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Topic: Happy New Years! Seventh alt coin thread! - page 44. (Read 34166 times)

legendary
Activity: 1498
Merit: 1030

https://chainradar.com/xmr/chart

In situations like this I think it is helpful to look at this from a purely economic standpoint: what are the incentives to Bitmain/Baikal/etc. using their own miners before selling them vs. the costs. Since these are foreign companies with near-zero liability to, say, customers in the US or EU, they don't have to worry about individuals claiming they were sent a used or defective product; big farms, perhaps, but not individuals. Conversely, stealth mining the shit out of a high value coin like XMR with your hot new ASIC miner would be all but irresistible so there is a huge incentive to do so.

Frankly, the incentives grossly outweigh the costs, and so you are left with trusting companies like Bitmain and Baikal to act ethically. You can take that bet if you want, but I certainly won't.


The "Vega are huge monero miners" news got widespread in November - which is when Vega supply dried up VERY quickly and the hashrate climb started.
Then the "3'd party" cards hit in Febuary or so, likely feeding the second hashrate surge 'till the price spike collapsed and hashrate went flat.

I doubt Bitmain had a LOT of miners running in that timeframe, though I'm sure they had SOME "engineering sample" type miners running to test out.
legendary
Activity: 1498
Merit: 1030

Are you trolling or you just didn't read my message? It's not a matter of naive or not naive, math doesn't lie, hashrate can't be hidden. You repeat yet again that Sia had a "steady rise in hashrate" "months before bitmain...". THAT IS NOT TRUE

From: https://siastats.info/mining

A3s batch 1 sold on Jan 18th. So, tell me, how in hell bimain "mined with them for months before selling them"? The entire Sia network hashrate was equivalent to only a few A3s before end of Jan.

It is likely that Bitmain had some engineering samples mining for a while - but the numbers don't support them having MASS deployed them to mine with prior to their sale announcements on the A3 OR the X3.



A shortage of FLASH to make SSDs with might affect pricing some, but it's not going to affect mining much - we're already having GPU shortage issues that are much worse after all.

legendary
Activity: 4256
Merit: 8551
'The right to privacy matters'
Samsung Power Outage Kills 3.5% of Global Flash For March


http://www.tomshardware.com/news/samsung-power-outage-flash-pyeongtaek,36670.html

Wonder how this affects mining>

I think it said that it was NAND flash so I assumed it was more the SSD side of things but I'm no expert.

Oh may not be much of an issue.
legendary
Activity: 1096
Merit: 1021
Samsung Power Outage Kills 3.5% of Global Flash For March


http://www.tomshardware.com/news/samsung-power-outage-flash-pyeongtaek,36670.html

Wonder how this affects mining>

I think it said that it was NAND flash so I assumed it was more the SSD side of things but I'm no expert.
legendary
Activity: 4256
Merit: 8551
'The right to privacy matters'
Samsung Power Outage Kills 3.5% of Global Flash For March


http://www.tomshardware.com/news/samsung-power-outage-flash-pyeongtaek,36670.html

Wonder how this affects mining>
legendary
Activity: 1096
Merit: 1021

Bitmain  made so much money last year they simply don't know what to do this year.

So they figured  WTF why not attack gpu coins.

The next  few months will be very interesting to say the least.

I think I read somewhere that Bitmain probably made more then Nvidia last year.  

By the time they ship in May that miner it will be pretty much a door stop.  Sure there might be one or two CN coins that don't switch but certainly not enough to be profitable.  It seems the crazy times of crypto never end.
legendary
Activity: 4256
Merit: 8551
'The right to privacy matters'
Are you trolling or you just didn't read my message? It's not a matter of naive or not naive, math doesn't lie, hashrate can't be hidden. You repeat yet again that Sia had a "steady rise in hashrate" "months before bitmain...". THAT IS NOT TRUE

From: https://siastats.info/mining

A3s batch 1 sold on Jan 18th. So, tell me, how in hell bimain "mined with them for months before selling them"? The entire Sia network hashrate was equivalent to only a few A3s before end of Jan.

That chart does seem to prove your point w/r/t SIA, but in the case of XMR it really looks like some front-running has been going on:

https://chainradar.com/xmr/chart

In situations like this I think it is helpful to look at this from a purely economic standpoint: what are the incentives to Bitmain/Baikal/etc. using their own miners before selling them vs. the costs. Since these are foreign companies with near-zero liability to, say, customers in the US or EU, they don't have to worry about individuals claiming they were sent a used or defective product; big farms, perhaps, but not individuals. Conversely, stealth mining the shit out of a high value coin like XMR with your hot new ASIC miner would be all but irresistible so there is a huge incentive to do so.

