"Failure to Understand Bitcoin Could Cost Investors Billions" (Bitcoin's flaws) - page 7.

AnonyMint

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Quote from: sidhujag on March 08, 2014, 03:39:18 AM

Quote from: AnonyMint on March 08, 2014, 12:12:14 AM

Quote from: sidhujag on March 07, 2014, 11:47:15 PM

Big wrench in altcoin.. coinpayments closing down because FinCEn classifies then as a money transmitter..

They would need to apply anti money laundering procedures to verify accounts and record keeping... I believe a proper company can step in here.. heck even bucket shop forex brokers and market makers comply why cant a crypto business do the same??? looks like coinpayments doesnt want to bother.

Crypto-currencies can be exchanged decentralized. So we can just put a decentralized exchange in front of Bitpay or any merchant accepting BTC.

The decentralized exchanges are not yet well developed. And as I said upthread, users may not use them if there is no compelling reason (because they are perceived to be less convenient, greater bid/ask spread+variance), but they can help users remain anonymous.

Im not talking about exchange coins but paymeny processors via third party need to follow regulation now. My business which was to accept devcoin litecoin bitcoin cant happen via unregulated third party processor now.. Cp did the job of ensuring payments are secure before fwding them on to a service you implement.. so i would just recieve coins with order info and a tx.. im sure i can do without but its more work.

Now im pretty sure my business which provides products in exchange for coins may need to be regulated too but im not sure if that classifies as money transmitter.

I already explained the potential technical solution for paying businesses with a real-time conversion on decentralized exchange, but yeah it won't help you if your business can be regulated by the authorities. You could change jurisdictions or change the business model to anonymous.

My prediction is that if you don't, Obama and Merkel and Hollande, etc will destroy your business eventually. I see really bad times coming.

AnonyMint

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Quote from: Vlad2Vlad on March 08, 2014, 01:06:03 AM

Quote from: AnonyMint on March 08, 2014, 12:14:07 AM

Quote from: Vlad2Vlad on March 08, 2014, 12:01:29 AM

Quote from: AnonyMint on March 07, 2014, 11:33:47 PM

Detailed discussion of the problems with Zerocoin:

https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.5580855

The biggest problem with any "ZeroCoin" is that Bitcoin was never truly designed or meant to be anonymous nor decentralized and thus any attempt to create a clone for that purpose will be snuffed out by the banks and governments of the world.

They have zero chance of widespread success but I suppose it makes for a nice hobby.

How can they snuff out something when they can't identify any of those who own the coin?

Paying for physical merchandise is an issue. But I will concede that market to Bitcoin and go after all the virtual merchandise, which will eventually be a larger market (as 3D printing in the home becomes prevalent).

The way they make counterfeit dollars illegal and few use them even though many could print their own dollars and do it well.

Most people would not risk prison given it's easy to track IP addresses and even physical hardware or software wallets.

And ZERO businesses would accept an illegal currency.

So then you'd be relegated to pure underground use, for things like drugs as only people willing to break the law would risk prison for a currency.

And that's being snuffed out, they would use national security to ban any truly anonymous currency saying a terrorist could easily buy bombs and maneuver through society using such anonymity and drug dralers as well.

Of course that's a lie, terrorists can be anonymous now with cash even more easily and so can drug dealers but who can fight the machine when they only need one executive order to kill anything and now, anyone.

I believe ~~all~~much of the economy will be forced underground by the collapse of the $150 trillion global debt bomb (which will attempt to confiscate all wealth and destroy all business at its end-game). Ignition is 2016ish.

I believe it will become illegal to write many kinds of software, to create 3D printer designs that compete with the factories owned by the old capital, etc..

A new age is upon us.

This paradigm shift will tear to shreds our current reality.

Ready for the Jetsons?

I believe many (most?) of you are not ready. You are still thinking in terms of this world we have now which is propped up by $150 trillion in funny money. Pull away that veneer and you have remaining those who are useless in the hitech world coming and those are useful. Make sure you are in the latter.

sidhujag

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Quote from: AnonyMint on March 08, 2014, 12:12:14 AM

Quote from: sidhujag on March 07, 2014, 11:47:15 PM

Big wrench in altcoin.. coinpayments closing down because FinCEn classifies then as a money transmitter..

