completed their study and been issued diploma certificates from the government's institutions.

https://webtimes.uk/38-high-school-students-in-el-salvador-earned-a-bitcoin-diploma/
legendary
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There are lies, damned lies and statistics. MTwain
El Salvador has received its first privately funded investments in the country that aim at mining Bitcoin. I’ve seen different articles pointing at a 200M $ investment, although the articles referenced (and Google translated) below seems to depict the plan better than other media that just focus on the above figure. The investors are seemingly a Swiss consortium, led by a local investor called Josué López.

The plan is to initially create a photovoltaic plant in the area of Chalatenango (first stone – so as to say – has already been laid), investing an initial 4M $ which should build-up to 15M $ eventually into a plant that should produce 6 Megawatts in the long run (though staring-off with a quarter of that). That plant should essentially power bitcoin mining operations.

The 200M $ figure thrown around here and there seems to be the global figure They're going to invest in energy driven projects, including other hydroelectric projects which I believe are not necessarily bitcoin mining driven, but rather energy driven per se.

See:
https://diarioelsalvador-com.translate.goog/construiran-primera-planta-solar-para-minar-bitcoin-en-el-pais/243550/?_x_tr_sl=es&_x_tr_tl=en&_x_tr_hl=es&_x_tr_pto=wapp

https://www-criptonoticias-com.translate.goog/mineria/minaran-bitcoin-energia-solar-zona-norte-el-salvador/?_x_tr_sl=es&_x_tr_tl=en&_x_tr_hl=es&_x_tr_pto=wapp
legendary
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Following El Salvador, now we've got Morocco on the list. The Moroccan Central Bank is working on a framework for the cryptocurrency regulation and this bill is to be introduced soon according to the bank's governor.

The framework is developed in a way to work against the anti money laundering and terrorism financing. Morocco is one among the country that is said to adopt crypto in the past. Slowly more countries will take initiative with some better plans avoiding the mistake that the country that adopted cryptocurrency earlier. This way the adoption process and the legal framework will be flawless. Here Morocco have considered the balance of innovation and consumer protection as the key factor.

Morocco's Central Bank to Unveil Crypto Regulation Bill Soon
member
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This doesn't age well. Is it just me or feel like they're going too fast and too forceful with all the transit and implementation the Bitcoin in El Salvador's economy. Not taking into account the bear market and high volatility from it pushes normal citizens to stay out. Only use it to the bare minimum to keep their fiat value stable.
hero member
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I think they have spent much state budget for investing with bitcoin but nowadays when bitcoin drop drastically how much money loss, hope they have sold bitcoin trough have reach higher price and right now they can try to buy back when bitcoin still have lower price.

One thing that is common to bitcoiners is that they keep on buying even when it's going dip, that's the kind of mindset we have in, El-Savador interest on bitcoin isn't just as a currency but also as an investment which will yield in due time, they bought about 500btc earlier when the price goes down to $30k and yet that is never good enough to stop the buy now that it's as low as $20k, the more the buy the higher the tendencies to realize more when the price begin to pump up.
legendary
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Before adopting bitcoin as legal currency transaction and they invested on bitcoin need to make research about bitcoin negative and positive side, exactly El Savador try to be investor with bitcoin trough price still pump.
We do not know the plans they had before making the conclusion to buy bitcoin at the price they bought it. It would have been more profitable if they buy at low price though, but what if they have made the analyses and knew bitcoin will at one point fall but later rise. People should not just conclude that El Salvador do not make research before investing.

If bitcoin hit $100000 like in next two years, don't you think El Salvador will be an example that would show people that bitcoin is a safe haven if they hold for long.

I think they have spent much state budget for investing with bitcoin but nowadays when bitcoin drop drastically how much money loss, hope they have sold bitcoin trough have reach higher price and right now they can try to buy back when bitcoin still have lower price.
El Salvador has not sold any bitcoin they are holding.

But El Salvador has not sold bitcoin still means that they are not yet losing, remember 1 BTC = 1 BTC. From the news we have read recently, it is clear that El Salvador is not selling any bitcoin holding. If selling, not this time.
legendary
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first time when bitcoin adopt by El Savador president price still expensive and what happen with El Savador assets bitcoin nowadays.
A hard decline have happened, but the government is very clear with the plans and the El Salvador President Nayib Bukele have mentioned with the positive and powerful facts of cryptocurrency. Don't go behind the charts, just enjoy bitcoin and have patience the recovery will happen.

