VOD should be removed from default trust for systematic abuse of his position - page 26.

SavellM

sr. member

Activity: 305

Merit: 250

Quote from: Muhammed Zakir on May 30, 2015, 10:58:31 AM

Quote from: jonald_fyookball on May 30, 2015, 09:49:36 AM

I don't know what he said. lets see exactly what was said.

Quote from: SavellM on May 14, 2015, 06:43:50 AM

Ok Vod if you say so.
Almost like you know me so well, and know exactly what I have invested and traded with.

But its ok, lets agree to disagree and end this here.
You have got your wishes, I have removed my listing and I will not post anything until the 15th June.

Like I said show me anywhere I have POSTED ie. Forum asking for a loan?
There is no solid ground, as it could mean not asking for another loan, and it could mean not asking on the forums here for another loan.

And I have not asking on the forums for a loan.

Still the issue is default trust and the abuse of this controlling the web.

Vod

legendary

Activity: 3668

Merit: 3010

Licking my boob since 1970

Quote from: tidus1097 on May 30, 2015, 05:34:03 PM

Quote from: Fazbeidel on May 29, 2015, 04:34:13 AM

VOD is a dickhead!

oh no now he will give me -rep Grin

This guy scammer: https://bitcointalksearch.org/user/fazbeidel-508087

phutto chonthicha (The recipient of this payment is Non-U.S. - Verified)
Email:
[email protected]

Quote from: Fazbeidel on May 30, 2015, 11:48:53 AM

Wonder why? You're a lying pos. He knew this about you. Hence is why you got -neg rep'ed.

It seems most people who have a problem with me turn out to be scammers. Go figure. Undecided

tidus1097

sr. member

Activity: 434

Merit: 252

Quote from: Fazbeidel on May 29, 2015, 04:34:13 AM

VOD is a dickhead!

oh no now he will give me -rep Grin

This guy scammer: https://bitcointalksearch.org/user/fazbeidel-508087

phutto chonthicha (The recipient of this payment is Non-U.S. - Verified)
Email:
[email protected]

Quote from: Fazbeidel on May 30, 2015, 11:48:53 AM

Wonder why? You're a lying pos. He knew this about you. Hence is why you got -neg rep'ed.

Snagglebone

member

Activity: 87

Merit: 10

Quote from: Muhammed Zakir on May 30, 2015, 11:41:43 AM

Quote from: legendster on May 30, 2015, 11:30:28 AM

This is ludicrous if you ask me.

Why should VOD be the dictator of when someone gets to ask for a loan ?

Say if his father has an accident next day and exhausts his savings / insurance and asking for a loan on Jam is the ONLY choice he is left with, VOD can come in and label him as a scammer, like WTF ?

Its like appointing VOD the authority from where Save has to get 'Permission' before asking for a loan (here or anywhere).

Yes I ve been here for a while and I have seen how much scammers have tormented the people on this forum and on Jam. But what the hell ? Why are people gonna get a rating BEFORE a scam happens ?

This shit is so Minority Report...

Like I said, "trust" is the issue here.

The trust is fine. I don't have any problems with VOD leaving negative trust to people for whatever reason he wants... (well, I do actually, but that's an entirely different argument). The problem is that he's in the DefaultTrust. If DefaultTrust went away, there wouldn't be an issue, but since it's here and VOD has clearly shown he's abused his position numerous times (and continues to abuse it) he should be removed from DefaultTrust, which is really the root of the issue here. He's demonstrated time and again that he's unsuitable to be given the power of DefaultTrust, yet he continues to wantonly abuse it and no action is taken.

Vod

legendary

Activity: 3668

Merit: 3010

Licking my boob since 1970

Quote from: jonald_fyookball on May 30, 2015, 08:59:29 AM

Vod can you paste where he agreed not to post on BTCJam?

The link is just a few posts above this one.
https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.11484861

jonald_fyookball

legendary

Activity: 1302

Merit: 1008

Core dev leaves me neg feedback #abuse #political

I agree, but is it really slander for savell? we do have a rule here (no collateral, no loan) and he broke that rule, then broke an agreement with Vod after that, right?

Vod didn't invent that rule.

now on the other hand the poster was registered for a year , not just some random newbie
but then again it was a huge amount...so I don't think the situation is that crazy.

legendster

hero member

Activity: 1778

Merit: 764

www.V.systems

Quote from: jonald_fyookball on May 30, 2015, 11:46:49 AM

Quote from: legendster on May 30, 2015, 11:30:28 AM

This is ludicrous if you ask me.

Why should VOD be the dictator of when someone gets to ask for a loan ?

Say if his father has an accident next day and exhausts his savings / insurance and asking for a loan on Jam is the ONLY choice he is left with, VOD can come in and label him as a scammer, like WTF ?

Its like appointing VOD the authority from where Save has to get 'Permission' before asking for a loan (here or anywhere).

Yes I ve been here for a while and I have seen how much scammers have tormented the people on this forum and on Jam. But what the hell ? Why are people gonna get a rating BEFORE a scam happens ?

This shit is so Minority Report...

