Topic: [OFFICIAL]Bitfinex.com first Bitcoin P2P lending platform for leverage trading - page 85. (Read 723861 times)

Come down please. Im not sure why you get angry. I did not read everything in this thread and i only tried if it works. So nothing wrong with asking about it i think. I only say that its not mentioned anywhere that i, on the one hand can lend out my real money, but on the other hand cant lend real money the same way. If its bound by one purpose then its only virtual.

Where is this history log you mention? I only see one daily line showing something like: "Swap Payment on wallet deposit". All swaps done are put into one line of payment. Even though i did many different swaps for different percents.

And regarding borrowers, i explained already that i had read it otherwise when i did margin trading. Wrong wording then most probably. And i didnt find where its stated on bitfinex that its only for the remaining hour. Link?

On the last page only a few days ago someone asked for this feature (again) because it is currently not possible. Then you try to do it despite that fact and are wondering why it doesn't work?

Also you claim several things that are not true, for example complete history of money you borrowed is available in the History tab, take a look at the other reports there... borrowers only pay for the remaining hour, not the remaining day.

Then i got this wrong. When i traded margin on bitfinex i always read things the way that, when i close a position, i still have to pay the full loan fee for the day. But its only for the hours i used the loan till now? I didnt find a statement about that on bitfinex faqs now.

The maybe additional minutes from a not ended hour are probably eaten by the time it takes to lend out the money again then.

they break down by the hour for calculations...not whole days

It might be easy to implement a stop so that lend money cant be withdrawn.

What i wanted to try to do was taking a swap at 0.09% and offer the money at 0.11% again. Arbitrage. Though if that would work then there most probably wouldnt be such a spread.

Im not happy how bitfinex is handling the swap payments. They pay all swaps at one single time at the day. If you started your swap at another time then you will be paid partially. Thats not so bad when bitfinex would make a clear statement about the payments. Instead there is only one single line where all payments are put into. No way to go into detail it seems. Or is there?

And what i really dont like is the following:

I lend an amount of money that would give me X amount of USD at the 0.107% i got. But instead getting X * 0.00107 = Y i get 84% of Y. Thats most probably the really HEFTY fee of 15% bitfinex is taking on swaps. Im not sure why it has to be that much.

But what i really dont like is that bitfinex is stealing my additional profit from users who pay back MY loan earlier. Those people have to pay the fee for the full day. I have to lend those coins out again and have work with it but bitfinex simply is taking that additionally paid fee for themselves. The credit i got clearly says so. And i think thats not ok. Its my money i lend and i have the additional work but i dont have anything from doing so. Its like i lend my money to bitfinex and not to other users. If i would lend my money to bitfinex then they could make such a rule but i lend to other users.

Am i wrong on this or is this unfair? First the high fee of 15% and then i lose completely the additional payments that users paid for my lent money.

Yes, swaps are explicitly only there to provide leverage in margin trading. What else exactly were you planning to do with the funds?

It has to be real money because it's going to go into trades with other users who might want some actual money in exchange, but it's "virtual" to prevent the swap recipient being able to run away with it. Similarly (in the sense that it's also to prevent losses) they're limited to borrowing only a multiple of the value of their deposit, and will be liquidated when necessary to pay off the swap.

The whole setup is designed to, as far as possible, guarantee that no funds will be lost by lenders. Or rather, by Bitfinex, since they've supposedly extended their "insurance" option to all swaps by default.

When i take a swap then it seems i dont have more money. For example i send $100 to trading (since it seems i only can take swaps with money that is there) and then i take a swap, then i only have this swap and a bit less than $100. I dont have the actual money anywhere.

So taking a swap doesnt give you actually the USD you loaned? Its only possible to use them for margin trading? If so then it would be a bit confusing. Giving loans you need actual real money, but taking loans only gives you something virtual.

That looks like what would happen if someone set an auto-renew at a super-low rate as a way to always hit the highest-rate demand, and then there was no demand for swaps of that duration.

Is someone trying to manipulate the FRR?

  Never even got the idea that could be something clickable and useful. Thanks!

There is a +/- located above the order book where you can zoom in/out

Thanks sukrim. I noticed that bitfinex now only has one decimal anymore on orderbook. Does that mean that further decimals are rounded completely or that they are shown rounded only? Wondering if a offer at a certain price will be eaten or if other bidders could use a slightly different decimal in order to get before my offer, without me seeing it.

The latter, that's why bots/autorenew/notifications come in handy.

Probably people with autorenew at fixed rates who are on holiday or so? It is up to every actor to choose how much return they actually want and also how much they are willing to pay... If you only want to earn 3%/year, you can do that too, even though it might be smarter to check first if someone offers to pay you more.

What happens when one offers a swap and its taken, then the loan is paid back earlier than the said timeframe... will the swap still run as if that didnt happen so that i dont notice that or would i need to offer those coins as a swap again?

I mean swaps run automatically for margin trading so i was wondering if there is automation too or if i should enable the notification so that i know when a number of my swaps ended earlier.

By the way... whats the story with swaps offered for half of the normal orderbook rate?

It just increases uncertainty which leads to even more people choosing FRR (if you don't know the proper price point, choose the average of existing prices).

Then again, maybe I'm wrong alltogether? I'd much rather see the new matching engine in prodiction though than being able to forward cheaper loans or get out earlier from existing ones.

The way I see it, that is an improvement. Also the short term rates would go up, and 30 day rates down.

It has been suggested multiple times, it won't really solve any problem imho and only clear the order books faster, leading to higher churn/turnover.

I have a suggestion regarding the swaps.

The issue: Borrowers mostly want 30 days, while many lenders prefer to lend shorter periods. Since the orderbook is shared, sometimes the bid/ask spread looks ...interesting.

A solution: Enable swaps trading. So, the same account could both borrow and lend, and would pay fees according to his net position. This would fix the spread, as it would become profitable to borrow short term (at a lower rate), and lend those very same funds for 30 days (at a higher rate). In this way, the swaps themselves would become a tradeable commodity. In the present situation they are only half way tradeable; you either borrow or lend, not both. Bitfinex would naturally need to ensure those swap term-arbitrageurs could cover their potential losses (i.e. the net position needs to be in proportion to the account's funds).

Bitfinex would benefit from the increased volume; short-term lenders would find a borrower quicker (while getting a better rate); long-term borrowers would find a lender quicker (getting a better rate, too). In general, the swaps market would work more smoothly.

Sorry if this idea has been presented before by someone else. I do not have time to read all those 278 pages.

He is a user of bitcointalk anyway, and, all in all, you don't need to know who the man is to thank him.

Neither... but yes, he's working for Bitfinex.