Topic: If Greece defaults - page 17. (Read 45251 times)
But Greece already defaulted partially. How do you call getting half of your debts wavered away ?
Do some good dear Greeks, buy some bitcoins!
They will buy Bitcoins, if you could guarentee them that the Bitcoin exchange rates will not got down by 20% or 30% all of a sudden (in less than a week's duration). Right now, Bitcoin is a very volatile currency, with highly unstable exchange rates. So obviously, people will go after safer options, be it the United States Treasury Bonds, or the American Gold Eagle coins.
I know what you mean it was only to make it less tragic...
Because it is, for them, a very tough time.
Do some good dear Greeks, buy some bitcoins!
They will buy Bitcoins, if you could guarentee them that the Bitcoin exchange rates will not got down by 20% or 30% all of a sudden (in less than a week's duration). Right now, Bitcoin is a very volatile currency, with highly unstable exchange rates. So obviously, people will go after safer options, be it the United States Treasury Bonds, or the American Gold Eagle coins.
^ He's talking about Iceland. Not Ireland.
Well... none of the deals have helped them much. Give them some significant concessions (such as lowering the interest rates), and then see the results. Right now, the troika is hell bent on destroying the Greek economy. Just tell me how is it possible to make a debt payment of € 8 billion per year, when the tax revenue is much lower than that amount?
These dangerous considerations are exactly why their bonds pay as well as they do. There will be no chaotic scenario. Greece will revert back to the drachma and the banksters will take their medicine. Iceland did that and they are doing just fine.
Not so simple. Going back to the drachma requires a lot of preparation. And a lot of experience otherwise it can go very wrong. The only ones who have the expertise for that are maybe the IMF. And I don't think the Greek government has been really preparing for that possibility yet. They are just trying to make the negotiations work for now.
How many "deals" have we already had with Greece? Insanity is doing the same thing and expecting different results.
Well... none of the deals have helped them much. Give them some significant concessions (such as lowering the interest rates), and then see the results. Right now, the troika is hell bent on destroying the Greek economy. Just tell me how is it possible to make a debt payment of € 8 billion per year, when the tax revenue is much lower than that amount?
Not so simple. Going back to the drachma requires a lot of preparation. And a lot of experience otherwise it can go very wrong. The only ones who have the expertise for that are maybe the IMF. And I don't think the Greek government has been really preparing for that possibility yet. They are just trying to make the negotiations work for now.
But you are implying things aren't going to go very wrong past June 30, with or without deal. So what's there to lose?
Greeks are stashing €10,000 bundles in their homes in fear of Grexit
http://uk.businessinsider.com/greeks-withdrawing-cash-from-banks-as-eurozone-exit-looms-2015-6
Do some good dear Greeks, buy some bitcoins!
http://uk.businessinsider.com/greeks-withdrawing-cash-from-banks-as-eurozone-exit-looms-2015-6
Do some good dear Greeks, buy some bitcoins!
She also insists that a reform of the Greek pension system should be carried out to seal a deal with Athens (as I got it, essentially dismantling it)...
What madame Lagarde is implying is that, in order to satisfy the greed of Goldman Sucks and other cartels, the Greek government should confiscate the pension funds, and hand it over to the troika. The Greek pensioners have already seen their pensions reduced to a fraction of the former levels. If madame Lagarde is going to get her own way, then we can see the pensioners starving to death in Greece.
Christine Lagarde says that If Greece fails to make a payment on June 30, it will be in default with the IMF at the start of July since there is no grace period or possibility to delay. She also insists that a reform of the Greek pension system should be carried out to seal a deal with Athens (as I got it, essentially dismantling it)...
^ He's talking about Iceland. Not Ireland.
Well... none of the deals have helped them much. Give them some significant concessions (such as lowering the interest rates), and then see the results. Right now, the troika is hell bent on destroying the Greek economy. Just tell me how is it possible to make a debt payment of € 8 billion per year, when the tax revenue is much lower than that amount?
These dangerous considerations are exactly why their bonds pay as well as they do. There will be no chaotic scenario. Greece will revert back to the drachma and the banksters will take their medicine. Iceland did that and they are doing just fine.
Not so simple. Going back to the drachma requires a lot of preparation. And a lot of experience otherwise it can go very wrong. The only ones who have the expertise for that are maybe the IMF. And I don't think the Greek government has been really preparing for that possibility yet. They are just trying to make the negotiations work for now.
