[OFFICIAL]Bitfinex.com first Bitcoin P2P lending platform for leverage trading - page 82.

camolist

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Quote from: bearproof on April 04, 2015, 02:25:52 PM

camolist you got that answer from support? it is very confusing and lacks of technical detail, there is nothing to "guess" about a source IP address, every connection comes with a source IP address and nothing need to be forwarded...
This is the first time happening to me in about a year, and if ppl start seeing successfull logins history from FOREIGN IP addresses this is absolutely normal to start worrying and flooding email support with questions.

yes and i agree

i'm not sure what to make of the reply was just sharing it as sent by their support

camolist

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Quote from: SebastianJu on April 05, 2015, 12:54:10 PM

Oh, you mean taking an FRR rate means that your taken swap constantly changes the daily rate? I did not think so. I thought its only for offering the swaps. When the swaps are taken then its a normal swap with the rate fixed for the rate it had when you took it.
Would be a strange setup if it works not that way.

it changes..hourly..

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Quote from: noggin-scratcher on April 04, 2015, 05:11:09 PM

Quote from: SebastianJu on April 04, 2015, 03:06:24 PM

I meant that there has to be two FRR rates. One for receive swap, one for offer swap. It sounded like you thought the option to use FRR rates for receive swap means that, when disabled, and chosing a rate that is higher than FRR on the swap offers orderbook, that you can clear this orderbook without taking the FRR-rate swaps.

Pretty sure FRR is always just one rate, for both offering and receiving funds. Or are you saying there ought to be two rates?

Problem would be that if you create a difference between the rate being paid and the rate being received, either Bitfinex would be stealing the difference (if the rate paid by traders is lower than the rate received by lenders) or there would be a shortfall in the funds collected and Bitfinex would have to pay to cover the difference and bring it up to the rate the lenders expect to receive (if the rate received is higher than the rate paid)

Hm... in that case its definitively a bug when FRR shows up on the swaps demand side. I saw them there often and was wondering why since the rates werent the way that they could be there.

Quote from: noggin-scratcher on April 04, 2015, 05:11:09 PM

Quote from: SebastianJu on April 04, 2015, 03:06:24 PM

I dont see a reason for that option existing. In fact its unfair to those offering at FRR. Why give them an disadvantage against normal orders? Is there a reason that explains this?

Fixed and variable rates aren't strictly comparable; you can't say with certainty that one is a "better rate" than the other because the variable rate could change at any time. A situation can be imagined where you would want to lock in a fixed rate that's slightly higher than the FRR at that moment, in case the FRR rises in the near future. That doesn't really explain why anyone would choose to take a 0.7% fixed rate over a 0.1% variable rate, but it does explain why the option exists to choose to not take variable-rate swaps.

Oh, you mean taking an FRR rate means that your taken swap constantly changes the daily rate? I did not think so. I thought its only for offering the swaps. When the swaps are taken then its a normal swap with the rate fixed for the rate it had when you took it.
Would be a strange setup if it works not that way.

davidgdg

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Quote from: Sukrim on April 05, 2015, 10:40:31 AM

You can check out the api for that info.

Thanks. How do I do that ?

Sukrim

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You can check out the api for that info.

davidgdg

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Whilst on the subject of FRR .....

When I offer funds on FRR my offer presumably goes into a queue. But there's no info on where I am in that queue. So it makes it incredibly difficult to know whether to make an immediate loan at fixed rates or stay in the FRR queue.

Eg there are currently 746 offers at FRR. How do I find out where I am in that list and thus how long it will take for my funds to be loaned out (and in the meantime it is dead money)

Why not make that info available to lenders so that they can judge whether to stick with FRR or offer fixed ?

noggin-scratcher

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Quote from: SebastianJu on April 04, 2015, 03:06:24 PM

I meant that there has to be two FRR rates. One for receive swap, one for offer swap. It sounded like you thought the option to use FRR rates for receive swap means that, when disabled, and chosing a rate that is higher than FRR on the swap offers orderbook, that you can clear this orderbook without taking the FRR-rate swaps.

Pretty sure FRR is always just one rate, for both offering and receiving funds. Or are you saying there ought to be two rates?