Vod doesn't have the power to stop someone posting on BTJam or even here.
All he can do is leave negative trust.

Which creates trust issues in a trade situation. Would you trade with someone who has a red trust if the same rates & conditions are available from a green trust guy ? No, and even if you do it would be through escrows. Offcourse everyone should use escrow but to start trusting a guy who's been slandered once by someone is harder than trusting someone who has a trust rating as squeaky clean as a baby's butt Undecided

Go to Jam, once someone is negatively rated his chances of getting a loan drops significantly.

jonald_fyookball

legendary

Activity: 1302

Merit: 1008

Core dev leaves me neg feedback #abuse #political

Quote from: legendster on May 30, 2015, 11:30:28 AM

This is ludicrous if you ask me.

Why should VOD be the dictator of when someone gets to ask for a loan ?

Say if his father has an accident next day and exhausts his savings / insurance and asking for a loan on Jam is the ONLY choice he is left with, VOD can come in and label him as a scammer, like WTF ?

Its like appointing VOD the authority from where Save has to get 'Permission' before asking for a loan (here or anywhere).

Yes I ve been here for a while and I have seen how much scammers have tormented the people on this forum and on Jam. But what the hell ? Why are people gonna get a rating BEFORE a scam happens ?

This shit is so Minority Report...

Vod doesn't have the power to stop someone posting on BTJam or even here.
All he can do is leave negative trust.

Muhammed Zakir

hero member

Activity: 560

Merit: 509

I prefer Zakir over Muhammed when mentioning me!

Quote from: legendster on May 30, 2015, 11:30:28 AM

This is ludicrous if you ask me.

Why should VOD be the dictator of when someone gets to ask for a loan ?

Say if his father has an accident next day and exhausts his savings / insurance and asking for a loan on Jam is the ONLY choice he is left with, VOD can come in and label him as a scammer, like WTF ?

Its like appointing VOD the authority from where Save has to get 'Permission' before asking for a loan (here or anywhere).

Yes I ve been here for a while and I have seen how much scammers have tormented the people on this forum and on Jam. But what the hell ? Why are people gonna get a rating BEFORE a scam happens ?

This shit is so Minority Report...

Like I said, "trust" is the issue here.

legendster

hero member

Activity: 1778

Merit: 764

www.V.systems

This is ludicrous if you ask me.

Why should VOD be the dictator of when someone gets to ask for a loan ?

Say if his father has an accident next day and exhausts his savings / insurance and asking for a loan on Jam is the ONLY choice he is left with, VOD can come in and label him as a scammer, like WTF ?

Its like appointing VOD the authority from where Save has to get 'Permission' before asking for a loan (here or anywhere).

Yes I ve been here for a while and I have seen how much scammers have tormented the people on this forum and on Jam. But what the hell ? Why are people gonna get a rating BEFORE a scam happens ?

This shit is so Minority Report...

Muhammed Zakir

hero member

Activity: 560

Merit: 509

I prefer Zakir over Muhammed when mentioning me!

Quote from: jonald_fyookball on May 30, 2015, 09:49:36 AM

I don't know what he said. lets see exactly what was said.

Quote from: SavellM on May 14, 2015, 06:43:50 AM

Ok Vod if you say so.
Almost like you know me so well, and know exactly what I have invested and traded with.

But its ok, lets agree to disagree and end this here.
You have got your wishes, I have removed my listing and I will not post anything until the 15th June.

jonald_fyookball

legendary

Activity: 1302

Merit: 1008

Core dev leaves me neg feedback #abuse #political

I don't know what he said. lets see exactly what was said.

pissedoff

hero member

Activity: 616

Merit: 500

Quote from: jonald_fyookball on May 30, 2015, 08:59:29 AM

Quote from: Vod on May 29, 2015, 04:55:18 PM

Quote from: SavellM on May 29, 2015, 12:44:42 PM

I seriously wish I never did ask, as I wouldn't have to deal with you and Vod.

I gave you a second chance! I removed your negative feedback. You promised not to ask for another loan for 30 days. You had what you wanted - it was as if you never asked!

Then your greed took over, you said I'm not going to honor my word, and you asked for another loan. Your brought this on yourself. Undecided

TC seems to think I should give you another chance, so I'm willing to review this case in 30-60 days or so (whenever my sailing schedule allows) to see if you are exhibiting scammy behavior by asking for larger and larger loans on BTCJam. You will have to choose which is more important - your reputation here, or your scam there.

But I would be a fool to remove your negative feedback now. (i.e. I'm not giving you another $100 up front.) You have already proven you don't stick to your word.

Quote from: SavellM on May 29, 2015, 04:53:20 PM

I'm sorry that I did not follow YOUR rules for how I use my own personal time on other sites.

If you don't want me to interfere with you on other sites, don't make an agreement with me that involves other sites. Undecided

Quote from: SavellM on May 29, 2015, 04:53:20 PM

So do what you wish... I'll let the community decide how far I need to fight you to prove my innocence and my keep my own rep.

You are not innocent. You lied when you broke your agreement with me. When dealing with an irreversible currency, lies are not a way to build rep.