How many "deals" have we already had with Greece? Insanity is doing the same thing and expecting different results.
Well... none of the deals have helped them much. Give them some significant concessions (such as lowering the interest rates), and then see the results. Right now, the troika is hell bent on destroying the Greek economy. Just tell me how is it possible to make a debt payment of € 8 billion per year, when the tax revenue is much lower than that amount?
Not so simple. Going back to the drachma requires a lot of preparation. And a lot of experience otherwise it can go very wrong. The only ones who have the expertise for that are maybe the IMF. And I don't think the Greek government has been really preparing for that possibility yet. They are just trying to make the negotiations work for now.
How many "deals" have we already had with Greece? Insanity is doing the same thing and expecting different results.
Well... none of the deals have helped them much. Give them some significant concessions (such as lowering the interest rates), and then see the results. Right now, the troika is hell bent on destroying the Greek economy. Just tell me how is it possible to make a debt payment of € 8 billion per year, when the tax revenue is much lower than that amount?
I don't think we can compare Greece to Ireland. They are very different countries, with very different people.
Very different history, too, but there's no doubt some of the harsh measures Ireland took to jack up its economy could help Greece, too.
Read an interesting article from a historian's point of view. I think it's some of the freshest writing I've read in months on the situation in greece:
http://www.ekathimerini.com/4dcgi/_w_articles_wsite3_1_17/06/2015_551127
http://www.ekathimerini.com/4dcgi/_w_articles_wsite3_1_17/06/2015_551127
We have €448m to the International Monetary Fund is due this Thursday (April 9th).
Then we have public sector wages and pensions, €1.7b in social security payments made by the state (April 14th).
Then we have a €200m loan repayment to the IMF (May 1st).
Now correct me if I am wrong, but if Greece cant pay any of these 3 bills we are talking about the first "western modern" country to be technically in default. If they resort back to the Drachma, it will be one of the most worthless currencies on the planet.
What I cant really figure out is the outcome, both worldwide financially against the Euro, and obviously against Bitcoin. Will we see BTC as safe heaven? Something tells me only a little, because the average Greek is not highly IT literate, but I could be wrong here.
Give me your thoughts people, as this goes down in about 3 days from now!
Then we have public sector wages and pensions, €1.7b in social security payments made by the state (April 14th).
Then we have a €200m loan repayment to the IMF (May 1st).
Now correct me if I am wrong, but if Greece cant pay any of these 3 bills we are talking about the first "western modern" country to be technically in default. If they resort back to the Drachma, it will be one of the most worthless currencies on the planet.
What I cant really figure out is the outcome, both worldwide financially against the Euro, and obviously against Bitcoin. Will we see BTC as safe heaven? Something tells me only a little, because the average Greek is not highly IT literate, but I could be wrong here.
Give me your thoughts people, as this goes down in about 3 days from now!
If Greece defaults Greece will have to pay it back anyhow.
i never understood, how is, leaving the eurozone will help them, if they are bankrupt, it's not like , if they leaves, suddently they will gain money from nowhere, in reality they will be more in bankrupt status, than anything else, because there will not be anymore, the help from the european central banks
they will not leaves eurozone, they need the support of it
they will not leaves eurozone, they need the support of it
Don't think they want to leave. Problem is the conditions imposed on them don't give them a lot of choices. Crushing debt. Forced to have large primary budget surplus instead of using that money to rebuild economy. Austerity policies for many years now. Etc. And for example when they recently proposed increasing taxes on corporations instead of the people to make more money, and disbanding military bases they aren't using to save money, the proposal was rejected. It doesn't make sense. Leaving the eurozone may be very bad, but on the long run better for them.
i never understood, how is, leaving the eurozone will help them, if they are bankrupt, it's not like , if they leaves, suddently they will gain money from nowhere, in reality they will be more in bankrupt status, than anything else, because there will not be anymore, the help from the european central banks
they will not leaves eurozone, they need the support of it
they will not leaves eurozone, they need the support of it
no one is going to be carrying physical gold and silver to pay in shops.
how will people buy things over the internet with metals? they'll have to have gold banks which i doubt anyone will trust after a default.
bitcoin is the obvious answer but most people are too stupid to realize it.
how will people buy things over the internet with metals? they'll have to have gold banks which i doubt anyone will trust after a default.
bitcoin is the obvious answer but most people are too stupid to realize it.