They would need to apply anti money laundering procedures to verify accounts and record keeping... I believe a proper company can step in here.. heck even bucket shop forex brokers and market makers comply why cant a crypto business do the same??? looks like coinpayments doesnt want to bother.

Crypto-currencies can be exchanged decentralized. So we can just put a decentralized exchange in front of Bitpay or any merchant accepting BTC.

The decentralized exchanges are not yet well developed. And as I said upthread, users may not use them if there is no compelling reason (because they are perceived to be less convenient, greater bid/ask spread+variance), but they can help users remain anonymous.

Im not talking about exchange coins but paymeny processors via third party need to follow regulation now. My business which was to accept devcoin litecoin bitcoin cant happen via unregulated third party processor now.. Cp did the job of ensuring payments are secure before fwding them on to a service you implement.. so i would just recieve coins with order info and a tx.. im sure i can do without but its more work.

Now im pretty sure my business which provides products in exchange for coins may need to be regulated too but im not sure if that classifies as money transmitter.

Vlad2Vlad

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www.ixcoin.net

Quote from: AnonyMint on March 08, 2014, 12:14:07 AM

Quote from: Vlad2Vlad on March 08, 2014, 12:01:29 AM

Quote from: AnonyMint on March 07, 2014, 11:33:47 PM

Detailed discussion of the problems with Zerocoin:

https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.5580855

The biggest problem with any "ZeroCoin" is that Bitcoin was never truly designed or meant to be anonymous nor decentralized and thus any attempt to create a clone for that purpose will be snuffed out by the banks and governments of the world.

They have zero chance of widespread success but I suppose it makes for a nice hobby.

How can they snuff out something when they can't identify any of those who own the coin?

Paying for physical merchandise is an issue. But I will concede that market to Bitcoin and go after all the virtual merchandise, which will eventually be a larger market (as 3D printing in the home becomes prevalent).

The way they make counterfeit dollars illegal and few use them even though many could print their own dollars and do it well.

Most people would not risk prison given it's easy to track IP addresses and even physical hardware or software wallets.

And ZERO businesses would accept an illegal currency.

So then you'd be relegated to pure underground use, for things like drugs as only people willing to break the law would risk prison for a currency.

And that's being snuffed out, they would use national security to ban any truly anonymous currency saying a terrorist could easily buy bombs and maneuver through society using such anonymity and drug dralers as well.

Of course that's a lie, terrorists can be anonymous now with cash even more easily and so can drug dealers but who can fight the machine when they only need one executive order to kill anything and now, anyone.

AnonyMint

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Activity: 518

Merit: 521

Quote from: Vlad2Vlad on March 08, 2014, 12:01:29 AM

Quote from: AnonyMint on March 07, 2014, 11:33:47 PM

Detailed discussion of the problems with Zerocoin:

https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.5580855

The biggest problem with any "ZeroCoin" is that Bitcoin was never truly designed or meant to be anonymous nor decentralized and thus any attempt to create a clone for that purpose will be snuffed out by the banks and governments of the world.

They have zero chance of widespread success but I suppose it makes for a nice hobby.

How can they snuff out something when they can't identify any of those who own the coin?

Paying for physical merchandise is an issue. But I will concede that market to Bitcoin and go after all the virtual merchandise, which will eventually be a larger market (as 3D printing in the home becomes prevalent).

AnonyMint

hero member

Activity: 518

Merit: 521

Quote from: sidhujag on March 07, 2014, 11:47:15 PM

Big wrench in altcoin.. coinpayments closing down because FinCEn classifies then as a money transmitter..

They would need to apply anti money laundering procedures to verify accounts and record keeping... I believe a proper company can step in here.. heck even bucket shop forex brokers and market makers comply why cant a crypto business do the same??? looks like coinpayments doesnt want to bother.

Crypto-currencies can be exchanged decentralized. So we can just put a decentralized exchange in front of Bitpay or any merchant accepting BTC.

The decentralized exchanges are not yet well developed. And as I said upthread, users may not use them if there is no compelling reason (because they are perceived to be less convenient, greater bid/ask spread+variance), but they can help users remain anonymous.

