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Topic: PRCDice.eu - Largest Dice invest site - Open since 2013! Chat, Play, Invest! (Read 89249 times)

legendary
Activity: 2436
Merit: 1561
A question to investors: how long does it take to reach a ROI? I know there isn't a fixed percentage in these kind of investments, but I just would like to know the average time for ROI, if it could be a good way to invest my money.

ROI is not the right term for such investments, as invested BTC are not spent but deposited. You can invest/divest any time you want.

So if you invest and some player loses, you get instant (small) profit (and the other way around).
legendary
Activity: 1717
Merit: 1125
hero member
Activity: 868
Merit: 1000
good luck dean on prcdice 2.0 looks good so far.
hero member
Activity: 658
Merit: 500
A question to investors: how long does it take to reach a ROI? I know there isn't a fixed percentage in these kind of investments, but I just would like to know the average time for ROI, if it could be a good way to invest my money.

You can never know. Its the night a gambler loses money to the site, and its like asking when will that night happen .
The site's been profit dead for the last 1 month.  Apart from what AK lost around 2 months back, there hasn't been enough action. Also the site owner has a negative trust so you might want to look at other options.


Thank you finnile for your quick and frank reply... I'll look for other options.
full member
Activity: 196
Merit: 104
A question to investors: how long does it take to reach a ROI? I know there isn't a fixed percentage in these kind of investments, but I just would like to know the average time for ROI, if it could be a good way to invest my money.

You can never know. Its the night a gambler loses money to the site, and its like asking when will that night happen .
The site's been profit dead for the last 1 month.  Apart from what AK lost around 2 months back, there hasn't been enough action. Also the site owner has a negative trust so you might want to look at other options.
hero member
Activity: 658
Merit: 500
A question to investors: how long does it take to reach a ROI? I know there isn't a fixed percentage in these kind of investments, but I just would like to know the average time for ROI, if it could be a good way to invest my money.
sr. member
Activity: 616
Merit: 250
IF THESE BITCOIN INVESTMENTS SCHEMES DONT OFFER LEVERAGE THEN YOU RISK ALL YOUR BTC BEING STOLEN.

DEMAND IT!
Roll Eyes
legendary
Activity: 882
Merit: 1000
Thanks for explanation.

So, if I got this right, as per my example "a) 0.25 kelly":

Quote
I know 1/4 kelly is the least risky and 10x kelly the most risky, but how does it work in practice? What happens in the scenario:

Bankroll is 100 BTC, I have 1 BTC invested, player wins/loses 1 BTC. What's my profit/loss if:

a) I have 1 BTC invested on 1/4 kelly
...

Let's ignore all the operator commission for easier calculation.

Assuming that all the other investments (99 BTC) are on 1x kelly, then:

a) 0.25 kelly
Max payout: (BTC99*1*0.01) + (BTC1*0.25*0.01)= BTC0.9925

Player wins BTC1:
BTC1 + ((-1 * BTC1 * 0.25 * 0.01 )/0.9925)= BTC0.99748110

Player loses BTC1:
BTC1 + ((1 * BTC1 * 0.25 * 0.01 )/0.9925)= BTC1.00251889


Quote
Also, does it make any sense to spread the investment, say 0.5 BTC on 1/2 kelly and 0.5 on 2x kelly, or is it perfectly the same as investing 1 BTC on 1x kelly?

^ So the above split won't make sense, as the results would be the same as with BTC1 on 1x kelly.

But you can still mix it up, say you want more than x2 but x5 is too much of a risk, and you want something around x3. So you can split it proportionally, put some on x2 and some on x5.


Your example of 0.25 kelly investment is correct yeah.

I don't think there is a good reason to have it split except maybe your example with wanting 3x or an option that isn't available.
legendary
Activity: 2436
Merit: 1561
Thanks for explanation.

So, if I got this right, as per my example "a) 0.25 kelly":

Quote
I know 1/4 kelly is the least risky and 10x kelly the most risky, but how does it work in practice? What happens in the scenario:

Bankroll is 100 BTC, I have 1 BTC invested, player wins/loses 1 BTC. What's my profit/loss if:

a) I have 1 BTC invested on 1/4 kelly
...