Before adopting bitcoin as legal currency transaction and they invested on bitcoin need to make research about bitcoin negative and positive side.
A country won't directly get into adoption of bitcoin just because the president is interested. Though it is a small country it took its time and then only made it legal tender. So, they're well aware of the positive and negative part of cryptocurrency.


I think they have spent much state budget for investing with bitcoin but nowadays when bitcoin drop drastically how much money loss.
For this President indicated that the amount spend on bitcoin reserve of 2301BTC is not even 0.5 percentage of the country's budget. So, this isn't gonna affect them as the entire holding is still available and not sold.
sr. member
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Appreciated what did by El Savador and make bitcoin as legal currency digital transaction in their country, but first time when bitcoin adopt by El Savador president price still expensive and what happen with El Savador assets bitcoin nowadays. Before adopting bitcoin as legal currency transaction and they invested on bitcoin need to make research about bitcoin negative and positive side, exactly El Savador try to be investor with bitcoin trough price still pump. I think they have spent much state budget for investing with bitcoin but nowadays when bitcoin drop drastically how much money loss, hope they have sold bitcoin trough have reach higher price and right now they can try to buy back when bitcoin still have lower price.
legendary
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We should also not forget that El Salvador is a poor country, their president bought a risky investment near the all time high and he used taxpayers money to buy this risky investment. What would this make him appear in front of his constituents presently that bitcoin has dumped?
...

It is a question of enlightenment: if El Salvador's government wants to have high enough support despite low rates of bitcoin it should educate Salvadorians more and give them enough economical and crypto information. If Salvadorians will understand that it is not a problem that long term investments went down in short prospective they will still support their government despite low rates of bitcoin. If not... well, we all can guess what can be then.

As South American, my opinion is that the topic of education is a vicious circle when comes to countries with social problems. Education in general is an important weapon against poverty and manipulation, ignorance itself is something taken advantage of to manipulate the masses, we all know that.

One can call El Salvador a "poor" country and part of this problem is the lack of education and culture there are nations that have such a strong culture about work and education that allows its population to be reborn from the ashes, Japan is a good example.

The vicious circle starts when there is poverty that does not allow to get education and therefore there is a perpetuation of poverty. The president of Salvador (as any good president would) is trying to break this circle by attacking the poverty but he should also attack the ignorance at the same time, if possible, because we would encounter himself swimming against the stream otherwise. The vicious circles are quite hard to break at a personal level, ever harder at a nationwide level.

Education, and without it it is not possible to eliminate poverty, has never come from below, it is always declared and imposed from above, everything else, no matter how well it is organized, plays the role of enlightenment, and in any case, the "declaration on universal education" will include certain forms of propaganda, which is just interested in in maintaining the status quo, but not in the fight against poverty.

Even the President of El Salvador, who initiated the legalization of bitcoin in this situation, which you describe in the field of education, is also a kind of awareness-raising activity, which, however, pushes people who have the opportunity to own a digital asset to engage in self-education, which, it seems to me, always benefits both the person himself and society as a whole.

So speaking about the benefits of the act of legalization of bitcoin for the growth of its popularity, it should be borne in mind that it also benefits society as a whole, as it helps at least a little, but to improve the literacy of the population, which in the future may become a trigger in society's need for change.
legendary
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Self-Custody is a right. Say no to"Non-custodial"
...
I am glad that you appreciate that concept.. .. even though from my perspective, your valuing correct word usage still leads you and me to have differing views about the value of using the term crypto when talking about bitcoin and bitcoin's relationship to cryptocurrency and whether your use of the term crypto may well carry a lot of baggage about shitcoins based on actual happenings in the world.. rather than merely some abstract academic use of the proper use of the term when applying the use of the term to actual happenings in the world....and whether it matters or not..  which it seems to matter.
...

Right, we have different views on some terms. Your position is clear enough but I don't agree with it. I see that you are worried about possible misunderstanding but you are the only one who misunderstood me with my terminology as for now.

My initial response was to the below cited for convenience post:

...
The vicious circle starts when there is poverty that does not allow to get education and therefore there is a perpetuation of poverty. The president of Salvador (as any good president would) is trying to break this circle by attacking the poverty but he should also attack the ignorance at the same time, if possible, because we would encounter himself swimming against the stream otherwise. The vicious circles are quite hard to break at a personal level, ever harder at a nationwide level.
Yes, I understand that it is not a trivial problem to educate a society of an entire state so they can get better understanding of economy and crypto. But to adopt bitcoin we IMO have no other ways as any crypto solutions are still not so easy to use. To get all benefits crypto can give and not to lose crypto user should get enough economic knowledge. It is hard but it is the only way, IMHO. [/size]

Even though no one besides me complained about not understanding what you were talking about in the above cited post, I doubt anybody really understood what you were talking about in any kind of a sufficiently and adequately meaningful way. 