Vlad2Vlad

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www.ixcoin.net

Quote from: AnonyMint on March 07, 2014, 11:33:47 PM

Detailed discussion of the problems with Zerocoin:

https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.5580855

The biggest problem with any "ZeroCoin" is that Bitcoin was never truly designed or meant to be anonymous nor decentralized and thus any attempt to create a clone for that purpose will be snuffed out by the banks and governments of the world.

They have zero chance of widespread success but I suppose it makes for a nice hobby.

sidhujag

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Activity: 2044

Merit: 1005

Big wrench in altcoin.. coinpayments closing down because FinCEn classifies then as a money transmitter..

They would need to apply anti money laundering procedures to verify accounts and record keeping... I believe a proper company can step in here.. heck even bucket shop forex brokers and market makers comply why cant a crypto business do the same??? looks like coinpayments doesnt want to bother.

AnonyMint

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Activity: 518

Merit: 521

Detailed discussion of the problems with Zerocoin:

https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.5580855

cAPSLOCK

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Note the unconventional cAPITALIZATION!

Quote from: AnonyMint on March 07, 2014, 08:57:52 AM

Do indeed keep your eyes on altcoins. There is a lot of money to be made there.

Oh shit did I do that crash on March 1 when I wrote the above (ProtoShares is the premine for Bitshares):

http://coinmarketcap.com/pts_30.html

Of course you didn't.

That is the market's perceived value of Bitshares-x exiting the Bitshares-PTS price.

sidhujag

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AnonyMint

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At least 30% of the people on this forum have IQs that are insufficient for them to be rational (fits the Bell Curve as expected that 30% or so would be below 90 IQ):

https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/basic-iq-test-on-satoshis-identity-505355

So keep that in mind on all polls such as for example the one on this thread. We can probably subtract up to 30% from the 50% above and arrive at a super majority of the rational people agree with the OP.

AnonyMint

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Do indeed keep your eyes on altcoins. There is a lot of money to be made there.

Based on the coins I know that are in developments (e.g. Ethereum, Zerocoin, ...) and the lag time for research & development since the huge price rise in Bitcoin since last summer, I estimate 30 - 50% odds on the serious competitor to Bitcoin arriving before June. Initially it might not be apparent that such a coin can challenge Bitcoin, but it will become clear rapidly (in weeks or few months after coin launch).

Quote from: Paashaas on March 07, 2014, 08:41:07 AM

Quote from: cAPSLOCK on March 05, 2014, 01:11:55 PM

Quote from: Paashaas on March 05, 2014, 12:51:20 PM

If another alt-coin pops up that it better than Bitcoin, it will need to kill Light-coin first and i've not even seen 1 alt-coin thats doing that in this time.
In time scale; Bitcoins infrasturcture+the amounth of the ppl in the world that is even aware of Bitcoin will be to big to catch up. In other words; Bitcoin wil be in the top 3 most used crypto money in the comming 10+ years.

Litecoin as a early warning system for the eventual bitcoin-killer is worth considering. A very interesting thought. I wonder if it has merit.

Yhe, but the price between Lightcoin and Bitcoin is huge so the maker of the ''Bitcoin killer'' needs to come up with very innovative tools ore reinvent the wheel of crypto again that will make his coin atleast $100 and up worthly. When Bitcoin rises; Lightcoin will follow in price. Its really interesting and i will keep an close eye to crypto.

Don't forget to multiply Litecoin's price by 4 to compare with Bitcoin, since Litecoin has 4X as many coins planned to issue than Bitcoin.

In other words, you really want to compare coin market caps.

http://coinmarketcap.com/

http://bitbet.us/bet/621/any-altcoin-will-surpass-litecoin-in-market-capitalization/

http://www.coindesk.com/top-altcoins-2013/

http://motherboard.vice.com/blog/beyond-bitcoin-a-guide-to-the-most-promising-cryptocurrencies

Note compare the hype and launch momentum of MaxCoin to the actual result in the market cap comparison:

http://www.nasdaq.com/article/the-next-altcoin-to-hit-20-million-cm323873

http://crypt.la/2014/02/16/10-signs-that-maxcoin-was-the-largest-altcoin-launch-in-history/

Appears that features are more important than hype and interest at launch.

