UEFA Europa League Discussion Thread - page 228.

joker_josue

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Quote from: Juggy777 on June 15, 2021, 10:33:24 PM

@mv1986 I think both are equally great because each one of them have achieved records which may never be broken, and both did whatever it took to win games on their own. However there’s one key difference between them, as Ronaldo went to different clubs and won, and Messi stayed at one club only and hence the world will say Ronaldo is more better than Messi.

I agree that this factor is fundamental to define who will be better between the two.

If Messi doesn't play for another club, he will always be at a disadvantage. Because he only played for Barcelona and for the National Team
We already know how he plays for Barcelona, a team built with him in mind. But how will he be playing on other teams? In the national team he rarely has great performances, and he still hasn't managed to win any competition.

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Quote from: Juggy777 on June 15, 2021, 10:33:24 PM

Quote from: mv1986 on June 15, 2021, 02:17:22 PM

Quote from: joker_josue on June 14, 2021, 01:53:09 AM

Quote from: mv1986 on June 13, 2021, 06:20:09 PM

I like watching both, but for me personally Messi is another level. There is this interview, I believe with Ibrahimovic, and he says, Ronaldo is the best on planet earth, and then there is Messi. I agree, Messi is just different. His free kick statistic alone is unbelievable.

This will be the eternal debate, which of the two is better. Both players have different characteristics. One has certain abilities that the other doesn't.
What defines, season by season, who is the best, will be the performance they had together with their teams.
I think we have to be happy that we have the opportunity to see the two best players in the world at the same time playing.

Messi is by far better in dribblings, by far better in free kicks, by far better in servicing his team mates putting them into the best position possible to score, Messi is by far better in 1:1, even in 1:7. When he gets the ball he just runs across the whole pitch and still scores. Ronaldo is by far better at headers, but that's not all too surprising given how tall Messi is.

I wonder what Ronaldo would have done if Juventus would have played Europa League next season. I don't think he would have stayed in Turin.

@mv1986 I think both are equally great because each one of them have achieved records which may never be broken, and both did whatever it took to win games on their own. However there’s one key difference between them, as Ronaldo went to different clubs and won, and Messi stayed at one club only and hence the world will say Ronaldo is more better than Messi.

Who is the best of these two can never be determined. The player you like to watch will be the best for you. Ronaldo does not have the skills that Messi has in dribbling. Again, like Ronaldo, Messi has yet to score from a bicycle kick. I would say the two players are the best, in different sectors.

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Quote from: mv1986 on June 15, 2021, 02:17:22 PM

Quote from: joker_josue on June 14, 2021, 01:53:09 AM

Quote from: mv1986 on June 13, 2021, 06:20:09 PM

I like watching both, but for me personally Messi is another level. There is this interview, I believe with Ibrahimovic, and he says, Ronaldo is the best on planet earth, and then there is Messi. I agree, Messi is just different. His free kick statistic alone is unbelievable.

This will be the eternal debate, which of the two is better. Both players have different characteristics. One has certain abilities that the other doesn't.
What defines, season by season, who is the best, will be the performance they had together with their teams.

I think we have to be happy that we have the opportunity to see the two best players in the world at the same time playing.

Messi is by far better in dribblings, by far better in free kicks, by far better in servicing his team mates putting them into the best position possible to score, Messi is by far better in 1:1, even in 1:7. When he gets the ball he just runs across the whole pitch and still scores. Ronaldo is by far better at headers, but that's not all too surprising given how tall Messi is.

I wonder what Ronaldo would have done if Juventus would have played Europa League next season. I don't think he would have stayed in Turin.

@mv1986 I think both are equally great because each one of them have achieved records which may never be broken, and both did whatever it took to win games on their own. However there’s one key difference between them, as Ronaldo went to different clubs and won, and Messi stayed at one club only and hence the world will say Ronaldo is more better than Messi.

mv1986

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Quote from: joker_josue on June 14, 2021, 01:53:09 AM

Quote from: mv1986 on June 13, 2021, 06:20:09 PM

I like watching both, but for me personally Messi is another level. There is this interview, I believe with Ibrahimovic, and he says, Ronaldo is the best on planet earth, and then there is Messi. I agree, Messi is just different. His free kick statistic alone is unbelievable.

