Topic: Proof that God exists - page 55. (Read 62273 times)
And now let's see the illogical argument from BADecker. I mean, we know that he'll find something. He's too sneaky to be otherwise.
It's the only thing we've been speaking about. Do you like Settlers of Catan?
We only agrees that science has a lot to learn. But that it also makes progress everyday. Don't get cute!
I am cute. I don't have to get cute. Now that you know this, since we have spoken on very few subjects, why do you think that this is the only thing that we agree on?
We only agrees that science has a lot to learn. But that it also makes progress everyday. Don't get cute!
Can you explain everything in nature? Do you understand everything that everybody does? Of course not. You don't even understand that contradictions to the Bible are false, even when you don't understand the Bible.
There are many things we don't understand - yet.
And there were many things we did not understand 200 years ago - but look what progress we made. It's beautiful. Thanks to science.
But the most important thing that we do know is the fact that
Actually, very few of the things that are available to understand in the universe, will ever be understood. The reason for this is that they are way to complex to be understood.
Science can be good when it helps us live better. science is bad when it causes us to think that we can know more than we are able to know.
Well, everyday discoveries are made that we even did not think were possible. Best example are discoveries influenced by sci-fi movies. People dreamed and then made reality. You do know teleportation is real? Even if only for a few atoms on a short distance but still.
We understand more and more everyday. And it doesn't look like it's going to stop. It only accelerates. And that's a fact.
And the understanding of the discoveries that we make, shows us more and more that we are barely moving with regard to the numbers of things that are not yet discovered. The more we learn, the more we find out that there are more things to learn. It's not that there really are more things to learn. It's simply that we don't know how many things there are to learn. But we are gradually finding out that there are way more things to learn than we could have ever dreamed of.
Agreed. I'm glad you finally see the light. Raise your hands!
Well, I'm glad that you finally see the light that this is part of what I have been expressing all along.
...God, Who science proves to exist, actually did examine science before He set it in place
Yet another claim pulled directly from your ass
Prove it
It is a logical conclusion based on the things that god's witnesses in the bible said and say.
It is a hearsay (at best).
Can you explain everything in nature? Do you understand everything that everybody does? Of course not. You don't even understand that contradictions to the Bible are false, even when you don't understand the Bible.
There are many things we don't understand - yet.
And there were many things we did not understand 200 years ago - but look what progress we made. It's beautiful. Thanks to science.
But the most important thing that we do know is the fact that
Actually, very few of the things that are available to understand in the universe, will ever be understood. The reason for this is that they are way to complex to be understood.
Science can be good when it helps us live better. science is bad when it causes us to think that we can know more than we are able to know.
Well, everyday discoveries are made that we even did not think were possible. Best example are discoveries influenced by sci-fi movies. People dreamed and then made reality. You do know teleportation is real? Even if only for a few atoms on a short distance but still.
We understand more and more everyday. And it doesn't look like it's going to stop. It only accelerates. And that's a fact.
And the understanding of the discoveries that we make, shows us more and more that we are barely moving with regard to the numbers of things that are not yet discovered. The more we learn, the more we find out that there are more things to learn. It's not that there really are more things to learn. It's simply that we don't know how many things there are to learn. But we are gradually finding out that there are way more things to learn than we could have ever dreamed of.
Agreed. I'm glad you finally see the light. Raise your hands!
...
Well, thanks for confirming that you can't find anything to prove that the 3 laws of science that I have provided don't prove God. Because of these pages and pages of posts where you completely avoid that point, you are adding your strength to the proof that God exists.
Well, thanks for confirming that you can't find anything to prove that the 3 laws of science that I have provided don't prove God. Because of these pages and pages of posts where you completely avoid that point, you are adding your strength to the proof that God exists.
BADecker,
I replied to your "3 laws" argument many times, but here it goes again:
1. cause and effect - You did not provide a cause for God so your argument is not valid.
2. complexity of the universe - It has no correlation between existence of God and complexity that I can see.
