Topic: PhoenixMiner 6.2c: fastest Ethereum/Ethash miner with lowest devfee (Win/Linux) - page 95. (Read 784985 times)
March 09, 2021, 03:10:16 AM
Pretty obvious - boycott NiceHack and support the professional outfit PM. Spread the word
March 09, 2021, 02:37:21 AM
This post was duplicated here because the direct link to this post didn't work (probably because of its excessive size). If this is against the rules, apologies to the mods.
Here are our thoughts about the whole debacle with MEGA terminating our account (and the accounts of many other miner developers), and NiceHash's "overreaction", which we now believe was a deliberate smear campaign, and perhaps something even more malicious.
We will post here some relevant private messages between us and representatives of NiceHash over the past several months. There was some internal debate if this is the right thing to do, but after some thought we decided that we can not stay silent when someone is trying to tarnish our reputation. The only changes in the messages bellow were to remove any personally identifiable information (names, etc.).
Timeline
The story begins last November, when a NiceHash representative tried to persuade us to sign our binaries with code singing certificate:
The signing of our files would involve revealing our identities, which is something we are reluctant to do because of the reasons outlined in our response to their message:
We will only add that the sudden disappearance of Clyamore some time ago had really spooked us ("are we next?"), especially given that the one of the last versions of his miner contained digitally signed Windows driver, which implies that he had to reveal his identity to the signing authority. This may be coincidence, but we are not willing to gamble with our lives, and the safety of our families by ignoring the risks. In the end, we decided to continue developing PhoenixMiner but with strict measures to keep our identities private.
March 7th
Now let's jump to the present. Some time last weekend MEGA decided to delete our account, as well as accounts of many other miner developers. We don't know the reasons but our best guess is that probably someone complained, or even threatened them with lawsuits. Whatever the reason, there are alternatives, and it seems that they didn't do anything evil like replacing the binaries with something malicious, so while inconvenient, this was not a big deal. Unfortunately, we were offline at the time and couldn't react fast enough.
When we found out about the situation, we checked our messages. Among all well wishes, anxious questions, some death threats (yep, we got some of those), there was this quite normal and reasonable message from Nicehash:
We didn't know that much about the situation yet but we already established that none of our accounts were compromised, so we reassured them that while our MEGA account was deleted, we are not hacked in any way:
Our first task was to remove the MEGA link in the first post in our thread, and post a message clarifying the situation, and providing checksums of the individual executable files in PhoenixMiner 5.5c archive, in case someone was trying to check if his copy of the miner is genuine. Then we created a github account and uploaded the latest version of PhoenixMiner there.
In the meantime we received this message from one of higher-ups of Nicehash (apologies, if we get his title incorrect but he did not find it necessary to introduce himself, probably assuming that everyone should know who he is):
So, beneath some genuine sounding apologies, we find another attempt to find out our real identities. Despite the polite tone of the message, its contents can be translated to: "We asked you nicely before and you refused, so if you want us to retract our FUD post about your miner, you must reveal your identity to me." Well, we don't react well to threats, even polite ones, so our response was:
After that we checked out more closely the NiceHash website, and their Reddit page, and we found that rather than a mere FUD post, they have created a full-blown smear campaign, with some gems like a "spontaneous" post (with nearly 5000 words!) sanctioned by NiceHash themselves, which warns you not only against the dangers of using PhoenixMiner but why you shouldn't use any other miner, besides the official miner of Nicehash. Frankly, we were half-expecting to find warnings that prolonged use of PhoenixMiner can lead to Covid-19, balding, or erectile dysfunction. At the end of this "work of art", there was this "promise":
Still waiting for that apology. Not holding our breaths though.
Our next order of business was to find some way to prove to all concerned miners that our bitcointalk.org account is not compromised. This was a bit tricky but we finally settled on making a big ETH transaction out of our main devfee wallet, and announcing the exact amount of the ETH to be transferred beforehand in our bitcointalk.org thread. As we all keep only parts of the keys for the devfee accounts, and we don't live at the same place, this took some time. In the meantime, we received another message, with quite different tone:
So, going from apologizing, to practically accusing us of being criminals almost mid-sentence? Mind you, we are not angels, but the worst things we are guilty of include a number of speeding tickets, and one citation for disorderly conduct after a night of heavy drinking
Another curious thing is that there is a well-known and publicized association of some high-caliber NiceHash employee (perhaps former?) with ... botnet creation! At least have the decency to fabricate some other crime, instead of accusing us of your own past wrongdoings.
The last part of this message however is rather interesting - "even if you are connected with a crime somehow and this is the reason to stay anonymous, why not create a second miner, as a legal business - a miner that you could sign and distribute without any worries for end users?" So, our imaginary criminal activity wouldn't be a problem for them as long as we create another, properly signed miner?!
At this point we were frankly fed up, and we decided that any further communication with NiceHash is pointless. After that there were several exchanges with wild allegations and counter-allegations between djeZo and (apparently) former member of NiceHash. Hopefully none of what was written there was true but the bad taste remains. Thankfully most of the messages were deleted by their authors, but not before destroying their credibility even further. A couple of hours after that we received this final message:
Perhaps you should have consulted your lawyers before making unfounded allegations?
Some time after that we have finally got our private keys together, and performed the "verifying" transaction of 123.456 ETH out of our main devfee wallet as detailed here: thread https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=2647654.msg56518728#msg56518728
So, what exactly happened?