Problem would be that if you create a difference between the rate being paid and the rate being received, either Bitfinex would be stealing the difference (if the rate paid by traders is lower than the rate received by lenders) or there would be a shortfall in the funds collected and Bitfinex would have to pay to cover the difference and bring it up to the rate the lenders expect to receive (if the rate received is higher than the rate paid)

Quote from: SebastianJu on April 04, 2015, 03:06:24 PM

I dont see a reason for that option existing. In fact its unfair to those offering at FRR. Why give them an disadvantage against normal orders? Is there a reason that explains this?

Fixed and variable rates aren't strictly comparable; you can't say with certainty that one is a "better rate" than the other because the variable rate could change at any time. A situation can be imagined where you would want to lock in a fixed rate that's slightly higher than the FRR at that moment, in case the FRR rises in the near future. That doesn't really explain why anyone would choose to take a 0.7% fixed rate over a 0.1% variable rate, but it does explain why the option exists to choose to not take variable-rate swaps.

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Quote from: noggin-scratcher on April 04, 2015, 02:46:28 PM

Quote from: SebastianJu on April 04, 2015, 11:54:34 AM

Im not sure that this option means that you dont want FRR swaps. For me it means that you want to take swaps at FRR price and i think that FRR for receive swap is another percent value since it wouldnt make sense otherwise. So one would create an FRR at the FRR for actively given swaps on the green side. So probably something way below the 0.11%. It really would be strange if its another way. But when i think about it. Im sure it isnt that way. Most users dont even have this option checked i think and still the FRR wall is eaten a bit often.

I'm having real trouble figuring out what you mean here. For example, "one would create an FRR at the FRR for actively given swaps on the green side" is not a phrase that I'm able to parse.

I'm looking at the Margin Trade page, where there's a dropdown section titled "Margin available", which... doesn't seem to be entirely accurate, but attempts to say how much money is available for swaps. There's a checkbox labelled "Include variable rates?". I'm assuming that with that box ticked, FRR-swaps are included in the margin available for you to take from, and that with it unticked you'll instead only take swaps from fixed-rate offers.

Sorry for that. Tongue

I meant that there has to be two FRR rates. One for receive swap, one for offer swap. It sounded like you thought the option to use FRR rates for receive swap means that, when disabled, and chosing a rate that is higher than FRR on the swap offers orderbook, that you can clear this orderbook without taking the FRR-rate swaps.

But i see now what you mean. With include variable rates? one can circumvent the FRR-wall.

I dont see a reason for that option existing. In fact its unfair to those offering at FRR. Why give them an disadvantage against normal orders? Is there a reason that explains this?

Quote from: bearproof on April 04, 2015, 02:25:52 PM

Quote from: camolist on April 04, 2015, 02:11:54 PM

simple email to support would answer this

"The IP address belongs to Incapsula, which is our DDoS protection service.

As Incapsula acts as a proxy for Bitfinex, it means that we have to be relying on extra information from your connection to "guess" the IP address. If for some reasons the network you used or the browser you used did not forward any of that information, the Incapsula IP can appear in lieu of your real IP.

I fully understand your concern. You experienced the affects of a DDoS attempt, though very annoying, no real bug. "

camolist you got that answer from support? it is very confusing and lacks of technical detail, there is nothing to "guess" about a source IP address, every connection comes with a source IP address and nothing need to be forwarded...
This is the first time happening to me in about a year, and if ppl start seeing successfull logins history from FOREIGN IP addresses this is absolutely normal to start worrying and flooding email support with questions.

I wonder too what that answer means. I mean i always use the same browser. Its not possible that from this ip a ddos came in so my ip should always be the same. And i doubt that camolist is used as a proxy and they log in with my login details so that their IP is shown when they forward my login details. Would be a bit weird that way.

I havent seen such IP-login-stat with other exchanges too.

noggin-scratcher

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Quote from: SebastianJu on April 04, 2015, 11:54:34 AM

Im not sure that this option means that you dont want FRR swaps. For me it means that you want to take swaps at FRR price and i think that FRR for receive swap is another percent value since it wouldnt make sense otherwise. So one would create an FRR at the FRR for actively given swaps on the green side. So probably something way below the 0.11%. It really would be strange if its another way. But when i think about it. Im sure it isnt that way. Most users dont even have this option checked i think and still the FRR wall is eaten a bit often.

I'm having real trouble figuring out what you mean here. For example, "one would create an FRR at the FRR for actively given swaps on the green side" is not a phrase that I'm able to parse.

