[**OPEN**]R2B:HashFast + Host, Dbl. HashRate Upgrade, $43, 10-13GH/s MPP - page 4.

aneutronic

full member

Activity: 175

Merit: 100

Quote from: philipma1957 on December 24, 2013, 07:24:22 AM

if you paid 155 in sept and get back 155 now. the legal system will say your losses are zip. unfortunately we both know your btc loss would be about 1 btc then and about .25 btc now. or a loss of .75btc.

for all those that live in the world of btc roi this would be a nice court case to win.
suing for btc restoration vs usd and winning would go a long way to making btc a fiat and not a "stock" right now btc is more like a stock then a fiat.

I would love to watch this go to a court room. but if I get an offer for usd back and I break even in usd I would sign any waiver just to get my usd restored.

Good points.
From my POV they defrauded us through deceptive advertising and guarantees to spend BTC I had in savings and admittedly shouldn't have touched.
Except they promised to refund in BTC if they missed their delivery date so I plan to hold their feet to the fire and will join with others in suing the scammers.

This gives me hope:
http://blogs.wsj.com/moneybeat/2013/11/07/judge-orders-coinlab-to-pay-up-in-bitcoin/

And an article for the customers from Canada (xpost cuz I'm lazy Tongue

):
https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.4124052

philipma1957

legendary

Activity: 4326

Merit: 8950

'The right to privacy matters'

Quote from: aneutronic on December 24, 2013, 04:36:55 AM

Quote from: DyslexicZombei on December 24, 2013, 02:33:00 AM

Quote from: Bakal on December 23, 2013, 11:48:29 PM

^ I think DZ can answer this question for us. DZ will always protect his coop members against scammers.

Thank you Bakal for the kind comments.

I don't know if I can always protect co-op members from scammers, but we try our very best to *not* order from known scammers and companies with previous reputations of abusing fellow miners (including the 2 companies permabanned from our co-op).

I hope you're adding HF to that list after this.

Quote

Unfortunately, it looks like if there's a refund, and if it's in BTC, it will be in BTC of the adjusted amount today: meaning if you bought a R2A share for $155 (or so), if HF refunds it'll be the BTC equivalent of $155 now, and not our original BTC.

The reason being: HF has almost certainly converted our BTC to fiat in the course of business.

Disheartening, but hopefully not a total loss.

Pretty close to a total loss if we accept their bullshit edited terms. Not many of their batch 1 customers are willing to accept that (myself included) and will sue the scamming liars. I have been following their thread and I know hindsight is always 20-20 but going back through it now it's pretty apparent that they never had the ability to deliver what they promised timewise or powerwise. I should have known better than to trust any company owned/operated by marketeers.
Angry

*FU Edward Bernays* Angry

if you paid 155 in sept and get back 155 now. the legal system will say your losses are zip. unfortunately we both know your btc loss would be about 1 btc then and about .25 btc now. or a loss of .75btc.

for all those that live in the world of btc roi this would be a nice court case to win.
suing for btc restoration vs usd and winning would go a long way to making btc a fiat and not a "stock" right now btc is more like a stock then a fiat.

I would love to watch this go to a court room. but if I get an offer for usd back and I break even in usd I would sign any waiver just to get my usd restored.

aneutronic

full member

Activity: 175

Merit: 100

I'm not sure, DZ will have to answer this.

abuelau

hero member

Activity: 750

Merit: 500

www.coinschedule.com

Quote from: aneutronic on December 24, 2013, 04:36:55 AM

Quote from: DyslexicZombei on December 24, 2013, 02:33:00 AM

Quote from: Bakal on December 23, 2013, 11:48:29 PM

^ I think DZ can answer this question for us. DZ will always protect his coop members against scammers.

Thank you Bakal for the kind comments.

I don't know if I can always protect co-op members from scammers, but we try our very best to *not* order from known scammers and companies with previous reputations of abusing fellow miners (including the 2 companies permabanned from our co-op).

I hope you're adding HF to that list after this.

Quote

Unfortunately, it looks like if there's a refund, and if it's in BTC, it will be in BTC of the adjusted amount today: meaning if you bought a R2A share for $155 (or so), if HF refunds it'll be the BTC equivalent of $155 now, and not our original BTC.

The reason being: HF has almost certainly converted our BTC to fiat in the course of business.

Disheartening, but hopefully not a total loss.

