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Topic: I'm Kevin, here's my side. - page 20. (Read 258592 times)

newbie
Activity: 28
Merit: 0
June 20, 2011, 04:36:43 PM
#45
Kevin, this isn't something that can be decided with forum posts. Get a lawyer and keep your mouth shut in public.


this ^

you can't seriously thing that you'll get the 250k or parts of it by making a forum post, do you?
there is nothing to gain, but there is 643 BTC to loose in case MtGox demands those back and you are making public statements here.


And if he refuses to give them back??? What are they going to do, sue him? How did any of us know it was a hack. As I stated, there were many forum posts right HERE talking about the "major selloff". People thought Satoshi was getting out and dumping. 90 percent of you would have bought at .01 if you could have. SO Mt Gox should get their coins back bcause they allowed themselves to be compromised?

Someone gets their wallet stolen and the prevailing attitude here is "oh well, should have been more careful", but a site trusted with our financial resources allows themselves to be hacked, and everyone feels bad for them?
hero member
Activity: 532
Merit: 500
FIAT LIBERTAS RVAT CAELVM
June 20, 2011, 04:36:11 PM
#44
We have no idea they were hacked, absolutely. We do not know they did not hack themselves.

A self-hack is still a hack. What I would like to see is a post from the guy whose account got drained. (verified, 'course.)
sr. member
Activity: 280
Merit: 252
June 20, 2011, 04:35:22 PM
#43
Must have been one hell of a few minutes!
full member
Activity: 182
Merit: 100
June 20, 2011, 04:35:09 PM
#42
I honestly can't say if I was in your position, I wouldn't be say the same thing.  And it probably hurts real bad.  I don't even know what solution is the right one - because almost every option is bad for somebody or the concept of btc itself.

newbie
Activity: 56
Merit: 0
June 20, 2011, 04:33:53 PM
#41
Kevin, this isn't something that can be decided with forum posts. Get a lawyer and keep your mouth shut in public.


this ^

you can't seriously thing that you'll get the 250k or parts of it by making a forum post, do you?
there is nothing to gain, but there is 643 BTC to loose in case MtGox demands those back and you are making public statements here.
member
Activity: 90
Merit: 12
June 20, 2011, 04:33:31 PM
#40
Kevin, this isn't something that can be decided with forum posts. Get a lawyer and keep your mouth shut in public.


If I lawyer up, it's game over. The lawyers I talked to said the first thing I'd have to do would be to get an injunction, which would effectively start a run on MtGox's reserves, which I won't do.

If nothing more, I'd like to be a cautionary tale to everyone else and stop the misunderstandings that resulted from Mt Gox's poorly written statement.
newbie
Activity: 28
Merit: 0
June 20, 2011, 04:33:20 PM
#39
I am astounded at the outpouring of support for MtGox here. Wow. MtGox allowed itself to be compromised, THEY are the ones responsible for settling things financially here. If they werent ready for this possibility, they shouldnt have been in the business.
hero member
Activity: 616
Merit: 500
June 20, 2011, 04:32:37 PM
#38
sr. member
Activity: 364
Merit: 251
June 20, 2011, 04:32:02 PM
#37
I feel for you, Kevin, I really do. Problem is, this isn't someone making a stupid trade, or even someone trying intentionally to crash the market. In either of those instances, I would support you in keeping not only the 643, but the full 259684. It wasn't though. It was a Hack. Which means that the poor guy whose BTC you got had nothing to do with the trade, which means that he was stolen from.

MtGox allowed the theft, so its their responsibility to fix it, which means returning things to the way they were before the hack.

This means you're out those BTC you didn't get out, And I would return the 643, as well. On the bright side, you get your cash back.

We have no idea they were hacked, absolutely. We do not know they did not hack themselves.
legendary
Activity: 1050
Merit: 1003
June 20, 2011, 04:31:05 PM
#36
Kevin, this isn't something that can be decided with forum posts. Get a lawyer and keep your mouth shut in public.
sr. member
Activity: 364
Merit: 251
June 20, 2011, 04:30:45 PM
#35
Quote
I also haven't said what I would do with that 643.

you basically admitted that you knew at the time you withdrew the 643 that it was the loot of a hacker.


