Topic: Innosilicon's A4 Dominator, 1.2W/Mhs 14nm ASIC and miner, open for Partners - page 17. (Read 49008 times)

I know it sucks as we are all hoping for a bigger leap in hash and power use, but this is my email in full.

Dave,

The hash rate per box is different from what we expected, but it's based on sample chip performance tested in the lab. And still A4 Dominator has the best efficiency ever, and we determined the price based on the specs.

Are you still interested? How many do you want? Since our first batch has very limited quantities, we will serve batch orders first.

Best regards,
Chloe Zhang
+86 18040500320
Innosilicon Technology Ltd.
www.innosilicon.com.cn

From: Chloe Zhang [mailto:[email protected]]
Sent: Sunday, June 12, 2016 12:31 PM
To: 'Dave'
Cc: '[email protected]'
Subject: RE: new a4 miner pre orders... Dave

Dear Dave,

I’m doing good. How about you?

A4 miners is open for pre-order now at price of 1800 USD per unit plus shipping fee, 10 units to start, with about 1000W per 260Mhs (+-10% performance variation) each and 30 days parts warranty.

Delivery starts from September and max delay is one month.

Best regards,
Chloe Zhang
+86 18040500320
Innosilicon Technology Ltd.
www.innosilicon.com.cn

From: Dave [mailto:]
Sent: Sunday, June 12, 2016 9:38 AM
To: 'Chloe Zhang'
Subject: new a4 miner pre orders... Dave

Hi Chloe, how are you today?
I was wondering if you are getting close to selling the new a4’s? What would be the final specs and the final pricing, with the farmboy discount? Thanks Dave

Thats extremely crappy performance / power usage. Is your "email response" even real?

Yea not sure whats going on here...they seemed like they had sample chips in from the fab last month and published those "tested" 1.5 w/MH specs, which is in line with what a 14nm scrypt chip *should* do. Now they are stating 4 w/mh??? Thats very fishy...I got 5 w/mh efficiency out of the 40nm Alcheminer chip on my USB miner. The only thing I can think of is that yield so horrible that they are only getting 1/4 functional cores per silicon area. That or they are selling an improved version of their 28nm chip and saying its 14nm...

I get 275MH/s @ 1250w from the wall, giving me about 4.54w/mh. Thats as good as Ive been able to get it even at extremely low clocks.

price is way too high if those numbers are right would not pay more than 900 per unit

      

"Miner Performance: 600Mhs from 720W at the Wall or 850Mhs from 1020W"

not even CLOSE. one really WOULD ask if that's even 14nm ;(

Are those miners really 14nm? Their performance is a huge disappointment.

wow, this means the titans are not far in eficiency... right now, one of my titans are doing 280Mh/s and draining 1320w (at the wall), so 4.71w/mhs; the new 14nm A4 will do 3.85w/mhs? it is only 18% better?? and i think i can optimice my titan better than now...   

And BTW, this miner was initially, "Miner Performance: 600Mhs from 720W at the Wall or 850Mhs from 1020W", so 1.2w/mhs, then they published "A4 Miner: 400Mhs per 1KW power supply in one standard miner box", 2.5w/mhs, but now they are telling 3.85w/mhs... in september they can publish 220mh/s and draining 1150w?? (4.6mh/s) 

email response from Innosilicon  (A4 miners is open for pre-order now at price of 1800 USD per unit plus shipping fee, 10 units to start, with about 1000W per 260Mhs (+-10% performance variation) each and 30 days parts warranty. Delivery starts from September and max delay is one month.) you would need an order of at least 10 on first come first served, very limited quantities. It is out of my ability to buy right now, just thought I would pass the info on.

I think this is a really good scope on the possible timeline given the info we have so far.  I received an email from Innosilicon that the miner is not ready yet, but to stay tuned.  Based on the pieces of info we have so far I think this timeline Searing has outlined is probably close to reality. 

On the pre-order thing from Aliexpress I will pass on that one...  This is WAY to speculative for my blood... I would rather sit on the BTC and get something firm in the way of pricing and ship dates.  And I also have seen A2's that look like the pictures.  Also note the description of an A4 says 2 modules...  So way too many things don't add up from the description to the pictures. 

I have an A2 Terminator that looks exactly like the one pictured. I believe it is the model from LKETC. It just depends if you allow them to be called A2 Terminators but they do exist.

 They're not A2 images.

 (1) 5 boards, NOT 6.
 (2) too much open space in the case. NONE of the A2 units I own or have seen pics of have that much open space between the "first" hashboard and the controller boards.
 (3) I don't think the A2 ever came in a black case, but not 100% sure on that.


 They could be using pictures of prototype units provided to them by Innosilicon.
 They also might be recycling Dragon miner pics - I think I remember some Dragons in black cases.