This is pure speculation at this point but given all the information before, we can think of two scenarios: best and worst. The truth is probably somewhere between them.
Best case scenario: NiceHash were not especially concerned when our MEGA accounts were deleted, but instead saw this as an opportunity to start smear campaign against us, hoping that their users will stop using our miner, and switch to theirs instead. They were probably encouraged by the fact that we weren't online for more than a month, and hoped that we would just disappear like Claymore before, and they would be able to spew whatever BS they want without any opposition from us. When we surfaced online, they first panicked that we may somehow prevent our users from mining on NiceHash as retaliation. A couple hours later, when they saw no such retaliation, the tone of djeZo messages quickly switched from apologetic to confrontational. At that point, they probably decided to just go all in, and continue spewing BS "because we can't be sure about PhoenixMiner's identity".
Worst case scenario: The whole MEGA mining software purge was initiated by complains and take down notices from NiceHash themselves. After that, this scenario is pretty much identical to the one above. However, the burning desire of NiceHash to reveal our identities, even if it is only to them, is quite disturbing. Maybe they just want to dug up some dirt on us (good luck with that!), but maybe they want to do something much more sinister.
Ok, but how can we trust PhoenixMiner?
We can't give you indisputable "proof of trust" because there is no such thing. However there are other things that you can consider:
Final thoughts
The whole thing is quite extraordinary because due to the nature of our business, we had some dealings with all major pools. In every single case, we found them to be totally reasonable, professional, and reliable (even when we were newbies and messed up in the beginning). Even when we had some disagreements, everything was solved in respectful and constructive manner. We never promoted, or badmouthed any pool because we feel that we must be impartial in order to develop good mining software. However, after only a couple of months that we had contact with NiceHash, we are frankly just fed up with them.
Still, we won't tell you to stop using NiceHash - it's not our place to do so, and everyone can decide for themselves. However, we personally wouldn't want to be associated with them in any way. Our advice is to be very cautious when dealing with them, withdraw your earnings as soon as possible, monitor your miner performance, and so on. We wouldn't put it beside them to start banning you, or creating some fake issues when you mine on their pool with PhoenixMiner.
After this colossal waste of everyone's time, we hope that this issue is behind us.
Edited for spelling and clarity
Here are our thoughts about the whole debacle with MEGA terminating our account (and the accounts of many other miner developers), and NiceHash's "overreaction", which we now believe was a deliberate smear campaign, and perhaps something even more malicious.
We will post here some relevant private messages between us and representatives of NiceHash over the past several months. There was some internal debate if this is the right thing to do, but after some thought we decided that we can not stay silent when someone is trying to tarnish our reputation. The only changes in the messages bellow were to remove any personally identifiable information (names, etc.).
Timeline
The story begins last November, when a NiceHash representative tried to persuade us to sign our binaries with code singing certificate:
Quote
NiceHash representative on Fri, Nov 27, 2020, 11:20 AM
Hello!
We would request that you code sign your releases of the binaries (*.exe's and *.dll's) you own. If possible please choose a globally accepted CA authority of your choice. If this is something you are not inclined to do please inform us why and what your concerns might be?
Code signing would reduce AV detection and would increase users' confidence in the software and of course, would increase our confidence that we are shipping correct binaries.
Note, that we will prefer and primarily use the miners who are signed.
Regards,
Hello!
We would request that you code sign your releases of the binaries (*.exe's and *.dll's) you own. If possible please choose a globally accepted CA authority of your choice. If this is something you are not inclined to do please inform us why and what your concerns might be?
Code signing would reduce AV detection and would increase users' confidence in the software and of course, would increase our confidence that we are shipping correct binaries.
Note, that we will prefer and primarily use the miners who are signed.
Regards,
The signing of our files would involve revealing our identities, which is something we are reluctant to do because of the reasons outlined in our response to their message:
Quote
PhoenixMiner on Sun, Nov 29, 2020, 9:19 AM
Hello!
Unfortunately, we can't do this for the following reasons:
* We want to keep our anonymity as well as possible, and this is at odds with getting a valid certificate from major CA. Part of our reasoning is that this is an integral part of the cryptocurrency ideology - you don't need to know, or have explicit trust in others in order to do business with them. However, much more important are a few high profile "accidents" with sudden unexplained disappearances of prominent software developers and pool owners (e.g. Claymore, the sudden closure of Dwarfpool, etc.). Some may call us paranoid but we are just cautious.
* Ulike the exchanges, pools, or services like yours, we don't hold any amount of user's cryptocurrency, nor do we have any server infrastructure that is publicly accessible, so there is no inherent risk that we will be hacked, or steal the funds of the users in any significant way. If our software does something malicious, it will be quickly detected and we will lose our reputation without much financial gain for it.
* As far as the AV detection goes - ever since the first release of our miner, various AV scanners "discovered" a lot of threats in an absolutely clean executable (built from entirely our source, without any external "blobs", so we knew it was totally clean). For a while we tried to argue with them, and several of the major ones made exceptions in their databases. However we soon discovered that we will need to go through this with each new release, which is a totally unproductive use of our time. We don't even use full executable encryption like some of our competitors - just some (admittedly advanced) anti-tampering code to protect our IP and detect attempts to reverse-engineer parts of our software. So, our choice is to either bow to the AV makers and make our software easy to reverse and lose our competitive advantage, or ignore them and provide the end users with the necessary tools (e.g. checksums) to check the authenticity of our software.
