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Topic: Off-Topic - page 109. (Read 384417 times)

member
Activity: 82
Merit: 10
August 14, 2013, 09:18:51 PM
You can try to get a refund, but again I don't condone hurting a small business because of the risk that the customer took. I consider this fraud and won't be part of it.
(The above can be changed if the company advertised falsehoods such as BFL, but so far Terrahash has done nothing wrong (No matter what the "Kooks" will have you think))

Selling the Hardware once Terrahash ships is probably your best bet. People will pay a fairly good amount for HashPower in Hand.

If you are feeling a little brave and risky, you can mine with your hardware for 2-3 Weeks after receiving it and then Sell it for a decent price. As long as No HUGE players like KnC Ship during this timeframe you might come out ahead of just selling it when receiving.

Either way, there are still plenty of options. Hell if KnC misses their deadline this Unit could pay for itself easily. (I don't think KnC will miss that deadline)

That being said a 75% linear monthly difficulty increase isn't going to stay that way past maybe 3-4 months. Then it will level off unless you see some other big players selling $2/GH units. (Could happen!)

You have somewhat of a point, except that you fail to acknowledge that Terrahash bears the risk here.
Business is about risk and reward.  The way that a normal business arrangement where this has happened works is this
You open up preorders for something you can't provide until you get parts from somewhere else.
Your supplier fails to provide those parts in a timely fashion, or at all
Your customers get upset or feel that they may never receive their merchandise and request refunds.
They have no business arrangement with your supplier - their business arrangement is with you.  Their recourse for getting their money back is to get it back from you, and legally you are required to provide it.
Your recourse, since you have been harmed in this process, is against your supplier.  In this case, since you've paid with a semi-untraceable currency that isn't official, your option is most likely limited to civil suit

Let's call this the way it is.  Nobody wanting a refund (and using whatever option available to get it) is committing fraud.  They are not harming Terrahash.  They are protecting their assets.
Terrahash is being harmed, to be sure.   It is Bitsyncom that has already harmed Terrahash, and I believe is continuing to harm Terrahash, not the customers.

Terrahash has already implied that they will not be able to refund everyone's money if the Avalon chips never show up.  That, regardless of what anyone here wants to try to convince people, is NOT legal.
No business has the legal right to take people's money, never provide the merchandise, and then say but it's not my fault it's this guy over here so I don't have to give back everyone's money.  I don't have, or see, any problem with someone deciding (in light of what's going on with Bitsyncom and TH admitting if it goes all the way bad they will not be able to refund everyone's money) that this is an unacceptable level of risk to them and they want out.


Now, you can argue but it's not them never providing the merchandise, they're just later than they thought!  ok, great, but how long does one wait before you say ok the merchandise is never coming?  6 months?  1 year?  5 years?  or do you suggest that people just say oh well, I guess if I die and I still haven't gotten my stuff, then I know and it won't matter?
That decision - where to draw the line - is subjective, and unique to each individual.  Personally, I already believe that the avalon chips aren't ever going to materialize in enough volume to fill the orders.  I firmly believe at this point that Bitsyncom, yifu, et al have scammed all of the businesses and the whole community, and are just making excuses to try to settle people down and buy some time - maybe to move the funds to someplace they can't be recovered and get away.

Does it suck for Terrahash?  Yes.  But the law (at least in the US) says that they are on the hook for refunds, regardless of their terms and conditions.  Terms and conditions do not trump federal law and regulations.
Their recourse is to go after Bitsyncom for their losses and the damage to their business.
sr. member
Activity: 269
Merit: 250
August 14, 2013, 08:07:04 PM
I have some extra 18GH/s boards from my paid order #451.  They have expedited shipping and I will drop-ship them to via a pre-labelled and paid Fedex Overnight AM delivery box on the same day I receive the board (if ever!).

I paid via PayPal funds (not a credit card) and have no recourse to supply a refund unless TH provides one.

$1100 each.  Only accepting BTC.  Can provide full proof of all payments, orders, etc.  Also have extra K16's.

PM or email [email protected].
sr. member
Activity: 389
Merit: 250
August 14, 2013, 08:00:19 PM
well I am just about to hit another 700 Feathercoins, so you know what that means  Grin a BTC in the ol wallet coming right up! lol

Nice. Wink

My miners are already back to Litecoin.

My Litecoin miner blew up last night. I am officially out of the business till I find a power supply. Sad

You have something in common with TH's part supply.... no power supplies.  

Instead of using a computer type power supply. Why not use something like this with plenty of amps? You need about 15 amps for 10 64's with fans.

http://www.magnalight.com/showproduct.aspx?productid=1494&gclid=CPiZi96e_rgCFS9eQgodU0UARQ
legendary
Activity: 1456
Merit: 1000
August 14, 2013, 07:26:10 PM
well I am just about to hit another 700 Feathercoins, so you know what that means  Grin a BTC in the ol wallet coming right up! lol

Nice. Wink

My miners are already back to Litecoin.