Frankly, the incentives grossly outweigh the costs, and so you are left with trusting companies like Bitmain and Baikal to act ethically. You can take that bet if you want, but I certainly won't.



Bitmain  made so much money last year they simply don't know what to do this year.

So they figured  WTF why not attack gpu coins.

The next  few months will be very interesting to say the least.
full member
Activity: 420
Merit: 184
Are you trolling or you just didn't read my message? It's not a matter of naive or not naive, math doesn't lie, hashrate can't be hidden. You repeat yet again that Sia had a "steady rise in hashrate" "months before bitmain...". THAT IS NOT TRUE

From: https://siastats.info/mining

A3s batch 1 sold on Jan 18th. So, tell me, how in hell bimain "mined with them for months before selling them"? The entire Sia network hashrate was equivalent to only a few A3s before end of Jan.

That chart does seem to prove your point w/r/t SIA, but in the case of XMR it really looks like some front-running has been going on:

https://chainradar.com/xmr/chart

In situations like this I think it is helpful to look at this from a purely economic standpoint: what are the incentives to Bitmain/Baikal/etc. using their own miners before selling them vs. the costs. Since these are foreign companies with near-zero liability to, say, customers in the US or EU, they don't have to worry about individuals claiming they were sent a used or defective product; big farms, perhaps, but not individuals. Conversely, stealth mining the shit out of a high value coin like XMR with your hot new ASIC miner would be all but irresistible so there is a huge incentive to do so.

Frankly, the incentives grossly outweigh the costs, and so you are left with trusting companies like Bitmain and Baikal to act ethically. You can take that bet if you want, but I certainly won't.

legendary
Activity: 2366
Merit: 1408
People keep saying "bitmain mines with them for months before releasing them". In the case of Sia, someone said bitmain "clearly" mined for 45 days before releasing. I was there looking when Sia ASICs came out, I can for sure say that bitmain didn't mine a single day before shipping them, ASIC introduction is obvious in a small coin like Sia.

Now in the case of Monero, the entire network today is equivalent to about 4000 X3s. Clearly there is no room there for bitmain to have been "mining with the X3s for months".

I'm not saying bitmain is not evil, but I'm tired of people accusing them of them stealing babies and killing kitties.


u have to know these chips have been running in some form or another in bitmains ‘testing’ enviroment for months now lol, no one is that naive, well at least i hope not.  Same with sia and x11 idgf what the network hash rate is after they open the floodgates.

all these coins have seen a steady rise in hash and decline in profitability months before bitmain magically announces thier sale. 

The magician has finally come out from behind the curtain but you are still falling for the illusions Dorothy
Are you trolling or you just didn't read my message? It's not a matter of naive or not naive, math doesn't lie, hashrate can't be hidden. You repeat yet again that Sia had a "steady rise in hashrate" "months before bitmain...". THAT IS NOT TRUE

From: https://siastats.info/mining

A3s batch 1 sold on Jan 18th. So, tell me, how in hell bimain "mined with them for months before selling them"? The entire Sia network hashrate was equivalent to only a few A3s before end of Jan.

How can you explain a huge spike in diff when people stop buying GPUs like before?
member
Activity: 140
Merit: 17
People keep saying "bitmain mines with them for months before releasing them". In the case of Sia, someone said bitmain "clearly" mined for 45 days before releasing. I was there looking when Sia ASICs came out, I can for sure say that bitmain didn't mine a single day before shipping them, ASIC introduction is obvious in a small coin like Sia.

Now in the case of Monero, the entire network today is equivalent to about 4000 X3s. Clearly there is no room there for bitmain to have been "mining with the X3s for months".

I'm not saying bitmain is not evil, but I'm tired of people accusing them of them stealing babies and killing kitties.


u have to know these chips have been running in some form or another in bitmains ‘testing’ enviroment for months now lol, no one is that naive, well at least i hope not.  Same with sia and x11 idgf what the network hash rate is after they open the floodgates.

all these coins have seen a steady rise in hash and decline in profitability months before bitmain magically announces thier sale. 

