Topic: MemoryDealers aka Roger Ver Arrested! - page 4. (Read 1607 times)

So what if satoshi is the NSA?  Bitcoin is open-source and probably one of the most scrutinized software projects on the internet.  By the way, he is probably not the NSA, just one of the popular cryptographer suspects. 


"Forever" is a very long time.  You can stay anonymous for a reasonable time.  Fire up Tails OS and use Monero as p2p e-cash.  Pretty good anonymity.  Just don't mess it up by linking your real world identity. 

Impossible to know what satoshi's real intention was. Maybe he was sincere or maybe he was a government tool. All I'm telling is, even if he was sincere, the gov would still find out his identity. Just because the general public don't know it, doesn't mean the big guys also don't.


That's the thing, you can't stay anonymous on the internet forever when you are using the internet infrastructure and domains which are controlled by the gov. They have unlimited power compared to a single individual.

You know even Intel admitted that they were putting a backdoor in their processors. That's what we are dealing with. Every windows/ios machine is a potential government spy in my eyes.

Exactly. I've always wondered about that. But what if Satoshi Nakamoto was actually the CIA or NSA (which explains why no one has been able to find who he/she/they really was)? We'll never know for sure. The thing is crypto users need to be aware of governments' increasing surveillance tactics by protecting their privacy as much as possible. If developers are creating something as controversial as a mixer or decentralized exchange, they must never reveal their identity to the public.

What's best? Satisfy investors by revealing your ID (making them believe your project is legit)? Or remain anonymous like Satoshi even if investors think your project is a scam? I think the last option is the way to go. Hopefully, crypto investors learn a valuable lesson with the US' aggressive stance towards the industry. Wishing all the best to Roger Ver.

How do we know if the gov don't already know satoshi's identity? I just posted another message in some other topic in the same context.


Do you think satoshi was an expert at hiding his tracks? Do you think the gov don't have the tools to reveal his identity? I don't know, it looks like a long shot to me. Maybe the other names you mentioned didn't bother because they knew it was a futile attempt.

It's the war of government against the people, and all of the sudden developers are getting arrested, and everyone is breaking a law if they had any connection with Bitcoin.
With the way how they are going in future you will be able to use bitcoin only with custodial and government approved services  
You don't need to be expert to understand what is happening.

They can change things as they like.
Imagine officials being so desperate to track, monitor and arrest ex US citizens in different countries because of this ... as if they don't have anything better to do, all terrorists and evil hackers are suddenly all gone...
I wonder what would Frédéric Bastiat say if he was alive today?

I am starting to wonder if Roger was actually right about many things  
They will probably ban Bitcoin in future, as soon as they release their CBDC crap.
Maybe they will allow Saylor and ''approved'' people to use it with special custodial wallets only.

I know, right? The US was skeptical of Bitcoin in the past, but things changed all of a sudden. It now considers BTC as money, targetting anyone involved in it as it sees fit. You can now see why Satoshi never disclosed his identity in the first place. I feel sorry for Vitalik Buterin, Charles Hoskinson, Gavin Wood, and other founders/developers/early crypto investors who disclosed their identities. They will get scrutinized by the government real soon. Roger Ver is now facing the consequences of revealing his identity to the public. I sure hope he doesn't get extradited to the US like CZ and the likes.

With the US government constantly attacking the crypto industry, we should expect companies, startups, exchanges, etc to move away from the country. If that happens, it'll be game over for the US. Especially when other countries will become technologically-superior by adopting the revolution. Who knows what the future will bring? 

This is insane. You'd think that after renouncing the citizenship you could just be left alone but nope.
I'm also puzzled if there are any expiry dates on such charges, if the "exit tax" was due at all, the liability arose over 10 years ago, so I imagine any country would just let it go (unless he was ordered to pay by the court etc).