3. entropy argument - complexity and randomness are two different things. even if one accepts your argument that the universe is devolving in complexity, the shear fact that we evolved from a less complex life form is enough to refute that argument
You might have an excuse for what you are doing to yourself/yourselves. It's in the first sentence of your post I am quoting here... "I don't see any evidence for God." Since you can't stick to science, you are showing your lack of ability, thereby strengthening the science.
Thanks, again, for your confirmation that God exists.
Thanks, again, for your confirmation that God exists.
I'm sticking to science. Not sure I lack the ability to process new information. I did graduate from the top engineering school so I don't think I lack the ability to
understand science. I'm sure I would understand a proof of God existence if it was presented to me.
Anyway, if you have a mathematical proof of God existence, please post it here. I don't think you will be able to provide data for any other type of proof as God is not observable entity so you cannot collect any data on him/her/it.
I have doubts you even understand what such proof would entail since you have trouble understanding what term: scientific theory means.
Can you explain everything in nature? Do you understand everything that everybody does? Of course not. You don't even understand that contradictions to the Bible are false, even when you don't understand the Bible.
There are many things we don't understand - yet.
And there were many things we did not understand 200 years ago - but look what progress we made. It's beautiful. Thanks to science.
But the most important thing that we do know is the fact that
Actually, very few of the things that are available to understand in the universe, will ever be understood. The reason for this is that they are way to complex to be understood.
Science can be good when it helps us live better. science is bad when it causes us to think that we can know more than we are able to know.
Well, everyday discoveries are made that we even did not think were possible. Best example are discoveries influenced by sci-fi movies. People dreamed and then made reality. You do know teleportation is real? Even if only for a few atoms on a short distance but still.
We understand more and more everyday. And it doesn't look like it's going to stop. It only accelerates. And that's a fact.
And the understanding of the discoveries that we make, shows us more and more that we are barely moving with regard to the numbers of things that are not yet discovered. The more we learn, the more we find out that there are more things to learn. It's not that there really are more things to learn. It's simply that we don't know how many things there are to learn. But we are gradually finding out that there are way more things to learn than we could have ever dreamed of.
Can you explain everything in nature? Do you understand everything that everybody does? Of course not. You don't even understand that contradictions to the Bible are false, even when you don't understand the Bible.
There are many things we don't understand - yet.
And there were many things we did not understand 200 years ago - but look what progress we made. It's beautiful. Thanks to science.
But the most important thing that we do know is the fact that
Actually, very few of the things that are available to understand in the universe, will ever be understood. The reason for this is that they are way to complex to be understood.
Science can be good when it helps us live better. science is bad when it causes us to think that we can know more than we are able to know.
Well, everyday discoveries are made that we even did not think were possible. Best example are discoveries influenced by sci-fi movies. People dreamed and then made reality. You do know teleportation is real? Even if only for a few atoms on a short distance but still.
We understand more and more everyday. And it doesn't look like it's going to stop. It only accelerates. And that's a fact.
Can you explain everything in nature? Do you understand everything that everybody does? Of course not. You don't even understand that contradictions to the Bible are false, even when you don't understand the Bible.
There are many things we don't understand - yet.
And there were many things we did not understand 200 years ago - but look what progress we made. It's beautiful. Thanks to science.
But the most important thing that we do know is the fact that
Actually, very few of the things that are available to understand in the universe, will ever be understood. The reason for this is that they are way to complex to be understood.
Science can be good when it helps us live better. Science is bad when it causes us to think that we can know more than we are able to know.
Can you explain everything in nature? Do you understand everything that everybody does? Of course not. You don't even understand that contradictions to the Bible are false, even when you don't understand the Bible.
There are many things we don't understand - yet.
And there were many things we did not understand 200 years ago - but look what progress we made. It's beautiful. Thanks to science.
But the most important thing that we do know is the fact that
Okay. I guess we are down to it. You simply won't accept the proof that God exists.
