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Topic: Minor trust score algorithm change - page 5. (Read 7377 times)

legendary
Activity: 1876
Merit: 1475
May 20, 2015, 03:47:25 PM
#67
IMO the scale doesn't change anything once we get used to it. It's like pricing everything in cents instead of dollars. Soon enough you'd get used to paying 150 cents for a coke instead of USD 1.5. If anything it makes things more detailed. Because there's no decimals in the trust ratings before 0.2 and 0.4 were both shown as 0. Now 2 and 4 are shown differently.

The important part is that everything gets reflected to the new scale, for example light green and dark green (which was already changed by theymos). And we must get used to the new scale.


I disagree since we have a scammer issue here. I think earning even 1 green trust should be a real hassle. It should be rare to see people with green trust around here with all the scams and B.S. Take my score for example on default trust... +196 that to me is just silly. Maybe on a scale of 1-25 I should be a +5 or even lower.

Now the trust is shown as green only when it's at least 5, not 1 as before, so that will help. But I see your point, probably scaling/rounding down would be helpful, especially for the first point(s). Maybe it would make sense to further increase the thresholds for light and dark green.

Also people shouldn't give positive (and negative) trust so easily, especially those on the default trust. For example I really don't think alcaz deserves a trusted positive trust just for sending first $4.40, even if that didn't make his trust green.
copper member
Activity: 3948
Merit: 2201
Verified awesomeness ✔
May 20, 2015, 03:41:10 PM
#66
At least darkgreen should be hard to obtain. Getting 15 points is pretty easy with this algorithm.
legendary
Activity: 2128
Merit: 1119
May 20, 2015, 03:38:27 PM
#65
I agree that the numbers should be scaled back...I kicked it on default trust only and it seems like everyone has huge scores now. Maybe a scale of -100 - +100 would be better. It seems like being trusted will be easier, and that is not a good thing around here.

Yeah, they're way too high in my opinion. https://bitcointalksearch.org/user/alcaz-343102 That guy only has one feedback from me I left over a year ago and he was 1: -0 / +1 the other day and now he's 10: -0 / +1. What are the question marks all about like here https://bitcointalksearch.org/user/muhammed-zakir-320943 ? ??: 1 / +2?

Exactly...It really diminishes the value of having earned a lot trust in my opinion. I see people now with high scores that look really trusted all the sudden.. Honestly I think a scale of 1-25 would be really good. It should take years of being honest to get any sort of good reputation here.

IMO the scale doesn't change anything once we get used to it. It's like pricing everything in cents instead of dollars. Soon enough you'd get used to paying 150 cents for a coke instead of USD 1.5. If anything it makes things more detailed. Because there's no decimals in the trust ratings before 0.2 and 0.4 were both shown as 0. Now 2 and 4 are shown differently.

The important part is that everything gets reflected to the new scale, for example light green and dark green (which was already changed by theymos). And we must get used to the new scale.


I disagree since we have a scammer issue here. I think earning even 1 green trust should be a real hassle. It should be rare to see people with green trust around here with all the scams and B.S. Take my score for example on default trust... +196 that to me is just silly. Maybe on a scale of 1-25 I should be a +5 or even lower.
sr. member
Activity: 434
Merit: 252
May 20, 2015, 03:35:50 PM
#64
Quickseller removed from the trust i just saw.

Makes no difference. Alot of users still respect his opinion. Thusmore, this post is in the wrong section as it does not pretain to the topic.
legendary
Activity: 1876
Merit: 1475
May 20, 2015, 03:35:34 PM
#63
I agree that the numbers should be scaled back...I kicked it on default trust only and it seems like everyone has huge scores now. Maybe a scale of -100 - +100 would be better. It seems like being trusted will be easier, and that is not a good thing around here.

Yeah, they're way too high in my opinion. https://bitcointalksearch.org/user/alcaz-343102 That guy only has one feedback from me I left over a year ago and he was 1: -0 / +1 the other day and now he's 10: -0 / +1. What are the question marks all about like here https://bitcointalksearch.org/user/muhammed-zakir-320943 ? ??: 1 / +2?

Exactly...It really diminishes the value of having earned a lot trust in my opinion. I see people now with high scores that look really trusted all the sudden.. Honestly I think a scale of 1-25 would be really good. It should take years of being honest to get any sort of good reputation here.

IMO the scale doesn't change anything once we get used to it. It's like pricing everything in cents instead of dollars. Soon enough you'd get used to paying 150 cents for a coke instead of USD 1.5. If anything it makes things more detailed. Because there's no decimals in the trust ratings before 0.2 and 0.4 were both shown as 0. Now 2 and 4 are shown differently.