Pretty close to a total loss if we accept their bullshit edited terms. Not many of their batch 1 customers are willing to accept that (myself included) and will sue the scamming liars. I have been following their thread and I know hindsight is always 20-20 but going back through it now it's pretty apparent that they never had the ability to deliver what they promised timewise or powerwise. I should have known better than to trust any company owned/operated by marketeers.
Angry

*FU Edward Bernays* Angry

Are both R1 and R2 in the same Hashfast batch?

aneutronic

full member

Activity: 175

Merit: 100

Quote from: DyslexicZombei on December 24, 2013, 02:33:00 AM

Quote from: Bakal on December 23, 2013, 11:48:29 PM

^ I think DZ can answer this question for us. DZ will always protect his coop members against scammers.

Thank you Bakal for the kind comments.

I don't know if I can always protect co-op members from scammers, but we try our very best to *not* order from known scammers and companies with previous reputations of abusing fellow miners (including the 2 companies permabanned from our co-op).

I hope you're adding HF to that list after this.

Quote

Unfortunately, it looks like if there's a refund, and if it's in BTC, it will be in BTC of the adjusted amount today: meaning if you bought a R2A share for $155 (or so), if HF refunds it'll be the BTC equivalent of $155 now, and not our original BTC.

The reason being: HF has almost certainly converted our BTC to fiat in the course of business.

Disheartening, but hopefully not a total loss.

Pretty close to a total loss if we accept their bullshit edited terms. Not many of their batch 1 customers are willing to accept that (myself included) and will sue the scamming liars. I have been following their thread and I know hindsight is always 20-20 but going back through it now it's pretty apparent that they never had the ability to deliver what they promised timewise or powerwise. I should have known better than to trust any company owned/operated by marketeers.
Angry

*FU Edward Bernays* Angry

DyslexicZombei

sr. member

Activity: 364

Merit: 250

Quote from: Bakal on December 23, 2013, 11:48:29 PM

^ I think DZ can answer this question for us. DZ will always protect his coop members against scammers.

Thank you Bakal for the kind comments.

I don't know if I can always protect co-op members from scammers, but we try our very best to *not* order from known scammers and companies with previous reputations of abusing fellow miners (including the 2 companies permabanned from our co-op).

Unfortunately, it looks like if there's a refund, and if it's in BTC, it will be in BTC of the adjusted amount today: meaning if you bought a R2A share for $155 (or so), if HF refunds it'll be the BTC equivalent of $155 now, and not our original BTC.

The reason being: HF has almost certainly converted our BTC to fiat in the course of business.

Disheartening, but hopefully not a total loss.

Bakal

sr. member

Activity: 245

Merit: 250

^ I think DZ can answer this question for us. DZ will always protect his coop members against scammers.

abdullahadam

sr. member

Activity: 285

Merit: 250

Quote from: Bakal on December 23, 2013, 08:03:41 PM

Merry Christmas Guys and Gals.

Lets wish that this HashLate will not deliver this year. So we can get our refunds in BTC.

this thing (ie. HashLate) is starting to be like avalongate, all PR BS.

I thought the deal on their site said refund in usd equivalent to the amount paid at the time of purchase?

Bakal

sr. member

Activity: 245

Merit: 250

Merry Christmas Guys and Gals.

Lets wish that this HashLate will not deliver this year. So we can get our refunds in BTC.

this thing (ie. HashLate) is starting to be like avalongate, all PR BS.

aneutronic

full member

Activity: 175

Merit: 100

I believe our GB purchase was originally purchased on the first day and the Dec 31 date was not in that TOS.
And they also said they would refund your BTC if not delivered in time.

https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.3643021

A great post with a collection of HF BS promises.

https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.3635117

I want a refund on my own VaporJet purchase.
I considered a guarantee in writing of enough hashrate when delivered to just break even but given their ability to bullshit I don't think it would be worth anything.
I don't consider myself greedy and I don't give a fuck about ROI, I just want to break even in BTC and don't want another huge loss like I have with avalon.

btw I did email support Nov 11 for a refund and no reply yet.

jungle_dave

full member

Activity: 200

Merit: 100

Hi DZ,

Thats what I got from the TOS as well.
As we never got a majority vote either way on the subject the best we all can do is hold tight until Dec. 31.
If nobody else noticed the BTC price lately its not bad. Lets just hope it stays that way and Hashfast delivers. I personally hope they do as they started off so well.

DyslexicZombei

sr. member

Activity: 364

Merit: 250

Hey Dave!

WRT to possible refunds - Last I checked a few days ago on the HF thread: they were denying refunds per their ToS.

If there is a refund, their ToS states that refunds will *not* be until after Dec. 31.

The sentiment seems to be almost universal in R1-4 to seek a refund if it is available.

jungle_dave

full member

Activity: 200

Merit: 100

Quote from: philipma1957 on November 07, 2013, 01:10:50 PM

Quote from: DyslexicZombei on November 07, 2013, 03:18:40 AM

Votes noted. Thank you gents.

