Topic: FreiCoin (FRC) discussion (was FreiCoin (FRC) for TRC, PPC, LTC or BTC) - page 16. (Read 42644 times)

lock this thread and close the topic as this coin is such a fail.

this coin will never be used on exchanges like mtgox or btc-e. and this is why

when depositing funds into the exchanges.. they hold them.

you continue your business trading the price fluctuations of the coin using a database of binary numbers that represent the deposited amount.

so while your profiting. the actual owner of the private key you deposited to (the exchange) is losing out due to the demurrage tax.

simply put. they wont touch it.

stick with the 2 longest surviving coins bitcoin and litecoin. or atleast invent something that has some actual use apart from making the first guy that owns the coin the richest and each subsequent person owning it receive less and less as they receive and hold it.

it also fails the demurrage thing by people just sending it to themselves on different addresses. too many loopholes. too many fails to be a viable candidate for mainstreaming

lol

 

From where did you gather the data for your graph?  

As you point out, the lender will try to maximize his profits and currencies can be exchanged. But that also applies to the borrower, who will try to minimize his borrowing costs. That way, bitcoin and freicoin financial markets will theoretically equilibrate and produce the same interest rate.
Now you ask why the equilibrium should be zero interest.
The fast answer is that without an artificial barrier for capital yields to drop, they would drop to zero like all profits do in perfect competition and interest rates are intimately linked to interest rates.
But let's make an example with some imaginary assumptions to simplify things. Freicoins and Bitcoins have the same price.

There's a given market, say car manufacturing, where factories (capital) yield 2% of their producing costs (the cost to build the factory). Of course, their yield comes from selling the consuming goods (cars). Building a new factory would push the yields down, since all compete selling cars. In perfect competition, profits drop to zero, but not yields, since they represent the borrowing costs for the investment. To be profitable with a new factory you need a loan at a lower rate than 2%. Sorry if I'm repeating myself but I want to stress how yields tend to drop by competition, which, by the way, is good for the consumers, since lower yields mean cheaper products.
If lenders/investors can find another market with higher yields they will prefer to invest on that other market first. Higher yields mean that the demand on that market hasn't fulfilled the whole demand at the lowest possible price. There's more margin for the lowest possible price (which is just the raw costs, without profits nor capital yields) on that market so the demand's signal is transmitted to the financial market. But those markets will eventually hit 2% yields and eventually lenders/investors will have to chose between 1.9% or hoarding money.

A bitcoin lender doesn't have any incentive to lend at zero interest, but a freicoin lender has. Borrowers/entrepreneurs will find lower interests on freicoin's financial market, possibly zero. As yields get lower, bitcoin's financial market would shrink in favor of freicoin's. Borrowers don't care about demurrage because they're going to invest the money, spend it on producing goods.

Why an entrepreneur would plan to invest in something that yields 0% ? That means that the factory on its whole lifetime will only pay for itself, not give more return. The lender just wants to spend his money at another time without paying demurrage nor conversion to bitcoin fees. And the entrepreneur is paying his own wage as part of the production costs. Being selfish that could be enough for him. Ideally at this stage the building costs of the factory equal its total outcomes in its productive lifetime and the consumer is only paying for the real costs of production.

I hope this makes sense to you, but of course don't hesitate to ask questions or criticize the parts you don't agree on.

This makes me wonder... is there any native type/class on a language that uses 30 or more decimal precision?
I'm most Database focused on my job, so idk pretty good about all programming languages...
The better ones that I can remember is Extended from Delphi and BigDecimal from Java.

Right you are. Windows calculator was dropping the last few number in a copy and paste. I blame Windows calculator

hehe
Fortunately I'm just pool operator and I'm only working with 0.00000001 precision numbers
BTW 934850464087855181388968773148467 / 10384593717069655257060992658440192 is closer to 0.090022... than to 9.0022..

I just would like to know why those balance fields are not decimal anymore. It is very inconvenient.

Do the math or you're rounding off too many numbers. You'll find computers are good at doing maths.

934850464087855181388968773148467 / 10384593717069655257060992658440192 = 9.0022825115555227875670197259871

I'd like to think an exchange operator is working to exact figures

I observed that you changed type of balance related fields in few rpc calls, for example getbalance, getinfo.
They are no longer decimal. Instead they look like :

"2358.09006344+934850464087855181388968773148467/10384593717069655257060992658440192"

I'm not sure how I should convert those values to simple decimal type.
Ommit everything after "+" ? Or perform whole calculation:
2358.09006344 + 934850464087855181388968773148467 / 10384593717069655257060992658440192

I'm close to mining 1000 FRC with my GTX 580. I think I'll stop at 1000.. MHm.. I don't know whether I should wish to regret mining 1000 coins only or not.. lol.

WWW.CRYPTOCOINEXPLORER.COM


New coin Freicoin has been added to the explorer

Due to the unique nature of  demurrage, further modification of the explorer is needed.

WARNING: THE ADDRESS PAGE DOES NOT TAKE DEMURRAGE INTO ACCOUNT WHEN CALCULATING BALANCES

We are working on a solution, until then you can view the demurrage wikki at:

How-to-properly-handle-demurrage-in-applications

I will keep you posted in the cryptocoin explorer thread. https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/cryptocoin-explorer-coin-block-explorers-124303

I want to thank Maaku for his support in helping to further the functionality of the explorer.

Super awesome work

I was working on my own pool but I think it best to leave it to those who know what they're doing. There are other FRC pools but they are not as pretty as Coinotron's.

Once shares are paying I'll come join the party.

I don't see how the claim of 0% interest rate could be a stable equilibrium. If I lend freicoin at 0% interest rate, alternatively I could exchange it to bitcoin and lend bitcoin at positive interest rate. Assuming the exchange rate between the two is stable, then obviously I would choose the second alternative.

Explanation of the practicalities of demurrage accounting, written with application developers in mind:

https://github.com/freicoin/freicoin/wiki/How-to-properly-handle-demurrage-in-applications

He's not

I hope you will not be the only one

Great, please fix share value
Thanks

EDIT: just saw your post on the other thread
im a volunteer tester then

I've started FRC pool.
www.coinotron.com

https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.1422430

Thank you Maaku for a very straightforward, hassle free trade.