The important part is that everything gets updated to the new scale, for example light green and dark green (which was already changed by theymos). And we must get used to the new scale.
legendary
Activity: 2128
Merit: 1119
May 20, 2015, 03:35:11 PM
#62
Quickseller removed from the trust i just saw.

That was before this change happened.
legendary
Activity: 2198
Merit: 1032
May 20, 2015, 03:32:57 PM
#61
Quickseller removed from the trust i just saw.
legendary
Activity: 2128
Merit: 1119
May 20, 2015, 03:27:33 PM
#60
I agree that the numbers should be scaled back...I kicked it on default trust only and it seems like everyone has huge scores now. Maybe a scale of -100 - +100 would be better. It seems like being trusted will be easier, and that is not a good thing around here.

Yeah, they're way too high in my opinion. https://bitcointalksearch.org/user/alcaz-343102 That guy only has one feedback from me I left over a year ago and he was 1: -0 / +1 the other day and now he's 10: -0 / +1. What are the question marks all about like here https://bitcointalksearch.org/user/muhammed-zakir-320943 ? ??: 1 / +2?

Exactly...It really diminishes the value of having earned a lot trust in my opinion. I see people now with high scores that look really trusted all the sudden.. Honestly I think a scale of 1-25 would be really good. It should take years of being honest to get any sort of good reputation here.

Also Theymos...

Can you make a list of users by trust within the default network? It would be interesting to have a leader board to see as people rise and fall trust wise here.
legendary
Activity: 1778
Merit: 1043
#Free market
May 20, 2015, 03:26:59 PM
#59
....
 What are the question marks all about like here https://bitcointalksearch.org/user/muhammed-zakir-320943 ? ??: 1 / +2?

This :


??? is a valid score in the new algorithm.
...
global moderator
Activity: 4018
Merit: 2728
Join the world-leading crypto sportsbook NOW!
May 20, 2015, 03:25:13 PM
#58
I agree that the numbers should be scaled back...I kicked it on default trust only and it seems like everyone has huge scores now. Maybe a scale of -100 - +100 would be better. It seems like being trusted will be easier, and that is not a good thing around here.

Yeah, they're way too high in my opinion. https://bitcointalksearch.org/user/alcaz-343102 That guy only has one feedback from me I left over a year ago and he was 1: -0 / +1 the other day and now he's 10: -0 / +1. What are the question marks all about like here https://bitcointalksearch.org/user/muhammed-zakir-320943 ? ??: 1 / +2?
legendary
Activity: 2128
Merit: 1119
May 20, 2015, 03:18:24 PM
#57
I agree that the numbers should be scaled back...I kicked it on default trust only and it seems like everyone has huge scores now. Maybe a scale of -100 - +100 would be better. It seems like being trusted will be easier, and that is not a good thing around here.
hero member
Activity: 593
Merit: 500
1NoBanksLuJPXf8Sc831fPqjrRpkQPKkEA
May 20, 2015, 03:08:52 PM
#56
In situations like TECSHARE's, you can (if you trust TECSHARE and disagree with Vod) post an additional positive rating responding to whatever Vod said. This will counteract Vod's negative rating.

The meaning of having "green" trust is now diminished and will be similar to what was previously the meaning of having black positive trust.  

Oh, good point. I changed it so that you have dark green trust if your score is 5 and dark green if your score is 15.

Tongue

What is the problem with rescaling instead? I don't see any benefits with the higher numbers.
administrator
Activity: 5222
Merit: 13032
May 20, 2015, 03:07:42 PM
#55
In situations like TECSHARE's, you can (if you trust TECSHARE and disagree with Vod) post an additional positive rating responding to whatever Vod said. This will counteract Vod's negative rating.

The meaning of having "green" trust is now diminished and will be similar to what was previously the meaning of having black positive trust. 

Oh, good point. I changed it so that you have dark green trust if your score is 5 and dark green if your score is 15.
legendary
Activity: 1120
Merit: 1000
Free & Fast Neotox Escrow http://bit.ly/1OGVykp
May 20, 2015, 03:07:31 PM
#54
God Bless users who trust green feedbacks until default trust users make all the scammers red again
member
Activity: 90
Merit: 10
May 20, 2015, 03:05:58 PM
#53
with new green feedback system , even proven scammers are having green trust ratings under their username, and they can scam users again using their green trust ratings Sad

Not exactly, an user should not see only the 'trust score'  Roll Eyes but also check the user's history and use always an escrow if he does not trust the other part.
yes we know this but what about new users or newbies who was always trusting green trust users blindly
they think green is symbol of trust