No, I had no way of knowing what was going on then, and still don't know. At first I thought it'd be safer trying to get a pile of bitcoins off a site if it possibly was hacked, but had absolutely no way of knowing.



I think you are smart Kevin. That should be rewarded. Not with stolen bitcoins, but first we need proof they were actually "stolen". Otherwise, they are and should be rightfully, yours.
hero member
Activity: 812
Merit: 1001
-
June 20, 2011, 04:30:06 PM
#34
Talk to a lawyer, preferably one specialising in securities. Who knows you might get a settlement from mtgox and rest of the community terms and conditions.

You will not find any justice even if you deserve it on the forum.



hero member
Activity: 532
Merit: 500
FIAT LIBERTAS RVAT CAELVM
June 20, 2011, 04:29:47 PM
#33
I feel for you, Kevin, I really do. Problem is, this isn't someone making a stupid trade, or even someone trying intentionally to crash the market. In either of those instances, I would support you in keeping not only the 643, but the full 259684. It wasn't though. It was a Hack. Which means that the poor guy whose BTC you got had nothing to do with the trade, which means that he was stolen from.

MtGox allowed the theft, so its their responsibility to fix it, which means returning things to the way they were before the hack.

This means you're out those BTC you didn't get out, And I would return the 643, as well. On the bright side, you get your cash back.
member
Activity: 90
Merit: 12
June 20, 2011, 04:29:40 PM
#32
Quote
I also haven't said what I would do with that 643.

you basically admitted that you knew at the time you withdrew the 643 that it was the loot of a hacker.


No, I had no way of knowing what was going on then, and still don't know. At first I thought it'd be safer trying to get a pile of bitcoins off a site if it possibly was hacked, but had absolutely no way of knowing.

legendary
Activity: 1736
Merit: 1006
June 20, 2011, 04:29:11 PM
#31
Honestly, I think you should just keep the coins. I personally was sleeping when the crash happened, but as a matter of principle I don't think actual BTC transactions should be reversed once finalized in the chain. Reversing the trades on MtGox's servers, though, is up to the owners, as there aren't actual BTC transactions being added to the chain.

MtGox screwed up though, and they should take the loss.

What would be honest about that?
member
Activity: 113
Merit: 10
June 20, 2011, 04:29:02 PM
#30
I almost wish you would have cashed out and would now have much more leverage against MtGox. I wish you luck OP, and think you're in the right
newbie
Activity: 57
Merit: 0
June 20, 2011, 04:28:10 PM
#29
When I signed up at Mt.Gox first thing I noticed was lack of user identity security. Definitely left themselves open to abuse.
legendary
Activity: 1736
Merit: 1006
June 20, 2011, 04:27:54 PM
#28
Executive summary:

1.) "I took advantage of an extraordinary event that turned out to be initiated by a rogue sell order, not legitimate trading."

2.) "Can I keep it? Look, here's why."

No, sorry. To allow the trade to stand would legitimize the attack, is that what you really want? (Besides bitcoins and dollars, I mean.)


+ 1,000
newbie
Activity: 14
Merit: 0
June 20, 2011, 04:27:23 PM
#27
Honestly, I think you should just keep the coins. I personally was sleeping when the crash happened, but as a matter of principle I don't think actual BTC transactions should be reversed once finalized in the chain. Reversing the trades on MtGox's servers, though, is up to the owners, as there aren't actual BTC transactions being added to the chain.

MtGox screwed up though, and they should take the loss.
full member
Activity: 210
Merit: 100
June 20, 2011, 04:27:03 PM
#26
Bitcoin is hardly a professional currency yet. It's an amateur one.

More of these things can be expected until the pros step in and start running things.


It's like comparing a street full of globalised company owned stores to a kid's fair at a school.
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