Incoming Avalon News 8/9/2013 - page 33.

pajak666

hero member

Activity: 746

Merit: 502

Looking for advertising deal

Quote from: Bitcoinorama on August 28, 2013, 03:04:07 PM

Pajak666, any chance you could get him to do a close up? Be interesting to see whether the manu. week number printed on the chip correlates with the 2.1million missing chips delivered in June...

I have done it already, but this guy is somewhat busy traveling across country so it might take few hours.
I don't see what it will actually change, tracking is proven, previous pictures of boxes full of chips are proven, now chips from chinese local resellers in are confirmed.

BFL - CEO

newbie

Activity: 14

Merit: 0

http://s10.postimg.org/6w5xgzoop/avalonchips.png

lemonte

hero member

Activity: 624

Merit: 502

Quote from: Bitcoinorama on August 28, 2013, 03:04:07 PM

Pajak666, any chance you could get him to do a close up? Be interesting to see whether the manu. week number printed on the chip correlates with the 2.1million missing chips delivered in June...

Nice shout!

Bitcoinorama

hero member

Activity: 532

Merit: 500

Pajak666, any chance you could get him to do a close up? Be interesting to see whether the manu. week number printed on the chip correlates with the 2.1million missing chips delivered in June...

g83

sr. member

Activity: 448

Merit: 250

Super Smash Bros. Ultimate Available Now!

I would sell mine too if they ever arrive

Xialla

legendary

Activity: 1036

Merit: 1001

/dev/null

Quote from: pajak666 on August 28, 2013, 02:10:28 PM

He is asking 31$ per chip.
VOILA that's where yifu shipped bitcointalk community chips, to a local resellers in Asia
Alibaba offers are real and toabao offers are real.
Still not in the mood for a proper lawsuit?

hmm it is so sad, how this chinese idiot from basement fuck up with community here. no words to comment this..

SebastianJu

legendary

Activity: 2674

Merit: 1083

Legendary Escrow Service - Tip Jar in Profile

Quote from: erk on August 28, 2013, 05:30:22 AM

Quote from: SebastianJu on August 28, 2013, 05:18:59 AM

Its not correct that a rising bitcoin exchange price is good for anything. If you await that the bitcoin price is rising then it would be smarter to simply buy bitcoins.

I'm pretty certain by now that most people are counting on the BTC price to rise.

As we have seen, people will do weak business plans an build big mining farms regardless of the trends and facts about difficulty staring them in the face.

Maybe some of them want a couple of my bitburner when i have them...

pajak666

hero member

Activity: 746

Merit: 502

Looking for advertising deal

Ok here as promised:
Photos from chinese stuff importer in Poland.
According to what he says somebody ordered 500 chips by him, and did not show up to pick up his order.
Here is most funny part, he writes:
"mamy 500szt, ale nic nie stoi na przeszkodzie, aby w około miesiąc czasu ściągnąć większą ilość z Azji, gdyby tylko miał Pan zbyt na to."
Which stands for "we got 500 pieces, but it's not a problem to import whole lot more from Asia, only if you could find a place where to sell it"
He is just a middle man, clueless what to do with the chips

Hi res pictures
http://extrazoom.com/image-5697.html?heuln50x50
http://extrazoom.com/image-5696.html?heuln50x50

He is asking 31$ per chip.
VOILA that's where yifu shipped bitcointalk community chips, to a local resellers in Asia
Alibaba offers are real and toabao offers are real.
Still not in the mood for a proper lawsuit?

erk

hero member

Activity: 826

Merit: 500

Quote from: SebastianJu on August 28, 2013, 05:18:59 AM

Its not correct that a rising bitcoin exchange price is good for anything. If you await that the bitcoin price is rising then it would be smarter to simply buy bitcoins.

I'm pretty certain by now that most people are counting on the BTC price to rise.

As we have seen, people will do weak business plans an build big mining farms regardless of the trends and facts about difficulty staring them in the face.

