Topic: Two interesting emails I received today... - page 4. (Read 16449 times)

Whatever one wants to say or not say about Bruce nothing about this makes the bitcoin community look good and I would ask everyone to cease commenting on it.  I think everyone getting all worked up about this don't have enough going on in their lives and need their minute of Entertainment Tonight on bitcointalk.

I'm not so sure. I think he can get his side out, which he still has not done so with regards to the Pattaya controversy (NOT the pedo stuff, just the destination and conflict of interest). I think this new revelation about mortgage fraud is really interesting and it needs to be discussed amongst the community if this is someone that we want being the face of Bitcoin (which to this point, he has been). As I said before, the media will love mentioning that the face behind bitcoin is a convicted fraudster (if it is the same Bruce, which at this point looks likely) and that's not something we need.

I'm not from SA, but I found it linked on here and I have to say I've enjoyed the site. Those guys haven't invented or fabricated anything really, they've just posted things that Bruce himself has put out there. Sure, the jump to pedo status was a bit unwarranted, but the rest of the stuff is plainly information that's publicly available.

That's not true at all, and your saying so betrays your lack of understanding. People still face the same problem they had getting into e-gold, Pecunix LR and now bitcoin. If you can't pay in cash, you can't get in. The auctions like Mt Gox serve a different function and are no competition to an exchanger. You might hear people refer to Gox, TH et al as "exchangers" but they are really not exchanging at all. The exchanger is Dwolla or Paxum. Mt Gox is the auction where traders meet. There is no exchange of fiat to digital currency there. Nobody at Gox will hold your hand through a WU, wire or other payment. You have to already have the DC when you get to Gox, or you can't trade there.

Not suggesting that at all. But then you are suggesting you ( SA ) has never been wrong either. I don't have a beef with SA I just want more transparency so the other forum members who don't know who SA is  can know who is associated with whom so they can make a well thought out opinion . I'm not taking a side either - who knows maybe Bruce has done what you all are accusing him of doing but it doesn't do you all any good to hide behind any "motives" either.

He does have many venue's but up against hundreds of SA members there is no way he'll be able to get his facts our to the story against a "machine" like this. Thanks for a civil discussion btw.

So we'll stop playing a game of 'our facts vs his' and play 'post the court documents and screenshots' when we get all the shit we're digging up organized
Not suggesting that at all. But then you are suggesting you ( SA ) has never been wrong either. I don't have a beef with SA I just want more transparency so the other forum members who don't know who SA is  can know who is associated with whom so they can make a well thought out opinion . I'm not taking a side either - who knows maybe Bruce has done what you all are accusing him of doing but it doesn't do you all any good to hide behind any "motives" either.

He does have many venue's but up against hundreds of SA members there is no way he'll be able to get his facts our to the story against a "machine" like this. Thanks for a civil discussion btw.

Are you suggesting that we're going back in time and creating articles 5 years ago to discredit someone?  Whether or not any one of us is trustworthy is kind of besides the point.  The information is available for anyone willing to look for it.

Also, Bruce has an account here and is CEO of a worldwide television network.  That's pretty much the definition of 'public figure' and he has multiple avenues to defend himself.

Illinois Foreclosure Rescue Company Fined and Shut Down
Wednesday, April 19 2006 12:27
Following a lawsuit brought by Illinois Cook County State's Attorney Richard Devine, a fraudulent mortgage lending company has been fined $250,000 and banned from doing business in Illinois.

Bold Funding, Inc. and its owner-operator, Bruce Wagner, were found to have violated Illinois law by falsely promising to secure private funding for loans to save the homes of persons who were in foreclosure for a fee ranging from $300 to $6,670.

In Civil Court on April 18, 2006, Judge Julia Nowicki ordered Bold Funding and Bruce Wagner to refund $115,858 in application fees to 74 former customers who never received any funding from the Defendants. Bold Funding and Bruce Wagner were also fined $250,000, and the Defendants were permanently banned from providing any services in Illinois related to residential mortgage loans.

"The taking of monies from vulnerable homeowners in foreclosure under false pretenses is reprehensibleX," Devine said. "Any company which purports to help homeowners who are in foreclosure must follow the law and fulfill its promises to assist its customers."

