Topic: Minor trust score algorithm change - page 6. (Read 7377 times)

Quote from: Neotox on May 20, 2015, 02:51:50 PM

@theymos what is the thinking behind increasing the numbers? It makes changes too much. Was it to increase the strength of DefaultTrust?

You'll get used to the larger numbers. DefaultTrust doesn't get any sort of advantage as far as I can tell.

What is the issue with the earlier numbers?

DefaultTrust gets an advantage. Earlier, one default feedback still means 10 months remaining black and slowly increasing number. Now, all one has to do is manage one default feedback and very soon it is green. Similar is the case for moving from light green to dark green.

Advantages of trading with DefaultTrust members went up even more, they are going to get bargains now.

The meaning of having "green" trust is now diminished and will be similar to what was previously the meaning of having black positive trust.

Yes. I think with this new algorithm low positive trust should be shown as black (maybe bold). Light green should be used when reaching some value (at least 5, maybe 10) and dark green when surpassing at least 2x or 3x that first threshold.

Either that or rescale it. Dividing it by 5-10.

@ Quickseller there is a difference. A single trade or activity gives a lot of numbers now, while a lot of trades outside that makes it remain 0. The number increase works for all those with any numbers. For all those with 0 it remains 0, there is no scaling.

a trust score of positive 5 with the new system is the same as a trust score of 0(0)-1(1) under the old system. IMO you really shouldn't be trading just because the other person is on default trust anyway.

Difference is anyone with a number gets a higher number. Anyone with a 0 is still 0.

If people here didn't do what they shouldn't do there would be no need of the trust system. Thats not how it works, scammers will attempt to trade with DefaultTrust members and wait for a few months to gain a lot of ratings and color.

It makes changes abrupt when the DefaultTrust list changes.

redsn0w

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#Free market

with new green feedback system , even proven scammers are having green trust ratings under their username, and they can scam users again using their green trust ratings Sad

Not exactly, an user should not see only the 'trust score' Roll Eyes

but also check the user's history and use always an escrow if he does not trust the other part.

marcotheminer

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Quote from: Neotox on May 20, 2015, 02:51:50 PM

with new green feedback system , even proven scammers are having green trust ratings under their username, and they can scam users again using their green trust ratings Sad

Like who?

Neotox

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with new green feedback system , even proven scammers are having green trust ratings under their username, and they can scam users again using their green trust ratings Sad

Quickseller

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Activity: 2996

Merit: 2374

Quote from: peligro on May 20, 2015, 02:45:16 PM

Quote from: EcuaMobi on May 20, 2015, 02:38:30 PM

Quote from: Quickseller on May 20, 2015, 02:29:17 PM

Quote from: EcuaMobi on May 20, 2015, 02:38:30 PM

@theymos what is the thinking behind increasing the numbers? It makes changes too much. Was it to increase the strength of DefaultTrust?

You'll get used to the larger numbers. DefaultTrust doesn't get any sort of advantage as far as I can tell.

What is the issue with the earlier numbers?

DefaultTrust gets an advantage. Earlier, one default feedback still means 10 months remaining black and slowly increasing number. Now, all one has to do is manage one default feedback and very soon it is green. Similar is the case for moving from light green to dark green.

Advantages of trading with DefaultTrust members went up even more, they are going to get bargains now.

The meaning of having "green" trust is now diminished and will be similar to what was previously the meaning of having black positive trust.

Yes. I think with this new algorithm low positive trust should be shown as black (maybe bold). Light green should be used when reaching some value (at least 5, maybe 10) and dark green when surpassing at least 2x or 3x that first threshold.

Either that or rescale it. Dividing it by 5-10.

@ Quickseller there is a difference. A single trade or activity gives a lot of numbers now, while a lot of trades outside that makes it remain 0. The number increase works for all those with any numbers. For all those with 0 it remains 0, there is no scaling.

a trust score of positive 5 with the new system is the same as a trust score of 0(0)-1(1) under the old system. IMO you really shouldn't be trading just because the other person is on default trust anyway.

peligro

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Activity: 593

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Quote from: Quickseller on May 20, 2015, 02:29:17 PM

Quote from: Quickseller on May 20, 2015, 02:29:17 PM

@theymos what is the thinking behind increasing the numbers? It makes changes too much. Was it to increase the strength of DefaultTrust?