Let's ignore all the operator commission for easier calculation.

Assuming that all the other investments (99 BTC) are on 1x kelly, then:

a) 0.25 kelly
Max payout: (BTC99*1*0.01) + (BTC1*0.25*0.01)= BTC0.9925

Player wins BTC1:
BTC1 + ((-1 * BTC1 * 0.25 * 0.01 )/0.9925)= BTC0.99748110

Player loses BTC1:
BTC1 + ((1 * BTC1 * 0.25 * 0.01 )/0.9925)= BTC1.00251889


Quote
Also, does it make any sense to spread the investment, say 0.5 BTC on 1/2 kelly and 0.5 on 2x kelly, or is it perfectly the same as investing 1 BTC on 1x kelly?

^ So the above split won't make sense, as the results would be the same as with BTC1 on 1x kelly.

But you can still mix it up, say you want more than x2 but x5 is too much of a risk, and you want something around x3. So you can split it proportionally, put some on x2 and some on x5.
legendary
Activity: 882
Merit: 1000

Noob question regarding "x Kelly" investment options. How does it really work? There's a 'more info' on the test site (in invest window) but nothing there yet.

I know 1/4 kelly is the least risky and 10x kelly the most risky, but how does it work in practice? What happens in the scenario:

Bankroll is 100 BTC, I have 1 BTC invested, player wins/loses 1 BTC. What's my profit/loss if:

a) I have 1 BTC invested on 1/4 kelly
b) 1 BTC invested on 10x kelly

Let's ignore all the operator commission for easier calculation.


Also, does it make any sense to spread the investment, say 0.5 BTC on 1/2 kelly and 0.5 on 2x kelly, or is it perfectly the same as investing 1 BTC on 1x kelly?



The leveraged kelly option is really to reduce counter party risk for investors.
Example, say you want to invest 10 Bitcoin at the normal risk of 1/2 kelly but don't want to have the risk of a site operator holding on to all your Bitcoin. You could instead deposit 0.5 Bitcoin and invest at 10x kelly.

This puts more of your investment at risk each bet and you may need to redeposit and top up your investment account frequently due to the variance of the game. So really you should have the coins in your own cold wallet to back up the desired investment total. Obviously some people may just want to gamble and risk their full 10 Bitcoin at 10x to try and maximise profit. This is not recommended though.

The maximum payout of the site is calculated by taking the sum of all the investments * risk * 0.01.

So imagine we had user A with 10 Bitcoins invested at 1/2 kelly, B with 10 at 5x and C with 10 at 10x.
The max payout would be:

(10*0.5*0.01) + (10*5*0.01) + (10*10*0.01) = 1.55 Bitcoin

The higher your risk the more you stand to win or lose each bet.

So each bet your investment will be updated like so:
i = i + ((-p * i * r * 0.01) / m)

Where:
p = the players profit for that bet
i = the amount you have invested
r = your risk
m = the current max payout

In the above example lets say a player bets 1 Bitcoin and wins.

The current investments would then be:

iA = 10 + ((-1 * 10 * 0.5 * 0.01 )/1.55) = 9.96774193
iB = 10 + ((-1 * 10 * 5 * 0.01 )/1.55) = 9.67741935
iC = 10 + ((-1 * 10 * 10 * 0.01 )/1.55) = 9.35483870

Max payout on the next bet would then be:

(9.9677*0.5*0.01) + (9.6774*5*0.01) + (9.3548*10*0.01) = 1.46919354

Again, you should only really be using this to reduce counter party risk and actually have the funds in your own cold wallet to replenish your investment as often as needed.

Feel free to test it out at https://test.prcdice.eu (note you will get a certificate warning but it is safe (I can think of a better site I could be malicious on) and is due to just using a self signed certificate on the test site. Obviously live site won't be like this.






sr. member
Activity: 378
Merit: 250

Noob question regarding "x Kelly" investment options. How does it really work? There's a 'more info' on the test site (in invest window) but nothing there yet.

