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Topic: | Nxt | Blockchain Platform | Proof of Stake | Official - page 497. (Read 941427 times)

full member
Activity: 237
Merit: 100


I want to use this quote to address an issue about forging power to the NXT community:

Besides the discussion of the 73 stakeholders, I come to the conclution that the accounts forging power being proportional to the ammount of NXT one possesses is fair in general (what concerns the forging system per se). BUT there is one big disadvantage that can also be seen in parallel to the fiat money system:

Large fiat holders get interest and compounded interest therefore always get richer whereas "average Joe" pays the interest for big "fiat-stakeholders". This inequality leads to the growing gap between rich and poor hard-working. The system works for large fiat-holders, in other words, the hard-working people indirectly work for large holders by paying loan-tax, VAT, credits,...

Now NXT forging system rewards those who posess the highest stakes. For people who have small ammounts, theres kind of an emotional threshold (if those kind of people let their client forge), to use NXT in general. I can imagine people quickly get frustrated seeing they dont get rewarded by the system when letting their nodes run.

Dont we see this all day? Arent we upset that people "up there" always get their pockets lined? Should a system for common people (as you are preaching nxt should be accepted by EVERYONE) ensure inequality? I SAY NO!

What about fair distribution of forged NXT? What about cutting upper limit of forging power at couple of thousand NXT? Has this topic been discussed before?


Yeah, AFAIK,  it was discussed before and few several times.

The points I briefly remember to come out against your "proposal" were like:

1) Upper limit forging power? No problem, I (who own 50M nxt account) redistribute it among 100 accounts with 500k nxt each. Problem solved  Grin
2) Forging power is NOT proportional to amount of NXT? OK! I will "create" millions and millions (or thousands, if my stake is not so big) accounts with 1NXT each, i will be rich in some weeks!  Grin


Hope I explained it clearly. But, I suppose, devs will provide a better and more technical point

Im not a NXT pro, but AFAIS you would have to run a node for each account to forge? So you would have to set up several computers I suppose...
full member
Activity: 237
Merit: 100
Here we go again.

How would your fairer forging system work?

Quote
What about cutting upper limit of forging power at couple of thousand NXT?

Then the large stakeholder splits his account and still forges most of the fees.


Get rewarded by letting a node run in general. Not according to how much nxt someone possesses. Maybe also cut forging power at an upper limit.

Sth. like this:

Probability of forgin a block = 1 / (2*(number of all nodes running)) + (0..current_NXT_balance..NXT_MAX) / (2 * (number of all NXT used for forging))

NXT_MAX would be threshold value. If we set it to lets say 100k then the ammount of NXT would contribute to 50% of the forging probability (in this example), also letting a node run in general would contribute to another 50% of the forging probability.

This would be in harmony with the thought to secure the network, because you could also forge with 0NXT in the account.
full member
Activity: 126
Merit: 100

Quote
What about cutting upper limit of forging power at couple of thousand NXT?

Then the large stakeholder splits his account and still forges most of the fees.

And if they don't bother to do this, then the system will be not secure, anyone can game it with almost nothing.
It's not only about the so-called "fair", but also about the security.
legendary
Activity: 952
Merit: 1000
Yeah! I hate ShroomsKit!


I want to use this quote to address an issue about forging power to the NXT community:

Besides the discussion of the 73 stakeholders, I come to the conclution that the accounts forging power being proportional to the ammount of NXT one possesses is fair in general (what concerns the forging system per se). BUT there is one big disadvantage that can also be seen in parallel to the fiat money system:

Large fiat holders get interest and compounded interest therefore always get richer whereas "average Joe" pays the interest for big "fiat-stakeholders". This inequality leads to the growing gap between rich and poor hard-working. The system works for large fiat-holders, in other words, the hard-working people indirectly work for large holders by paying loan-tax, VAT, credits,...

Now NXT forging system rewards those who posess the highest stakes. For people who have small ammounts, theres kind of an emotional threshold (if those kind of people let their client forge), to use NXT in general. I can imagine people quickly get frustrated seeing they dont get rewarded by the system when letting their nodes run.

Dont we see this all day? Arent we upset that people "up there" always get their pockets lined? Should a system for common people (as you are preaching nxt should be accepted by EVERYONE) ensure inequality? I SAY NO!

What about fair distribution of forged NXT? What about cutting upper limit of forging power at couple of thousand NXT? Has this topic been discussed before?


Yeah, AFAIK,  it was discussed before and few several times.

The points I briefly remember to come out against your "proposal" were like:

1) Upper limit forging power? No problem, I (who own 50M nxt account) redistribute it among 100 accounts with 500k nxt each. Problem solved  Grin
2) Forging power is NOT proportional to amount of NXT? OK! I will "create" millions and millions (or thousands, if my stake is not so big) accounts with 1NXT each, i will be rich in some weeks!  Grin


Hope I explained it clearly. But, I suppose, devs will provide a better and more technical point
member
Activity: 78
Merit: 10
A leader of the altcoin market, a lot of followers are waiting for the source code of Asset Exchange.
legendary
Activity: 1225
Merit: 1000
Here we go again.

How would your fairer forging system work?

Quote
What about cutting upper limit of forging power at couple of thousand NXT?

Then the large stakeholder splits his account and still forges most of the fees.
full member
Activity: 237
Merit: 100
Hi all, i'm a long time miner (Go DRK!) but new to NXT.  So i've installed the "one click install" wallet on my Windows 7 PC and all seems to be OK.

