Topic: 🔥 GingerWallet.io - Desktop, Non-custodial, Open source | #CoinJoin - page 6. (Read 2745 times)

I did not look in to either Wasabi Wallet, Ginger Wallet or Open Co-ordinator enough to know about any of these operating a system that facilitates users to lose change as a trade-off for increased privacy. A side question, you were probably hoping for more activity in this thread therefore does it concern you there in not much traction in this forum regarding your Ginger Wallet product?

You can always check your coins and their privacy level at the wallet's coin list or at the coinjoin bar. At opencoordinator you will also lose the "change" money, this is a client thing, not a server side thing. The client decides not to create change.

Also please consider using the Ginger Wallet directly, it can be installed parallel to Wasabi, has slightly different coinjoin solutions. Only one can run at a time though.

Also don't forget that we will have a free weekend.

I will take a look at those figures to work out what happened. Does that mean when coin join reaches a latter part (around 80-90% upwards), it is better to not further coin join as only a small amount remains and it is better to use/move the already parts of the private funds before proceeding further and only after further funds have been added?

The next time I use Ginger Wallet I will change the default co-ordinator to Open Co-ordinator because they charge zero percent fees therefore all that should be deducted is the mining fee. The time it takes to reach 100% privacy will be a key comparator the time Ginger Wallet took.

Both Wasabi and Ginger clients aim to avoid generating 'change.' In other words, all coins should be consolidated into specific denominations (those values that are generated by all clients). This means the difference should stay below a certain minimum output amount, which is set at 10,000 satoshis for Ginger. (It’s widely believed that change negatively impacts privacy). However, this can become a significant issue if the client can only participate with low-value coins.

If only a small amount of money remains, it’s advised not to coinjoin (this applies to all clients), as you'll lose an average of 3-5k satoshis per round on top of the mining fee. There's almost certainly no coordinator fee involved.

The mining fee can be calculated, but in an environment with a rate of 3-4 sat/vbyte, it shouldn't be a major expense by itself. The vbyte is roughly 70 times the size of the input coin and 30 times the size of the output coin, and you multiply this by the mining fee. At a rate of 4 satoshis, the cost will be around 3,000-4,000 satoshis (independent of the client, assuming an average number of input/output coins).

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🎉 Ginger Free Coinjoin Weekend is here! 🎉
Join us from Friday 20:00 to Monday 08:00 UTC and participate in Ginger Coinjoin rounds with no coordinator fee! Don’t miss out on this opportunity for enhanced privacy at no extra cost. 🚀

I used GingerWallet with their default gingerwallet co-ordinator because I wanted to know how much time the coin join took to reach 100% and wanted to check the fees incurred.

Ginger Wallet via their co-ordinator are supposed to take fees of 0.3% for deposits that are 0.01 BTC and above, the rest are supposed to be mining fees. In my case, the total deduction when it reached 100% was significantly higher than I expected and the time it took to get there was in double digit hours.

Rather than use a calculator to work out 0.3% from the actual deposit and then assume the difference from the balance is the mining fee, is there a simple way to categorically ascertain how much of the deduction is the co-ordinator fee and how much of it is the mining fee?

Since we operate as a company, a coin verifier solution is essential. This will not impact the average user.
Apologies if any of your questions have gone unanswered. What are they, and how can we assist you?

Ginger, new to the forum... just give them some time to get their bearings. 

Why the multi-posting? You should just keep everything in one post at a time instead of posting consecutively.

🚀 GingerWallet v2.0.10 is here!
* New Feature: One-click transaction viewing on mempool.space.
* Enhancements: Improved CoinJoin checks, fee estimation, and bug fixes.
* Flexible Browsing: Choose your preferred browser for transaction viewing, including Tor, Brave, Firefox, Chrome, and more!
Update now for a smoother, faster Bitcoin experience!
https://gingerwallet.io

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Got questions? Join our Telegram channel and let's chat! 🗨️
🔗 t.me/GingerWallet

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🚨 The free remix and friends don't pay features are available only with Wasabi Wallet version 2.0.8.1 or earlier. If you are using a later version, you can still use our Coordinator, but without these benefits.
Download GingerWallet: https://gingerwallet.io

Mod note: Consecutive posts merged

Maybe icopress was creating the thread in the run-up to them giving the go-ahead for a signature campaign. It is possible something could be happening behind the scenes and just a few people are privy to it. Keeping that to one side, if a Ginger Wallet representative is active on other forums it really would be helpful if they were also active here too because there a lot of questions being asked.