This will be the eternal debate, which of the two is better. Both players have different characteristics. One has certain abilities that the other doesn't.
What defines, season by season, who is the best, will be the performance they had together with their teams.

I think we have to be happy that we have the opportunity to see the two best players in the world at the same time playing.

Messi is by far better in dribblings, by far better in free kicks, by far better in servicing his team mates putting them into the best position possible to score, Messi is by far better in 1:1, even in 1:7. When he gets the ball he just runs across the whole pitch and still scores. Ronaldo is by far better at headers, but that's not all too surprising given how tall Messi is.

I wonder what Ronaldo would have done if Juventus would have played Europa League next season. I don't think he would have stayed in Turin.

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Quote from: mv1986 on June 13, 2021, 06:20:09 PM

I like watching both, but for me personally Messi is another level. There is this interview, I believe with Ibrahimovic, and he says, Ronaldo is the best on planet earth, and then there is Messi. I agree, Messi is just different. His free kick statistic alone is unbelievable.

This will be the eternal debate, which of the two is better. Both players have different characteristics. One has certain abilities that the other doesn't.
What defines, season by season, who is the best, will be the performance they had together with their teams.

I think we have to be happy that we have the opportunity to see the two best players in the world at the same time playing.

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Quote from: Luzin on June 13, 2021, 06:48:58 AM

Quote from: yemight600 on June 13, 2021, 12:39:36 AM

Chelsea couldn't have wont the cup without determination however manchester United is lacking in that aspect.

Even though I was very confident with the MU squad at that time. They have players above Villarreal so I am very sure that they will win.
But it's true what you say, United don't have the same fighting spirit, determination as Villareal. They underestimate the opponent too much before playing. MU management seems to have to evaluate Solskejaer immediately.

I think the main requirements from Solskjaer will be this season. I think the main requirements from Solskjaer will be this season. Manchester United, with its ambition and history, needs titles, not just places in the finals or qualifying for the Champions League. The pressure will increase and if now the fans of Manchester United were happy that the team at least claims something, then as they say, the appetite comes with eating. Villarreal is writing its club history in front of us and it turned out that the players did everything impossible for this plus Emery, who has already accumulated a decent experience of winning the Europa League in different conditions.

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Quote from: joker_josue on June 09, 2021, 01:53:24 AM

Quote from: mv1986 on June 08, 2021, 11:08:55 PM

The thing with Messi is he does't have to run the pitch up and down nonstop in order to be noticed as an engaged player. Everyone in the stadium and in front of the TV knows that it is just this one action he needs. The free kick, the solo dribbling for 70 yards, the genius pass across the pitch. The way he plays the game has always been pretty much the same and not for a second would you think "this guy can't score today". Because he can.

Messi and Ronaldo are those players, whose worst day is better than the whole team.

The game may not be going well for them, but at any moment, they can score a goal.
They don't just hit the ball or the free kick that they score well, it's their possibility on the field. It helps the world.
And another important thing, even if they have a bad game, their presence on cable, can mean that their colleagues are not marked and so they can even do a good job.

I like watching both, but for me personally Messi is another level. There is this interview, I believe with Ibrahimovic, and he says, Ronaldo is the best on planet earth, and then there is Messi. I agree, Messi is just different. His free kick statistic alone is unbelievable.

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Quote from: ?? on ??

Not so easy win for England vs Croatia.
In my opinion, England is a Tier 2 team, with only France in Tier 1, and they could win easier versus them.

Anyway 3 points and now the game no one will watch

Austria - Northern Macedonia Huh

Wrong topic coinlocket, that's Europa League one and not EURO.
After all England got the precious 3 points and Austria + Netherlands should follow too by the end of the day.