I've got 100 (less a couple for fee and test transaction) NXT in there, the wallet has been running for less than a day.

How long until i start forging? I think i read i need to keep it open for atleast 24 hours?  On my Dashboard screen, when i click "forging" it says my net account balance is 0.  yet I have 97 NXT?
 
Is there anything I need to do now?

Once I start forging, if i reboot my PC for example, will i loose the 'forging' status when i re-launch my wallet? 

Thanks,
Ili

If anyone feeling generous pls help me build my NXT account: 13132972958635556559

ta!
Since you started your post mentioning you are a miner, I just want to make sure you understand what forging is, and how your balance correlates. If you are under the impression that running your client with 100 Nxt will net any additional Nxt for you, I am sorry to say it may never happen. Forging only serves to secure the network, so unless you have atleast 100k Nxt, you'll never see any sort of return. If you already understand everything i just covered, well then, please allow me to welcome you to the Nxt community.

On another note, you can point your current minig rig(s) to on of the Nxt pools where they mine other altcoins, then sell them and purchase Nxt's and split the Nxt among contributing miners.

I want to use this quote to address an issue about forging power to the NXT community:

Besides the discussion of the 73 stakeholders, I come to the conclution that the accounts forging power being proportional to the ammount of NXT one possesses is fair in general (what concerns the forging system per se). BUT there is one big disadvantage that can also be seen in parallel to the fiat money system:

Large fiat holders get interest and compounded interest therefore always get richer whereas "average Joe" pays the interest for big "fiat-stakeholders". This inequality leads to the growing gap between rich and poor hard-working. The system works for large fiat-holders, in other words, the hard-working people indirectly work for large holders by paying loan-tax, VAT, credits,...

Now NXT forging system rewards those who posess the highest stakes. For people who have small ammounts, theres kind of an emotional threshold (if those kind of people let their client forge), to use NXT in general. I can imagine people quickly get frustrated seeing they dont get rewarded by the system when letting their nodes run.

Dont we see this all day? Arent we upset that people "up there" always get their pockets lined? Should a system for common people (as you are preaching nxt should be accepted by EVERYONE) ensure inequality? I SAY NO!

What about fair distribution of forged NXT? What about cutting upper limit of forging power at couple of thousand NXT? Has this topic been discussed before?
legendary
Activity: 1205
Merit: 1000
How do I blacklist the peers in the new client (Wesley's)?

You have to edit the file nxt-default.properties

# Known bad peers to be blacklisted
nxt.knownBlacklistedPeers=

Here you have to fill in the IP's of the nodes that you want to blacklist.

I never blacklisted a node so I hope this is the right way to do it  Wink
Thanks a lot!! Smiley
newbie
Activity: 31
Merit: 0
its really getting excited with the asset exchange coming up!
legendary
Activity: 1225
Merit: 1000
How do I blacklist the peers in the new client (Wesley's)?

You have to edit the file nxt-default.properties

# Known bad peers to be blacklisted
nxt.knownBlacklistedPeers=

Here you have to fill in the IP's of the nodes that you want to blacklist.

I never blacklisted a node so I hope this is the right way to do it  Wink
legendary
Activity: 1205
Merit: 1000
How do I blacklist the peers in the new client (Wesley's)?
legendary
Activity: 1225
Merit: 1000
Yes you can make transactions if you are on the main chain (if you are on 1.0.0).
How do I know if I am on the main chain? About 11 out of 20 nodes in my Nxt Wallet (Wesley's client) aren't on 1.0.0.

I think your client won't accept the blocks generated by nodes that are not on 1.0.0?

You could blacklist the peers that are not on the curent version
legendary
Activity: 1205
Merit: 1000
Yes you can make transactions if you are on the main chain (if you are on 1.0.0).
How do I know if I am on the main chain? About 11 out of 20 nodes in my Nxt Wallet (Wesley's client) aren't on 1.0.0.
newbie
Activity: 42
Merit: 0
i am a bit fearful that a lot of nodes didn't upgrade and we ended up with multiple forks.
legendary
Activity: 1225
Merit: 1000
Still a lot of nodes who didn't upgrade. Can I make transactions? Where can I get a list of all the nodes?

Yes you can make transactions if you are on the main chain (if you are on 1.0.0).

Here's a list of the nodes, at the bottom: http://www.peerexplorer.com/
legendary
Activity: 1205
Merit: 1000
Still a lot of nodes who didn't upgrade. Can I make transactions? Where can I get a list of all the nodes?
sr. member
Activity: 364
Merit: 250
☕ NXT-4BTE-8Y4K-CDS2-6TB82
130K reached. Thanks to everybody who updated their nodes so quickly.

We are thinking about a more elaborated approach to update nodes.
Let us know if you have an idea.
sr. member
Activity: 364
Merit: 250
☕ NXT-4BTE-8Y4K-CDS2-6TB82
Couple of things, The main page nxt.org (nxtcommunity.org) makes it really difficult to find the forums and you've taken a lot of focus off the asset exchange countdown.

Agreed.
sr. member
Activity: 404
Merit: 253
Couple of things, The main page nxt.org (nxtcommunity.org) makes it really difficult to find the forums and you've taken a lot of focus off the asset exchange countdown.
full member
Activity: 168
Merit: 100
Only 9 more blocks until 130K!  Cheesy
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