SebastianJu

legendary

Activity: 2674

Merit: 1083

Legendary Escrow Service - Tip Jar in Profile

Quote from: ?? on ??

Quote from: erk on August 27, 2013, 10:43:51 PM

I don't think ASIC mining scales to suit big farms. I think it is best for home users with no staff or rent overheads, I might be wrong, but so far none of the big projects make sense on paper unless BTC/USD starts doubling in price every few months.

+1

You are very right about this. Bitcoin mining does not make any business sense. Only when projections of ever increasing BTC/USD exchange rate are included a business plan, the numbers add up.

Big farms have big capital expenditures, operating costs AND ever decreasing profits. How is it attractive from a business perspective? It is extremely risky, needs lots of capital and profits are decreasing every two weeks. You need to add more capital to invest in more hardware and infrastructure to maintain the same profit level. But even then the the actual profit/capital invested is decreasing as time goes on.

If you build 14M data center, the capacity of that center might be reached within first few months, then what? You build another one? Another 14M?

Its not correct that a rising bitcoin exchange price is good for anything. If you await that the bitcoin price is rising then it would be smarter to simply buy bitcoins.

badalien

sr. member

Activity: 540

Merit: 250

BestRate.org

Yifu ripped us, day by day by day. Day by day lies. The men must in court.

Unacceptable

legendary

Activity: 2212

Merit: 1001

Quote from: rebelrat on August 28, 2013, 12:31:33 AM

Quote from: superduh on August 28, 2013, 12:12:46 AM

Quote from: CoinHoarder on August 27, 2013, 06:36:18 PM

Prison? Jeez.. I'm as upset with the delays as anyone, but this seems a little harsh.

I do agree though that Avalon are basically scammers at this point.

intentional fraud,if proven, should be punishable by jail especially if there is no restitution to the victims. we can't have people arbitrarily held accountable.

Could not agree more. As I said before, to hurt the gangsta is to take his money, that seems what he
craves. His actions are criminal, by any legal standard, that is besides the civil liabilities incurred.
Well played, a good legal team can bury him financially for the rest of his life, besides the time he will
have to serve. We are talking about several Million $ - that is no chickenfeed, not by any standard.
When you get caught embezzling Millions, you usually end up doing time in the US.

Sonny V. from BFL got away with it(slap on the wrist only),so will Y I FU Roll Eyes

eve

full member

Activity: 210

Merit: 100

Quote from: erk on August 28, 2013, 12:23:47 AM

So where did that Avalon chip shipment that was tracked to Hong Kong end up, at Bitmine?

A possibility Bitmine have to pay extra to shipped the chips maybe another $2k or so to Yifu, so he can ship his batch a head of others,.

rebelrat

newbie

Activity: 52

Merit: 0

Quote from: superduh on August 28, 2013, 12:12:46 AM

Quote from: CoinHoarder on August 27, 2013, 06:36:18 PM

Prison? Jeez.. I'm as upset with the delays as anyone, but this seems a little harsh.

I do agree though that Avalon are basically scammers at this point.

intentional fraud,if proven, should be punishable by jail especially if there is no restitution to the victims. we can't have people arbitrarily held accountable.

Could not agree more. As I said before, to hurt the gangsta is to take his money, that seems what he
craves. His actions are criminal, by any legal standard, that is besides the civil liabilities incurred.
Well played, a good legal team can bury him financially for the rest of his life, besides the time he will
have to serve. We are talking about several Million $ - that is no chickenfeed, not by any standard.
When you get caught embezzling Millions, you usually end up doing time in the US.

erk

hero member

Activity: 826

Merit: 500

So where did that Avalon chip shipment that was tracked to Hong Kong end up, at Bitmine?

superduh

hero member

Activity: 602

Merit: 500

Quote from: CoinHoarder on August 27, 2013, 06:36:18 PM

Prison? Jeez.. I'm as upset with the delays as anyone, but this seems a little harsh.

