Topic: [Ver 2.0] R14x: Intl. Robocoin GB ATM Launch in EU, N America, Feb '14. PMs only (Read 31338 times)

Hey everyone,

Thanks for being patient thru the manual refund process.

Unlocking this topic and updating this thread in case you're wondering what became of our ATM management offering: https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/open-robocoin-btc-atm-operating-services-available-in-us-and-internationally-330662

For legal reasons we had to retool it as a Services offering. Unfortunately, you or a group will need to buy a Bitcoin ATM or ATMs outright to take advantage of our new Service.

If you (or your group) do proceed, you own the Bitcoin ATM(s) forever, which is much better than our modified terms of 3 years from R14x, Ver. 1.0. In fact, you can even replace us as your Services company, if you'd like.

We're still planning to launch in those first 5 locations we listed (except #1 will be Berlin). What's different about this retooled rollout is that as customers contact us, this will modify our rollout plans based on actual demand.

Also, we're buying ATMs from Robocoin with internal funds and customer funds before the 18th; it's just a matter of how many we're buying.



P.S. If you're already a co-op member who was keen on R14x and you don't have the funds for an entire ATM, please send me a PM to discuss your situation.

For those that sent partial payment the site doesn't keep track of this by default if you did send this I will need your order# and refund address and I can look up your bitcents and send them back to you.

I am so sorry but this offer is CLOSED INDEFINITELY. We are refunding everyone as soon as orders are confirmed on Thomas's spreadsheets.

This will be done in batches and you *will* get your refund back.

After conferring with legal staff and our board of directors, I have decided that we (I) jumped in too early and that this is much too risky for a startup.  
We actually had a lot of legal counsel today offsite. It turns out that *no one* has attempted to do this so far. There's zero case law to refer to.

We are refunding everyone and freezing sales. The legal morass is just too much to deal with right now for a small startup.

If you're willing to buy a machine that needs management services, please talk to us.


==

We are looking for Qualified Investors. We are also looking for potential locations for said ATMs. Please contact us for discussions if you'd like to work with us.

We are looking into our public proof of concept. We still intend to come back for the US launch, it all depends upon Washington DC and what state governments decide as far as laws/policy.

I was interested until I read the 300% cap.  Doesn't make sense to do this, let people get in at the ground level and stay in for life.  PS, more machines in Canada!

i am a bit disappointed it only lasts 2 years or as soon at 300% ROI is reached and then they get to keep the ATMs but thats what they want to do it's their choice i guess.
i got my full BTC refund back no problem at all for my order #460, thankyou for the refund, i hope everything goes well in the future

+1

People only invest what you are willing to lose.

They refunded a large order on my part. That is a good sign about their intentions at least.

+1

Getting Bitcoin ATMs into some capital cities via crowd-funding is a great idea, but this is more like a 2-year USD-Bond with 300% interest, than an invest into BTC cash machines.

I'm a bit disappointed..

Was looking for a long term investment.  I don't particularly fancy being used to front these machines for you guys to keep after 2 years.

unless there is long term dividend on profits, I'm sorry but I'm not interested.

+1

So to be clear, at the end of this agreement we will have received the BTC-equivalent of $492 calculated at that time? In other words, we will not necessarily receive BTC2.46?
(1 share = $123 = BTC0.615 at $200/BTC - 4xshare = BTC2.46)

my 2 satoshis to OP:
1. denominate the shares in BTC or some call it XBT now. ( don't use USD )
2. hire lawyers
3. hire an auditor
4. get an escrow to act as trustee and distribute the dividends.

my 2 satoshis to potential investors:
1. let the buyer beware (Caveat emptor)
2. do your own due diligence
3. there's plenty of other XBT investments out there. (just like the ones we in BitAngels see on a daily basis)

Hello,
I would like to see a business plan written up or full disclosure. Such as a prospectus. Guaranteeing a certain ROI is a bit worrisome. I think of the show "American greed". Everybody guarantees a certain amount and we know how that turns out..
Just some random thoughts
Brian

One ATM is limited size for sure.

