Motosport General discussion tread --- Formula1, MotoGP, WTCC, ETCC, DTM..... - page 407.

Cnut237

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Quote from: coinlocket$ on July 18, 2021, 09:25:13 AM

Verstappen did the turn like Lewis wasn't there.

Yeah. That's his driving style. There have been a number of times this season, Lewis is obviously more experienced and is generally more restrained. Max has a tendency to just try to plough his way straight through, thinking everyone will just get out of his way. But Lewis can't afford to give ground in the title battle any more. If you have two drivers at the front, for different teams, and neither is willing to give an inch, then a collision is inevitable.

BTW - Lap 37, I think Hamilton is likely to win this now, 3s behind Bottas, 12s behind Leclerc.

Jackl87

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Quote from: coinlocket$ on July 18, 2021, 09:25:13 AM

Quote from: tokeweed on July 18, 2021, 09:11:37 AM

This guy... Lol. The stewards should give Hamilton a penalty. That was ruthless and what a dirty driver. Embarassing.

Edit: From the replays viewed from Hamilton’s camera it looked like it was just a racing incident. But from top view it looked like Hamilton should have given Verstappen some space cos Verstappen was ahead of him.

Not sure about it.
Hamilton had the car in the side, according to the rule Verstappen should give space for Hamilton to turn.
Verstappen did the turn like Lewis wasn't there.

Lewis has more responsibility but I don't know if he deserves a penalty.

For me that 10 second penalty is a joke. You can either decide that it is a racing accident and don't give a penalty at all to anyone or you decide that it was the fault of one of the drivers and then give a punishment according to the severity of the incident. Now they give hamilton a 10 second penalty which tells me that it is the stewards opionion that is was Hamiltons fault, which sent Verstappen into the barriers with a 51G impact and ended his race which means he will make 0 points and Hamilton only gets 10 seconds for that? He will probably still finish in the first place or at least on position 2, so this bad decision could really decide the championship this year. Lips sealed

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Quote from: tokeweed on July 18, 2021, 09:11:37 AM

This guy... Lol. The stewards should give Hamilton a penalty. That was ruthless and what a dirty driver. Embarassing.

Edit: From the replays viewed from Hamilton’s camera it looked like it was just a racing incident. But from top view it looked like Hamilton should have given Verstappen some space cos Verstappen was ahead of him.

Not sure about it.
Hamilton had the car in the side, according to the rule Verstappen should give space for Hamilton to turn.
Verstappen did the turn like Lewis wasn't there.

Lewis has more responsibility but I don't know if he deserves a penalty.

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Quote from: tokeweed on July 18, 2021, 09:11:37 AM

This guy... Lol. The stewards should give Hamilton a penalty. That was ruthless and what a dirty driver. Embarassing.

Edit: From the replays viewed from Hamilton’s camera it looked like it was just a racing incident. But from top view it looked like Hamilton should have given Verstappen some space cos Verstappen was ahead of him.

Initially I also blamed Hamilton, but after replays I changed my mind. It's racing accident when nobody is to blame.
It's pity how it ended because it looked that fight between Hamilton and Max would be epic.

tokeweed

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This guy... Lol. The stewards should give Hamilton a penalty. That was ruthless and what a dirty driver. Embarassing.

Edit: From the replays viewed from Hamilton’s camera it looked like it was just a racing incident. But from top view it looked like Hamilton should have given Verstappen some space cos Verstappen was ahead of him.

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The asphalt temperature is over 50 degrees. Already yesterday we saw big signs of problems with the tires during the sprint race by Mercedes and Redbull while the Ferrari had a minor degradation.
Could this be the variable of the race?

Whoever uses the tires the least will probably win.

Jackl87

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Quote from: tokeweed on July 17, 2021, 11:12:18 AM

^ It was intense during the first couple of laps when they has opportunities to fight for higher places on the grid.. But when everything has settled and towards the end, you kinda notice the drivers weren’t pushing as much anymore. I think Vettel could haved pushed more and get Alonso’s spot.