My Litecoin miner blew up last night. I am officially out of the business till I find a power supply. Sad

You have something in common with TH's part supply.... no power supplies. 
legendary
Activity: 2198
Merit: 1000
August 14, 2013, 06:21:18 PM
well I am just about to hit another 700 Feathercoins, so you know what that means  Grin a BTC in the ol wallet coming right up! lol

Nice. Wink

My miners are already back to Litecoin.

My Litecoin miner blew up last night. I am officially out of the business till I find a power supply. Sad
Oh no! Newegg 3 days lol...
 
Here ya go, I got this unit about 3 weeks ago to push 2 x 6870,s, doesnt even get warm ... lol,,,good price. so far so good..also bought the 550 model..discontinued..k,

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817342040
newbie
Activity: 46
Merit: 0
August 14, 2013, 06:05:02 PM
well I am just about to hit another 700 Feathercoins, so you know what that means  Grin a BTC in the ol wallet coming right up! lol

Nice. Wink

My miners are already back to Litecoin.

My Litecoin miner blew up last night. I am officially out of the business till I find a power supply. Sad
hero member
Activity: 854
Merit: 500
August 14, 2013, 06:00:49 PM
No, they should sit on Gen2 until every motherflucking Avalon Gen1 device is delivered by Terrahash, BKK and everyone else who bought chips and then wait one more month
legendary
Activity: 1582
Merit: 1001
August 14, 2013, 06:00:24 PM
And hopefully let us put in orders without preorderring

If terrahash opens to previous buyers first without this whole preorder deal I would be so impressed and remain a TH supporter for as long as I keep buying asics

Also I would promise to not call you more than once per order :p
sr. member
Activity: 378
Merit: 250
August 14, 2013, 05:50:21 PM
I sure hope gen 2 chips take a while...
They should give gen 1 buyers first shot at gen 2.
sr. member
Activity: 266
Merit: 250
August 14, 2013, 05:05:06 PM
Strange and interesting. Why do these companies even post a release date without thinking about manufacturing processing and developing.??

Mail update!!!

"Hello,

Just wanted to touch base with everybody who is waiting for their orders. As most of you already know, the delay has been caused due to BitSyncom's (the company that manufactures Avalon ASIC chips) inability to deliver chips on time. Most of you might have already read Yifu Guo's (head of operations at BitSyncom) statement last week at http://www.avalon-asics.com/, wherein he promised to resume shipping chips by the end of this week. On reading the statement, we decided to wait and watch a few more days. We just received 60 sample chips from Avalon today (apparently for our 20,000 chips order that we placed on June 20th), totally out of the blue (no update on the order page, no tracking number). We are pretty confident that BitSyncom will start shipping chip orders soon as well.

Assembly update: We already have components on stock to assemble upto 200,000 Avalon ASIC chips. As you know, we have ordered 40,000 chips directly from Avalon and have received orders/interest for assembly of 40,000 chips acquired by people independently from us. We are fully prepared to start assembling as soon as we receive the chips. We will start shipping your orders within 2 weeks of the arrival of chips.

Update regarding re-opening orders: A lot of folks have been inquiring about when will we start taking orders again. We have received very favorable offers from people willing to sell their Avalon chip pre-orders to us. In the coming days, if BitSyncom resumes shipping chips, we will acquire at least 30,000 additional chips and open orders for our products again.

Additionally, we are looking into starting another product line based on Bitfury's ASIC chips. We have initiated communication with Bitfury to acquire chips from them in bulk. We have also initiated communication with "c-scape" to license their design of Bitfury boards. We will update once a deal is finalized.

Thanks, TerraHash Team."
legendary
Activity: 1582
Merit: 1001
August 14, 2013, 04:27:06 PM
I sure hope gen 2 chips take a while...
full member
Activity: 232
Merit: 100
August 14, 2013, 04:10:22 PM
Is terrahash going to assemble a revised board since you have plenty of sample chips? would be nice to see if it fixes the HW errors/noise issues, hasnt been updates from BKK about his assembled board..
legendary
Activity: 2198
Merit: 1000
August 14, 2013, 02:34:47 PM
18 blocks till 50,808,288 new difficulty Sad

You are a bit late on this...  happened yesterday
lol,,,your right,,,the site i was on hadn't refreshed! I'm not mining BTC at the moment,,FTC,,,so wasn't watching that hard my bad! thanks for the correction Smiley
hero member
Activity: 778
Merit: 563
August 14, 2013, 02:06:25 PM
18 blocks till 50,808,288 new difficulty Sad

You are a bit late on this...  happened yesterday
legendary
Activity: 1498
Merit: 1000
August 14, 2013, 10:41:10 AM
Mail update!!!