I said this in the other thread, but for buyers that paid BTC (like us), if there's a refund, BTC buyers better be getting BTC back, because anything else is just not right.

while I agree in principle . I would be willing to my money in usd. better to get breakeven then get 0.

I did buy 1 not buy 2. but 100 % refund in usd is better then 0% refund in btc.

I know that in btc it would be 2x close to 2.75x as it would be in cash.

I would even be happy to find middle ground with them. as we would all get a profit that way in USD terms.

philipma1957 I like your thinking

That would be great but in the end I too would be happy to get back what we put in at the time.
Its really too bad but these things happen and we all knew the risks.
Personally I don't think they are going to pull a BFL with us but it could be some time before we see refund.
Has anyone been able to contact them yet?

philipma1957

legendary

Activity: 4326

Merit: 8950

'The right to privacy matters'

Quote from: DyslexicZombei on November 07, 2013, 03:18:40 AM

Votes noted. Thank you gents.

I said this in the other thread, but for buyers that paid BTC (like us), if there's a refund, BTC buyers better be getting BTC back, because anything else is just not right.

while I agree in principle . I would be willing to my money in usd. better to get breakeven then get 0.

I did buy 1 not buy 2. but 100 % refund in usd is better then 0% refund in btc.

I know that in btc it would be 2x close to 2.75x as it would be in cash.

I would even be happy to find middle ground with them. as we would all get a profit that way in USD terms.

DyslexicZombei

sr. member

Activity: 364

Merit: 250

Votes noted. Thank you gents.

I said this in the other thread, but for buyers that paid BTC (like us), if there's a refund, BTC buyers better be getting BTC back, because anything else is just not right.

baros008

member

Activity: 78

Merit: 10

Thursday morning here, no news -------> I vote for refund.

philipma1957

legendary

Activity: 4326

Merit: 8950

'The right to privacy matters'

Quote from: aneutronic on November 06, 2013, 12:41:18 PM

Quote from: mrm0 on November 06, 2013, 08:38:16 AM

Quote from: jungle_dave on November 06, 2013, 08:03:06 AM

Quote from: -Redacted- on November 04, 2013, 03:02:36 PM

If they are talking weeks worth of delay, about all you can assume is that their chip failed. I'd be wanting to take any refund offered just as soon as it was offered.

Well, no update or even a PR statement, this is disrespectful to the customers, sorry I mean R&D investors at this point.
This sucks!
Lets get this sorted with a vote , my vote is refund.

+1

Silence speaks volumes.

Voting for refund.

I vote refund also, it's been 2 days since they were supposed make an announcement and nothing.

This is bullshit!

yeah they may be a new bfl

aneutronic

full member

Activity: 175

Merit: 100

Quote from: mrm0 on November 06, 2013, 08:38:16 AM

Quote from: jungle_dave on November 06, 2013, 08:03:06 AM

Quote from: -Redacted- on November 04, 2013, 03:02:36 PM

If they are talking weeks worth of delay, about all you can assume is that their chip failed. I'd be wanting to take any refund offered just as soon as it was offered.

Well, no update or even a PR statement, this is disrespectful to the customers, sorry I mean R&D investors at this point.
This sucks!
Lets get this sorted with a vote , my vote is refund.

+1

Silence speaks volumes.

Voting for refund.

I vote refund also, it's been 2 days since they were supposed make an announcement and nothing.

This is bullshit!

mrm0

member

Activity: 89

Merit: 10

Quote from: jungle_dave on November 06, 2013, 08:03:06 AM

Quote from: -Redacted- on November 04, 2013, 03:02:36 PM

If they are talking weeks worth of delay, about all you can assume is that their chip failed. I'd be wanting to take any refund offered just as soon as it was offered.

Well, no update or even a PR statement, this is disrespectful to the customers, sorry I mean R&D investors at this point.
This sucks!
Lets get this sorted with a vote , my vote is refund.

+1

Silence speaks volumes.

Voting for refund.

jungle_dave

full member

Activity: 200

Merit: 100

Quote from: -Redacted- on November 04, 2013, 03:02:36 PM

If they are talking weeks worth of delay, about all you can assume is that their chip failed. I'd be wanting to take any refund offered just as soon as it was offered.

Well, no update or even a PR statement, this is disrespectful to the customers, sorry I mean R&D investors at this point.
This sucks!
Lets get this sorted with a vote , my vote is refund.

Topic: [**OPEN**]R2B:HashFast + Host, Dbl. HashRate Upgrade, $43, 10-13GH/s MPP - page 4. (Read 35765 times)

Topic: [OPEN]R2B:HashFast + Host, Dbl. HashRate Upgrade, $43, 10-13GH/s MPP - page 4. (Read 35765 times)