Our "chain of trust" starts with bitcointalk.com, which may seem absurd at first but it has proven to be reliable and impartial over the years, and never bowed to any outside pressure, which is more than can be said for most CAs.
Best regards!
Hello!
Unfortunately, we can't do this for the following reasons:
* We want to keep our anonymity as well as possible, and this is at odds with getting a valid certificate from major CA. Part of our reasoning is that this is an integral part of the cryptocurrency ideology - you don't need to know, or have explicit trust in others in order to do business with them. However, much more important are a few high profile "accidents" with sudden unexplained disappearances of prominent software developers and pool owners (e.g. Claymore, the sudden closure of Dwarfpool, etc.). Some may call us paranoid but we are just cautious.
* Ulike the exchanges, pools, or services like yours, we don't hold any amount of user's cryptocurrency, nor do we have any server infrastructure that is publicly accessible, so there is no inherent risk that we will be hacked, or steal the funds of the users in any significant way. If our software does something malicious, it will be quickly detected and we will lose our reputation without much financial gain for it.
* As far as the AV detection goes - ever since the first release of our miner, various AV scanners "discovered" a lot of threats in an absolutely clean executable (built from entirely our source, without any external "blobs", so we knew it was totally clean). For a while we tried to argue with them, and several of the major ones made exceptions in their databases. However we soon discovered that we will need to go through this with each new release, which is a totally unproductive use of our time. We don't even use full executable encryption like some of our competitors - just some (admittedly advanced) anti-tampering code to protect our IP and detect attempts to reverse-engineer parts of our software. So, our choice is to either bow to the AV makers and make our software easy to reverse and lose our competitive advantage, or ignore them and provide the end users with the necessary tools (e.g. checksums) to check the authenticity of our software.
Our "chain of trust" starts with bitcointalk.com, which may seem absurd at first but it has proven to be reliable and impartial over the years, and never bowed to any outside pressure, which is more than can be said for most CAs.
Best regards!
We will only add that the sudden disappearance of Clyamore some time ago had really spooked us ("are we next?"), especially given that the one of the last versions of his miner contained digitally signed Windows driver, which implies that he had to reveal his identity to the signing authority. This may be coincidence, but we are not willing to gamble with our lives, and the safety of our families by ignoring the risks. In the end, we decided to continue developing PhoenixMiner but with strict measures to keep our identities private.
March 7th
Now let's jump to the present. Some time last weekend MEGA decided to delete our account, as well as accounts of many other miner developers. We don't know the reasons but our best guess is that probably someone complained, or even threatened them with lawsuits. Whatever the reason, there are alternatives, and it seems that they didn't do anything evil like replacing the binaries with something malicious, so while inconvenient, this was not a big deal. Unfortunately, we were offline at the time and couldn't react fast enough.
When we found out about the situation, we checked our messages. Among all well wishes, anxious questions, some death threats (yep, we got some of those), there was this quite normal and reasonable message from Nicehash:
Quote
NiceHash representative on Sun, Mar 7, 10:20 AM
Hello!
Can you explain what happened with your account at MEGA.cz?
Regards
Hello!
Can you explain what happened with your account at MEGA.cz?
Regards
We didn't know that much about the situation yet but we already established that none of our accounts were compromised, so we reassured them that while our MEGA account was deleted, we are not hacked in any way:
Quote
PhoenixMiner on Mar 8, 2021, 5:56 AM
Hello!
We don't know the reason either but MEGA just terminated our account without any explanation besides "you violated our TOS". As the same has happened to Clyamore's account and some other miners, it is obvious that there is a cryptomining software "purge" on MEGA. We are looking for a new hosting solution for our software and it will be up and running very soon.
We still have full control of our bitcointalk.org account and we are busy making the next version of PhoenixMiner.
Best regards!
Hello!
We don't know the reason either but MEGA just terminated our account without any explanation besides "you violated our TOS". As the same has happened to Clyamore's account and some other miners, it is obvious that there is a cryptomining software "purge" on MEGA. We are looking for a new hosting solution for our software and it will be up and running very soon.
We still have full control of our bitcointalk.org account and we are busy making the next version of PhoenixMiner.
Best regards!
Our first task was to remove the MEGA link in the first post in our thread, and post a message clarifying the situation, and providing checksums of the individual executable files in PhoenixMiner 5.5c archive, in case someone was trying to check if his copy of the miner is genuine. Then we created a github account and uploaded the latest version of PhoenixMiner there.
In the meantime we received this message from one of higher-ups of Nicehash (apologies, if we get his title incorrect but he did not find it necessary to introduce himself, probably assuming that everyone should know who he is):
Quote
djeZo on March 8th, 2021, 05:09:07 AM
First, let me tell you that we are very sorry for the damages caused to you. We will make public apology.
I hope you agree that this was now very bad for us and for you - and all because of a simple misunderstanding! This should not happen in the future anymore.
Is there any way that you reveal your identity at least to us? Because if we know your identity, then we don't have this issue anymore and would publish all of your updates asap. We could perhaps even work out some deal to get your bins signed for NHM.