Like this dope

Fooled by the nice color and now out of 0.7 BTC
this one has black, i have seen scammers in green
now its a lot of work for default trust members to spot the scammers and help the community

This happened earlier. I was giving an example how color can fool a newbie. In that case it is even more so as there was very specific rating warning against that very particular trade. Goes to show that they rely mostly on colors and hardly on the text.
copper member
Activity: 2996
Merit: 2374
May 20, 2015, 03:04:06 PM
#52
The scores seem like too much of a drastic jump in my opinion and will make users seem more trusted than they really are or should be. Mine went from 4: -0 / +0 to 22: -0 / +3.
It used to take a lot to jump from 3 to 4 (or from one number to the next). You can somewhat equate your current trust rating as being a 2.2 under the old system.

I think the color scheme should probably be reformed as the difference between dark green and light green is much smaller then it was previously.
legendary
Activity: 1120
Merit: 1000
Free & Fast Neotox Escrow http://bit.ly/1OGVykp
May 20, 2015, 03:02:44 PM
#51
with new green feedback system , even proven scammers are having green trust ratings under their username, and they can scam users again using their green trust ratings Sad

Not exactly, an user should not see only the 'trust score'  Roll Eyes but also check the user's history and use always an escrow if he does not trust the other part.
yes we know this but what about new users or newbies who was always trusting green trust users blindly
they think green is symbol of trust

Like this dope

Fooled by the nice color and now out of 0.7 BTC
this one has black, i have seen scammers in green
now its a lot of work for default trust members to spot the scammers and help the community
copper member
Activity: 2996
Merit: 2374
May 20, 2015, 03:01:16 PM
#50
@theymos what is the thinking behind increasing the numbers? It makes changes too much. Was it to increase the strength of DefaultTrust?

You'll get used to the larger numbers. DefaultTrust doesn't get any sort of advantage as far as I can tell.

What is the issue with the earlier numbers?

DefaultTrust gets an advantage. Earlier, one default feedback still means 10 months remaining black and slowly increasing number. Now, all one has to do is manage one default feedback and very soon it is green. Similar is the case for moving from light green to dark green.

Advantages of trading with DefaultTrust members went up even more, they are going to get bargains now.
The meaning of having "green" trust is now diminished and will be similar to what was previously the meaning of having black positive trust.  

Yes. I think with this new algorithm low positive trust should be shown as black (maybe bold). Light green should be used when reaching some value (at least 5, maybe 10) and dark green when surpassing at least 2x or 3x that first threshold.


Either that or rescale it. Dividing it by 5-10.

@ Quickseller there is a difference. A single trade or activity gives a lot of numbers now, while a lot of trades outside that makes it remain 0. The number increase works for all those with any numbers. For all those with 0 it remains 0, there is no scaling.
a trust score of positive 5 with the new system is the same as a trust score of 0(0)-1(1) under the old system. IMO you really shouldn't be trading just because the other person is on default trust anyway.

Difference is anyone with a number gets a higher number. Anyone with a 0 is still 0.

If people here didn't do what they shouldn't do there would be no need of the trust system. Thats not how it works, scammers will attempt to trade with DefaultTrust members and wait for a few months to gain a lot of ratings and color.

It makes changes abrupt, like that happened with Muhammed Zakir.
Fair enough on trading with specific people.

However the meaning of having a low trust score now is the same meaning as having black positive trust. Their potential trading partners should take similar precautions with someone with a green trust score of plus 5 now as they would as black trust with one trust rating previously.

Also this is an improvement as previously you could have one successful trade two years ago and would show as having significant amounts of trust. This is fixed by getting a max of 10 points per trade.

You also need to consider that previously the max score you can have was 150 while now the max score is 9999 so having a small positive score would be essentially the same as zero.
global moderator
Activity: 4018
Merit: 2728
Join the world-leading crypto sportsbook NOW!
May 20, 2015, 03:00:36 PM
#49
The scores seem like too much of a drastic jump in my opinion and will make users seem more trusted than they really are or should be. Mine went from 4: -0 / +0 to 22: -0 / +3.
member
Activity: 90
Merit: 10
May 20, 2015, 02:59:54 PM
#48
with new green feedback system , even proven scammers are having green trust ratings under their username, and they can scam users again using their green trust ratings Sad

Not exactly, an user should not see only the 'trust score'  Roll Eyes but also check the user's history and use always an escrow if he does not trust the other part.
yes we know this but what about new users or newbies who was always trusting green trust users blindly
they think green is symbol of trust

Like this dope

Fooled by the nice color and now out of 0.7 BTC
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