I'm looking at the Margin Trade page, where there's a dropdown section titled "Margin available", which... doesn't seem to be entirely accurate, but attempts to say how much money is available for swaps. There's a checkbox labelled "Include variable rates?". I'm assuming that with that box ticked, FRR-swaps are included in the margin available for you to take from, and that with it unticked you'll instead only take swaps from fixed-rate offers.

bearproof

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Quote from: camolist on April 04, 2015, 02:11:54 PM

simple email to support would answer this

"The IP address belongs to Incapsula, which is our DDoS protection service.

As Incapsula acts as a proxy for Bitfinex, it means that we have to be relying on extra information from your connection to "guess" the IP address. If for some reasons the network you used or the browser you used did not forward any of that information, the Incapsula IP can appear in lieu of your real IP.

I fully understand your concern. You experienced the affects of a DDoS attempt, though very annoying, no real bug. "

camolist you got that answer from support? it is very confusing and lacks of technical detail, there is nothing to "guess" about a source IP address, every connection comes with a source IP address and nothing need to be forwarded...
This is the first time happening to me in about a year, and if ppl start seeing successfull logins history from FOREIGN IP addresses this is absolutely normal to start worrying and flooding email support with questions.

camolist

hero member

Activity: 896

Merit: 1000

Quote from: bearproof on April 04, 2015, 01:41:41 PM

Quote from: SebastianJu on April 04, 2015, 11:38:25 AM

Yes, i have a similar behaviour. Im logged in but when i click a link i get a blank page. Reloading again i have to relogin. And when i did so then it start again after i clicked the first link inside.

This worries me. I hope its not that my account is safe because of 2FA but others arent. If enough other accounts were hacked successfully then my funds would be missing too. I really hope everything is fine.

Staff?

Edit: And yes i see IPs logged in that werent mine? GUYS?

Now i see that i logged in 18:29 with my correct ip and ten minutes later with a different one. Though im still logged in. I run MarginBot so i thought it might be that but its different IPs and my server has a fixed one that doesnt show up as far as i see.

I hope all is well but if something strange is going on i would suggest make sure funds are safe.

Ok you experienced exactly the same as me, by any chance the IP you see on logins history is "198.143.41.97" ? I already opened a ticket with them by emailing support, hope this is a bug on their system and this is not hackers... I will post some news if I figure out simething else...

simple email to support would answer this

"The IP address belongs to Incapsula, which is our DDoS protection service.

As Incapsula acts as a proxy for Bitfinex, it means that we have to be relying on extra information from your connection to "guess" the IP address. If for some reasons the network you used or the browser you used did not forward any of that information, the Incapsula IP can appear in lieu of your real IP.

I fully understand your concern. You experienced the affects of a DDoS attempt, though very annoying, no real bug. "

SebastianJu

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Quote from: bearproof on April 04, 2015, 01:41:41 PM

Quote from: SebastianJu on April 04, 2015, 11:38:25 AM

Yes, i have a similar behaviour. Im logged in but when i click a link i get a blank page. Reloading again i have to relogin. And when i did so then it start again after i clicked the first link inside.

This worries me. I hope its not that my account is safe because of 2FA but others arent. If enough other accounts were hacked successfully then my funds would be missing too. I really hope everything is fine.

Staff?

Edit: And yes i see IPs logged in that werent mine? GUYS?

Now i see that i logged in 18:29 with my correct ip and ten minutes later with a different one. Though im still logged in. I run MarginBot so i thought it might be that but its different IPs and my server has a fixed one that doesnt show up as far as i see.

I hope all is well but if something strange is going on i would suggest make sure funds are safe.

Ok you experienced exactly the same as me, by any chance the IP you see on logins history is "198.143.41.97" ? I already opened a ticket with them by emailing support, hope this is a bug on their system and this is not hackers... I will post some news if I figure out simething else...

Its not that ip but others i dont know. I think its a good guess that a hacker is using tornodes or other proxies. So i think the ips would be different all the time.

But it stopped now. I dont know why. Did bitfinex act or the hacker wasnt successful. Anyway... seeing these logs saying these ip successfully logged in doesnt make me feel safe.

Though when i see my past logs i see that there are many different ips. My provider gives me a semi non dynamic IP, so for long times i should have the same ip. And if it changes it should be in the same ip area. So im wondering what these ips mean.

Maybe im worried too much but i think being worried because of such thing is smart since there are enough exchanges that died already.

bearproof

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Quote from: SebastianJu on April 04, 2015, 11:38:25 AM

Yes, i have a similar behaviour. Im logged in but when i click a link i get a blank page. Reloading again i have to relogin. And when i did so then it start again after i clicked the first link inside.