Not drawing any conclusions, but it's a bit strange that he decided to return after 5 years long inactivity just to casually reply in a thread that has been dead for 10 years and got necroposted by a newbie with a total post count of 1.

years ago there were some social media trends about tax avoidance by seeking citizenship else where. and alot of people didnt and still dont realise that by the very act of trying to change citizenship is a trigger of a taxable event in of itself.
back then we had many crypto scammers trying to offer citizenships onboard their off short boats, seapods, steasteading campaigns.. it was hilarious calling out them scams.

many dont realise that revoking your own citizenship stops the clock meaning it alienates you from the laws that could have aided you. and you are then stuck as an outlaw knowing if you returned, you will get targetted..

its much easier to just learn the laws to learn the loopholes of how to legally avoid tax, rather than find the evasion tricks found in social media

,,
one other thing about one of the charges against ver is a silly administration one that started the headaches against ver vs irs..
him filing a valuation based on 3/2/14 instead of 2/3/14 (well if you are in the EU or US they switch meaning of actual calendar real time..)
EU 2/3/14 is 2nd march but in US is 3rd Feb
thats where one of the charges are called 'erroneous' because its just a slip up. but started several balls rolling of vers arguments against valuations in 2014+
so even little errors can start big avalanches

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as for society as a whole
when the law society made tax law a speciality, they had to make it worthy, thus they ensured basic tax filings and tax understanding was not taught at highschool. thus creating a whole industry and university required education system and business sector out of it
if all high school kids knew how to file taxes and tax law was as straight forward s it should be.. $billions of business would be lost...
.. so now you know why its not taught

C'mon Mann.. I don't think that's just some government stipulations - Unless they'd charge him with the fines for his crime .. Dude has been running Memorydealers.com and agilestar.com for as long as 12years now - who knows how long he's been evading 'em taxes?
No, there's nothing stupid about it .. AFAIK, The monetary and financial regulatory system in any country works as good as what you described; they gotta make sure that currency notes don't suffer too much wear and tear thus, causing major devaluations.
Mopping out funds from circulation through the initiation of taxes, levies and internal revenue services would serve as a defence mechanism for the government and an easy way to control inflation

Edit: The only thing I'd consider as a wrong narrative or say - a selfish misconception - would be that he tried to convince people to believe BCH is BTC.

As someone who worked with helping people file their taxes in the US, I understand why there is a huge number of citizens that do not know how to file for their taxes and would rather pay other people to do it for them, even if it means that it might be an additional amount equivalent to the tax that they should be paying. This goes out to individuals that are earning modestly and quite 'comfortably', but I'm not certain about people who are earning millions from whatever venture they have.

I'm pretty sure Roger Ver knows his taxes. He may have forgotten that he's still obligated to pay his taxes (that's how absurd it is) even though in his mind, he no longer has this obligation to the US.

I wouldn't concern myself with Buterin.  Any developer who has revealed their true identity should anticipate scrutiny from authorities.  The more influential the individual, the more advantageous it is for the government.  Buterin hard forked Ethereum to undo a hacker's transaction and subsequently implemented another called the "merge", which transitioned it to proof-of-stake.  That's all I need to know about his intentions. 


When you print money, you're stealing money equally from all fiat currency owners.  Taxes, on the other hand, offer more flexibility.  For example, they can levy a higher percentage on people earning $10,000 per month compared to those earning $1,000.

Resorting to printing money seems more like a final option.  Plus, not all countries have a central bank (see EU member nations).

According to the indictment in late  2018 he did file form 1040NR for tax year 2017 where did not report the income he got by expatriating bitcoins sent from MemoryDealers and Agilestar to himself. That did not happen outside of the statute of limitations, regardless of whether clocks were stopped or not.

the civil case did not expire!!!!
this gave the IRS ammo to re look over the filings, paperwork, documentations.. and re do an investigation..  and then due to lack of expiration.. file new criminal case in the last couple years

get it yet

I don't think that is right. Civil and criminal liability are two separate things.