I do agree though that Avalon are basically scammers at this point.

intentional fraud,if proven, should be punishable by jail especially if there is no restitution to the victims. we can't have people arbitrarily held accountable.

User705

legendary

Activity: 896

Merit: 1006

First 100% Liquid Stablecoin Backed by Gold

Quote from: ?? on ??

Quote from: erk on August 27, 2013, 10:43:51 PM

I don't think ASIC mining scales to suit big farms. I think it is best for home users with no staff or rent overheads, I might be wrong, but so far none of the big projects make sense on paper unless BTC/USD starts doubling in price every few months.

+1

You are very right about this. Bitcoin mining does not make any business sense. Only when projections of ever increasing BTC/USD exchange rate are included a business plan, the numbers add up.

Big farms have big capital expenditures, operating costs AND ever decreasing profits. How is it attractive from a business perspective? It is extremely risky, needs lots of capital and profits are decreasing every two weeks. You need to add more capital to invest in more hardware and infrastructure to maintain the same profit level. But even then the the actual profit/capital invested is decreasing as time goes on.

If you build 14M data center, the capacity of that center might be reached within first few months, then what? You build another one? Another 14M?

Quote from: DeathAndTaxes on August 27, 2013, 11:27:55 PM

Quote from: erk on August 27, 2013, 11:11:25 PM

Don't forget to double your electricity costs to allow for the air conditioning. If you have to hire even a single staff member to run the show, their wages would buy a lot of electricity. Data center space is not cheap either.

Good point on the AC.

I got an interesting idea regarding this. Looking for trusted hero members to partner up. If any are interested PM me plz.

DeathAndTaxes

donator

Activity: 1218

Merit: 1080

Gerald Davis

Quote from: erk on August 27, 2013, 11:11:25 PM

Don't forget to double your electricity costs to allow for the air conditioning. If you have to hire even a single staff member to run the show, their wages would buy a lot of electricity. Data center space is not cheap either.

Good point on the AC.

erk

hero member

Activity: 826

Merit: 500

Quote from: DeathAndTaxes on August 27, 2013, 10:52:57 PM

Quote from: Syke on August 27, 2013, 10:40:23 PM

Quote from: erk on August 27, 2013, 10:34:45 PM

It's quite laughable, 4PH/s of obsolete 110nm Avalon chips with no chance of ROI, probably wont even cover power costs.

Don't be ridiculous. It's going to be quite some time before Avalon chips can't cover power costs.

17.9 PH @ $100 exchange rate & $0.10 per kWh. It could happen mid next year. If you believe some of the "exponential growth forever" kids it will happen in 10 weeks or some nonsense.
https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/break-even-difficulty-by-hardware-efficiency-power-cost-value-of-btc-281279

Don't forget to double your electricity costs to allow for the air conditioning. If you have to hire even a single staff member to run the show, their wages would buy a lot of electricity. Data center space is not cheap either.

The article also said Bitmine were in Hong Kong where the electricity is way more than $0.10 per kWh.
http://www.hkelectric.com/web/CommercialAndIndustrialServices/BillingPaymentAndElectricityTariff/TariffTable/Index_en.htm

DeathAndTaxes

donator

Activity: 1218

Merit: 1080

Gerald Davis

Quote from: Syke on August 27, 2013, 10:40:23 PM

Quote from: erk on August 27, 2013, 10:34:45 PM

It's quite laughable, 4PH/s of obsolete 110nm Avalon chips with no chance of ROI, probably wont even cover power costs.

Don't be ridiculous. It's going to be quite some time before Avalon chips can't cover power costs.

17.9 PH @ $100 exchange rate & $0.10 per kWh. It could happen mid next year. If you believe some of the "exponential growth forever" kids it will happen in 10 weeks or some nonsense.
https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/break-even-difficulty-by-hardware-efficiency-power-cost-value-of-btc-281279

Topic: Incoming Avalon News 8/9/2013 - page 33. (Read 186795 times)