Their failure to respond does not mean that they understood anything, and yeah sure they could guess about what you meant, but that does not mean that you had communicated very much substantive meaning.. or even made it clear what you meant. especially when there would be a lot of vagueness there and even multiple readings could be arrived at. 

So you can deny and blame me for your vagueness, ambiguity (and possible misleadingness) all that you like... I doubt that you are being very realistic in your expectations that you had been communicating clearly about what you were talking about.

Even though I would not agree with any characterization of bitcoin education or implementation in El Salvador as a failure
...

Returning to an idea of correct words: I never named "bitcoin education or implementation in El Salvador as a failure" so no one expects you to agree with such strange idea. I talked about problems and the ways of their solving, it is definitely not the same.

It could be true that I read too much negativism into your assessment of the problems that you were pointing out.. but since we are on a public thread, there is no reason to take that kind of an overreading personally.. and in any event, it allowed some further fleshing out of the topic, too.

If to talk in general it doesn't really matter what way of adoption a random country chooses for bitcoin unless it's a kind of criminal ban on using or holding: bitcoin gives a lot of benefits even with just its existence. Being a competitive alternative it can give interesting options for using directly but even for those who don't use it directly it gives benefits anyway as bank system is motivated to be more client-oriented not to lose clients.

 It seems that a lot of folks have become interested and focused specifically in the way that El Salvador is going about their bitcoin approach (in a variety of angles) because El Salvador had chosen to implement bitcoin as legal tender law, which put them into a kind of unique position in regards to taking a comprehensive (rather than piece-meal) approach.. so that seems to make El Salvador more interesting rather than just any thing that a "random country" might decide to do. 

Sure, there are ways in which any of us could minimize the El Salvadorean efforts or proclaim that they are a rinky-dink country or to proclaim that their efforts are so lacking in success that the results create effects that are not much different from what a piece-meal approach might have been.  Whatever El Salvador is doing (even if lacking in success in some ways) still seems quite important in the whole scheme of things including providing some more pure laboratory grounds for bitcoin adoption experimentation and it seems to be an ongoing attempt at comprehensiveness across the whole country, even if some regions/cities are more advantaged than others to advance some bitcoin transactional/adoption practices.. some locations have more businesses and internet connections and other areas have more variety of people, and of course El Zonte.. (bitcoin beach) had a head start..

But as I do believe that it can give benefits from it's direct using and see that 71% of Salvadorians don't see the same while they've got all possible enabling legislative regulation for bitcoin I wonder what's the reason: if Salvadorians would knew what I know they'd definitely said that they have benefits from bitcoin adoption, so I conclude that the problem is in lack of knowledge. And the solution is in additional education.

Sure.  It could take a decent amount of time in a lot of ways in terms of some of the normal El Salvadorean people to just getting used to what it is like to have a form of banking that might be different from traditional banking but still if they had not really had access to any kind of traditional banking then they might have some different ways of learning about banking like activities and even some skepticisms regarding even there might be any benefits in having access to a different kind of bank (bitcoin) which would have the possibility of also increasing monetary options in which there are likely going to be a decent number of mistakes that regular people are going to make along their learning journey.. and then also if there are likely going to be some challenges for some folks in getting used to the internet and technology.. even though apparently, El Salvador does seem to have a decent amount of mobile devices penetration.. but surely bitcoin implementation can cause incentives to build and to adopt those kinds of infrastructure and usage, and also for regular peeps to become inspired to learn how to use internet (technological applications) based approaches in regards to their money.. perhaps?

With anything, some people will be in a better position to learn than others, and some people will be more motivated to learn than others.

Now I've become interested. They invested in bitcoin clearly at a higher price. What about the country's economy now? I don't think there is much positive...

You have those kinds of thoughts because you are engaging with fantasy-inspired wishful-thinking rather than attempting to grapple with actual facts.
hero member
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Now I've become interested. They invested in bitcoin clearly at a higher price. What about the country's economy now? I don't think there is much positive...
What about their country's economy before they bought bitcoin? You should also ask that question! Their economy is not doing any worse that it was prior to El Salvador's investment in bitcoin, but their investment in bitcoin is a move to better the country, and even Bukele knows that it is not a short term thing, but something that will happen long term. There are positives, but you fail to see them because you want to see it in the short term which is not possible.
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