Ideally for us would be if you already provided signed bins - we could use them to go mainstream, to make every gamer also a miner and for miners to have a choice among mining tools is never a bad thing. I hope you did not see our action as a way of pushing our new QuickMiner by killing your product, because QuickMiner cannot be replacement, far from that - it has no AMD support and it works only on Windows thus is targeted towards different audience. It was just very convenient for a lot of people to start pouring all the hate they usually have against us - we gave them a perfect chance and reasons.
Our intentions were completely legit - to protect our customers and to throw off any possible responsibility if in fact there was an evil plan behind your product - this is something we are very much scared of and there is only one reason why - because your identity is not known. We do have 3rd party EULA users have to agree to, but this could only protect us in court, our reputation would be ruined badly. I hope you understand our point of view and why we did actions that we did.
First, let me tell you that we are very sorry for the damages caused to you. We will make public apology.
I hope you agree that this was now very bad for us and for you - and all because of a simple misunderstanding! This should not happen in the future anymore.
Is there any way that you reveal your identity at least to us? Because if we know your identity, then we don't have this issue anymore and would publish all of your updates asap. We could perhaps even work out some deal to get your bins signed for NHM.
Ideally for us would be if you already provided signed bins - we could use them to go mainstream, to make every gamer also a miner and for miners to have a choice among mining tools is never a bad thing. I hope you did not see our action as a way of pushing our new QuickMiner by killing your product, because QuickMiner cannot be replacement, far from that - it has no AMD support and it works only on Windows thus is targeted towards different audience. It was just very convenient for a lot of people to start pouring all the hate they usually have against us - we gave them a perfect chance and reasons.
Our intentions were completely legit - to protect our customers and to throw off any possible responsibility if in fact there was an evil plan behind your product - this is something we are very much scared of and there is only one reason why - because your identity is not known. We do have 3rd party EULA users have to agree to, but this could only protect us in court, our reputation would be ruined badly. I hope you understand our point of view and why we did actions that we did.
So, beneath some genuine sounding apologies, we find another attempt to find out our real identities. Despite the polite tone of the message, its contents can be translated to: "We asked you nicely before and you refused, so if you want us to retract our FUD post about your miner, you must reveal your identity to me." Well, we don't react well to threats, even polite ones, so our response was:
Quote
PhoenixMiner on March 08, 2021, 06:12:59 AM
Regardless of your intentions, this wasn't the best way to react to this not-so-dramatic event - none of our accounts have been hacked, and none of our customers that follow the simple procedure of downloading from the official MEGA link, or at least comparing the checksums, were at risk at any time. Please note that there were much more serious security incidents in your company's past.
We find it hard to believe in your sincerity, so let's see your retraction post first, and then we can talk about what kind of identity proof we can give you. Otherwise we will be rewarding your damaging over-reaction, which is not a good thing in our book.
We are moving to github as a first (probably temporary) solution, and then will set up a few backup hosts in case github also caves under pressure.
Regardless of your intentions, this wasn't the best way to react to this not-so-dramatic event - none of our accounts have been hacked, and none of our customers that follow the simple procedure of downloading from the official MEGA link, or at least comparing the checksums, were at risk at any time. Please note that there were much more serious security incidents in your company's past.
We find it hard to believe in your sincerity, so let's see your retraction post first, and then we can talk about what kind of identity proof we can give you. Otherwise we will be rewarding your damaging over-reaction, which is not a good thing in our book.
We are moving to github as a first (probably temporary) solution, and then will set up a few backup hosts in case github also caves under pressure.
After that we checked out more closely the NiceHash website, and their Reddit page, and we found that rather than a mere FUD post, they have created a full-blown smear campaign, with some gems like a "spontaneous" post (with nearly 5000 words!) sanctioned by NiceHash themselves, which warns you not only against the dangers of using PhoenixMiner but why you shouldn't use any other miner, besides the official miner of Nicehash. Frankly, we were half-expecting to find warnings that prolonged use of PhoenixMiner can lead to Covid-19, balding, or erectile dysfunction. At the end of this "work of art", there was this "promise":
Quote
Would you apologize to PhoenixMiner if it turns out that there was trully just a misunderstanding and some third force made him unable to fix issue with download location?
Yes, we would make public apology to PhoenixMiner if this ever happens and turns out that there was indeed no evil plan behind. But at this moment in time, we had to warn our customers about potential dangers.
Yes, we would make public apology to PhoenixMiner if this ever happens and turns out that there was indeed no evil plan behind. But at this moment in time, we had to warn our customers about potential dangers.
Still waiting for that apology. Not holding our breaths though.
Our next order of business was to find some way to prove to all concerned miners that our bitcointalk.org account is not compromised. This was a bit tricky but we finally settled on making a big ETH transaction out of our main devfee wallet, and announcing the exact amount of the ETH to be transferred beforehand in our bitcointalk.org thread. As we all keep only parts of the keys for the devfee accounts, and we don't live at the same place, this took some time. In the meantime, we received another message, with quite different tone:
Quote
djeZo on March 8th, 2021, 07:58:33 AM
Everything will be established back as it was. But I am really curious, why are you so anonymous? I got another hint from someone that you are collecting fees from botnets. Is that true? Because then this is really not good for our business - we cannot afford to be linked with a crime of such proportions. And we would have to make greater distance between.
Also what I dont understand is, even if you are connected with a crime somehow and this is the reason to stay anonymous, why not create a second miner, as a legal business - a miner that you could sign and distribute without any worries for end users?