I am a bit curious why, however. I suspect that you believe other things that are factual. I mean, if you were crossing a railroad track, and you saw a train bearing down on yourself at 60 mph, you would get out of the way as fast as you could. Although God is patient and loving, He can be way more dangerous than a train. And you are disrespectful of the nitroglycerin you are tossing back and forth from hand to hand. How utterly reckless of you.
I don't see any evidence for God. Quite the opposite. There is strong evidence that God described in the holy books is a social construct developed by people in various times in our human history. Why? Because each God has the qualities of people who lived at the time when the God story was invented. His interactions with the world are described in terms of how people in those times understood the world around them.
If two armies are to about fight each other and the soldiers on each side believe in the same God and pray to help them win the battle, how is God suppose to reconcile those requests? Free will was invented to justify God's actions. For example where was God when 6 million Jews were being killed by Germans who believed in the same God.
Anyone who read Bible, Talmud and Quran understands this. Those books were written for specific purpose, nothing to do with divine power.
Those stories are ridiculous.
Why did God create me to be an Atheist? I was Catholic before only because I was born into that religion. Now I used my brain (that God gave me?) to reason my way out of that cult. Freewill my ass.
Seriously, you are fooling YOURSELF believing in this nonsense. If you have any reason left in you, I suggest you re-read your bible and apply the same scrutiny as you would to reading a physics textbook. Reason every paragraph. Don't listen what others tell you those words mean. Read and reason for yourself.
I don't really care what you believe, it does not matter. I have problem with the missionary aspect of the religion because you guys spreading lies about science, history and reality in general.
PS. The story of Adam and Eve and the incest that followed is as ridiculous as it is immoral.
Reason every paragraph. Don't say that! You'll ruin everything!
...God, Who science proves to exist, actually did examine science before He set it in place
Yet another claim pulled directly from your ass
Prove it
It is a logical conclusion based on the things that god's witnesses in the bible said and say.
God's witness? I've heard about conspiracies since G. Washington's time and can't know if those are real and you put your "logic" on something someone proposedly once might have seen? That's weak.
...God, Who science proves to exist, actually did examine science before He set it in place
Yet another claim pulled directly from your ass
Prove it
It is a logical conclusion based on the things that god's witnesses in the bible said and say.
It is a hearsay (at best).
Oh, because the bible says so?
The bible also says that rabbits chew their cud like a cow
The bible says unicorns exist
The bible condones slavery in no less than 5 different books
The entire old testament is filled with murder and genocide
The bible places Jesus in cities hundreds of miles apart on the same day
The bible says the earth has four corners (implying the earth is flat)
The bible says God created light... 3 days before he created the sun and stars...
The bible is wrong on so many things... Literally hundreds of provable errors and contradictions
I will gladly provide dozens of links to scholarly sources on the subject if you are interested
The one thing that annoys me the most is that "everyone can understand bible in their own way" or such the cases that you've said can be understood differently from person to person or completely ignored. Ignoring the bad parts and counting just he good ones, The Evolution of Bible. Therefore bible is as much as a blank papers bounded together, it's just a great hitorical artifact, nothing else absolutely.
This is why the real Bible, the original written in Hebrew, Aramaic and Greek, was written in those languages, which are meaning specific in the things that they say.
So you talk and read Hebrew Aramaic and Greek then? Or you don't understand the Bible either?
I don't speak or read Hebrew, Aramaic, or Greek. But I do understand the Bible. How can this be?
The Bible translations are not entirely accurate according to the originals, and they probably will never be. However, there is enough accuracy in the translations that a person can get a basic understanding of what is being said. This basic understanding includes knowledge of Jesus salvation.
When a person comes to Jesus salvation, the Holy Spirit, over time, gradually works a knowledge of the rest of the Bible in Him. A non-believer in Jesus salvation doesn't get this knowledge, unless he fluently understands the original languages in their context and the way they were spoken back in their day.
So can you explain this:
The bible also says that rabbits chew their cud like a cow
The bible says unicorns exist
The bible condones slavery in no less than 5 different books
The entire old testament is filled with murder and genocide
The bible places Jesus in cities hundreds of miles apart on the same day
The bible says the earth has four corners (implying the earth is flat)
The bible says God created light... 3 days before he created the sun and stars...