I know 1/4 kelly is the least risky and 10x kelly the most risky, but how does it work in practice? What happens in the scenario:

Bankroll is 100 BTC, I have 1 BTC invested, player wins/loses 1 BTC. What's my profit/loss if:

a) I have 1 BTC invested on 1/4 kelly
b) 1 BTC invested on 10x kelly

Let's ignore all the operator commission for easier calculation.


Also, does it make any sense to spread the investment, say 0.5 BTC on 1/2 kelly and 0.5 on 2x kelly, or is it perfectly the same as investing 1 BTC on 1x kelly?



I'll follow up on this asap so to help explain it better. Just sorting a few other things at the moment...

any ETA on v2?  Huh
legendary
Activity: 882
Merit: 1000

Noob question regarding "x Kelly" investment options. How does it really work? There's a 'more info' on the test site (in invest window) but nothing there yet.

I know 1/4 kelly is the least risky and 10x kelly the most risky, but how does it work in practice? What happens in the scenario:

Bankroll is 100 BTC, I have 1 BTC invested, player wins/loses 1 BTC. What's my profit/loss if:

a) I have 1 BTC invested on 1/4 kelly
b) 1 BTC invested on 10x kelly

Let's ignore all the operator commission for easier calculation.


Also, does it make any sense to spread the investment, say 0.5 BTC on 1/2 kelly and 0.5 on 2x kelly, or is it perfectly the same as investing 1 BTC on 1x kelly?



I'll follow up on this asap so to help explain it better. Just sorting a few other things at the moment...
legendary
Activity: 2436
Merit: 1561

Noob question regarding "x Kelly" investment options. How does it really work? There's a 'more info' on the test site (in invest window) but nothing there yet.

I know 1/4 kelly is the least risky and 10x kelly the most risky, but how does it work in practice? What happens in the scenario:

Bankroll is 100 BTC, I have 1 BTC invested, player wins/loses 1 BTC. What's my profit/loss if:

a) I have 1 BTC invested on 1/4 kelly
b) 1 BTC invested on 10x kelly

Let's ignore all the operator commission for easier calculation.


Also, does it make any sense to spread the investment, say 0.5 BTC on 1/2 kelly and 0.5 on 2x kelly, or is it perfectly the same as investing 1 BTC on 1x kelly?

legendary
Activity: 882
Merit: 1000



zoom in...

enhance...



"probably fair"

lol Smiley



There are many PROBABLY FAIR sites , especially licenced casinos.

Somebody didnt do research here..

It was just a designer mocking up a NEW design. It's quite an easy typo considering V and B are right next t each other on the keyboard.
We did all laugh about it in the chat room though.
The site is provably fair.
full member
Activity: 126
Merit: 100
*Bitcoin Betting*



zoom in...

enhance...



"probably fair"

lol Smiley



There are many PROBABLY FAIR sites , especially licenced casinos.

Somebody didnt do research here..
legendary
Activity: 2198
Merit: 1014
Bitdice is scam scam scammmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm



zoom in...

enhance...



"probably fair"

lol Smiley



There are many PROBABLY FAIR sites , especially licenced casinos.
full member
Activity: 154
Merit: 100
waiting for prcdice 2 here!!!

bring it on  Wink
full member
Activity: 196
Merit: 104
I personally think PRC2 looks like a copy of coinichiwa.com . Now I understand why people hate dean so much. Good luck with your site dean.



zoom in...

enhance...



"probably fair"

lol Smiley

Yeah we had a good laugh about that in chat lol.
I can assure you it's only a typo on the design though Wink



lol Cheesy
I doubt it dean.
Anyways




Wheres my promised bounty Dean?
full member
Activity: 288
Merit: 113
Web dev for hire
Yeah we had a good laugh about that in chat lol.
I can assure you it's only a typo on the design though Wink

is the new site still running on .NET?
legendary
Activity: 882
Merit: 1000
I personally think PRC2 looks like a copy of coinichiwa.com . Now I understand why people hate dean so much. Good luck with your site dean.



zoom in...

enhance...



"probably fair"

lol Smiley

Yeah we had a good laugh about that in chat lol.
I can assure you it's only a typo on the design though Wink
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