Sportsbet.io's English Premier League Football Pool Discussion Thread - page 66.

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Quote from: Hhampuz on January 26, 2024, 08:34:07 AM

Liverpool won't be the same without Klopp, sad to hear the news today.

Damn... He will be missed. I hope Liverpool finds a decent manager that would bring stability within the club and on the pitch. But it will be hard for the manager who came to replace the great Jurgen Klopp, the trendsetter of the modern gegenpress. Even Guardiola had to incorporate those ideas in his philosophy... That's why he acquired players who are good ball handlers who would also try to win the ball back asap the second they lose possesion.

And speaking of which, I think Guardiola will also follow him out of the EPL soon after 2024 - 2025 season. I wonder who'll replace him as it's also going to be hard to be the manager who came after Guardiola.

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Quote from: Harkorede on January 27, 2024, 07:48:26 AM

Man what are you high on ? have you been drinking today ?

What happened to Liverpool's 25 years Old Joe Allen and Jordan Henderson, Adam Lallana, Daniel Sturridge and even Raheem Sterling, I'm not not going to speak of sensational Albert Moreno or Mario Balotelli, What Liverpool lacked was a decent coach who knows what's he doing, and Guardiola inherited a 4th placed Manchester City, the season which Leicester won the league...

A piece of advise Sheriff, stop drinking on duty mate, Whiskey before noon is terribly bad for a law and order enforcer Grin

You probably don't want to know what happened to those players. You failed to include Mamadou Sakho and Jordan Ibe in the list of flops you just pointed out. Your Starboy Allen is having difficulty finding playing time at Stoke City. Pep saw the Liverpool squad and said, "No thanks."

Well, Don Simon is my brand, from your location to mine is less than 12hrs. Get it done. Let me top up Grin

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Quote from: Igebotz on January 27, 2024, 07:23:40 AM

Quote from: Harkorede on January 27, 2024, 06:59:22 AM

Guardiola and Klopp inherited an almost equivalent squad value, but Liverpool were such a mess indeed before Klopp's arrival and biggest props to him for the level of consistency he's brought to the club, but without Guardiola premier league would have been a one horse race for Liverpool, in my opinion.

Pep inherited League champions, Klopp inherited 6th position team. No way they inherited almost the same equivalent squad value. Grin

the biggest players in Liverpool was Skatel and Countiho. Lol Grin

Man, come on. Klopp arrived in the 2015/2016 season, winning the EPL once and two runners-up places, as well as Manchester United and Arsenal. So, without Manchester City, Liverpool would have won three Premier League titles, Manchester United two, Chelsea one, and Arsenal one. Does this appear like a one-horse race?

Man what are you high on ? have you been drinking today ?

What happened to Liverpool's 25 years Old Joe Allen and Jordan Henderson, Adam Lallana, Daniel Sturridge and even Raheem Sterling, I'm not not going to speak of sensational Albert Moreno or Mario Balotelli, What Liverpool lacked was a decent coach who knows what's he doing, and Guardiola inherited a 4th placed Manchester City, the season which Leicester won the league...

A piece of advise Sheriff, stop drinking on duty mate, Whiskey before noon is terribly bad for a law and order enforcer Grin

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Quote from: Harkorede on January 27, 2024, 06:59:22 AM

Guardiola and Klopp inherited an almost equivalent squad value, but Liverpool were such a mess indeed before Klopp's arrival and biggest props to him for the level of consistency he's brought to the club, but without Guardiola premier league would have been a one horse race for Liverpool, in my opinion.

Pep inherited League champions, Klopp inherited 6th position team. No way they inherited almost the same equivalent squad value. Grin

the biggest players in Liverpool was Skatel and Countiho. Lol Grin

Man, come on. Klopp arrived in the 2015/2016 season, winning the EPL once and two runners-up places, as well as Manchester United and Arsenal. So, without Manchester City, Liverpool would have won three Premier League titles, Manchester United two, Chelsea one, and Arsenal one. Does this appear like a one-horse race?

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Quote from: cryptofrka on January 27, 2024, 04:49:48 AM

Quote from: Harkorede on January 26, 2024, 08:31:45 AM

Klopp is a world class coach no iota of doubt, and so is Pep Guardiola, these are two managers with different ideologies but very good at what they do best, however, what @Igebotz meant by "little resources" is a terminology I still can't fathom.

Liverpool spending under Jurgen Klopp: Transfer expenditure: €1,133,615,000

Man City spending under Guardiola: Transfer expenditure: €1,492,058,181

Chelsea spending since 2015/16: Transfer expenditure: €1.936 Billion Roll Eyes

Information source: Transfermarkt.