This worries me. I hope its not that my account is safe because of 2FA but others arent. If enough other accounts were hacked successfully then my funds would be missing too. I really hope everything is fine.

Staff?

Edit: And yes i see IPs logged in that werent mine? GUYS?

Now i see that i logged in 18:29 with my correct ip and ten minutes later with a different one. Though im still logged in. I run MarginBot so i thought it might be that but its different IPs and my server has a fixed one that doesnt show up as far as i see.

I hope all is well but if something strange is going on i would suggest make sure funds are safe.

Ok you experienced exactly the same as me, by any chance the IP you see on logins history is "198.143.41.97" ? I already opened a ticket with them by emailing support, hope this is a bug on their system and this is not hackers... I will post some news if I figure out simething else...

SebastianJu

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Quote from: noggin-scratcher on April 03, 2015, 08:41:45 PM

Quote from: SebastianJu on April 02, 2015, 03:49:54 PM

I dont understand what you mean with tunneling. Either FRR is eaten up by 6 figues + or not. But i dont see how it could get tunneled normally.

When taking a swap you can choose whether you want your demand to be matched with variable-rate swap offers or not. Which makes sense as a feature to have, because "FRR, currently 0.1%" isn't necessarily better than, say, a fixed-rate swap at 0.11%, if you expect the going rate to rise. But when someone specifies a demand for a massive amount of swap with "Don't take variable-rate swaps" checked, they can sweep out all the fixed-rate offers up to 0.75% without touching the FRR wall at all.

Possible motivation for doing so... I guess it could be an attempt to push up the flash rate. If so, it is at least a "gentler" way of moving the going rate than the old game of "It grinds slowly down for months until at 0.02% the whole FRR wall goes at once, and then the going rate jumps dramatically up to 0.75% until the wall is rebuilt"

Quote from: Sukrim on April 02, 2015, 03:54:53 PM

By the way (as someone who has already lent out money at Bitfinex at rates far beyond 1%/day historically): Even if you manage to get a 0.6%/day 30d loan out there, don't expect it to last any substantial amount of time.

Mostly very true - they don't last long. But if you happen to have funds repaid at the right moment it can still be worth trying to catch the spikes. I've had the rare/occasional swap last a lot longer than expected at a high rate (at least one that's still going after 2 weeks). My guess is that they're small enough quantities that the high rate passes unnoticed because the total fee remains low.

Im not sure that this option means that you dont want FRR swaps. For me it means that you want to take swaps at FRR price and i think that FRR for receive swap is another percent value since it wouldnt make sense otherwise. So one would create an FRR at the FRR for actively given swaps on the green side. So probably something way below the 0.11%. It really would be strange if its another way. But when i think about it. Im sure it isnt that way. Most users dont even have this option checked i think and still the FRR wall is eaten a bit often.

Might be wrong though. Staff?

Edit: Oh, and yes... i think most users dont care about the rate of swaps they automatically took. Its simply mostly in the same area.

SebastianJu

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Quote from: bearproof on April 03, 2015, 04:01:36 PM

Today I experienced some strange behaviour with Bitfinex web site, screen went blank everytime a page was requested, I logued out, and logued in again after about 30 mins, and all started working ok again.
Then I went to account security / logins history and found two successfull login from an IP that it was not me, IP was from another country.
I think nothing was stolen from my account because I have two factor authentication, but I'm worried about this.
Anyone experiences something similar?, ofc I already changed my account password, but I should have some device compromised or this is some bug at Bitfinex Huh

the password was impossible to guess btw...

Yes, i have a similar behaviour. Im logged in but when i click a link i get a blank page. Reloading again i have to relogin. And when i did so then it start again after i clicked the first link inside.

This worries me. I hope its not that my account is safe because of 2FA but others arent. If enough other accounts were hacked successfully then my funds would be missing too. I really hope everything is fine.

Staff?

Edit: And yes i see IPs logged in that werent mine? GUYS?

Now i see that i logged in 18:29 with my correct ip and ten minutes later with a different one. Though im still logged in. I run MarginBot so i thought it might be that but its different IPs and my server has a fixed one that doesnt show up as far as i see.

I hope all is well but if something strange is going on i would suggest make sure funds are safe.

noggin-scratcher

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Quote from: SebastianJu on April 02, 2015, 03:49:54 PM

I dont understand what you mean with tunneling. Either FRR is eaten up by 6 figues + or not. But i dont see how it could get tunneled normally.