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Quote from: yemight600 on June 13, 2021, 12:39:36 AM

Chelsea couldn't have wont the cup without determination however manchester United is lacking in that aspect.

Even though I was very confident with the MU squad at that time. They have players above Villarreal so I am very sure that they will win.
But it's true what you say, United don't have the same fighting spirit, determination as Villareal. They underestimate the opponent too much before playing. MU management seems to have to evaluate Solskejaer immediately.

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Quote from: ILuckyGuyI on June 02, 2021, 05:06:57 AM

Quote from: babo on May 28, 2021, 03:14:35 AM

i dont like the game
and i dont expect Manchester United is so slow (mentally, i mean in the mind)

i dont bet because at this level is hard to win a bet... congrats to villareal

i'am happy for this tiny team
but i dont like this kind of game

long, boring, exhausting

It was really hard to make a bet, I agree with you on that. I actually thought Manchester Utd would win the title but still I didn't get the guts to bet on them. Grin

And I'm really happy that I didn't now. Lastly, I agree with the boring part also.

Thank God you didn't place a bet on Manchester United. The team have all it's need to win (squard, fitness, coach) except determination which is the most important part of competition winning. Chelsea couldn't have wont the cup without determination however manchester United is lacking in that aspect.

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Quote from: AakZaki on June 09, 2021, 08:34:39 AM

Quote from: Juggy777 on June 09, 2021, 04:29:45 AM

@DU18 there’s no doubt that a fit Cavani can do lot of damage on the opposite teams, but what’s the guarantee that he can be fit to play all the matches.
~snip~

He's old, it's natural to have doubts but remember his experience is very useful for other young players. Some of the strikers I think Manchester United would suit are Erling Haaland, Harry Kane and maybe Ronaldo (even though they are old).
The news that I heard Harry Kane was not comfortable at Tottenham, because he could not feel the title while there. I think Manchester City should be able to take advantage of this moment.

I have not seen any news of Ronaldo leaving Juventus at the moment. He will probably stay at Juventus next season. Rumors are circulating that Tuchel wants to take Haaland to the team. Chelsea needs a skilled striker at the moment. I don't think Chelsea will miss the opportunity to take Haaland to the team. Aguero has moved from Manchester City to Barcelona. Kane is suitable as Aguero's replacement. He is a goal machine. And Kane wants to win the title. Manchester City are the right team for Harry Kane to win the title.

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Quote from: Juggy777 on June 09, 2021, 04:29:45 AM

@DU18 there’s no doubt that a fit Cavani can do lot of damage on the opposite teams, but what’s the guarantee that he can be fit to play all the matches.
~snip~

He's old, it's natural to have doubts but remember his experience is very useful for other young players. Some of the strikers I think Manchester United would suit are Erling Haaland, Harry Kane and maybe Ronaldo (even though they are old).
The news that I heard Harry Kane was not comfortable at Tottenham, because he could not feel the title while there. I think Manchester City should be able to take advantage of this moment.

Juggy777

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Quote from: DU18 on June 09, 2021, 04:10:21 AM

Quote from: swogerino on June 03, 2021, 09:06:42 AM

Cavani still has it and it is a really good player.Manchester United should only have to wait a bit as he will get in shape during the first stages of upcoming Premier League season,Manchester United will also be playing in Champions League where Cavani has excelled many times there with PSG and other teams he has played for.If he gets in shape which I believe he will this year we are going to see a great Premier League season with Manchester United being a strong contender since the beginning as they have really good attacking players.

When Manchester United signed Cavani this season, many people doubted that Cavani could impress at Man United this season, especially since the Uruguayan national team player was recruited by Man United at a not young age, which is 33 years old, but as a professional player, Cavani certainly makes a surprise to silence everyone who had doubted him by scoring 15 goals and five assists in 35 appearances for Man United this season.
I think Cavani still deserves to be one of the strikers who are the mainstay of Manchester United next season but even so Ole Gunnar Solskjaer certainly still needs a new striker to be able to maintain the performance of his team next season playing in the domestic league and also the champions league.

