Topic: Off-Topic - page 95. (Read 384416 times)

TerraHsh, can you provide which of these batches are yours?

Here is the problem with your statement:

The difference is that it doesn't matter whether they are a 100 year old billion $ company or a brand new start-up, neither company can use customer money to fund their business, that is called investing, non of us agreed to invest in their company, did you? would you?

This is not kickstarter!

I'll give you a legitimate response.  One that seems to escape most people.  If you buy on pre-order a PS4 from Sony you're buying a 4th generation product from an electronics giant.  A company that's been around for a few decades.  If you equate Terrahash, a company that has only just been created, with the sole purpose of making a bitcoin mining rig with Avalon chips that are as rare as hens teeth, then you're bat shit crazy delusional.

And if in the case of the PS4 being non-deliverable you know that Sony would do a full refund, because the pre-orders they took weren't to fund its development, but a marketing ploy to generate demand and a feeding frenzy.

Be pissed all you want, its an aggravating situation all around, but try at least to hang on to some sense of reality.  Comparing a fledgling company in a fledgling industry to the likes of Sony is one step away from that reality.

oh that is proprietary business information that if it got disclosed would ruin our business.
/s

Perhaps it has something to do with the fact that they lied about ordering chips?

I wonder why TerraHash have not registered its orders at group tracking page here:
Did something went wrong with ordering chips that tracking data cannot be revealed?

Tracking page:
https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/closed-refunds-processavalon-chips-group-buy-order-time-frame-and-deliveries-277198

He likes to hear himself talk and thinks he has an impact here. Just shake your head and laugh a little knowing the personality type you're dealing with.. Jesus complex.

This is not true, no-where have I said that I think that TerraHash can give me a product but are refusing to do so, I don't think anybody has said that at all.

What you are failing to grasp is the shear arrogance, disdain and hatred that Amir and Justin have shown to their own customers.

• Refusing to answer most or all questions about their business.
• Refusing to honor refunds when requested.
• Lying about chip orders.
• Pulling a switcheroo 2 days prior to opening sales regarding refund verbiage and neglecting to tell anybody.
• Horrible communication skills
• Horrible decision making skills
• lying about what parts they have and when they had/purchased them.
• Near criminal behavior regarding refunds

I deserve to lose money because why?
Which words have I twisted?
What product are you talking about? The one that as of yet does not exist, but when it does will most certainly lose "customers" money?
Amir and Justin have dropped the ball in every single way possible, not sure where your delusional mind makes it so that they have done outstanding things, or even ordinary things or anything at all for that matter!
Most people are disagreeing with you, you seem to be implying that there is this vast silent magority that are behind you. Well lets see them?

Without a doubt the amount of risk that they took v.s. the community is very relevant and strikes at the heart of the debate, Amir and Justin saw an opportunity to make money with very little risk, They have raised (probably) 100's of thousands of dollars in USD and BTC and have literally done almost nothing for it.

They only thing they have showed anybody is a few boxes of "stuff", a picture of one case, a prototype board that has a ton of Hardware errors and empty and now broken promises.

Somebody a few pages back was practically begging TerraHash for more information with a $15,000 order and Amir nor Justin have done anything to appease even the largest of order holders.

http://www.coindesk.com/terrahash-opens-asic-mining-preorders-loses-business/

The level of Arrogance is astounding, they don't care about you, this company if you can call it that is borderline criminal.

TH is still required to deliver a product and if we don't feel that product is arriving when we expected then we should be refunded. some of you are suggesting that we should be biting the bullet. That isn't how it works.

The original assertion was that TH put 100% of the risk on the customer which is not true. How much risk they took isn't relevant. We all knew there was a possibility that this could happen.

Your welcome, I think you made the right decision, TH clearly lacks in the business sense dept. and more than likely this venture for Amir and Justin will likely end in bankruptcy after they are forced to refund everybody's pre-orders when the ftc and other agencies come calling. The arrogance, poor judgement and lack of basic communication skills will be their undoing.

just checking to see if i made the right decision, hope you guys get your hardware while still profitable. It's a race against time with avalon as your driver.

bluefin - thank you.

No, they have not delivered anything at all and from the looks of it probably wont deliver anything for at least another 30-45 days minimum (very late September, Early October), which will then put these miners firmly into  negative ROI territory.

Bottom line, if you have an order cancel it, if you haven't ordered, don't.

It would be correct to say that Avalon has not delivered chips to Terrahash yet.  Why are you here?

havent really been following this thread after paypal got my money back.  from the last few pages it looks like TH hasnt delivered anything yet, is that correct?

Almost all of the current ASIC manufactures have absolutely no clue what the legal difference between a customer and an investor is, what they have done is tried to create a new category called investomers.  If things end up going south for one of them they will quickly learn the law has no definition for an investomer.

Amir,
So if you have been ready 100% for more than 2 weeks as of the above writing, what have you been doing? Do you just sit in the office tinkering with the board? Do you have a second job? Have you been replying to emails or Support Tickets? Do you feel that people that have entrusted you with their funds (100's of thousands of dollars) deserve to ask questions about their orders? How much money have you personally invested into this venture?

TerraHash took almost no risk, they gambled with the communities money, not their own. How much have they actually risked of their own funds? Did they take a small business loan? Just to clarify, there is a huge difference between investors and customers.

So, to reiterate something I've said before - how long do you wait?  You say 2 weeks after the chips arrive, but that's meaningless.  What if the chips never arrive?
Are you going to just wait forever, and if they never show up, continue to defend it by saying well he still hasn't missed his deadline?  If not, how long is long enough?

I already firmly believe the chips will never show up.  Yifu's explanations don't add up.  There's too many indications that something is going on that Bitsyncom doesn't want anyone knowing, and it's not good.
You're entitled to sit and wait if you like, and I'm not going to say otherwise, nor will I tell you you're wrong to do so.  It's your money it's your choice.
I'm not willing to become a passthrough victim to Bitsyncom's scam, that's the bottom line.

But just to satisfy those who are nitpicking on my comparison due to size, fine.
Let's say you go to the small time local electronics shop down the road.  They're advertising a super high power LED flashlight you think is cool, and taking pre-orders for it.
You preorder one and pay in full up front.  They say it'll be delivered 2 weeks after they get the LEDs from some other company that already has a less than stellar reputation and some concern about whether they're entirely on the up and up, or maybe just enough to keep people coming back for a bit longer
Are you seriously telling me that if something went sideways and they didn't get their parts; they couldn't tell you when they'd get the parts other than they were 'pretty confident they'll start shipping the parts to us soon'; that you'd just be content to sit and wait?  That you'd be content to lose your money if those LEDs never came in?

If that's really what you're saying, you are the wet dream of scammers and dishonest cheating corporations everywhere. (not saying that all businesses and corporations are dishonest and cheating, just the ones that are)