Topic: Nefario GLBSE - page 8. (Read 28552 times)
LG what's the timeline for "almost immediately" I'm just a spectator on this one, but I would like to know. How long did it take nefario to retract his statement? And why is it now deleted?
There doesn't need to be consideration in this case because there is detrimental reliance sufficient to establish promissory estoppel (see my other post). But there was consideration -- Goat acquired shares on GLBSE, transactions for which GLBSE receives a commission.
You'd need a lawyer with huge balls to argue that this counts as consideration.
I wonder, why the shareholders of GLBSE Real should be held liable for the actions of a criminal in creating GLBSE Fake? There operating partner, Nefario, identified the fraud as soon as it was known, and made no indication AT THAT TIME that there would be any compensation to the victims of the fraud. It was only later, after any reasonable person had a chance to know the state of the fake asset that Nefario extended the courtesy of compensation to the holders of GLBSE Fake. That he did so without the contractual ability to do so was identified almost immediately by the balance of the shareholders of GLBSE Real, and he was stopped from going forward with this plan. His courtesy offer to the holders of those fraudulent shares became an issue now, only because of the scammish behavior of Goat in trying to sell these worthless assets for a massive profit, knowing full well that they were Fakes, and had nothing backing them up.
Thanks for this. This is the kind of context I was looking for.Goat, do you disagree with any of the statements in the above quoted post?
I think it is pretty clear that there is no consensus that Nefario scammed anyone here.
Scammer,no. Breach of fiduciary duty to existing shareholders? Maybe...by not shutting down the fake shares and instead promising to honor them he damaged the other shareholders of the company and as can be seen this damage along with other recent acts has greatly harmed the company. I dont really know what to say about that as he has placed them in between a rock and a hard place.
I think it was a fairly childish move to kick him off the exchange. I would have halted public trading instead. I haven't made any moves to pull my money off the exchange. The assets Goat ran were pretty worthless to begin with. They were just written off to zero ahead of time.
I think it was a long time coming. A lot of the trash that is on GLBSE needs to be cleaned out. I hope Nefario goes after Obsi next.
I think it is pretty clear that there is no consensus that Nefario scammed anyone here.
Scammer,no. Breach of fiduciary duty to existing shareholders? Maybe...by not shutting down the fake shares and instead promising to honor them he damaged the other shareholders of the company and as can be seen this damage along with other recent acts has greatly harmed the company. I dont really know what to say about that as he has placed them in between a rock and a hard place.
I think it is pretty clear that there is no consensus that Nefario scammed anyone here.
I wonder, why the shareholders of GLBSE Real should be held liable for the actions of a criminal in creating GLBSE Fake? There operating partner, Nefario, identified the fraud as soon as it was known, and made no indication AT THAT TIME that there would be any compensation to the victims of the fraud. It was only later, after any reasonable person had a chance to know the state of the fake asset that Nefario extended the courtesy of compensation to the holders of GLBSE Fake. That he did so without the contractual ability to do so was identified almost immediately by the balance of the shareholders of GLBSE Real, and he was stopped from going forward with this plan. His courtesy offer to the holders of those fraudulent shares became an issue now, only because of the scammish behavior of Goat in trying to sell these worthless assets for a massive profit, knowing full well that they were Fakes, and had nothing backing them up.
GLBSE, for one, failed to protect its name, and any trademark that might be in the letters GLBSE.
Nefario, for another, allowed the known fake (and promised to be made real) asset, in his companies name, to continue trading on his exchange. I can't, for the life of me, understand why anyone would continue to claim this asset to be "fake" - It's been given some value in the past, and it's traded, and never been removed for having been fake (when all the other GLBSE 1.0 fake assets were removed). IOW, nefario allowed a fraud to continued to be perpetrated by allowing the asset to continue trading.
This shows, at least, gross negligence on nefario's part. We really ought to have a tag for that. I'm sure nefario had no intent to deceive people into losing their money. However, his appalling failure to remove dead and scam assets in the past, which seems to be negligence, has lead directly to this incident.
And, yes, I do believe that the exchange is going to become liable for the criminal actions of their users when those criminal actions become known, and any assets created are left to trade, as if created by legitimate issuers. This is the exchanges job to list and delist assets. Their negligence in their process is going to make them liable for damages to investors.
How is an investor to know this is a dead, or fake asset if it's still trading? Search these forums for clues?!
It wasnt trading, it was simply sitting in peoples accounts and didnt exist as a public asset. It has never been available to buy on GLBSE 2.0 except through p2p transfer.
