Topic: Just-Dice.com : now with added CLAMs : Play or Invest - page 53. (Read 454769 times)

People have asked about it before, but I don't think it would really work. The house edge is only 1%, and 90% of that goes to the investors. That means that the site only takes 0.1% of turnover on average. Affiliate programs usually pay way more than that, so we just can't compete.

You're welcome to refer people anyway, since now that you're invested you'll get a share of anything they lose. But I don't think a referral program is worth doing. I hate affiliate links in general anyway. It just encourages people to spam places.


Ha!

BayAreaCoins made some pretty big bets today on the site. He was up over 3000 on the day when he started betting 1 CLAM at 1%, trying to hit the 99x payout. After a bunch of losses he upped his bet to 2 CLAM, 5 CLAM, 10 CLAM. After 239 losing bets rolling 'hi' at 1% he gave up and switched to betting 1000 CLAMs at 49.5%, lo. And guess what... the very next roll was a 99.x and the 1% would finally have hit. He stopped playing exactly at the wrong time, at the end of a 239 bet losing streak:



It's lucky we're provably fair because nobody would believe it otherwise.

Imagine that was you Dabs

Do I know this user?

nice site .. invested a bit online n offline

cant we have referral link to promote to others n win on their losses / winnings?

well hufflepuff could be playing atm with another account, cashing up 1-2 bitcoins a day , who knows what that guy might be doing now anyway

3000 or 4000 win for Hufflepuff but maybe much more with other accounts.
RobbingHood made it obvious by winning 100 large bets in a row!

or the one with the exploit could be clever enough by intentioning to lose some high amount while trying to strive for great profit

If I can be sure that you cheated to win then I won't let you withdraw your ill-gotten winnings. But it's pretty much impossible to be sure. People often have very lucky runs, and I won't ever use that as an excuse to withhold winnings.

That'd be an exploit. I'm sure Dooglus analyzes the records as well before paying out huge wins, and probably does it proactively regardless.

ahh thats finally explains the magic of that hupplepuff, so is it or is it not againts the rules that if we somehow discover the server seed and use it to win the game?

Ah, that explained it, thanks !

Yes. If you can discover your server seed you can win the whole bankroll.

You would need to be careful to not make it look too obvious.

This apparently happened not so long ago at Prime Dice, where a player called "Hufflepuff" was able to somehow discover their server seed and then proceeded to win and withdraw some large number (4000?) of Bitcoins. He was careful to hit losing streaks as well as winning ones, but the winning streaks always ended up being bigger. I think the who thing took a few weeks to play out.

Shortly after that another player, called something like RobbingHood won over 100 large bets in a row at 49.5%. I guess this was the same person. He wasn't able to withdraw much of his winnings before the account was banned.

https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.9576925
http://www.reddit.com/r/Primedice/comments/2mmg69/

Great explanation! Doesn't this also open the server to potential exploits, though, in that someone else could gain access to the same information?

Here's the 10 days or so:

It's like this:

1) the server picks a random "server seed" for your account
2) the server tells you the hash of the server seed, and you make a note of it
3) you pick a "client seed"
4) you make a bunch of bets - each roll is the result of hashing the two seeds (server and client) together with a nonce which is 1 for the first bet you make, and goes up by 1 for each subsequent bet you make
5) you click 'randomize'; the server publishes your server seed
6) go to 1

a) You then compare the hash of the server seed from (5) with the hash given in (2) to make sure that the seed you were given after you played matches the hash you were given before you played. That proves to you that the site committed to a particular server seed before you picked your client seed.

b) Then you use the server seed (5) and the client seed (3) to regenerate all the rolls you made. You can compare them with the rolls the site actually gave you.

Since the site provably picked the server seed before you played and before you told it your client seed (a), and since the site used those two seeds to generate all your rolls (b), there's no way the site could have cheated you.

So in a sense the rolls are random, since they depend on the server seed, which is random.

But in another sense the rolls are predetermined once you've picked your client seed, since the pair of seeds uniquely and completely determines all your future rolls.

Since you pick the client seed *after* we pick the server seed, we can't pick what numbers you are going to roll. The client seed has the final say on that, and that's entirely your decision.

If each roll was truly random, there would be no way for you to check whether the site was cheating. You play "less than 98", we pick "99". You lose. Did we cheat? We went to random.org and it told us 99. Honest! There's no way you can be sure we went to random.org and didn't just pick a number bigger than 98 to make you lose. So that's why we do it how we do - so that there's no way we can cheat the players.

On the other hand, we *can* cheat the investors. I can see what my next roll is going to be (it's 98.3610), and so I can be sure of winning it if I want to. That's the same with any provably fair site - you have to trust that the operator isn't going to play with knowledge of his upcoming rolls.

Here are the first 3 rolls I made with my current seed pair:



and here's my "prediction" of the 4th roll:



This is why, if I'm going to play against the investors for more than small amounts, I go to great lengths to prove that it's legit. For example:
  http://www.reddit.com/r/justdice/comments/1vbo1p/justdice_owner_plays_his_own_game_and_wins/

Edit: I made that 4th roll:

Got to keep clamming and staking on 
Also its nice to have a steady profit

You're actually able to see this? I thought it was all randomized.

Profits steady at 47 000 CLAM

We recently hired a new employee, told him we would pay him a share of the profits, and immediately gave him commit access to the source code...

Just kidding.

I didn't reset seeds when launching for CLAM. You have the same client and server seed as you had before. Your rolls carried on exactly where you left off with BTC. Your last bet for BTC had nonce 1, so your first bet for CLAM had nonce 2.

There's only one user whose seeds I did randomize before launching for CLAM, and that's because I told him how long his current losing streak would have ended up being. He could have used that information to win huge bets, and so I reset his seeds.

I'm searching old JD logs to try to find your last bet there, but it's taking too long, so I'll just post this for now and update later with details.

Edit: I found it. You only made one bet on JD on that account:


So that's where the nonce=1 bet rolling 38.8747 happened...

What happened to the bet id's? also all your image shows is that you did not screenshot the bet with nonce #1