"Hello,

Just wanted to touch base with everybody who is waiting for their orders. As most of you already know, the delay has been caused due to BitSyncom's (the company that manufactures Avalon ASIC chips) inability to deliver chips on time. Most of you might have already read Yifu Guo's (head of operations at BitSyncom) statement last week at http://www.avalon-asics.com/, wherein he promised to resume shipping chips by the end of this week. On reading the statement, we decided to wait and watch a few more days. We just received 60 sample chips from Avalon today (apparently for our 20,000 chips order that we placed on June 20th), totally out of the blue (no update on the order page, no tracking number). We are pretty confident that BitSyncom will start shipping chip orders soon as well.

Assembly update: We already have components on stock to assemble upto 200,000 Avalon ASIC chips. As you know, we have ordered 40,000 chips directly from Avalon and have received orders/interest for assembly of 40,000 chips acquired by people independently from us. We are fully prepared to start assembling as soon as we receive the chips. We will start shipping your orders within 2 weeks of the arrival of chips.

Update regarding re-opening orders: A lot of folks have been inquiring about when will we start taking orders again. We have received very favorable offers from people willing to sell their Avalon chip pre-orders to us. In the coming days, if BitSyncom resumes shipping chips, we will acquire at least 30,000 additional chips and open orders for our products again.

Additionally, we are looking into starting another product line based on Bitfury's ASIC chips. We have initiated communication with Bitfury to acquire chips from them in bulk. We have also initiated communication with "c-scape" to license their design of Bitfury boards. We will update once a deal is finalized.

Thanks, TerraHash Team."
sr. member
Activity: 449
Merit: 250
August 14, 2013, 10:06:45 AM
We just received 60 sample chips from Avalon. Apparently from the 20,000 chips order we placed on June 20th. There was no status updated on the order page, and we never received a tracking number. As knightlife pointed, some other people who placed order around the same time have received chips in the last couple days in the same fashion.

The op below ordered on july 10 and his sample chips is shipped today.  Looks like avalon is moving faster. 

https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/avalon-is-alive-chips-shipped-notice-273459
hero member
Activity: 532
Merit: 500
August 14, 2013, 06:29:39 AM
Can you take an upclose picture of the new sample chips? would be interesting to see which week these ones were produced.

I don't have my camera with me right now, and the phone camera doesn't work this close. But, this is whats printed on the chips: P6N41613272C.

It seems they were produced in week 27.

Between July 1, 2013 and July 7, 2013

Over a month ago then!
sr. member
Activity: 252
Merit: 250
August 14, 2013, 03:18:06 AM
Can you take an upclose picture of the new sample chips? would be interesting to see which week these ones were produced.

I don't have my camera with me right now, and the phone camera doesn't work this close. But, this is whats printed on the chips: P6N41613272C.

It seems they were produced in week 27.

Between July 1, 2013 and July 7, 2013
newbie
Activity: 17
Merit: 0
August 14, 2013, 02:41:59 AM

(didnt know this is .. THIS IS GREAT!... )
But what the heck is the real story?Huh?

Terrahash, this is ridiculous.
Please help me understand The REAL ORDERS placed. In sequence please... and please try not to change your story again.

What happened to the original 40K???

Look at my photobucket pictures (http://s1334.photobucket.com/user/knightlife999/library/?sort=3&page=1) of the original chip orders Kooks. TH had an agreement with a 3rd party to buy ANOTHER 20k chips from an early May order (in addition to the 40k chips they have on order with Bitsyncom). They stated that they decided not to take that route, which was at a premium price, and are now looking at offers to buy early orders of 20-30k chips at cost. Sound judgement.

Btw, I'm still waiting for you to answer my question about how many chips/boards you have on order?

okay... thanks for the clarification? and why is this coming from you not terrahash?
Gottit you have lots of orders and have preferential treatment (?)

My order is small which makes it even more insane, make fun of it as you see fit. 1 x 4.5 Gh and DX mini 18Gh complete kit.
http://i40.tinypic.com/2h6vnkp.png


My turn:
1. PSUs (When will these arrive? not caught in customs I hope!)
2. Cases (When will these arrive? not caught in customs I hope!)
3. Heat Sinks (When will these arrive? not caught in customs I hope!)
4. PCBs  (When will these arrive? not caught in customs I hope!)
5. When will we see the 1 unit hashing at 4.5Ghash?


My order is even smaller, just mini DX case + psu and 2 x 4,5 Ghs boards, as I had no more funds, plan was to order more boards later. Regarding my previous post about chargeback: I decided to not do it after last TH statement.
full member
Activity: 232
Merit: 100
August 13, 2013, 11:42:47 PM
Can you take an upclose picture of the new sample chips? would be interesting to see which week these ones were produced.
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