In 2004, Bold Funding maintained its "headquarters" at a commercial post office box at 40 E. Chicago Ave., Chicago, Illinois. Bold Funding also operated a website at http://www.boldfunding.com and sponsored hundreds of commercials on local and out-of-state radio stations. On its website and radio commercials, Bold Funding claimed that it could save homes from foreclosure even after a Sheriff s sale. Homeowners in foreclosure sent thousands of dollars to Bold Funding under the belief that Bold Funding would secure funding to refinance their mortgages and save their homes. The Defendants did not arrange or provide any funding. Neither Bold Funding nor Bruce Wagner ever possessed an Illinois residential mortgage broker's or lender's license.

On November 10, 2004, the Cook County State's Attorney's Office Consumer Fraud Division filed its lawsuit against Bold Funding and Bruce Wagner charging the Defendants with violating the Illinois Consumer Fraud and Deceptive Business Practices Act. This lawsuit was initiated after the State's Attorney's Office received numerous complaints from citizens regarding Bold Funding. Bold Funding and Bruce Wagner could not identify anyone who actually received any funding through the efforts of the Defendants. The court heard testimony from one victim who testified that she lost her home, and another victim who testified that he had to file for bankruptcy to save his home after the Defendants failed to obtain funding for him.

Consumers with questions or complaints about other foreclosure "rescue" businesses may contact the Cook County State's Attorney's Office, Consumer Fraud Division, at (312) 603-8700, or online at http://www.statesattorney.org.

i would have to say i am slightly relived that he is not a pedophile. However I don't think we really ever needed a "spokesmen".

I also think all the shit people are giving him is uncalled for. Although i didn't see as much as you would think, but i still don't particularly care for it.

Also, this article from 2006 is clearly about him and has him living in the Illinois area, matching up with the article.
http://therealbrucewagner.blogspot.com/

You have to admit where does the line stop with "bs" and the truth -  as you say and what kind of credibility can a forum like that have when you start blasting someone with really bad accusations with basically no evidence or the person can't even defend themselves? And your ok with associating with people who do this and do this on another forum around a great technology as bitcoin?  and who does this for fun?

If "mobilizing" is against the rules if I were to ask let me see a raise of hands how many people on this thread are from SA I bet a good portion would be from there  and this isn't "breaking the rules"?

I don't know about the rest of you but there is no creditably from ANYONE from SA  member and who is also a member of this forum to go around accusing others for the "fun of it". Just my humble opinion.

No, we're not a troll board.  We do like to laugh at people acting stupid, and we like to point out really horrible shit about people that others are missing, but 'mobilizing' is considered forum invasion and against the rules.  If you think there's no intelligent conversation on SA then you're deluding yourself.  We do tend to dogpile obvious BS, though.

I love bitcoins as a study of money since I'm an Economics/Accounting major which is why I've followed it this closely.  This Bruce stuff is just the newest in a long string of hilarious and completely obvious shit to come out of the project.

At least you are honest I'll give you that  .  I wasn't referring to the "mortgage scam" I don't have an opinion on it and wasn't my point - we've all done something wrong once in our life. I was pointing out as for as I know somethingawefull is troll board that mobilizes to bring down people either  right or wrong ... in this case most likely wrong - is this correct to assume this? I see no good of a board like that compared to this where there is actually intelligent talking going on ( minus the scams) . I mean correct me if I'm wrong in my thinking?  Also, you have full right to be member of that board I just wish people were more honest like yourself!

No, it's not.

This is bullshit. It's nothing but a common first and last name.

I'm from somethingisawful.com.  Can you really claim a false attack when we're just pointing out stuff that's really easy to find on the internet?  I used to defend Bruce.  Sure, I didn't agree with his views on bitcoins, but I thought he was a lovable dupe following his dream.  

It's hard to hold that opinion when you find information that he was involved in a mortgage scam stealing money from people, though:
http://mortgagefraudblog.com/perp-walk/item/10674-illinois_foreclosure_rescue_company_fined_and_shut_down

Please explain to me how it's a 'false attack' when the article is from 2007 and none of us knew he existed back then.

This is bullshit. It's nothing but a common first and last name.