I am still not sure if i like this new sprint race or not, as you already said the first lap had a lot of action going on, even more than in a normal race i would say. I guess that is because the cars are lighter because of less fuel in the cars and right after the start where Verstappen managed to overtake Hamilton it looked like they would change positions again really soon but the remaining 16 laps where pretty boring sadly. We saw one overtake of lando norris vs. alonso but that was pretty much it. Vettel did not manage to overtake him but that was also because alonso was changing the lanes 2 or 3 times when vettel and norris tried to overtake which is not allowed so he should have received a warning for that way earlier than he did.

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Quote from: boltz on July 18, 2021, 06:52:42 AM

Today race is 2 hours away from start and the weather is good , fans are already there cheering for drivers and I think the drivers are ready to deliver a great show today as fans don't forget that last 3 races were kinda boring.

I can't wait for it too.It is 15 Pm track time and my time is 16 Pm and I too think that the race will be beautiful today based on the last few races that we have seen in Silverstone.Here where I am located started some really heavy rain but unfortunately is purely 100% sun on Silverstone today so we will not have any race alterations because of the weather.

boltz

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Sprint race is a must be in F1 even they should reduced the laps from 17 to 10 so in this way we will have a full action Sprint Race from start to finish.

Today race is 2 hours away from start and the weather is good , fans are already there cheering for drivers and I think the drivers are ready to deliver a great show today as fans don't forget that last 3 races were kinda boring.

Pulsar77

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I really enjoyed the sprint race yesterday. Especially Alonso did a great job by overtaking 6 cars at the beginning. And Verstappen had a really good start and didn't let Hamilton pass even once. And he got 3 points also. The race today can be really interesting. I expect a really fast Hamilton like in the qualifying session. So, we could see a high competition between him and Verstappen.

Cnut237

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Quote from: coinlocket$ on July 17, 2021, 05:37:29 PM

Quote from: boltz on July 17, 2021, 03:56:37 PM

Uhm, I've read only negative posts on F1 social media about Sprint Race but honestly, I loved it but they should make it 10 laps and I it should be enough.

Tomorrow race will be enjoyable to watch as we saw Mercedes has the necessary pace to overtake RedBull ,but on the long run we saw that RedBull is getting in comfortable zone and from there is very hard to catch them and also make the overtake.

The format is nice but the "problem" is always the same.
When you have 2 cars overperforming the pack whatever they do it will be boring.

Yes, exactly. By two cars I assume you mean the two Red Bull cars? Cheesy

Mercedes are fairly close, and there were some encouraging signs here... but it's getting a bit monotonous now, Red Bull are winning every single race, just like Mercedes used to.
I suppose it's inevitable, if you have drivers as good as Hamilton and Verstappen, very consistent and able to get the best out of their machines... it will always come down to fine margins, and whoever has the best car will win.
The only solution really is to have everyone drive the same make of car... which is impossible given how F1 is structured.

AndySt

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Quote from: boltz on July 17, 2021, 03:56:37 PM

Uhm, I've read only negative posts on F1 social media about Sprint Race but honestly, I loved it but they should make it 10 laps and I it should be enough.
Tomorrow race will be enjoyable to watch as we saw Mercedes has the necessary pace to overtake RedBull ,but on the long run we saw that RedBull is getting in comfortable zone and from there is very hard to catch them and also make the overtake.

It's just that everything was for the first time and the audience and riders have not yet got used to the new format, so there must be a negative reaction as well. Tomorrow the race will be with a much larger number of laps, so you can look at the real progress of the Mercedes car in real combat conditions with a change of tires. However, Hamilton himself did not speak negatively about the new format and even said that he liked the format of the weekend, despite the fact that he lost one position in the sprint result. But it is undoubtedly clear that Hamilton can and should try to break into the first place in the race as quickly as possible, because today Lewis did not take any risks and abandoned his attempts to break ahead after the first laps.

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Quote from: boltz on July 17, 2021, 03:56:37 PM

Uhm, I've read only negative posts on F1 social media about Sprint Race but honestly, I loved it but they should make it 10 laps and I it should be enough.

