Topic: FreeBitco.in-$200 FreeBTC⭐Win Lambo🔥0.2BTC DailyJackpot🏆$32,500 Wager Contest - page 1258. (Read 559462 times)

Thanks for communicating this to Wetsuit.

If you look at the steps mentioned carefully. You can see that no matter what the client sends, the server can break the promise of which hash to use and the only way to catch is as you mentioned, or bots. I'm still not making any accusations. I just want to point it out that this can be as real as it gets and is currently extremely hard to verify this by any normal person.

I know FreeBitco has a huge reputation, but it also has a huge userbase, everyone is claiming 'free money' by the hour. If you take out most of the last 3 free-game prizes, statistically the server will end up paying ~7.34 times less. I'm just pointing out there is an incentive to cheat and the system allows it to make it easier to hide.

TheQuin
Thank you Huge, excuse me for worrying, good luck to you in everything

I've just heard from wetsuit and I've asked him to have a look at this. My personal view and understanding is that sort of manipulation wouldn't work because there's a nonce on the client side. The argument that the server seed could be changed is negated by the fact you could easily implement a script that checked that before and after each roll. I'm sure there are enough sceptics out that have tried to catch sites out and have failed because they don't actually cheat. It really wouldn't be worth it, the site's reputation is worth far more than any individual bet.

Ignore Juggy777 negativity. You have a right to raise your concerns, if you spot something that might cause problems in the future. One thing about Wetsuit is this, if there are concerns raised, he or she will address those concerns. Wetsuit will either explain it in detail or he will improve the system.

Sometimes people raise concerns because they enjoy the site and they want things to be perfect. Your argument makes sense and you should investigate further, if there are any doubts.

A lot of us raised our concerns about the Lottery and Wetsuit and his team responded by adding improvements and ways to verify the lottery. So this is just more proof that they are listening and reacting on "customer" concerns. 

I enjoy it so I'm just playing I always looked forward to those time that I can roll again. I hope that one day I will win the lottery round I never lost hope, " freebitco.in " is the best faucet for me.
Enjoy every one and goodluck.

I'll give you the same answer I gave Thirdspace:


I know he's going to start work on the rebrand soon which involves recoding the whole site from the ground up. That probably makes it a good time to discuss this. I have no idea why you feel the need to hide your identity but I really don't think you need to. We've got problem discussing suggested improvements.

it would not be possible for someone to keep claiming every day within 24 hours just to get the faucet, if using bots can run smoothly to claim the faucet every hour, it is likely that many people are doing it and the possibility of this site going bankrupt.

The amount people get from each claim from a faucet is very small so it is quite hard to find an active referral. Members may be active for a while then they will understand it is not worth and move on to other ways to earn money. So if one plan to earn money from referrals then should promote continuously and get new referrals on a regular basis to have regular income from these referrals. Maybe few members will be active for a long time but that doesn't mean that every referral can be active for a long time.

Seems like we do have a die hard fan or user of Freebitco.in. Imagine in 2 years time he do have the main target of 1 BTC thru faucets? even those amounts accumulated be used either on hi-lo game and lottery there would still have small chances on winning. Referral is easy to say but would really be hard to invite someone.

Reading up conversations above about possible manipulation of seed,i cant make a word yet ive treated all gambling sites do have shady part.

Its very good now low stake holders winning very regularly and many can hope for win as well because in start I watch most of members with very huge number of tickets was enjoying this all but after many rounds now all is changing just we need this lady of luck 

seems to be really cool, definitely gonna try out

First of all, I didn't directly accuse that FreeBitco is manipulating the Rolls because I wouldn't be taken seriously if I did so.
It's better to provide all the information necessary so you can check it by yourselves and even maybe convince FreeBitco to improve their system.


I will explain this in two stages:
First the current (and exploitable) implementation:

1) You Login into FreeBitco and click on the "THIS GAME IS PROVABLY FAIR!"
2) In this screen, the Server *promises* that it will calculate the next roll using your Client Seed + next Nonce + Server Seed. (Server sends you the Hash of that seed so you can check it later, that's perfectly implemented).
3) You save the server seed hash and you hit Roll.
4) The server does all the math. Using the Client Seed, the Nonce, and the secret Server Seed.
5) Then here is where the server MAY say: Oh wait.. I do not like this roll. Let's use the Client Seed, the Nonce, but let's break the promise of which Seed we were going to use.
6) You verify your bet using the bet History (which was saved by the Server). The math here rounds up perfectly and the game seems provably-fair.