@DU18 there’s no doubt that a fit Cavani can do lot of damage on the opposite teams, but what’s the guarantee that he can be fit to play all the matches. Also I’m not doubting his potential, but I’m concerned because of his injury record and therefore I too agree that the club needs one more striker to provide cover for him.

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Quote from: swogerino on June 03, 2021, 09:06:42 AM

Cavani still has it and it is a really good player.Manchester United should only have to wait a bit as he will get in shape during the first stages of upcoming Premier League season,Manchester United will also be playing in Champions League where Cavani has excelled many times there with PSG and other teams he has played for.If he gets in shape which I believe he will this year we are going to see a great Premier League season with Manchester United being a strong contender since the beginning as they have really good attacking players.

When Manchester United signed Cavani this season, many people doubted that Cavani could impress at Man United this season, especially since the Uruguayan national team player was recruited by Man United at a not young age, which is 33 years old, but as a professional player, Cavani certainly makes a surprise to silence everyone who had doubted him by scoring 15 goals and five assists in 35 appearances for Man United this season.
I think Cavani still deserves to be one of the strikers who are the mainstay of Manchester United next season but even so Ole Gunnar Solskjaer certainly still needs a new striker to be able to maintain the performance of his team next season playing in the domestic league and also the champions league.

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Quote from: mv1986 on June 08, 2021, 11:08:55 PM

The thing with Messi is he does't have to run the pitch up and down nonstop in order to be noticed as an engaged player. Everyone in the stadium and in front of the TV knows that it is just this one action he needs. The free kick, the solo dribbling for 70 yards, the genius pass across the pitch. The way he plays the game has always been pretty much the same and not for a second would you think "this guy can't score today". Because he can.

Messi and Ronaldo are those players, whose worst day is better than the whole team.

The game may not be going well for them, but at any moment, they can score a goal.
They don't just hit the ball or the free kick that they score well, it's their possibility on the field. It helps the world.
And another important thing, even if they have a bad game, their presence on cable, can mean that their colleagues are not marked and so they can even do a good job.

mv1986

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Quote from: Trofo on June 06, 2021, 04:40:30 AM

Quote from: mv1986 on June 06, 2021, 04:30:55 AM

When it comes to work ethics there are probably players that are better than Cavani. I don't want to give Ronaldo as an example because that guy is just crazy, but when it comes to scandals and longer vacations, it happens more often to Cavani. The issue is that it shows his mind set. These people give up earlier in games.

Neymar is a great example: he can play out of this world but also lose his mind completely and just give up and start playing bad being angry and so on. You have almost never ever seen Messi or Ronaldo or Lewandowski give up. They don't give up. Those guys also don't party. They are solely determined to be successful on the pitch.

I am accepting first part of your argument about work ethics, Ronaldo and Messi are out of this world and they made what they did because they had talent and then worked harder than anyone to develop it to its full potential. That goes double for Ronaldo.

The part where they don't give up is absolutely not true. There is so many Messi games coming to my mind when you can see him with head down and totally out of a game. That goes hand in hand with that old Barca argument that they would be better team if they had a captain like Roy Keane or Puyol, that is the type of the guy that never gives up and would yell at his teammates and make them give their best as well. Messi is best player in the world but he is not that guy.

There was a statistic published by the economist which player scored the most game decisive goals in history. It is a while ago and I can't exactly recall how many years, but back then it was Messi. They had a scale where the first goal of the game counted more than the 4-0 and so on. They built an interesting scale also for finals ad different competitions.

The thing with Messi is he does't have to run the pitch up and down nonstop in order to be noticed as an engaged player. Everyone in the stadium and in front of the TV knows that it is just this one action he needs. The free kick, the solo dribbling for 70 yards, the genius pass across the pitch. The way he plays the game has always been pretty much the same and not for a second would you think "this guy can't score today". Because he can.