I wonder, why the shareholders of GLBSE Real should be held liable for the actions of a criminal in creating GLBSE Fake? There operating partner, Nefario, identified the fraud as soon as it was known, and made no indication AT THAT TIME that there would be any compensation to the victims of the fraud. It was only later, after any reasonable person had a chance to know the state of the fake asset that Nefario extended the courtesy of compensation to the holders of GLBSE Fake. That he did so without the contractual ability to do so was identified almost immediately by the balance of the shareholders of GLBSE Real, and he was stopped from going forward with this plan. His courtesy offer to the holders of those fraudulent shares became an issue now, only because of the scammish behavior of Goat in trying to sell these worthless assets for a massive profit, knowing full well that they were Fakes, and had nothing backing them up.
GLBSE, for one, failed to protect its name, and any trademark that might be in the letters GLBSE.
Nefario, for another, allowed the known fake (and promised to be made real) asset, in his companies name, to continue trading on his exchange. I can't, for the life of me, understand why anyone would continue to claim this asset to be "fake" - It's been given some value in the past, and it's traded, and never been removed for having been fake (when all the other GLBSE 1.0 fake assets were removed). IOW, nefario allowed a fraud to continued to be perpetrated by allowing the asset to continue trading.
This shows, at least, gross negligence on nefario's part. We really ought to have a tag for that. I'm sure nefario had no intent to deceive people into losing their money. However, his appalling failure to remove dead and scam assets in the past, which seems to be negligence, has lead directly to this incident.
And, yes, I do believe that the exchange is going to become liable for the criminal actions of their users when those criminal actions become known, and any assets created are left to trade, as if created by legitimate issuers. This is the exchanges job to list and delist assets. Their negligence in their process is going to make them liable for damages to investors.
How is an investor to know this is a dead, or fake asset if it's still trading? Search these forums for clues?!
After witnessing the BS that is Goat, one thing is clear to me.. crystal clear..
Goat should not, and cannot be in charge of any asset, amount of bitcoin or anything remotely important, and to do business with him is identical to shooting yourself in the foot, and expecting a free ride to the hospital paid for by the people he cheats, and the money he loses of others
Goat should not, and cannot be in charge of any asset, amount of bitcoin or anything remotely important, and to do business with him is identical to shooting yourself in the foot, and expecting a free ride to the hospital paid for by the people he cheats, and the money he loses of others
Yeah, I'm 100% scammer. Go post your evidence in the Goat is a scammer thread if you have anything other than slander.
Thanks.
I don't think he called you a scammer. You are a liability (but then again so is Nefario). You let tantrums, and games get in the way of profits and business. You have no common sense, no ability to reach equitable solutions in a dispute, and no real ethics. Anyone doing business with you WILL LOSE eventually. That doesn't make you a scammer, it just makes you a liability to be avoided at all cost.
Exactly..
Thank you for putting it a little more eloquently, those are my thoughts precisely
After witnessing the BS that is Goat, one thing is clear to me.. crystal clear..
Goat should not, and cannot be in charge of any asset, amount of bitcoin or anything remotely important, and to do business with him is identical to shooting yourself in the foot, and expecting a free ride to the hospital paid for by the people he cheats, and the money he loses of others
Goat should not, and cannot be in charge of any asset, amount of bitcoin or anything remotely important, and to do business with him is identical to shooting yourself in the foot, and expecting a free ride to the hospital paid for by the people he cheats, and the money he loses of others
Yeah, I'm 100% scammer. Go post your evidence in the Goat is a scammer thread if you have anything other than slander.
Thanks.
I don't think he called you a scammer. You are a liability (but then again so is Nefario). You let tantrums, and games get in the way of profits and business. You have no common sense, no ability to reach equitable solutions in a dispute, and no real ethics. Anyone doing business with you WILL LOSE eventually. That doesn't make you a scammer, it just makes you a liability to be avoided at all cost.
After witnessing the BS that is Goat, one thing is clear to me.. crystal clear..
Goat should not, and cannot be in charge of any asset, amount of bitcoin or anything remotely important, and to do business with him is identical to shooting yourself in the foot, and expecting a free ride to the hospital paid for by the people he cheats, and the money he loses of others
Goat should not, and cannot be in charge of any asset, amount of bitcoin or anything remotely important, and to do business with him is identical to shooting yourself in the foot, and expecting a free ride to the hospital paid for by the people he cheats, and the money he loses of others
Yeah, I'm 100% scammer. Go post your evidence in the Goat is a scammer thread if you have anything other than slander.
Thanks.
Nahhh.. thanks..
I have better things to do then to fight the world.. Clearly you have it under control..