Greece should accept they are in bankruptcy.
If Greece leaves the Euro.... this is longterm bullish for Euro, right?
I mean, short term, some shock maybe, but this is sort of cutting out the weak link, yeah? Seems the EURUSD market is still willing to go bull on bearish US economic data..... so the bears don't seem that strong.
I mean, short term, some shock maybe, but this is sort of cutting out the weak link, yeah? Seems the EURUSD market is still willing to go bull on bearish US economic data..... so the bears don't seem that strong.
Don't think anyone knows for sure it would be that simple. Partly depends on the effect on other countries going through austerity and how people react. It's the contagion idea. Depositors in countries like Spain, Italy or Portugal may try to move their money out of the country to safer places. Could lead to a banking crisis there and other banks that lent to those countries. And businesses and people may cut spending out of fear leading to another recession.
If Greece leaves the Euro.... this is longterm bullish for Euro, right?
I mean, short term, some shock maybe, but this is sort of cutting out the weak link, yeah? Seems the EURUSD market is still willing to go bull on bearish US economic data..... so the bears don't seem that strong.
I mean, short term, some shock maybe, but this is sort of cutting out the weak link, yeah? Seems the EURUSD market is still willing to go bull on bearish US economic data..... so the bears don't seem that strong.
Very true, and the Bulgarians are smarter, it's a much better country to start a business than in Greece. Economic data doesn't lie. Foreign investments are growing in Bulgaria, and global economic growth is among the best in Europe. I guess Bulgarians could teach a lot to Greeks, but the Greeks don't want to learn.
Bulgaria transformed itself from a third world nation to a developed nation, after it joined the European Union. The salaries are still extremely low, when compared to those in the other parts of the EU, and that's why the corporations are flocking to Bulgaria. And the real estate sector is also seeing a lot of momentum, especially from the non-EU clients (Russia, Turkey).
Kick the ~Greece out from the EU .They lied to join the EZ , and they should not be trusted again with a Golden Credit Card again.
Eastern Europeans live on far less than they do.
A pensioner in Bulgaria gets half of what a Greek pensioner gets in Greece right now.
Have you seen the Bulgarians asking for more ? If the Bulgarians can live without borrowing money, so the Greeks can do.
Eastern Europeans live on far less than they do.
A pensioner in Bulgaria gets half of what a Greek pensioner gets in Greece right now.
Have you seen the Bulgarians asking for more ? If the Bulgarians can live without borrowing money, so the Greeks can do.
Very true, and the Bulgarians are smarter, it's a much better country to start a business than in Greece. Economic data doesn't lie. Foreign investments are growing in Bulgaria, and global economic growth is among the best in Europe. I guess Bulgarians could teach a lot to Greeks, but the Greeks don't want to learn.
A pensioner in Bulgaria gets half of what a Greek pensioner gets in Greece right now.
If the Bulgarian pensioners are earning less, then it is the fault of the Bulgarians and their government, not the Greeks' fault. An average pensioner in Greece has contributed as much as 10 times the amount to the pension fund, compared to the same by the Bulgarian pensioners. Using that logic, the pensioners in Greece should be getting 10 times the pensions as in Bulgaria. But that is not the case, as 80% of the money in the pension funds are diverted to make the debt payments.
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The controls on Greece should have been in position from day one.The EU threw money at Greece for years.They never reformed and wont be reforming now.They will never be fit for the EU and many nations in Europe are not fit for the EU the only nation fit for the EU is Germany so it should leave and reintroduce the EU mark as its currency.U wait and see the EU will break up the peoples power will ultimately win through and the corrupt and stupid politicians will lose. its all happened before Hitlers 100 year Reich lasted 13 years so the EU has already done very well indeed.
Yes Greece should leave, but I disagree with who's ruining Europe's Economy, but those at the helm of the Dream they still cling too, everyone else's Nightmare, who's not a big Multi Corporation, or Banker, a Politician, the Unelected that rule the roast out there in the EU, the fault lays firmly at their feet, there is no recovery, any Government that relies on a Central Bank, is Bankrupt, were all on the verge of another total collapse of the Monetary System, WAY BIGGER purely because of Fraud at the highest level, you can't fix what you broke by doing the same thing.
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