Don't look at expenditure - the only relevant info is net spend.
Then again, if you inherit a team that is valued at 800 million, you can offload a lot of players and reduce your net spend. If you inherit a 400 mil $ team, there's no one to sell and your net spend grows.

What Klopp did with the budget he's had (net spend) is remarkable. Yes, Pep is fantastic, he changes the philosophy of football, but he does it from the position in which he can do whatever and bring whoever.
Klopp has done it all with a lot less support, and in my opinion deserves more credit for what he's done than Pep.

To be clear, Jurgen Klopp was never meant to be a part of this conversation, it's just due to the Sheriff's usual antics of bringing unrelated conversations to derail an original discussion.

The conversation was that Man City wasn't part of the dubbed "Top four" teams in England, and the Sheriff decided to go all bananas over that simply because, of he'd probably say Man City was bigger a club than Arsenal or Liverpool in 2008-2013 because they had won a premier league then Grin

Quote from: https://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-13011017/Jurgen-Klopp-net-spend-Premier-League-Big-Six-clubs.html

I just think it's very very unfair to presume Guardiola success should be attributed to how deep a pocket he has when the likes of Arsenal, Chelsea and Man United all have such a pocket, but because they all probably suck at shopping for priorities and necessities, Guardiola is to blamed for knowing his needs and goes all out for it.

Guardiola and Klopp inherited an almost equivalent squad value, but Liverpool were such a mess indeed before Klopp's arrival and biggest props to him for the level of consistency he's brought to the club, but without Guardiola premier league would have been a one horse race for Liverpool, in my opinion.

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Quote from: cryptofrka on January 27, 2024, 04:49:48 AM

What Klopp did with the budget he's had (net spend) is remarkable. Yes, Pep is fantastic, he changes the philosophy of football, but he does it from the position in which he can do whatever and bring whoever.
Klopp has done it all with a lot less support, and in my opinion deserves more credit for what he's done than Pep.

Exactly my sentiments - Klopp inherited a drowning Liverpool side out of the top4 for ages, dragging sixth and eighth every season, and rebuilt them into title challengers with limited resources. Pep, on the other hand, inherited League winners. He got the easiest job with unlimited resources. He basically points to the player he wants and gets it right away, whereas Liverpool struggles to get plan A players every season.

I'm not discrediting Pep he's still in my list of the Top 4 EPL manager of all time.

Quote from: un_rank on January 26, 2024, 02:50:47 PM

I pointed out to you that City were not the best team in England before 2013 when SAF was till in the dug out, and that is a fact. This statement is a reach.

Manchester City won their first EPL title under SAF noise in 2011 and has remained the best in England ever since. SAF was able to secure one before he retired, and Harkorede is telling me that Manchester City were not a Top 4 team until Pep

Man was unaware that Wright Phillips and Lescott were part of the early phase of Manchester City's rebuilding project, and that they were players in their prime.

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Quote from: Harkorede on January 26, 2024, 08:31:45 AM

Klopp is a world class coach no iota of doubt, and so is Pep Guardiola, these are two managers with different ideologies but very good at what they do best, however, what @Igebotz meant by "little resources" is a terminology I still can't fathom.

Liverpool spending under Jurgen Klopp: Transfer expenditure: €1,133,615,000

Man City spending under Guardiola: Transfer expenditure: €1,492,058,181

Chelsea spending since 2015/16: Transfer expenditure: €1.936 Billion Roll Eyes

Information source: Transfermarkt.

Don't look at expenditure - the only relevant info is net spend.
Then again, if you inherit a team that is valued at 800 million, you can offload a lot of players and reduce your net spend. If you inherit a 400 mil $ team, there's no one to sell and your net spend grows.

What Klopp did with the budget he's had (net spend) is remarkable. Yes, Pep is fantastic, he changes the philosophy of football, but he does it from the position in which he can do whatever and bring whoever.
Klopp has done it all with a lot less support, and in my opinion deserves more credit for what he's done than Pep.

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Quote from: Igebotz on January 26, 2024, 09:20:02 AM

Quote of the Year.

Winning all domestic titles, playing in the Champions league does not make you a Top 4 club unless Pep joins....

......Harkorede et un_rank. 2024.

I pointed out to you that City were not the best team in England before 2013 when SAF was till in the dug out, and that is a fact. This statement is a reach.