So.. did you sue Pirate yet ?
After witnessing the BS that is Goat for nearly 2 years, one thing is clear to me.. crystal clear..
Goat should not, and cannot be in charge of any asset, amount of bitcoin or anything remotely important, and to do business with him is identical to shooting yourself in the foot, and expecting a free ride to the hospital paid for by the people he cheats, and the money he loses of others
Goat should not, and cannot be in charge of any asset, amount of bitcoin or anything remotely important, and to do business with him is identical to shooting yourself in the foot, and expecting a free ride to the hospital paid for by the people he cheats, and the money he loses of others
This'd seem to run against the shield-not-sword doctrine tho.
I presume he's trying to recover losses, not replace lost profits. If that's not true, then it's a different story.What losses?
He has profited.
But he never replied to the offer !
He didn't have to. The offer didn't ask for people to reply to it. It was a statement that an action would be performed in the future conditional on others performing actions in the future. It's like, "If you bring us 100 pounds of corn, we'll give you $100 off on a car". You don't have to accept the offer, you just have to bring 100 pounds of corn to the place. Goat did what the offer required him to do -- he acquired shares of GLBSE. Nefario then reneged on his offer after Goat completed his part.
There doesn't need to be consideration in this case because there is detrimental reliance sufficient to establish promissory estoppel (see my other post). But there was consideration -- Goat acquired shares on GLBSE, transactions for which GLBSE receives a commission.
I wonder, why the shareholders of GLBSE Real should be held liable for the actions of a criminal in His courtesy offer to the holders of those fraudulent shares became an issue now, only because of the scammish behavior of Goat in trying to sell these worthless assets for a massive profit, knowing full well that they were Fakes, and had nothing backing them up.
You are saying the assets were worthless even after Nefario stated he would redeem them? Why? Should Goat have known not to trust Nefario?300 shares is going to be pretty worthless in the scheme of things. Goat is going to wish he took the generous offer he got presented.
So "fake"/"fraudulent" GLBSE shares were listed but also still remain listed and traded?
And, the "real" shares in the GLBSE are not actually traded on the GLBSE?
And, the "real" shares in the GLBSE are not actually traded on the GLBSE?
They are no longer listed or tradeable on the exchange. They can be "traded" off the exchange by using the transfer function (transfer assets from one account to another account).
This is correct.
Nefario however let the "fake" GLBSE trade for months after he said they would be converted to real GLBSE assets.
I now hold "fake" GLBSE stock and do not consent to them being sold to Nefario for .1 BTC Nefario needs to just leave them alone as I value them more than he does.
This is my huge problem with this whole story.
Goat and nefario do not get along, and act like asshats toward each other. This is irrelevant. What is relevant is what was agreed to by both parties in the past, how the glbse shareholders have responded to the egregious overstepping of authority by nefario, and the offer (and further negotiations) on the table.
IMO, the reason that GLBSE must honor those shares, is they were allowed to trade on the open market for a very very long time. Anyone could have bought them. I almost bought some too. I would have liked to own shares in GLBSE. I am now glad I do not. I wouldn't want to be trying to dump them this week as GLBSE starts to feel the pressure of nefario's bad & arbitrary decisions.
IMO, all of the shareholders of GLBSE should be held accountable for this issue, not just nefario.
Yes, but 300 shares out of how many
I think it was because Goat bought some then started whinging about it that Nefario made the offer.
If so, that means Nefario intended Goat to rely on the offer.http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Consideration_in_English_law
I think it was because Goat bought some then started whinging about it that Nefario made the offer.
If so, that means Nefario intended Goat to rely on the offer.But he never replied to the offer !
I think it was because Goat bought some then started whinging about it that Nefario made the offer.
If so, that means Nefario intended Goat to rely on the offer. I wonder, why the shareholders of GLBSE Real should be held liable for the actions of a criminal in creating GLBSE Fake? There operating partner, Nefario, identified the fraud as soon as it was known, and made no indication AT THAT TIME that there would be any compensation to the victims of the fraud. It was only later, after any reasonable person had a chance to know the state of the fake asset that Nefario extended the courtesy of compensation to the holders of GLBSE Fake. That he did so without the contractual ability to do so was identified almost immediately by the balance of the shareholders of GLBSE Real, and he was stopped from going forward with this plan. His courtesy offer to the holders of those fraudulent shares became an issue now, only because of the scammish behavior of Goat in trying to sell these worthless assets for a massive profit, knowing full well that they were Fakes, and had nothing backing them up.
I think it was because Goat bought some then started whinging about it that Nefario made the offer.
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