But when i read the ROI... turning $123 into $492 might be 300% ROI but only if the bitcoin price freezes now. If the bitcoin price goes from $230 to $690 in 2 years it would be the same like keeping the bitcoins. If the bitcoin price is higher thatn $690 in 2years!!! then it would be a negative ROI for me instead keeping my bitcoins. And i highly doubt that the bitcoin is at 690$ in 2 years. If he is lower or even dead then the ATMs would be dead too.

So thats not for me. I dont see why the ROI is calculated in USD but maybe the numbers are correct from the first ATMs results. Where are the numbers of that ATM? Maybe these numbers are not real and in reality higher?

I really hope that you guys can work this out. Is there a possibility of retaining a lawyer if beavertank can't help? Also, I have a question about payment. I can send in enough coins that I will only have about .04BTC left, however Coinbase apparently took away my ability to purchase BTC instantly, and my BTC will come in on Friday. Is this acceptable or should I just bow out? I am order #451 if that helps.

Oh, do tell? We are all ears. We have an oil/gas contracts expert on-board, but honestly, any help to navigate this legal international morass is greatly appreciated. We may be able to work out a BTC compensation for your services.

We really, really wish we could just give you guys partial ownership for life. Believe us: if there's a way to give you guys partial ownership for the life of the ATM outright, we'd take that option in a NY minute.

We are still reserving this option as our first choice, if this becomes feasible.


===

FWIW, for those worrying about the legality of an offering running afoul of SEC laws, there is an exemption for "offerings of limited size."

"Not all offerings of securities must be registered with the Commission. Some exemptions from the registration requirement include:

    private offerings to a limited number of persons or institutions;

    offerings of limited size;

    intrastate offerings; and

    securities of municipal, state, and federal governments.

By exempting many small offerings from the registration process, the SEC seeks to foster capital formation by lowering the cost of offering securities to the public."

http://www.sec.gov/about/laws.shtml

Digging through it again, I could not find any clarification as to what size of an offering will trigger mandatory SEC registration.

==

Pertaining to ROI payback: if you invested $123 in a share, with a 300% ROI guarantee, you will receive the BTC equivalent of $492, or 4x your original investment.

Again, our first choice is to give you outright ownership if we can legally square this away, with this 300% ROI guarantee of 4x your original investment as our 2nd option we *really* don't want to take, but may be forced to at this early stage of our startup's operations.

I tend to agree with this sentiment, the main attraction to an ATM over a miner is that there is no concern about unpredictable future profitability. It should be able to run for the full life of the hardware and produce income for investors over that entire timeframe, rather than operate as financing of a longer-term investment for the corporation's owners.

I'm not particularly interested in becoming the corporation's lawyer, but if the main reason for the two year/300% ROI timeframe is legal compliance concerns I would be willing to put my expertise to use in overcoming that concern so this can become a life-of-the-ATM type investment rather than a bond-financing situation.

When will DZ host an ATM in Hong Kong?

So now you explain that i only jumpstart your own business? I have to donate my part of the ATM to you after 2 years? So that its not only the 20% you earn as the organisator you get 100% later for all the ATM.

Why is that needed? This doesnt have to be a security. I dont need to own a company. I own a part on a machine. I doubt thats a security. And if it were, then i dont own a part on the machine, i would get bounty since i brought the company a good thing some time ago? Bounties are paid out all the time.

Anyway... with Asicminer i knew friedcat will get his fair share and i will take part the whole time. Im not sure that i want to see ATM's being a big success over time and then i have to donate everything like it became the next google type of success.

And the ROI over 2 years? I bought shares in USD. So i hope that doesnt mean i get revenue in USD. Since when i look at the developing of the bitcoin price it would be laughable it bitcoins would be only 3 times as costly in 2 years as they are now. So if your ROI is calculated in USD really it would be a sure way to make a loss.

When i invest im in with my money as risk and i want to be in with my money with the success too. Not being the donator that donates someone other a big business.

I hope you find another solution since i dont like this.

I'm pretty sure this would result in the ATM's being seized and any hope of getting our money back would vanish. While this works for ASICMiner, that's only because they're mining and are only selling mining equipment (although that may change in the future). Here the company has to abide by a whole different set of laws that are very strict (Know Your Customer/money laundering laws). However, I'm hoping that I'm wrong and you're right.