Everything will be established back as it was. But I am really curious, why are you so anonymous? I got another hint from someone that you are collecting fees from botnets. Is that true? Because then this is really not good for our business - we cannot afford to be linked with a crime of such proportions. And we would have to make greater distance between.
Also what I dont understand is, even if you are connected with a crime somehow and this is the reason to stay anonymous, why not create a second miner, as a legal business - a miner that you could sign and distribute without any worries for end users?
So, going from apologizing, to practically accusing us of being criminals almost mid-sentence? Mind you, we are not angels, but the worst things we are guilty of include a number of speeding tickets, and one citation for disorderly conduct after a night of heavy drinking
Another curious thing is that there is a well-known and publicized association of some high-caliber NiceHash employee (perhaps former?) with ... botnet creation! At least have the decency to fabricate some other crime, instead of accusing us of your own past wrongdoings.The last part of this message however is rather interesting - "even if you are connected with a crime somehow and this is the reason to stay anonymous, why not create a second miner, as a legal business - a miner that you could sign and distribute without any worries for end users?" So, our imaginary criminal activity wouldn't be a problem for them as long as we create another, properly signed miner?!
At this point we were frankly fed up, and we decided that any further communication with NiceHash is pointless. After that there were several exchanges with wild allegations and counter-allegations between djeZo and (apparently) former member of NiceHash. Hopefully none of what was written there was true but the bad taste remains. Thankfully most of the messages were deleted by their authors, but not before destroying their credibility even further. A couple of hours after that we received this final message:
Quote
djeZo on March 08, 2021, 09:47:19 AM
I have just talked to our lawayers and they suggested to take over from here. They are being very cautions because you could actually make serious damage to us, so it seems that we will be stuck in this deadlock until this is cleared out with your KYC or smth like that. Also KYC will be mandatory for all other 3rd party miners. We may lose some customers if you wouldn't be interested to perform this action, but it is less risky than continuous red button that you could press any time to destroy us.
I have just talked to our lawayers and they suggested to take over from here. They are being very cautions because you could actually make serious damage to us, so it seems that we will be stuck in this deadlock until this is cleared out with your KYC or smth like that. Also KYC will be mandatory for all other 3rd party miners. We may lose some customers if you wouldn't be interested to perform this action, but it is less risky than continuous red button that you could press any time to destroy us.
Perhaps you should have consulted your lawyers before making unfounded allegations?
Some time after that we have finally got our private keys together, and performed the "verifying" transaction of 123.456 ETH out of our main devfee wallet as detailed here: thread https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=2647654.msg56518728#msg56518728
So, what exactly happened?
This is pure speculation at this point but given all the information before, we can think of two scenarios: best and worst. The truth is probably somewhere between them.
Best case scenario: NiceHash were not especially concerned when our MEGA accounts were deleted, but instead saw this as an opportunity to start smear campaign against us, hoping that their users will stop using our miner, and switch to theirs instead. They were probably encouraged by the fact that we weren't online for more than a month, and hoped that we would just disappear like Claymore before, and they would be able to spew whatever BS they want without any opposition from us. When we surfaced online, they first panicked that we may somehow prevent our users from mining on NiceHash as retaliation. A couple hours later, when they saw no such retaliation, the tone of djeZo messages quickly switched from apologetic to confrontational. At that point, they probably decided to just go all in, and continue spewing BS "because we can't be sure about PhoenixMiner's identity".
Worst case scenario: The whole MEGA mining software purge was initiated by complains and take down notices from NiceHash themselves. After that, this scenario is pretty much identical to the one above. However, the burning desire of NiceHash to reveal our identities, even if it is only to them, is quite disturbing. Maybe they just want to dug up some dirt on us (good luck with that!), but maybe they want to do something much more sinister.
Ok, but how can we trust PhoenixMiner?
We can't give you indisputable "proof of trust" because there is no such thing. However there are other things that you can consider:
- We have developed PhoenixMiner for more that three years, and we have thousands of users
- There never was any security incident with our miner, as long as it was downloaded from the official download location (MEGA link before, now moved to github).
- We provide checksums in our thread here, so you can check the integrity of your miner even you have downloaded from somewhere else. Making sure that the checksums match should be done by everybody, even if you download the miner from the official link
- We don't hold any amount of user's cryptocurrency, nor do we have any server infrastructure that is publicly accessible, so there is no inherent risk that we will be hacked, or steal the funds of the users in any significant way
- We are group of old school developers with real passion about computing, and programming
- We believe in the crypto, and we are fully invested in its future (yes, it is easy to say this now when the profits are at ATH, but during the first few years the profits weren't that great compared to our day jobs at the time)
- Over the years our market share grew substantially, so it would be extremely foolish to jeopardize our legitimate income by doing something malicious. If you can't trust our integrity, you can at least trust our rationality.
Final thoughts
The whole thing is quite extraordinary because due to the nature of our business, we had some dealings with all major pools. In every single case, we found them to be totally reasonable, professional, and reliable (even when we were newbies and messed up in the beginning). Even when we had some disagreements, everything was solved in respectful and constructive manner. We never promoted, or badmouthed any pool because we feel that we must be impartial in order to develop good mining software. However, after only a couple of months that we had contact with NiceHash, we are frankly just fed up with them.