You'll get used to the larger numbers. DefaultTrust doesn't get any sort of advantage as far as I can tell.

What is the issue with the earlier numbers?

DefaultTrust gets an advantage. Earlier, one default feedback still means 10 months remaining black and slowly increasing number. Now, all one has to do is manage one default feedback and very soon it is green. Similar is the case for moving from light green to dark green.

Advantages of trading with DefaultTrust members went up even more, they are going to get bargains now.

The meaning of having "green" trust is now diminished and will be similar to what was previously the meaning of having black positive trust.

Yes. I think with this new algorithm low positive trust should be shown as black (maybe bold). Light green should be used when reaching some value (at least 5, maybe 10) and dark green when surpassing at least 2x or 3x that first threshold.

Either that or rescale it. Dividing it by 5-10.

@ Quickseller there is a difference. A single trade or activity gives a lot of numbers now, while a lot of trades outside that makes it remain 0. The number increase works for all those with any numbers. For all those with 0 it remains 0, there is no scaling.

EcuaMobi

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Activity: 1876

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@theymos what is the thinking behind increasing the numbers? It makes changes too much. Was it to increase the strength of DefaultTrust?

You'll get used to the larger numbers. DefaultTrust doesn't get any sort of advantage as far as I can tell.

What is the issue with the earlier numbers?

DefaultTrust gets an advantage. Earlier, one default feedback still means 10 months remaining black and slowly increasing number. Now, all one has to do is manage one default feedback and very soon it is green. Similar is the case for moving from light green to dark green.

Advantages of trading with DefaultTrust members went up even more, they are going to get bargains now.

The meaning of having "green" trust is now diminished and will be similar to what was previously the meaning of having black positive trust.

Yes. I think with this new algorithm low positive trust should be shown as black (maybe bold). Light green should be used when reaching some value (at least 5, maybe 10) and dark green when surpassing at least 2x or 3x that first threshold.

erikalui

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Quote from: tidus1097 on May 20, 2015, 02:25:56 PM

Correct. Your trust network is assumed to consist of people who are basically reasonable. So if any trusted ratings are negative (which means "this person is probably a scammer, watch out!"), then this should be taken very seriously. That's why a single negative rating can easily cause a loss of 100+ trust points in this new algorithm. And if the most recent rating is negative, then this is a strong indicator that the person may have been running a long con which has turned into a full-blown scam.

If anyone is abusing this by reposting negative trust unnecessarily or giving out negative trust too easily, then you should remove them from your trust network.

@bold: This may lead to an abuse of feedback left by Default Trust members. I can't imagine now how one scammers account will look like with the max limit being 9999.

Is it possible to have a notification when a feedback is left? If not, it would be useful if the feedback system has a time attached to the date. It helps to know when a person was left a feedback if there are many members who have left a feedback on the same day.

chronicsky

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Just looking for peace

Looks like Tecshare will have something to converse again about Tongue

But all jokes aside, why does his show up as this for me? A bug in the system?

Theymos cleared it before

Quote from: theymos on May 20, 2015, 01:57:19 PM

If someone has 1 positive and 1 negative, then the time doesn't matter. They'll have a score of -1.

Examples:
Old -> New
+ - : -1
- + : -1
+ + - : ???
+ - + : 0
- + + : 1
+ + + : >=3
- - + : -3
+ - - : -3
- - - : -8

Quote from: Neotox on May 20, 2015, 02:27:35 PM

@ redsn0w
@ chronicsky

you see marco's rating green because you left him positive feedbacks also
Me and other users who doesn't left him positive feedbacks see it in black, not green
Trust: 0: -2 / +4

ohk! first i though that could be it but i never though redsnow left him feedback

Quickseller

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Activity: 2996

Merit: 2374

Quote from: tidus1097 on May 20, 2015, 02:25:56 PM

@theymos what is the thinking behind increasing the numbers? It makes changes too much. Was it to increase the strength of DefaultTrust?

You'll get used to the larger numbers. DefaultTrust doesn't get any sort of advantage as far as I can tell.

What is the issue with the earlier numbers?

DefaultTrust gets an advantage. Earlier, one default feedback still means 10 months remaining black and slowly increasing number. Now, all one has to do is manage one default feedback and very soon it is green. Similar is the case for moving from light green to dark green.