Tomorrow race will be enjoyable to watch as we saw Mercedes has the necessary pace to overtake RedBull ,but on the long run we saw that RedBull is getting in comfortable zone and from there is very hard to catch them and also make the overtake.

The format is nice but the "problem" is always the same.
When you have 2 cars overperforming the pack whatever they do it will be boring.

DIA7

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Quote from: boltz on July 17, 2021, 03:56:37 PM

Uhm, I've read only negative posts on F1 social media about Sprint Race but honestly, I loved it but they should make it 10 laps and I it should be enough.

Tomorrow race will be enjoyable to watch as we saw Mercedes has the necessary pace to overtake RedBull ,but on the long run we saw that RedBull is getting in comfortable zone and from there is very hard to catch them and also make the overtake.

yeah it was enjoyable but 10 laps is not enough, and in every track it will depend on how long the track is as in Brazil GP 10 laps would equal 7 laps of Silverstone because the Brazilian GP is Shorter that is why they chose third of a standard race because a standard race is 300km and in a 100Km if you use Super soft tires and you don't preserve them well you will struggle in the last couple laps and if they chose Medium other cars with soft will have better advantage.
So it was a well planned Sprint any more laps they would all just put Medium or hard to avoid pitting. Any less wouldn't be such fun either.

boltz

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Uhm, I've read only negative posts on F1 social media about Sprint Race but honestly, I loved it but they should make it 10 laps and I it should be enough.

Tomorrow race will be enjoyable to watch as we saw Mercedes has the necessary pace to overtake RedBull ,but on the long run we saw that RedBull is getting in comfortable zone and from there is very hard to catch them and also make the overtake.

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Quote from: tokeweed on July 17, 2021, 01:02:55 PM

^ Afaik, that rule when the tires you used in your fastest qualifying lap in Q2 should be used at the start of the race still applies in the sprint race. And I think there are no pit stops allowed. So yeah.. The tires they start with, are the tires they’ll be using for the whole sprint race.

So they had a free choice for the sprint race.
Why they all went with red tires?

They probably were worried about degradation but they were only 17 laps.

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Awesome sprint race today for setting up the starting order tomorrow.I don't know if anyone saw in SkySports F1 it showed Max Verstappen front left tire a bit on fire before starting and winning the 17 Laps 100 Km sprint race of today.It looks like it is going to be a very good race tomorrow and a hard fought one as right behind Max is Lewis and Valteri.Also the McLaren-s did pretty well here today.The tires will be a big challenge tomorrow because they have already done a few laps today,probably the pit stops will be earlier and who can manage better the tires will be the winner tomorrow.

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The weird thing about new 2022 cars is the problem about DRS, that is going to be an issue because DRS allows people to get closer to each other and the whole point of this current model is the fact that we should be able to get closer to each other, Mercedes could be fighting with Haas, that is the idea, plus the cap on how much a team could spend should also make it very difficult for teams like Mercedes to end up spending 300+ million dollars more than the lowest team.

So, basically everything was made to make sure that the difference between cars is not as much as anything else, so if you are Mercedes and pay 40 million to Hamilton, you have 100 million left to spend on everything, whereas if you are Haas mazepin is paying you let alone get paid, hence why difference should be minimal. Yet even with all of that, we still somehow have DRS as a possibly gone thing, why?

tokeweed

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^ Afaik, that rule when the tires you used in your fastest qualifying lap in Q2 should be used at the start of the race still applies in the sprint race. And I think there are no pit stops allowed. So yeah.. The tires they start with, are the tires they’ll be using for the whole sprint race.

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Quote from: tokeweed on July 17, 2021, 11:12:18 AM

^ It was intense during the first couple of laps when they has opportunities to fight for higher places on the grid.. But when everything has settled and towards the end, you kinda notice the drivers weren’t pushing as much anymore. I think Vettel could haved pushed more and get Alonso’s spot.

Do they need to keep this type of tires? not using red tires seems to be a mistake.

Look what Alonso did in the 1st lap, overlapping 6 cars.

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