The magician has finally come out from behind the curtain but you are still falling for the illusions Dorothy
Are you trolling or you just didn't read my message? It's not a matter of naive or not naive, math doesn't lie, hashrate can't be hidden. You repeat yet again that Sia had a "steady rise in hashrate" "months before bitmain...". THAT IS NOT TRUE

From: https://siastats.info/mining

A3s batch 1 sold on Jan 18th. So, tell me, how in hell bimain "mined with them for months before selling them"? The entire Sia network hashrate was equivalent to only a few A3s before end of Jan.
legendary
Activity: 2366
Merit: 1408
Here in this topic you guys have a lot of experience and love in cryptos, maybe this is the time to boycott Asics, like said in this topic: Only decentralized GPU minable coins for this guy from here on out

If we really believe in decentralization we should stop buying Asics, stop buying coins that allow asics and support devs, coins and algos that are against asics
If we just sit and watch we'll lose everything and only big farms will exist
Totally against the core of cryptos
We are not different than bankers and government
full member
Activity: 1148
Merit: 132
People keep saying "bitmain mines with them for months before releasing them". In the case of Sia, someone said bitmain "clearly" mined for 45 days before releasing. I was there looking when Sia ASICs came out, I can for sure say that bitmain didn't mine a single day before shipping them, ASIC introduction is obvious in a small coin like Sia.

Now in the case of Monero, the entire network today is equivalent to about 4000 X3s. Clearly there is no room there for bitmain to have been "mining with the X3s for months".

I'm not saying bitmain is not evil, but I'm tired of people accusing them of them stealing babies and killing kitties.


u have to know these chips have been running in some form or another in bitmains ‘testing’ enviroment for months now lol, no one is that naive, well at least i hope not.  Same with sia and x11 idgf what the network hash rate is after they open the floodgates.

all these coins have seen a steady rise in hash and decline in profitability months before bitmain magically announces thier sale. 

The magician has finally come out from behind the curtain but you are still falling for the illusions Dorothy
member
Activity: 140
Merit: 17
People keep saying "bitmain mines with them for months before releasing them". In the case of Sia, someone said bitmain "clearly" mined for 45 days before releasing. I was there looking when Sia ASICs came out, I can for sure say that bitmain didn't mine a single day before shipping them, ASIC introduction is obvious in a small coin like Sia.

Now in the case of Monero, the entire network today is equivalent to about 4000 X3s. Clearly there is no room there for bitmain to have been "mining with the X3s for months".

I'm not saying bitmain is not evil, but I'm tired of people accusing them of them stealing babies and killing kitties.
legendary
Activity: 3416
Merit: 1059
https://twitter.com/fluffypony/status/974182821437825024

Monero's lead developer fluffypony replying to Bitmain's X3 announcement.

Imagine that... Monero openly saying X3 wont work mining Monero.... what a slap in the face.



any info about the new monero algo? will it still be cpu friendly? favors AMD or NVIDIA?
legendary
Activity: 1834
Merit: 1080
---- winter*juvia -----
https://twitter.com/fluffypony/status/974182821437825024

Monero's lead developer fluffypony replying to Bitmain's X3 announcement.

Imagine that... Monero openly saying X3 wont work mining Monero.... what a slap in the face.

legendary
Activity: 4256
Merit: 8551
'The right to privacy matters'
They're going to be bloody expensive paperweights real fast.
I doubt even the FIRST adopters will manage to make back half their price.

Seems like Bitmain didn't think THIS move through at all.



Bitmain and baikal knows exactly what they're doing. They got the rug pulled out from under them with the algo change, making their ASICs worthless. All they can do besides recycling them for precious metals is dump them on unsuspecting, uninformed miners. This is 100% a malicious move on both their parts. If the algo switch hadn't been announced, these would still be humming away in their farms making them huge profits.

It's sad that they'll get away with selling some of these to people with more money than brains.
they think they are smart but in the long term this is a big miscalculation based on thier overwhelming greed.
they have basically exposed the fact to even the nonbelivers that they mine for months with thier asics before releasing them.  They have shown withoute a doubt that they are a bad actor in the mining space , heck I think this might eveb give sia and other devs the ammunition they needed to push thier forks though.

I hope this is the info people needed.  I’ve been saying bitmain is bad actor since s5 sales.  Most people don’t like to admit when their wrong.  But those who don’t see this coming is also not good for this space.  Maybe is time to go back and read thru some old threads when people defended bitmain with every word they spoke.  Once there was a time in crypto when we were proactive not reactive.  I miss those times

I used to like bitmain did a lot of purchases from them. As time went on I see them as simply too big and as too greedy.  Once in a while I still think they have a master plan but reality is that plan does not include me.