 Innosilicon WAS talking "mass production" in June/July timeframe - one would think they'd have at least a FEW prototype miners built by now for testing and to take pics of.

Well assuming I have this correct and all the 'bulk orders' (was it like over 100k they would talk to you) it may be a long time before we see the A4

on the following (my guesses)

Prototype :   JULY 2016

Prototype to Production: say AUG 2016

Bulk Purchases out:  AUG THRU SAY SEPT 2016

1st run of individual units at say (4k) each...would START SHIPPING IN OCTOBER ...now if this is at a 4k price yet...they an't gonna sell many imho.

again above is assuming the timeline has ANY merit and what was in this guys description is legit that is selling the pre-order on aliexpress

The images on the Aliexpress page look like A2 images.  The description says the A4 prototype won't be available until July.  So what is pictured is not one of the prototypes.  This is a "pre-order" for still unbuilt equipment.  Also from what I have read Innosilicon does not do preorders.  So this person selling either must have a standing order and commitment for a bulk order or he/she is taking wild liberties on the price and number he will have available to sell. 

Thanks for the link.  It at least has a bunch of us all talking and thinking about doing really stupid stuff like a bulk preorder...  Yes, we are that crazy!  I personally am going to wait until something firms up and then figure out where in the world I would put more miners or get more electricity to run them! ROFL

Is this what were talking about?
http://www.aliexpress.com/store/product/New-arrival-Zeus-Scrypt-Miner-All-Solution-Litecoin-Miner-300M-digging-Litecoin-with-power-supply-send/227686_2048732975.html

Of course the description on the page says newest A2 480M miner the link looks to be describe something different.
If so looking at it I find it strange to see what looks like DC-DC converter inductors all over the boards, I thought they were DC-DC less.

In the for what it's worth department : this guy will be selling them.

I've bought a bunch of equipment off him and he's trustworthy - so is the guy at Itopshop.net - I've bought from him also.

I'm in the East Coast of the US and stuff arrive in 2 days via DHL

http://www.aliexpress.com/store/227686

I tried to be optimistic and re-looked at my views on the 4k (likely) for an A4 being correct. (remember I know zip at one time I drank the BFL kool aid..you've been warned) BUT

just can't feel it. I mean from Innsilicon's point of view with LTC now at around $5 IF they came out with one at 4k imho they'd be patting themselves on the back as being

nice guys and not gouging the 'home miners' (compared to other prices in the past and service/firmware/support from other asic makers of all kinds in the past they'd likely be

correct ..again imho)

So to tell the truth 4k on review looks 'low ball' now...it likely will be somewhat to a lot higher is my conclusion now.

As to the 2nd elephant in the room HOW many will they make? ie ..will they be more into 'bulk' sales and the home miner market is an afterthought (even at 4k price) or will
they go all 'consumer is all' and crank  out bulk sales/chip sales/home miner sales and flood the market...likely in that at this time it is JUST them...again imho they will (if a 4k price)
sell a limited number of these units...a couple months after the units at the bulk price units/bulk chips/whatever have moved out the door and play king of the hill ....actually
the only guys on the hill ..have someone to climb the hill and/or even frigging be within distance of seeing the hill

hard to 'limit' oneself on your product price wise etc if you are the 'only game in town'

They also could easily imho 'justify' a 4k price simply because used Titans on Ebay go for 3.3k (low) to 3.7k (high) if you can find them on ebay. Currently no one is selling since
the last panic dump on the knc class action loss.....zip.....that is if they happened to be really trying to 'guess' the market.

Also is the consensus here the unit is gonna be 400mh and 1150 watts yet? Perhaps someone knows if it is higher then that? I would have to modify my calcs or as I like to say

"big ass guesses' if the A4 units were now 600mh or some such

whatever...again hope I'm wrong and they are 400mh 1150 watts at 2100 bucks ........(the 90 day warranty still bugs the hell out of me however ...live a little make it 6 months?)

 The Baikal is Johnnie-come-Lately - I suspect the other 2 had more to do with X11 hashrate jumps so far.
 I'm still shocked that *3* different entities came out with X11 ASIC at almost the same time, much less AT ALL - and I have to wonder how many if any of them are going to manage to recoup their investment in the chip work.


 I would be SHOCKED to see the A4 start out at $2000 - I'm starting to think I was optimistic planning for it to be INNOSILICON DIRECT priced at $2500.

 Year or two from now, after the initial sales rush has ended, I could see it dropping to the $2k range - or IF someone else actually gets a competative Scrypt miner out the door (seems like the Alcheminer folks aren't going to manage it, didn't raise enough funding for their second-gen miner/chip designs).


 

thanks - I just wanted to save your quote as is  for future reference.

OMG! Thank you for a good laugh today! I like it.