- Jay -

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Quote from: swogerino on January 26, 2024, 09:47:08 AM

Leicester City has been playing most of the time in lower divisions and lately in recent times also Nottingham Forest but anyone wanting to learn more about a certain league or a certain team they can easily find such info in the Google search engine and it will be not difficult to know things like they truly are,also learn history in this case.As long as they are able to win domestic leagues in a consistent way,only in such case they will become a top tier team,I mean Leicester.Everything else can be learned in google.

People watching the game don't need Google, do they? And kids born in the 2000s have no business discussing what happened in the 1980s. Discuss the game from the day you first started watching it. Knowing the history of the team you follow is fine, nobody will ask you what occurred in the 1970s and 1980s when dinosaurs were watching matches in Spain and England.

Nobody will ever ask Liverpool fans how it felt to win their first Premier League title since the players celebrated in an empty stadium with no fans. Grin

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Quote from: Harkorede on January 26, 2024, 09:32:37 AM

Quote from: Igebotz on January 26, 2024, 09:20:02 AM

Quote from: Harkorede on January 26, 2024, 09:05:36 AM

The genesis of this conversation remains that Man City wasn't a part of the teams dubbed the "big four" in England until Guardiola's era during which it only became dubbed the "big five", instead.

Quote of the Year.

Winning all domestic titles, playing in the Champions league does not make you a Top 4 club unless Pep joins....

......Harkorede et un_rank. 2024.

How do I explain this to my kids without looking stupid?

Explain to them that a Top 4 club in Leicester City who won the domestic league and played in the champions league are currently plying their trade in the second division and/or Nottingham Forest with all possible domestic titles and two champions league trophy is one the top 4 clubs in England Wink

Leicester City has been playing most of the time in lower divisions and lately in recent times also Nottingham Forest but anyone wanting to learn more about a certain league or a certain team they can easily find such info in the Google search engine and it will be not difficult to know things like they truly are,also learn history in this case.As long as they are able to win domestic leagues in a consistent way,only in such case they will become a top tier team,I mean Leicester.Everything else can be learned in google.

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Quote from: Harkorede on January 26, 2024, 09:32:37 AM

Quote from: Igebotz on January 26, 2024, 09:20:02 AM

Quote from: Harkorede on January 26, 2024, 09:05:36 AM

The genesis of this conversation remains that Man City wasn't a part of the teams dubbed the "big four" in England until Guardiola's era during which it only became dubbed the "big five", instead.

Quote of the Year.

Winning all domestic titles, playing in the Champions league does not make you a Top 4 club unless Pep joins....

......Harkorede et un_rank. 2024.

How do I explain this to my kids without looking stupid?

Explain to them that a Top 4 club in Leicester City who won the domestic league and played in the champions league are currently plying their trade in the second division and/or Nottingham Forest with all possible domestic titles and two champions league trophy is one the top 4 clubs in England Wink

Five conservative Champions League appearances before Pep does not sound like what Leicester City achieved. Manchester City has been a top-four club since the 2011/12 season. C'mon, bro, stop twerking. We all love him, too. Grin

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Quote from: Igebotz on January 26, 2024, 09:20:02 AM

Quote from: Harkorede on January 26, 2024, 09:05:36 AM

The genesis of this conversation remains that Man City wasn't a part of the teams dubbed the "big four" in England until Guardiola's era during which it only became dubbed the "big five", instead.

Quote of the Year.

Winning all domestic titles, playing in the Champions league does not make you a Top 4 club unless Pep joins....

......Harkorede et un_rank. 2024.

How do I explain this to my kids without looking stupid?

Explain to them that a Top 4 club in Leicester City who won the domestic league and played in the champions league are currently plying their trade in the second division and/or Nottingham Forest with all possible domestic titles and two champions league trophy is one the top 4 clubs in England Wink

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Oh wow. I've never seen this kind of thing happen. Managers usually leave in disappointment or 'mutual understanding' but this one seems like a serious goodbye. I'm not even a Liverpool fan but I love what they brought to football for the past 7 years. Klopp and Liverpool are so special, I think the whole footballing world is gonna be sad.

Pep said it many times. Klopp's teams always make his better. Dortmund made Bayern elite when they were in danger of falling. Liverpool made City elite when it was in danger of becoming Chelsea.

I hope he manages again, or at least advisory. Wow. So sad for you Liverpool guys.

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Quote from: Harkorede on January 26, 2024, 09:05:36 AM

The genesis of this conversation remains that Man City wasn't a part of the teams dubbed the "big four" in England until Guardiola's era during which it only became dubbed the "big five", instead.

Quote of the Year.

Winning all domestic titles, playing in the Champions league does not make you a Top 4 club unless Pep joins....

......Harkorede et un_rank. 2024.

How do I explain this to my kids without looking stupid?