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Quote from: mv1986 on June 06, 2021, 04:30:55 AM

When it comes to work ethics there are probably players that are better than Cavani. I don't want to give Ronaldo as an example because that guy is just crazy, but when it comes to scandals and longer vacations, it happens more often to Cavani. The issue is that it shows his mind set. These people give up earlier in games.

Neymar is a great example: he can play out of this world but also lose his mind completely and just give up and start playing bad being angry and so on. You have almost never ever seen Messi or Ronaldo or Lewandowski give up. They don't give up. Those guys also don't party. They are solely determined to be successful on the pitch.

I am accepting first part of your argument about work ethics, Ronaldo and Messi are out of this world and they made what they did because they had talent and then worked harder than anyone to develop it to its full potential. That goes double for Ronaldo.

The part where they don't give up is absolutely not true. There is so many Messi games coming to my mind when you can see him with head down and totally out of a game. That goes hand in hand with that old Barca argument that they would be better team if they had a captain like Roy Keane or Puyol, that is the type of the guy that never gives up and would yell at his teammates and make them give their best as well. Messi is best player in the world but he is not that guy.

mv1986

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Quote from: hahay on June 03, 2021, 03:47:47 AM

Quote from: joker_josue on June 02, 2021, 07:02:03 PM

Quote from: mv1986 on June 02, 2021, 04:25:28 PM

It is nice that Cavani extended his contract. He is a weapon if he is in good shape.

Cavani's problem is the holidays. Man can't go to Argentina, he just wants parties, girls, and nothing else. Then when the season resumes, you have to work harder (if you feel like it) to get in shape.
That's why he only starts to have good performances towards the middle of the season.

I'm personally not sure if the problem is just about holidays, because when it comes to holidays I think other players are getting the same thing or at least not much different from him. Yesterday was his first season at Manchester United so yes I think that's natural and even so, Cavani was still able to score in yesterday's final and that is something great considering at his age that he is no longer young so there will be many factors to attention.

When it comes to work ethics there are probably players that are better than Cavani. I don't want to give Ronaldo as an example because that guy is just crazy, but when it comes to scandals and longer vacations, it happens more often to Cavani. The issue is that it shows his mind set. These people give up earlier in games.

Neymar is a great example: he can play out of this world but also lose his mind completely and just give up and start playing bad being angry and so on. You have almost never ever seen Messi or Ronaldo or Lewandowski give up. They don't give up. Those guys also don't party. They are solely determined to be successful on the pitch.

mv1986

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Quote from: babo on June 04, 2021, 02:01:21 AM

Quote from: Ebede on June 03, 2021, 03:20:19 AM

Manchester United Coach making irregular decisions always,Rashy wasn't at he's best at all in that match, mean while Greenwood was not meant to be pulled out.
Congratulations to Villarreal!

Agree with you

irregular decisions sometime is good, sometime is bad.. the beauty of football/soccer
Some time a weak team, with passion.. win against strong team.. because (like i said before) is the beauty of this sport

at the moment, my preferred "moment" is a story/legend of Leichester Cheesy

very magic story

But it's always hard to take someone like Rashford off. He is good for a goal in so many situations. No doubt Greenwood is awesome too, but imagine you would be the coach. Would you take Rashford out in a final? Very tough decision. Maybe the key for Villareal was that Manchester underestimated them because they themselves were in a pretty good shape.

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Quote from: Ebede on June 03, 2021, 03:20:19 AM

Manchester United Coach making irregular decisions always,Rashy wasn't at he's best at all in that match, mean while Greenwood was not meant to be pulled out.
Congratulations to Villarreal!

Agree with you

irregular decisions sometime is good, sometime is bad.. the beauty of football/soccer
Some time a weak team, with passion.. win against strong team.. because (like i said before) is the beauty of this sport

at the moment, my preferred "moment" is a story/legend of Leichester Cheesy

very magic story

Topic: UEFA Europa League Discussion Thread - page 228. (Read 34287 times)