We are in very turbulent times. For crypto coins .

If all coins die but BTC and BCH it will mean only really big owners of gear and all of us in the small to medium mines will be out of the game.

Hobby -------- will stay around
Small --------- will die
Medium ------- will die
Large ---------- may merge into Huge
Huge ----------  3 to 5 companies
Massive -------  1 to 2 companies

I am in the small size not the medium  I am over 10k and under 100k total   gear coin cash

My hope is rolling algo's for multiple coins

 a zec that changes algos
 a monero that changes algos

this keeps gpus alive.
gpu miners need understand that 110% tdp and lots of rmas hurt  the go mining indsutry as gpu companies have no interest in dealing with 2x 3x or 4x the rma rates

I will continue to hold me last 24 1080ti's
I will not load up on asics I have 6 or 7 from sidekick and 8 from jestanop all usb sticks.
I will still get the 1 dragon mint
I will still get the bitmain L3+
I may get a few avalon's as I hope they will become leaders in servicing their gear.

Oh I am going to be doing a new thread.

I have the two identical omen dual 1080ti pc's
I will be doing software tests as with 2 identical machines I can fairly compare zec programs

1st test will be
bminer 5.5
dstm 6.0
legendary
Activity: 1453
Merit: 1011
Bitcoin Talks Bullshit Walks
They're going to be bloody expensive paperweights real fast.
I doubt even the FIRST adopters will manage to make back half their price.

Seems like Bitmain didn't think THIS move through at all.



Bitmain and baikal knows exactly what they're doing. They got the rug pulled out from under them with the algo change, making their ASICs worthless. All they can do besides recycling them for precious metals is dump them on unsuspecting, uninformed miners. This is 100% a malicious move on both their parts. If the algo switch hadn't been announced, these would still be humming away in their farms making them huge profits.

It's sad that they'll get away with selling some of these to people with more money than brains.
they think they are smart but in the long term this is a big miscalculation based on thier overwhelming greed.
they have basically exposed the fact to even the nonbelivers that they mine for months with thier asics before releasing them.  They have shown withoute a doubt that they are a bad actor in the mining space , heck I think this might eveb give sia and other devs the ammunition they needed to push thier forks though.

I hope this is the info people needed.  I’ve been saying bitmain is bad actor since s5 sales.  Most people don’t like to admit when their wrong.  But those who don’t see this coming is also not good for this space.  Maybe is time to go back and read thru some old threads when people defended bitmain with every word they spoke.  Once there was a time in crypto when we were proactive not reactive.  I miss those times
legendary
Activity: 4256
Merit: 8551
'The right to privacy matters'
They're going to be bloody expensive paperweights real fast.
I doubt even the FIRST adopters will manage to make back half their price.

Seems like Bitmain didn't think THIS move through at all.



Bitmain and baikal knows exactly what they're doing. They got the rug pulled out from under them with the algo change, making their ASICs worthless. All they can do besides recycling them for precious metals is dump them on unsuspecting, uninformed miners. This is 100% a malicious move on both their parts. If the algo switch hadn't been announced, these would still be humming away in their farms making them huge profits.

It's sad that they'll get away with selling some of these to people with more money than brains.
they think they are smart but in the long term this is a big miscalculation based on thier overwhelming greed.
they have basically exposed the fact to even the nonbelivers that they mine for months with thier asics before releasing them.  They have shown withoute a doubt that they are a bad actor in the mining space , heck I think this might eveb give sia and other devs the ammunition they needed to push thier forks though.

They're 100% dumb, but I doubt they miscalculated. They have been able to mine YUGE sums of money with these in the last months. They have for sure covered their R&D and production costs on these ASICs. Their cash cow is now dead, so they try pass these on to us.

ASIC companies are absolutely, 100% of the time bad actors. Does that mean you can't make money with some ASICs? No. But when they decide to sell ASICs to the public, they have calculated that they've been milked as much as possible and then throw us the scraps to make even more money off of our backs.