Still, we won't tell you to stop using NiceHash - it's not our place to do so, and everyone can decide for themselves. However, we personally wouldn't want to be associated with them in any way. Our advice is to be very cautious when dealing with them, withdraw your earnings as soon as possible, monitor your miner performance, and so on. We wouldn't put it beside them to start banning you, or creating some fake issues when you mine on their pool with PhoenixMiner.
After this colossal waste of everyone's time, we hope that this issue is behind us.
Edited for spelling and clarity
March 09, 2021, 02:14:06 AM
What about the 3060 cards?
Is Phoenix already optimized for them? Just offer to buy cheap rig for 3060.
Thanks
Is Phoenix already optimized for them? Just offer to buy cheap rig for 3060.
Thanks
Well - i had a chance to test RTX 3060 12GB (Palit Dual)
DaggerHashimoto - 24.8 MH/s (Power 141W)
So there is really nerf for ETHash algos (tested also with Gminer and NBminer)... sad, but other coins are untouched
Just info about other algos:
PowerLimit to 100pct to see basic wattage during mining
Core: no overclock
Memory: +1000
Gminer 2.45
Zhash (144,5) - 64.9 Sol/s (Power 166W)
(miniZ 66 Sol/s)
GrinCuckatoo - 1.24 G/s (Power 169W)
CuckooCycle - 7.19 G/s (Power 162W)
Cuckatoo32 - 0.47 G/s (Power 169W)
KawPow - 23.7 MH/s (Power 167W)
BeamV3 - 22.3 Sol/s (Power 169W)
(miniZ 23.4 Sol/s)
TRex 0.19.11
Octopus - 44.91 MH/s
Happy Mining to all
DaggerHashimoto - 24.8 MH/s (Power 141W)
So there is really nerf for ETHash algos (tested also with Gminer and NBminer)... sad, but other coins are untouched
Just info about other algos:
PowerLimit to 100pct to see basic wattage during mining
Core: no overclock
Memory: +1000
Gminer 2.45
Zhash (144,5) - 64.9 Sol/s (Power 166W)
(miniZ 66 Sol/s)
GrinCuckatoo - 1.24 G/s (Power 169W)
CuckooCycle - 7.19 G/s (Power 162W)
Cuckatoo32 - 0.47 G/s (Power 169W)
KawPow - 23.7 MH/s (Power 167W)
BeamV3 - 22.3 Sol/s (Power 169W)
(miniZ 23.4 Sol/s)
TRex 0.19.11
Octopus - 44.91 MH/s
Happy Mining to all
Sorry for offtopic, only reply to one, who asked about 3060...
---continue to mine with Phoenix---cause it rulez----
March 09, 2021, 01:18:54 AM
RX 6800 support for Linux?
How's AMD RX support in Linux for PM 5.5c? Has anybody had any success?
I plan on running PhoenixMiner on Tiny Core Linux 11.1. Rig will be running 1 x RX 5700 and 6 x RX 6800 (non-XT) with no plans on doing any CPU mining.
I currently am running Win 10 and looking to move to something a lot more stable that can still give me at least 425 MH/s.
And if anyone has figured out how to consistently do 70 MH/s on an RX 6800 running PhoenixMiner, please DO let us know!
How's AMD RX support in Linux for PM 5.5c? Has anybody had any success?
I plan on running PhoenixMiner on Tiny Core Linux 11.1. Rig will be running 1 x RX 5700 and 6 x RX 6800 (non-XT) with no plans on doing any CPU mining.
I currently am running Win 10 and looking to move to something a lot more stable that can still give me at least 425 MH/s.
And if anyone has figured out how to consistently do 70 MH/s on an RX 6800 running PhoenixMiner, please DO let us know!
March 08, 2021, 10:15:14 PM
I can't find how to configure the bat with command lines to mine on binancepool. Any gidance?
March 08, 2021, 09:24:48 PM
We have added some additional files that were hosted on MEGA previously, as well as some older versions of PhoenixMiner here:
https://github.com/PhoenixMinerDevTeam/files/
If a lot of people are using even older versions of PhoenixMiner, let us know and we will add them. However we advise against using older versions because most of them won't even work with the current DAG epoch, and we will not offer any support for anything older than the last two releases (5.4c, and 5.5c).
Please add more DAG epoch in new version! https://github.com/PhoenixMinerDevTeam/files/
If a lot of people are using even older versions of PhoenixMiner, let us know and we will add them. However we advise against using older versions because most of them won't even work with the current DAG epoch, and we will not offer any support for anything older than the last two releases (5.4c, and 5.5c).
March 08, 2021, 09:13:23 PM
We have added some additional files that were hosted on MEGA previously, as well as some older versions of PhoenixMiner here:
https://phoenixminer.info/downloads/files/
https://phoenixminer.info/downloads/archive/
If a lot of people are using even older versions of PhoenixMiner, let us know and we will add them. However we advise against using older versions because most of them won't even work with the current DAG epoch, and we will not offer any support for anything older than the last two releases (5.4c, and 5.5c).
https://phoenixminer.info/downloads/files/
https://phoenixminer.info/downloads/archive/
If a lot of people are using even older versions of PhoenixMiner, let us know and we will add them. However we advise against using older versions because most of them won't even work with the current DAG epoch, and we will not offer any support for anything older than the last two releases (5.4c, and 5.5c).
March 08, 2021, 09:12:48 PM
It apparently got fixed. Now I can see both the 5.4C and 5.5C versions in the correct order from the new GitHub link.