There are two problems for you with this implementation regarding how can you verify that you were cheated:
1) You will need to do this for probably thousands of rolls until the server attempts to cheat on you.
2) Once you eventually find a discrepancy, you will be left proof-less and alone. The server promised you it was going to use Hash111 but ended up using Hash222, in the History it stored Hash222 for you to verify/share the bet result.


Now, here is the basic idea on how it should be implemented:

1) Server generates a new secret Seed. Sets the Nonce to 0. And returns you the SHA256 of that Seed.
2) When you roll, you provide your own Client seed to the server.
3) The server calculates the roll using it's secret seed + nonce + client seed.
4) Server increases the Nonce by one. And keeps the same server seed for the next roll.
5) If I want to verify my bets (and only if I ask for it). The server reveals it's secret seed to me and re-executes step 1 for future rolls.
6) The server should add an entry to the history saying that I manually requested the server to reveal the seed.

This way, the server should be able to calculate all rolls without changing the promised seed unless you ask for the seed. Also, you don't need to save each server seed hash and compare it with the one used in the rolls history.
(It can still cheat you into saying you asked for the Seed for verifying before you actually rolled and thus generating a losing seed)
But at least this way it will be way more visible for you to see if your are being cheated, because you will see that the server changed the seed without you asking to reveal the seed.

It's not perfect. But this way it will be extremely hard for them to conceal the cheating.
To compensate the problem of this proposed approach, an option is that the server provides and resets the server Seed and Nonce every week. This way the server cannot cheat the History by saying that you requested the seed for verifying when you didn't.
You will only be able to verify your bets every week, but it can be optional with a setup with a cooldown.


Sorry for the delayed response. I'll do my best to answer all the details.

You must be crazy then to think that claiming faucet in 2 years will earn you 1 btc. You can calculate it by yourselves, 400sat per claim(this is mine) * 24 hours * 30 days * 12 month = 3,456,000 which is 0.03456 btc and 2 years you will get 0.069. This is a perfect 24 hours that we count. I do not think you can claim it 24 hours unless you are using bot but this is not allow on their site so you will get lower

To be honest I think there might be good reasons that the other sites haven't changed but I'm not really an expert in that field. It could be more about a matter of opinion as to which system is fairer. If you're concerned I'd suggest PMing wetsuit and having a chat about it. I know he hasn't logged on to the forum for a while, he's been away but should be back very soon. I think me getting in the middle of the debate would probably only confuse things.

the computation is done on server side and needs both seeds to produce result
the reason server only reveals server seed hash is to prevent the player to calculate future results
the reason server has to keep the same server seed is to guarantee fairness to the player
when provably fair is raised, server seed is revealed for proving previous results
and player can check if the server seed hash matched the server seed used, thus provably fair

I'm not good in explaining this stuff, but I remember it was discussed somewhere on this forum or dice's chat
about the key factor of not changing server seed to provide fairness to player
a server seed + nonce = pre determined output sequences, to prevent server cheating

if a server can predict player's bet pattern and player doesn't change his seed, server can generate seed to anticipate such condition
if I'm not mistaken, early primedice also change seed on every roll but not anymore
now afaik primedice and just-dice only change server seed on (player) demand

I'm not accusing, only state the possibilty

LOTTERY ROUND 155
This round, the winner with the lowest number of tickets is #10 with 1,943 tickets.
#1 won 1.26644511 BTC with 49,292 tickets.

I'm bit surprised that a reputed site like freebitco has to time and time come out and give an explanation it's kind of boring dude, there're hundreds of false claims and each one has been answered and cleared by the team and the owners, but bringing this stupid stuff again and again is dam boring. Do you realise they're the best probably fair faucet site out there so stop boring us with this idiotic claims. I'm sure sooner or later we'll learn to ignore such posts so people will stop posting such bs.

This is why I don't understand what they are going on about. Like every other provably fair site we give you the hash of the server seed before the roll. Then after the roll, we reveal the server seed and you can check it against that hash. The client seed you are free to change, use static or random.

Edit: I should have said "every other provably fair site that I've used".

Are you saying that Freebitco.in is manipulating the server seed? Have you tested this and is there any method to test that they are not changing the server seed? This might be a unexploded Bombshell if you can prove that Freebitco.in is manipulating the outcome of the Free Roll & Multiply games.

This whole site is built on trust that was established over years and years of honest and timeous payments to it's users. How is the Lottery system different than the implementation of the Provably Fair system of the Free Roll & Multiply games?

When allegations are made, people must provide the proof.  

I think you mean:
the server only knows the server seed but the player knows the "server seed hash" and client seed which they can change.

AFAIK that is how we do it.

https://snag.gy/W9JsGl.jpg


If you can explain to me what is wrong with that and what exactly Primedice do differently I'll ask wetsuit about it.