Advantages of trading with DefaultTrust members went up even more, they are going to get bargains now.

The meaning of having "green" trust is now diminished and will be similar to what was previously the meaning of having black positive trust.

Neotox

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Activity: 1120

Merit: 1000

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Looks like Tecshare will have something to converse again about Tongue

But all jokes aside, why does his show up as this for me? A bug in the system?

http://i60.tinypic.com/2428pz9.png

it was already explained here
https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.11433109

Neotox

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@ redsn0w
@ chronicsky

you see marco's rating green because you left him positive feedbacks also
Me and other users who doesn't left him positive feedbacks see it in black, not green
Trust: 0: -2 / +4

peligro

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Activity: 593

Merit: 500

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Quote from: marcotheminer on May 20, 2015, 02:19:08 PM

@theymos what is the thinking behind increasing the numbers? It makes changes too much. Was it to increase the strength of DefaultTrust?

You'll get used to the larger numbers. DefaultTrust doesn't get any sort of advantage as far as I can tell.

What is the issue with the earlier numbers?

DefaultTrust gets an advantage. Earlier, one default feedback still means 10 months remaining black and slowly increasing number. Now, all one has to do is manage one default feedback and very soon it is green. Similar is the case for moving from light green to dark green.

Advantages of trading with DefaultTrust members went up even more, they are going to get bargains now.

tidus1097

sr. member

Activity: 434

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Looks like Tecshare will have something to converse again about Tongue

But all jokes aside, why does his show up as this for me? A bug in the system?

Neotox

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Merit: 1000

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Quote from: Quickseller on May 20, 2015, 02:08:44 PM

It looks like no matter what if the last feedback you receive is negative then you will either have a ?? ? Trust score or a negative score. Look at TECSHARE for example, his rating from Vod means he has a question mark rating.

Also TF has a negative 9999 rating lol.

not always
I have seen users who received both positive and negative feedbacks and still has black trust ratings with first number 0

For example: my trust.

yes. you trust is still black while you have 6 months old positive trust ratings

chronicsky

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Activity: 2828

Merit: 1222

Just looking for peace

Quote from: marcotheminer on May 20, 2015, 02:19:08 PM

Quote from: Quickseller on May 20, 2015, 02:08:44 PM

It looks like no matter what if the last feedback you receive is negative then you will either have a ?? ? Trust score or a negative score. Look at TECSHARE for example, his rating from Vod means he has a question mark rating.

Also TF has a negative 9999 rating lol.

not always
I have seen users who received both positive and negative feedbacks and still has black trust ratings with first number 0

For example: my trust.

I see you Green

redsn0w

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Activity: 1778

Merit: 1043

#Free market

Quote from: marcotheminer on May 20, 2015, 02:19:08 PM

Quote from: Quickseller on May 20, 2015, 02:08:44 PM

It looks like no matter what if the last feedback you receive is negative then you will either have a ?? ? Trust score or a negative score. Look at TECSHARE for example, his rating from Vod means he has a question mark rating.

Also TF has a negative 9999 rating lol.

not always
I have seen users who received both positive and negative feedbacks and still has black trust ratings with first number 0

For example: my trust.

No I don't think:

theymos

administrator

Activity: 5222

Merit: 13032

Quote from: Quickseller on May 20, 2015, 02:08:44 PM

It looks like no matter what if the last feedback you receive is negative then you will either have a ?? ? Trust score or a negative score.

Correct. Your trust network is assumed to consist of people who are basically reasonable. So if any trusted ratings are negative (which means "this person is probably a scammer, watch out!"), then this should be taken very seriously. That's why a single negative rating can easily cause a loss of 100+ trust points in this new algorithm. And if the most recent rating is negative, then this is a strong indicator that the person may have been running a long con which has turned into a full-blown scam.

If anyone is abusing this by reposting negative trust unnecessarily or giving out negative trust too easily, then you should remove them from your trust network.

@theymos what is the thinking behind increasing the numbers? It makes changes too much. Was it to increase the strength of DefaultTrust?

You'll get used to the larger numbers. DefaultTrust doesn't get any sort of advantage as far as I can tell.

marcotheminer

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Activity: 2072

Merit: 1049

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