All is well in my world now.
All is well in my world now.
March 08, 2021, 08:16:48 PM
If the correct and current version is 5.5c why does the new download location only have 5.4c ?
Did I miss something and you went back to 5.4c ?
Did I miss something and you went back to 5.4c ?
The github linked in the first post has 5.5c and 5.4c if you click on releases. It's just showing the latter as the latest.
I presume they posted 5.5c first and then decided to upload 5.4c, or were asked to, likely so people have a source for it if they have any issues with 5.5c and need to fall back to an older version.
I fell for the same thing, I think PhoenixMiner uploaded 5.5 then 5.4, so that's why it shows as the latest, and was worried my SHA was different, turns out I was comparing 5.5 with 5.4, like a dummy. So I was a bit worried, once I figured how to actually download the right 5.5c zip and ran the checksums to confirm its the original file from Mega. I also went through the comparison of the EIO.dll/.exe, IOMap64.sys, and PhoenixMiner.exe to confirm those files match the file from PhoenixMiner.org zip I had downloaded some time ago, no idea if there are any other issues with their zip, but at least the main files match. So I feel a whole lot better now.
Also the bozos posting B.S. 5.5d updates can get bent, same for the bozos conveniently offering a new Mega link.
at this point it's gotta be a bot, there's a new mega link up and then down damn near every time I refresh the page
And someone is paying attention to the thread because the spam changed in the last like 12 hours
March 08, 2021, 08:10:16 PM
If the correct and current version is 5.5c why does the new download location only have 5.4c ?
Did I miss something and you went back to 5.4c ?
Did I miss something and you went back to 5.4c ?
The github linked in the first post has 5.5c and 5.4c if you click on releases. It's just showing the latter as the latest.
I presume they posted 5.5c first and then decided to upload 5.4c, or were asked to, likely so people have a source for it if they have any issues with 5.5c and need to fall back to an older version.
I fell for the same thing, I think PhoenixMiner uploaded 5.5 then 5.4, so that's why it shows as the latest, and was worried my SHA was different, turns out I was comparing 5.5 with 5.4, like a dummy. So I was a bit worried, once I figured how to actually download the right 5.5c zip and ran the checksums to confirm its the original file from Mega. I also went through the comparison of the EIO.dll/.exe, IOMap64.sys, and PhoenixMiner.exe to confirm those files match the file from PhoenixMiner.org zip I had downloaded some time ago, no idea if there are any other issues with their zip, but at least the main files match. So I feel a whole lot better now.
Also the bozos posting B.S. 5.5d updates can get bent, same for the bozos conveniently offering a new Mega link.
March 08, 2021, 08:09:54 PM
After inquiring about the situation with Nicehash, I received an answer from them that NO ONE was compromised.
That there was no malware in any Phoenixminer version ever in nicehashminer.
Well that news is a relief for most of us. But I feel bad for the guys who wiped their entire PC and have to re-install
everything over a false alarm. Nicehash could have handled this situation better and should update their reddit and
twitter with an apology stating there turns out to be no malware, but better safe than sorry. I think this would do
a lot for customer retention. I also think a REAL human dev/coder should be vetting all future plug in updates to nicehash
miner. He could do this on a test machine with tools to look for malware as well as communication from pc that
shouldn't be happening (zone alarm does this very well). And maybe having a small amount of bitcoin and ether
on the test machine for bait would be a good idea. They can monitor that machine for a few weeks and if nothing
happens, they are a lot more sure it isn't malware. The rare ticking time bomb a year from now case is not that
likely and even if it was a trojan like that, they would have a month to find out about it. It is not like the latest miner
plug in is WAY faster, it is maybe 1-5% improvement each time, so just wait, as you say better safe than sorry.
That there was no malware in any Phoenixminer version ever in nicehashminer.
Well that news is a relief for most of us. But I feel bad for the guys who wiped their entire PC and have to re-install
everything over a false alarm. Nicehash could have handled this situation better and should update their reddit and
twitter with an apology stating there turns out to be no malware, but better safe than sorry. I think this would do
a lot for customer retention. I also think a REAL human dev/coder should be vetting all future plug in updates to nicehash
miner. He could do this on a test machine with tools to look for malware as well as communication from pc that
shouldn't be happening (zone alarm does this very well). And maybe having a small amount of bitcoin and ether
on the test machine for bait would be a good idea. They can monitor that machine for a few weeks and if nothing
happens, they are a lot more sure it isn't malware. The rare ticking time bomb a year from now case is not that
likely and even if it was a trojan like that, they would have a month to find out about it. It is not like the latest miner
plug in is WAY faster, it is maybe 1-5% improvement each time, so just wait, as you say better safe than sorry.
March 08, 2021, 07:53:04 PM
If the correct and current version is 5.5c why does the new download location only have 5.4c ?
Did I miss something and you went back to 5.4c ?
Did I miss something and you went back to 5.4c ?
The github linked in the first post has 5.5c and 5.4c if you click on releases. It's just showing the latter as the latest.
I presume they posted 5.5c first and then decided to upload 5.4c, or were asked to, likely so people have a source for it if they have any issues with 5.5c and need to fall back to an older version.
March 08, 2021, 07:52:18 PM
If the correct and current version is 5.5c why does the new download location only have 5.4c ?
Did I miss something and you went back to 5.4c ?