Quote from: AnonyMint on March 01, 2014, 04:09:54 AM

Quote from: sidhujag on March 01, 2014, 12:21:47 AM

Bitshares is supposed to be like a decenrralized bank via BitUSD or Bitxxx is this similar to your understanding of a decentralized exchange?

No because it attempts to do market clearing of bids and asks at the miner. And it has no mechanism to move fiat in the system and depends on their unproven faith that BitUSD will track the value of fiat (which I think I refuted in the thread of discussion on that, yet they are welcome to try it and see what happens).

Oh shit did I do that crash on March 1 when I wrote the above (ProtoShares is the premine for Bitshares):

http://coinmarketcap.com/pts_30.html

Paashaas

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Quote from: cAPSLOCK on March 05, 2014, 01:11:55 PM

Quote from: Paashaas on March 05, 2014, 12:51:20 PM

If another alt-coin pops up that it better than Bitcoin, it will need to kill Light-coin first and i've not even seen 1 alt-coin thats doing that in this time.
In time scale; Bitcoins infrasturcture+the amounth of the ppl in the world that is even aware of Bitcoin will be to big to catch up. In other words; Bitcoin wil be in the top 3 most used crypto money in the comming 10+ years.

Litecoin as a early warning system for the eventual bitcoin-killer is worth considering. A very interesting thought. I wonder if it has merit.

Yhe, but the price between Lightcoin and Bitcoin is huge so the maker of the ''Bitcoin killer'' needs to come up with very innovative tools ore reinvent the wheel of crypto again that will make his coin atleast $100 and up worthly. When Bitcoin rises; Lightcoin will follow in price. Its really interesting and i will keep an close eye to crypto.

AnonyMint

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What would Satoshi say when he comes back into public view...

https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.5563694

Quote from: AnonyMint on March 07, 2014, 01:58:11 AM

"It would have been impossible for us to develop our plan for the world if we had been subjected to the lights of publicity during those formative years. But, the world is more sophisticated and has accepted the all seeing ledger. The supranational sovereignty of an intellectual elite and world bankers is surely preferable to the national autodetermination practiced in past centuries."

AnonyMint

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MoonShadow

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Quote from: AnonyMint on March 06, 2014, 12:44:40 AM

It is amusing that he takes my "Bitard" comments as inability to refute. I've refuted every challenge presented to me without exception.

You are a self-deluded meglomaniac.

Refute that.

MagicalBear

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Seems a good article, following

AnonyMint

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AnonyMint

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Most humans think that political discussion will make any difference in the outcome.

In the burgeoning Knowledge age, the outcomes will be increasingly decided by technology and the macro-economics.

https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.5540510

Quote from: jonald_fyookball on March 06, 2014, 12:32:16 AM

1. Create a bitcointalk account.
2. Make lots of posts to become a "Sr. Member" so you have a pretense of credibility.
3. Create long posts enumerating the possible ways Bitcoin is flawed.
4. Claim bitcoin will fail. Posture as being "pro cryptocurrency", yet offer no real solutions.
5. Paint "doomsday" scenarios to spread fear.
6. Be sure to mention the NSA ,the NWO, the FBI, and the elite will either stop Bitcoin or secretly created Bitcoin.
7. Debate endlessly with people. Make sure your posts get more than 100 replies so they become "very hot topics".
8. When you can't refute a point, either ignore it or use an ad hominem attack.
9. Make yourself look really smart by referencing advanced topics and/or claiming 'credentials'.
10. Link back to your own posts to create more views and controversy.

It is amusing that he takes my "Bitard" comments as inability to refute. I've refuted every challenge presented to me without exception. (or in the case of PoS, I made strong arguments in a cordial discussion upthread) That is why I feel entitled to insult those who are incapable of or obstinately unwilling to comprehend what they supposedly read, especially when they push that sort of political insanity above.

As a technical dolt (fact not ad hominem), he can't discern a genuine expert from a pretender.

In short, let them go ahead. I should go quiet. Action will speak loudest now.

Topic: "Failure to Understand Bitcoin Could Cost Investors Billions" (Bitcoin's flaws) - page 7. (Read 43230 times)