Fuck ASICs, and fuck bitmain in baikal in particular.
yeah I only have a few asics and after this im resolved to stop feeding the pig
Im out , idgaf how much they claim we can make Im onky buying gpus , every dev out there
needs to fork the fk out of thier coins to get them out of the business of dumping used gear on the masses

keep your useless toastes baikal and bitmain and fuck off


Same here. My Titan is on life support, after I pull it's plug I'll have rid myself of all my ASICs. Only decentralized GPU minable coins for this guy from here on out.

Hopefully Monero inspires other coin devs to shove a cylindrical cheese grater up bitmain & companies assholes.

 any small to middle guy should side with gpu's
Basically my single biggest problem with asic's = real warranties

with the solar array I can fix power cost to always make some money unless the gear breaks.

An evga 1080ti with a 3 year warranty = a certain profit

an asic with a 90 day shit warranty = certain uncertainty
legendary
Activity: 1596
Merit: 1000
They're going to be bloody expensive paperweights real fast.
I doubt even the FIRST adopters will manage to make back half their price.

Seems like Bitmain didn't think THIS move through at all.



Bitmain and baikal knows exactly what they're doing. They got the rug pulled out from under them with the algo change, making their ASICs worthless. All they can do besides recycling them for precious metals is dump them on unsuspecting, uninformed miners. This is 100% a malicious move on both their parts. If the algo switch hadn't been announced, these would still be humming away in their farms making them huge profits.

It's sad that they'll get away with selling some of these to people with more money than brains.
they think they are smart but in the long term this is a big miscalculation based on thier overwhelming greed.
they have basically exposed the fact to even the nonbelivers that they mine for months with thier asics before releasing them.  They have shown withoute a doubt that they are a bad actor in the mining space , heck I think this might eveb give sia and other devs the ammunition they needed to push thier forks though.

They're 100% dumb, but I doubt they miscalculated. They have been able to mine YUGE sums of money with these in the last months. They have for sure covered their R&D and production costs on these ASICs. Their cash cow is now dead, so they try pass these on to us.

ASIC companies are absolutely, 100% of the time bad actors. Does that mean you can't make money with some ASICs? No. But when they decide to sell ASICs to the public, they have calculated that they've been milked as much as possible and then throw us the scraps to make even more money off of our backs.

Fuck ASICs, and fuck bitmain in baikal in particular.
yeah I only have a few asics and after this im resolved to stop feeding the pig
Im out , idgaf how much they claim we can make Im onky buying gpus , every dev out there
needs to fork the fk out of thier coins to get them out of the business of dumping used gear on the masses

keep your useless toastes baikal and bitmain and fuck off


Same here. My Titan is on life support, after I pull it's plug I'll have rid myself of all my ASICs. Only decentralized GPU minable coins for this guy from here on out.

Hopefully Monero inspires other coin devs to shove a cylindrical cheese grater up bitmain & companies assholes.
full member
Activity: 1148
Merit: 132
They're going to be bloody expensive paperweights real fast.
I doubt even the FIRST adopters will manage to make back half their price.

Seems like Bitmain didn't think THIS move through at all.



Bitmain and baikal knows exactly what they're doing. They got the rug pulled out from under them with the algo change, making their ASICs worthless. All they can do besides recycling them for precious metals is dump them on unsuspecting, uninformed miners. This is 100% a malicious move on both their parts. If the algo switch hadn't been announced, these would still be humming away in their farms making them huge profits.

It's sad that they'll get away with selling some of these to people with more money than brains.
they think they are smart but in the long term this is a big miscalculation based on thier overwhelming greed.
they have basically exposed the fact to even the nonbelivers that they mine for months with thier asics before releasing them.  They have shown withoute a doubt that they are a bad actor in the mining space , heck I think this might eveb give sia and other devs the ammunition they needed to push thier forks though.

They're 100% dumb, but I doubt they miscalculated. They have been able to mine YUGE sums of money with these in the last months. They have for sure covered their R&D and production costs on these ASICs. Their cash cow is now dead, so they try pass these on to us.

ASIC companies are absolutely, 100% of the time bad actors. Does that mean you can't make money with some ASICs? No. But when they decide to sell ASICs to the public, they have calculated that they've been milked as much as possible and then throw us the scraps to make even more money off of our backs.

Fuck ASICs, and fuck bitmain in baikal in particular.
yeah I only have a few asics and after this im resolved to stop feeding the pig
Im out , idgaf how much they claim we can make Im onky buying gpus , every dev out there
needs to fork the fk out of thier coins to get them out of the business of dumping used gear on the masses

keep your useless toastes baikal and bitmain and fuck off
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