Did I miss something and you went back to 5.4c ?
here
https://github.com/PhoenixMinerDevTeam/PhoenixMiner/releases/download/5.5c/PhoenixMiner_5.5c_Windows.zip
March 08, 2021, 07:28:08 PM
If the correct and current version is 5.5c why does the new download location only have 5.4c ?
Did I miss something and you went back to 5.4c ?
Did I miss something and you went back to 5.4c ?
March 08, 2021, 06:10:35 PM
Well, he had stolen 80M worth of BTC in last bull run when it was on the peak and then returned it to people when it was worth 30M, so 50M robbery... It's obvious that you can expect everything from him
Maybe nicehash did this with purpose, uploaded infected version of phoenix miner to get passwords/private keys from people so he can rob someone again and now he passed the blame on phoenix miner dev
Maybe nicehash did this with purpose, uploaded infected version of phoenix miner to get passwords/private keys from people so he can rob someone again and now he passed the blame on phoenix miner dev
March 08, 2021, 06:09:18 PM
Question, my mini rig has been mining without any problems, but this week I've gotten two blue Windows screen error saying something like:
Anybody has seen this, and what could possibly be the problem? I checked PM log but there's no error shown in the log. Thanks.
Win 10
4x 1070 Current drivers
Latest PM
Quote
Windows 10 encountered an error, it's trying to fix the problem and will restart shortly 
Anybody has seen this, and what could possibly be the problem? I checked PM log but there's no error shown in the log. Thanks.
Win 10
4x 1070 Current drivers
Latest PM
March 08, 2021, 06:05:31 PM
Finally got the last of my NiceHash balance out, and am using PhoenixMiner with direct mining pools from now on.
Getting paid in BTC was my preference, but seeing how unstable the dev is on Reddit and this forum completely tanked my confidence in them. Hell, putting that together with the founders' history makes me question exactly WHERE their BTC stash is even coming from.
Integrity matters even in this business. And NH has demonstrated none of that over the past 36 hours.
Getting paid in BTC was my preference, but seeing how unstable the dev is on Reddit and this forum completely tanked my confidence in them. Hell, putting that together with the founders' history makes me question exactly WHERE their BTC stash is even coming from.
Integrity matters even in this business. And NH has demonstrated none of that over the past 36 hours.
welcome. if you have questions just post here and you will get better support than at scamhash anyways
r/GPUmining or r/Ethermining is also a good avenue of support
If y'all read the PSA on reddit that was on the hotpage, that was me
March 08, 2021, 06:01:51 PM
Finally got the last of my NiceHash balance out, and am using PhoenixMiner with direct mining pools from now on.
Getting paid in BTC was my preference, but seeing how unstable the dev is on Reddit and this forum completely tanked my confidence in them. Hell, putting that together with the founders' history makes me question exactly WHERE their BTC stash is even coming from.
Integrity matters even in this business. And NH has demonstrated none of that over the past 36 hours.
Getting paid in BTC was my preference, but seeing how unstable the dev is on Reddit and this forum completely tanked my confidence in them. Hell, putting that together with the founders' history makes me question exactly WHERE their BTC stash is even coming from.
Integrity matters even in this business. And NH has demonstrated none of that over the past 36 hours.
welcome. if you have questions just post here and you will get better support than at scamhash anyways
March 08, 2021, 06:01:04 PM
Finally got the last of my NiceHash balance out, and am using PhoenixMiner with direct mining pools from now on.
Getting paid in BTC was my preference, but seeing how unstable the dev is on Reddit and this forum completely tanked my confidence in them. Hell, putting that together with the founders' history makes me question exactly WHERE their BTC stash is even coming from.
Integrity matters even in this business. And NH has demonstrated none of that over the past 36 hours.
Getting paid in BTC was my preference, but seeing how unstable the dev is on Reddit and this forum completely tanked my confidence in them. Hell, putting that together with the founders' history makes me question exactly WHERE their BTC stash is even coming from.
Integrity matters even in this business. And NH has demonstrated none of that over the past 36 hours.
Yes that was a bit of a rollercoaster of nonsense from them, especially for what should simply have been a short post saying "out of an abundance of caution we are temporarily removing the PhoenixMiner plugin" yet turned into several extremely long and unprofessional Reddit posts with associated comments over here.
Their admins and the owner to their credit were quite professional, even if they do appear to have misattributed that .org website (and the corresponding files with mismatching hash) to PhoenixMiner. That they let that dev rabidly rant about "paid shill attacks" or post multi-page, semi-coherent ramblings on their behalf doesn't do them any credit mind you.
They overreacted a little initially, and seemed confused in their messaging, but that dev took it to a whole new level of batshit crazy.
March 08, 2021, 05:48:43 PM
Finally got the last of my NiceHash balance out, and am using PhoenixMiner with direct mining pools from now on.
Getting paid in BTC was my preference, but seeing how unstable the dev is on Reddit and this forum completely tanked my confidence in them. Hell, putting that together with the founders' history makes me question exactly WHERE their BTC stash is even coming from.
Integrity matters even in this business. And NH has demonstrated none of that over the past 36 hours.
Getting paid in BTC was my preference, but seeing how unstable the dev is on Reddit and this forum completely tanked my confidence in them. Hell, putting that together with the founders' history makes me question exactly WHERE their BTC stash is even coming from.
Integrity matters even in this business. And NH has demonstrated none of that over the past 36 hours.
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