I was unaware of that thread and the account. It was created on 15th June 2024 and last active on 3rd July 2024. Maybe they have given up trying to use this forum as a means to attract a customer/user base.

One of their representatives ^[sztest] used to be somewhat active when he/she created an announcement "thread" prior to this one, but they locked it because of this thread.
^{- The only other place where I'm seeing some recent activities is in one of their GitHub repositories.}

There is one account on the altcoinstalks forum belonging to a Ginger Wallet rep which has talked about their wallet on that thread - I've talked to it too - but it's just weird how they're just having @icopress create an ANN thread on Bitcointalk but they never show up themselves. It's not like they are banned or anything.

I have not seem any posts from a Ginger Wallet forum account, maybe they are not interested in engaging with members of the forum after they studied the way members interacted with Kruw (as a so-called Wasabi Wallet contributor that might or might not have actually been employed by zkSNACKs). Or maybe this thread is a pre-cursor to them getting ready to start engaging with members, we do not know but they should have at least started posting here by now.

It's a wolf in sheep's clothing. Just like AMLbot (sends all your addresses to law enforcement). I don't even understand why their developer or rep isn't writing on this thread.

Customers not knowing whether they will be allowed to coinjoin is counterproductive to those wanting to use their service.

I do not understand which logic they would apply to create a service based on Wasabi Wallet yet when they forked it instead of removing the same modifications that caused Wasabi Wallet to suffer an enormous loss of reputation, they have kept them implemented even though they knew how the community would react. The question arises, why would they launch a product that will probably not gain traction when they already know blockchain analysis of customers transactions is not accepted by the majority of people in the first place.

If you use open source, you partly SHOULD be paranoid. You always verify checksums and/or PGP signatures, and do other tedious things. Sometimes you could get very paranoid, you need to install and run it in a VM in another computer.

But for the developers of Ginger Wallet, if they're actually good, they should find flaws/bugs and patch them up, make UI/UX better for users, it's also their responsibility to find exploits and take advantage of them then report what they discovered.

To make it seem like they have done everything they can to block US citizens from using the service. But that restriction only prevents US IP addresses from accessing the website and downloading the wallet. They can easily bypass this with VPNs. If, after that, the wallet has a way to monitor and check that it's not being used by US citizens, then what kind of privacy are we talking about? And like I said previously, if we are moving towards a future where privacy-preserving services aren't welcome (and we are), the governments aren't going to make it easier for you just because you have terms meant to block certain people from using the service. Remember, they don't want the service to exist in the first place.

That's correct. You didn't misunderstand. If the blockchain analysis partner shows thumbs down, those coins can't be used in coinjoin rounds.

I agree, I see your point however the fact of the matter is GingerWallet was created by forking WasabiWallet and when they did they decided to use blockchain analysis when they easily could have chosen to exclude it. Furthermore, their terms and conditions clearly state the service is not open to US citizens. The logic of adding these two clauses demonstrate a pre-emotive move. I am curious, if not to do it to demonstrate to US authorities, then why do it?

About the blockchain analysis, with WasabiWallet I was under the impression coinjoining would not go ahead if the coins were analysed and deemed to be suspicious/taint and have the same impression from the GingerWallet fork. Maybe I understood it wrong.

That wouldn't make sense. If the authorities consider the act of coinjoining to be illicit because it provides you with a level of privacy they don't want to see, then using such a coinjoin-enabling service wouldn't be allowed (or it would be frowned upon) by default. Blockchain analysis does nothing to stop coinjoining. All it does is it sells the notion of bitcoin taint and dirty coins to those who want to purchase it. The coinjoining still happens with or without blockchain analysis.

No. When I say they are the same, I mean their software is probably the same. The coordinator software (as you've probably heard many times already   ) is open-source, available for everyone to download and setup, in Github. As per my knowledge, there is no guide from Wasabi that shows step-by-step how to spin off your own coordinator, but I've come across this:
They prioritize marketing, likely because they learned from the mistakes of another company that ruined its entire reputation through a marketing failure. Any such company comes to mind?