step 1. 10+ years statute about collecting taxes. which yep is not 6 years and has not expired due to what i referenced
which ver didnt pay(they say $48m IRS loss) which triggered step 2

step 2 new criminal case, which that can do within the (step 1)statute of limitations, to then file a criminal case to get extradition ball rolling
this new case which found abnormalities in the original civil case paperwork thus got the courts to move forward to get the international authorities to arrest him in spain and seek extradition back to the US to answer to step 1 and 2 claims/charges against ver

in short.. back in 2014.. his first 2 mistakes were
a. not accounting, documenting filing accurate holdings.. and not paying the tax owed
b. expatriating, thus pausing the clock.. meaning even if he left for 1-100 years IRS can still investigate him... and they did 9 years later

That article is referring to collecting back taxes, a civil matter. I was referring to the criminal prosecution for tax fraud.

nope.. its much longer
https://wiggamlaw.com/blog/irs-10-year-back-taxes-statute-of-limitations/

in short being an expat in another country means the clock stops after 6 months when you left. but when you return they can start the clock again after 6 months of arriving. so even if you left the country in 2014 and returned in say 2022.. the deadline of a 2014 case only starts its first year in 2023

also if you stay out the country for 10-20-50 years. then returned. the clock doesnt go away due to length of time away. it just starts ticking again when you return for more then 6 months even after [insert any time away]

Here's the real reason why they are after Ver. Go to the site and look at the list of things RV did.

Watch this video - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gREaPClHWqg.


Crypto veterans call out DOJ for targeting Roger Ver a decade after he left US

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https://cointelegraph.com/news/crypto-veterans-call-out-doj-targeting-roger-ver
Many members of the crypto community criticized the U.S. government for its indictment against Ver, with some calling it part of the broader anti-crypto stance of the Biden administration.

The arrest of early Bitcoin investor and Bitcoin cash proponent Roger Ver on tax evasion charges in the United States has invoked strong reactions from the crypto community.

Many within the community criticized the arrest, with some justifying it over Ver's adoption of an anti-Bitcoin stance in the latter part of his career.

Dan Held, a long-term Bitcoin proponent, was among the few who lauded Ver's arrest, saying, "he's been a net negative for Bitcoin."

Crypto-centered X account Pledditor suspected that Ver's arrest is related to his name popping up in several investigations, such as those involving Binance, Genesis and Three Arrows Capital.

Go to the website for this picture.

Kim Dotcom, a crypto veteran who has also been on the receiving end of government enforcement, said that the indictment against Ver has nothing to do with tax evasion but rather a “witch hunt against a man who turned his back on U.S. wars and malicious foreign and domestic policy.” He added: “Roger is a supporter of Julian Assange and press freedom not just with words but with actions.”
...

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It appears the statute of limitations for tax fraud is 6 years. I haven't read the indictment, but it is strange they are charging him this long after the alleged crimes.
 
edit to add:
I just read the indictment, and it seems like the statute of limitations has expired for many of the crimes alleged in the indictment. I am not sure how the government got around this, (maybe a covid exception?). According to the indictment, Ver needed to file various tax forms (and use the mail to do so) years after he renounced his citizenship.

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I think that portion of the indictment raises an interesting question of "how exactly can you legally transfer ownership of coin to another person?"

From a technical standpoint, this is easy, you simply publish a transaction that gets confirmed.

From a legal standpoint, this is more complicated. Most centralized exchanges will update a database/create a business record that reflects the updated ownership.

Attorney-client privilege only covers legal advice. A discussion with your lawyer about a baseball game is not protected by attorney-client privilege.

U.S. decided to empty all the “fat wallets” with bitcoin? They should have publicly stated “thank you guys for pumping up bitcoin and now we will take on this asset ourselves”, when the whole world believed in this cryptocurrency and billions of capital were poured in. The right time to get your hands on this is when BTC has gained value. It sounds slightly absurd, but it seems to me that independent individual large BTC-holders (like Roger Ver) will be forced to part with (at least part of) their savings, because it is easy to influence (find and force) such people, and the reward will be impressive.

It's funny that yesterday the state pretended that bitcoin was a candy wrapper, but today they arrest you for it.