It's over bro. Let it go. Grin

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Quote from: Igebotz on January 26, 2024, 08:49:11 AM

Quote from: Harkorede on January 26, 2024, 08:02:20 AM

If, despite all of the world-class players you named and the titles they won following the 2008 takeover, you still feel Manchester City were not an elite team prior to Pep, I would argue you began watching the EPL when Pep came. (He took numerous Barcelona fans with him, and you are just one of them.)

World class players, did you consider the squad of other teams ?

I began watching EPL in 2016 ?? aren't you just bare funny, lol.

Quote from: Igebotz on January 26, 2024, 08:49:11 AM

There were many (1) illegal transfers, (2)wrong transfer fees and (3)huge money paid to agents and many more 111 charges. Klopp -Liverpool didn't go through any of this to win trophies.

Here we go, I expected you to deflect or derail from the main conversation as usual, so, I'll let you keep riding your horse of ignorance all day long Grin

The genesis of this conversation remains that Man City wasn't a part of the teams dubbed the "big four" in England until Guardiola's era during which it only became dubbed the "big five", instead.

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Quote from: Harkorede on January 26, 2024, 08:02:20 AM

Oh my days! Just quit it mate, you're utterly mixing things up yet again!

Did you even follow football well enough from this said decade ?

Robinho joined City in 2008, spent less than 2 seasons and played 41 games in total, Carlos Tevez joined City in 2009/10 and Man City finished 5th in the league, their best league finish inside the top 10 after a long while.

Negredo didn't join Man City until 2013 and played only 32 games for Man City in EPL (one season era ?)

If, despite all of the world-class players you named and the titles they won following the 2008 takeover, you still feel Manchester City were not an elite team prior to Pep, I would argue you began watching the EPL when Pep came. (He took numerous Barcelona fans with him, and you are just one of them.)

As a core EPL fan I'm tell you that City were already given us problems before Pep

Quote from: un_rank on January 26, 2024, 08:03:23 AM

I cannot argue with your opinion, but they are worlds apart in reality. The media make it look like there is or was a rivalry between them, but 5 titles in the last 6 seasons says otherwise.

Doesn't matter - I will take Klopp over Pep every day of my life.

Quote from: Harkorede on January 26, 2024, 08:31:45 AM

@Igebotz meant by "little resources" is a terminology I still can't fathom.

There were many (1) illegal transfers, (2)wrong transfer fees and (3)huge money paid to agents and many more 111 charges. Klopp -Liverpool didn't go through any of this to win trophies.

Now give us Klopp Dortmund spending and success stories. Grin

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Quote from: Hhampuz on January 26, 2024, 08:34:07 AM

Liverpool won't be the same without Klopp, sad to hear the news today.

As you'd often say, "That's how the cookie crumbles."

It was imminent at the end of the day, no one just saw it coming or wanted it to happen this early but then c'est la vie!

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Meh.

Liverpool won't be the same without Klopp, sad to hear the news today.

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Quote from: un_rank on January 26, 2024, 08:03:23 AM

We mentioning Guardiola again *rubs palm*

Quote from: Igebotz on January 26, 2024, 06:33:21 AM

A better coach than Pep in my opinion.

I cannot argue with your opinion, but they are worlds apart in reality. The media make it look like there is or was a rivalry between them, but 5 titles in the last 6 seasons says otherwise.

Klopp is a world class coach no iota of doubt, and so is Pep Guardiola, these are two managers with different ideologies but very good at what they do best, however, what @Igebotz meant by "little resources" is a terminology I still can't fathom.

Liverpool spending under Jurgen Klopp: Transfer expenditure: €1,133,615,000

Man City spending under Guardiola: Transfer expenditure: €1,492,058,181

Chelsea spending since 2015/16: Transfer expenditure: €1.936 Billion Roll Eyes

Information source: Transfermarkt.

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We mentioning Guardiola again *rubs palm*

Quote from: Igebotz on January 26, 2024, 06:33:21 AM

A better coach than Pep in my opinion.

I cannot argue with your opinion, but they are worlds apart in reality. The media make it look like there is or was a rivalry between them, but 5 titles in the last 6 seasons says otherwise.

Quote from: Igebotz on January 26, 2024, 06:33:21 AM

Man just disrespected Robinho, Nedredo, Yaya Toure, Edin Dzeko, Tevez, Nasri, Aguero, Barry, Joe Hart era just like that! Manchester city were already the best in England before Pep under SAF watch. Man stop it already Grin

City only won 1 league title under SAF watch, and Ferguson won 5/7 before bowing out.

- Jay -

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