When taking a swap you can choose whether you want your demand to be matched with variable-rate swap offers or not. Which makes sense as a feature to have, because "FRR, currently 0.1%" isn't necessarily better than, say, a fixed-rate swap at 0.11%, if you expect the going rate to rise. But when someone specifies a demand for a massive amount of swap with "Don't take variable-rate swaps" checked, they can sweep out all the fixed-rate offers up to 0.75% without touching the FRR wall at all.

Possible motivation for doing so... I guess it could be an attempt to push up the flash rate. If so, it is at least a "gentler" way of moving the going rate than the old game of "It grinds slowly down for months until at 0.02% the whole FRR wall goes at once, and then the going rate jumps dramatically up to 0.75% until the wall is rebuilt"

Quote from: Sukrim on April 02, 2015, 03:54:53 PM

By the way (as someone who has already lent out money at Bitfinex at rates far beyond 1%/day historically): Even if you manage to get a 0.6%/day 30d loan out there, don't expect it to last any substantial amount of time.

Mostly very true - they don't last long. But if you happen to have funds repaid at the right moment it can still be worth trying to catch the spikes. I've had the rare/occasional swap last a lot longer than expected at a high rate (at least one that's still going after 2 weeks). My guess is that they're small enough quantities that the high rate passes unnoticed because the total fee remains low.

bearproof

newbie

Activity: 11

Merit: 0

Today I experienced some strange behaviour with Bitfinex web site, screen went blank everytime a page was requested, I logued out, and logued in again after about 30 mins, and all started working ok again.
Then I went to account security / logins history and found two successfull login from an IP that it was not me, IP was from another country.
I think nothing was stolen from my account because I have two factor authentication, but I'm worried about this.
Anyone experiences something similar?, ofc I already changed my account password, but I should have some device compromised or this is some bug at Bitfinex Huh

the password was impossible to guess btw...

SebastianJu

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Quote from: Sukrim on April 02, 2015, 03:54:53 PM

By the way (as someone who has already lent out money at Bitfinex at rates far beyond 1%/day historically): Even if you manage to get a 0.6%/day 30d loan out there, don't expect it to last any substantial amount of time.

Too bad, i really thought it might be worth to check out if its worth to wait for these things happen. I mean normal traders most probably dont check the swap rates they got when margin trade.

I guess the best thing is still to relatively fast get your money lent out for 2 days for a rate before FRR-Wall.

Sukrim

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Quote from: DoubleSwapper on April 02, 2015, 03:24:36 PM

Quote from: Sukrim on April 02, 2015, 02:25:54 PM

People can either take a fixed rate or flexible rate. FRR historically has spiked due to manipulation and wiped out a lot of positions, hence the setting to allow traders to either consider FRR and take the risk of a spike or not.

FRR has spiked? lol. It went from 0.02 to 0.1

I said historically, I use Bitfinex probably a lot longer than you do.

On one hand people complain about FRR and then again you complain now that FRR is not forced onto people (it is a VERY risky thing to hold FRR loans!) or that some traders rather prefer a fixed rate loan...

By the way (as someone who has already lent out money at Bitfinex at rates far beyond 1%/day historically): Even if you manage to get a 0.6%/day 30d loan out there, don't expect it to last any substantial amount of time.

SebastianJu

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Quote from: DoubleSwapper on April 02, 2015, 03:44:49 PM

Of course it happens as I have shown with the screenshot. It's happening right now and nobody cares. You can also look it up on bfxdata. Seemingly because suddenly people (god knows why, it never happened before 1.5 months ago) order large amounts of money (6 figures+ multiple times) and don't include "variable" rate" to be taken which cleans the order book behind the FRR but leaves it intact. Tunneling like that should not be possible, it messes up the order book, ruins any predictability and further kills liquidity.

I checked bfxdata but they only have a volume weighted graph. But even this shows rates of 0.22. Impossible with FFR before it. So either FRR wall vanished because of some bug for some time or the FRR rate was calculated wrong for a moment. Maybe FRR showed up on the wrong side of orderbook only.

I dont understand what you mean with tunneling. Either FRR is eaten up by 6 figues + or not. But i dont see how it could get tunneled normally.

Topic: [OFFICIAL]Bitfinex.com first Bitcoin P2P lending platform for leverage trading - page 82. (Read 723903 times)