Can you explain everything in nature? Do you understand everything that everybody does? Of course not. You don't even understand that contradictions to the Bible are false, even when you don't understand the Bible.
Okay. I guess we are down to it. You simply won't accept the proof that God exists.
I am a bit curious why, however. I suspect that you believe other things that are factual. I mean, if you were crossing a railroad track, and you saw a train bearing down on yourself at 60 mph, you would get out of the way as fast as you could. Although God is patient and loving, He can be way more dangerous than a train. And you are disrespectful of the nitroglycerin you are tossing back and forth from hand to hand. How utterly reckless of you.
I don't see any evidence for God. Quite the opposite. There is strong evidence that God described in the holy books is a social construct developed by people in various times in our human history. Why? Because each God has the qualities of people who lived at the time when the God story was invented. His interactions with the world are described in terms of how people in those times understood the world around them.
If two armies are to about fight each other and the soldiers on each side believe in the same God and pray to help them win the battle, how is God suppose to reconcile those requests? Free will was invented to justify God's actions. For example where was God when 6 million Jews were being killed by Germans who believed in the same God.
Anyone who read Bible, Talmud and Quran understands this. Those books were written for specific purpose, nothing to do with divine power.
Those stories are ridiculous.
Why did God create me to be an Atheist? I was Catholic before only because I was born into that religion. Now I used my brain (that God gave me?) to reason my way out of that cult. Freewill my ass.
Seriously, you are fooling YOURSELF believing in this nonsense. If you have any reason left in you, I suggest you re-read your bible and apply the same scrutiny as you would to reading a physics textbook. Reason every paragraph. Don't listen what others tell you those words mean. Read and reason for yourself.
I don't really care what you believe, it does not matter. I have problem with the missionary aspect of the religion because you guys spreading lies about science, history and reality in general.
PS. The story of Adam and Eve and the incest that followed is as ridiculous as it is immoral.
...God, Who science proves to exist, actually did examine science before He set it in place
Yet another claim pulled directly from your ass
Prove it
It is a logical conclusion based on the things that god's witnesses in the bible said and say.
It is a hearsay (at best).
Oh, because the bible says so?
The bible also says that rabbits chew their cud like a cow
The bible says unicorns exist
The bible condones slavery in no less than 5 different books
The entire old testament is filled with murder and genocide
The bible places Jesus in cities hundreds of miles apart on the same day
The bible says the earth has four corners (implying the earth is flat)
The bible says God created light... 3 days before he created the sun and stars...
The bible is wrong on so many things... Literally hundreds of provable errors and contradictions
I will gladly provide dozens of links to scholarly sources on the subject if you are interested
The one thing that annoys me the most is that "everyone can understand bible in their own way" or such the cases that you've said can be understood differently from person to person or completely ignored. Ignoring the bad parts and counting just he good ones, The Evolution of Bible. Therefore bible is as much as a blank papers bounded together, it's just a great hitorical artifact, nothing else absolutely.
This is why the real Bible, the original written in Hebrew, Aramaic and Greek, was written in those languages, which are meaning specific in the things that they say.
So you talk and read Hebrew Aramaic and Greek then? Or you don't understand the Bible either?
I don't speak or read Hebrew, Aramaic, or Greek. But I do understand the Bible. How can this be?
The Bible translations are not entirely accurate according to the originals, and they probably will never be. However, there is enough accuracy in the translations that a person can get a basic understanding of what is being said. This basic understanding includes knowledge of Jesus salvation.
When a person comes to Jesus salvation, the Holy Spirit, over time, gradually works a knowledge of the rest of the Bible in Him. A non-believer in Jesus salvation doesn't get this knowledge, unless he fluently understands the original languages in their context and the way they were spoken back in their day.
So can you explain this:
The bible also says that rabbits chew their cud like a cow
The bible says unicorns exist
The bible condones slavery in no less than 5 different books
The entire old testament is filled with murder and genocide
The bible places Jesus in cities hundreds of miles apart on the same day
The bible says the earth has four corners (implying the earth is flat)
The bible says God created light... 3 days before he created the sun and stars...
...God, Who science proves to exist, actually did examine science before He set it in place
Yet another claim pulled directly from your ass
Prove it
It is a logical conclusion based on the things that god's witnesses in the bible said and say.
It is a hearsay (at best).
Oh, because the bible says so?
The bible also says that rabbits chew their cud like a cow
The bible says unicorns exist
The bible condones slavery in no less than 5 different books
The entire old testament is filled with murder and genocide
The bible places Jesus in cities hundreds of miles apart on the same day
The bible says the earth has four corners (implying the earth is flat)
The bible says God created light... 3 days before he created the sun and stars...
The bible is wrong on so many things... Literally hundreds of provable errors and contradictions
I will gladly provide dozens of links to scholarly sources on the subject if you are interested
The one thing that annoys me the most is that "everyone can understand bible in their own way" or such the cases that you've said can be understood differently from person to person or completely ignored. Ignoring the bad parts and counting just he good ones, The Evolution of Bible. Therefore bible is as much as a blank papers bounded together, it's just a great hitorical artifact, nothing else absolutely.
This is why the real Bible, the original written in Hebrew, Aramaic and Greek, was written in those languages, which are meaning specific in the things that they say.
So you talk and read Hebrew Aramaic and Greek then? Or you don't understand the Bible either?
I don't speak or read Hebrew, Aramaic, or Greek. But I do understand the Bible. How can this be?
The Bible translations are not entirely accurate according to the originals, and they probably will never be. However, there is enough accuracy in the translations that a person can get a basic understanding of what is being said. This basic understanding includes knowledge of Jesus salvation.
When a person comes to Jesus salvation, the Holy Spirit, over time, gradually works a knowledge of the rest of the Bible in Him. A non-believer in Jesus salvation doesn't get this knowledge, unless he fluently understands the original languages in their context and the way they were spoken back in their day.
Proof means real things - faith means nothing. I believe Star Wars exists. Because I've seen it. No one has seen God.
This is why faith is important. Nobody can understand the things of God. We barely can understand that there are things of God. Faith is all we have regarding things of God. The proof that God exists makes our faith in the things God tells us, to be stronger faith.
Faith, by definition, is belief without knowledge...
If you had proof of God, it would no longer require faith... Religion without faith would be science, because it would then be based on fact, not fiction...
That is a good point. Religion requires faith. There is your proof God does not exist. Because if it did, religion would not need faith.
Ahh satisfaction.
I so like it when meaningful, logical discussions reveal the truth. Truth is inevitable.
This is the same reason why theoretical science requires faith. For example. There are at least three mathematical models of the Big Bang, which is a theory. There are at least two mathematical models of Black Hole Theory. None of the 3 Big Bangs can fit together. While the 2 Black Holes can supposedly exist, they can't exist at the same place at the same time. And, mathematically speaking, neither of the Black Hole models can fit mathematically into any of the 3 Big Bang universes.
So you see, Big Bang theory and Black Hole Theory are things that must be taken on faith. Why? Because so far at least, they don't work together. In other words, they don't work.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dz2A4qXJQjc
Proof means real things - faith means nothing. I believe Star Wars exists. Because I've seen it. No one has seen God.
This is why faith is important. Nobody can understand the things of God. We barely can understand that there are things of God. Faith is all we have regarding things of God. The proof that God exists makes our faith in the things God tells us, to be stronger faith.
Faith, by definition, is belief without knowledge...
If you had proof of God, it would no longer require faith... Religion without faith would be science, because it would then be based on fact, not fiction...
That is a good point. Religion requires faith. There is your proof God does not exist. Because if it did, religion would not need faith.
Ahh satisfaction.
I so like it when meaningful, logical discussions reveal the truth. Truth is inevitable.
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