Vod can you paste where he agreed not to post on BTCJam?

he agreed not to ask for a loan did he not? that means anywhere not just on this forum.

jonald_fyookball

legendary

Activity: 1302

Merit: 1008

Core dev leaves me neg feedback #abuse #political

Quote from: Vod on May 29, 2015, 04:55:18 PM

Quote from: SavellM on May 29, 2015, 12:44:42 PM

I seriously wish I never did ask, as I wouldn't have to deal with you and Vod.

I gave you a second chance! I removed your negative feedback. You promised not to ask for another loan for 30 days. You had what you wanted - it was as if you never asked!

Then your greed took over, you said I'm not going to honor my word, and you asked for another loan. Your brought this on yourself. Undecided

TC seems to think I should give you another chance, so I'm willing to review this case in 30-60 days or so (whenever my sailing schedule allows) to see if you are exhibiting scammy behavior by asking for larger and larger loans on BTCJam. You will have to choose which is more important - your reputation here, or your scam there.

But I would be a fool to remove your negative feedback now. (i.e. I'm not giving you another $100 up front.) You have already proven you don't stick to your word.

Quote from: SavellM on May 29, 2015, 04:53:20 PM

I'm sorry that I did not follow YOUR rules for how I use my own personal time on other sites.

If you don't want me to interfere with you on other sites, don't make an agreement with me that involves other sites. Undecided

Quote from: SavellM on May 29, 2015, 04:53:20 PM

So do what you wish... I'll let the community decide how far I need to fight you to prove my innocence and my keep my own rep.

You are not innocent. You lied when you broke your agreement with me. When dealing with an irreversible currency, lies are not a way to build rep.

Vod can you paste where he agreed not to post on BTCJam?

XinXan

hero member

Activity: 1064

Merit: 505

Quote from: SavellM on May 29, 2015, 06:39:35 PM

I can save you the trouble for the next 60days. I'm going to plan more investments as I have other ideas and things I would like to deal with, like starting HashNest.

But if you think that in 60days I continue to pay off any and all my loans (of which I make no pact with you or bitcointalk) then I leave you out to chose your own path. If in the future you remove my negative feedback I will remove mine.

For the record I still 100% think you are going over your bounds by abusing the trust system here!
Just to reiterate in case you miss it, I am NOT asking Bitcointalk for any loans I may or may not be taking out!

If at any point I default on a loan feel free to label me a scam and give me negative feedback. BUT until such a time as I am late on payments I do not deserve your negativity! Innocent until proven guilty!

Lastly I thank TC for his reasonableness!

Yes you do, you deserve the negative trust like everybody else. Have you seen the lending section? Any newbie that asks for a loan without collateral gets red trust, is how it is. Seems like vod removed your neg feebdack once and you decided to troll and you still think you are right?? You are either dellusional or stupid.

Also in the trust ratings it clearly specifies that you can leave a neg feedback if you believe that user will scam, so it doesnt have to wait for you to actually scam.

SavellM

sr. member

Activity: 305

Merit: 250

I can save you the trouble for the next 60days. I'm going to plan more investments as I have other ideas and things I would like to deal with, like starting HashNest.

But if you think that in 60days I continue to pay off any and all my loans (of which I make no pact with you or bitcointalk) then I leave you out to chose your own path. If in the future you remove my negative feedback I will remove mine.

For the record I still 100% think you are going over your bounds by abusing the trust system here!
Just to reiterate in case you miss it, I am NOT asking Bitcointalk for any loans I may or may not be taking out!

If at any point I default on a loan feel free to label me a scam and give me negative feedback. BUT until such a time as I am late on payments I do not deserve your negativity! Innocent until proven guilty!

Lastly I thank TC for his reasonableness!

Vod

legendary

Activity: 3668

Merit: 3010

Licking my boob since 1970

Quote from: SavellM on May 29, 2015, 12:44:42 PM

I seriously wish I never did ask, as I wouldn't have to deal with you and Vod.

I gave you a second chance! I removed your negative feedback. You promised not to ask for another loan for 30 days. You had what you wanted - it was as if you never asked!

Then your greed took over, you said I'm not going to honor my word, and you asked for another loan. Your brought this on yourself. Undecided

TC seems to think I should give you another chance, so I'm willing to review this case in 30-60 days or so (whenever my sailing schedule allows) to see if you are exhibiting scammy behavior by asking for larger and larger loans on BTCJam. You will have to choose which is more important - your reputation here, or your scam there.

But I would be a fool to remove your negative feedback now. (i.e. I'm not giving you another $100 up front.) You have already proven you don't stick to your word.

Quote from: SavellM on May 29, 2015, 04:53:20 PM

I'm sorry that I did not follow YOUR rules for how I use my own personal time on other sites.

If you don't want me to interfere with you on other sites, don't make an agreement with me that involves other sites. Undecided

Quote from: SavellM on May 29, 2015, 04:53:20 PM

So do what you wish... I'll let the community decide how far I need to fight you to prove my innocence and my keep my own rep.

You are not innocent. You lied when you broke your agreement with me. When dealing with an irreversible currency, lies are not a way to build rep.

SavellM

sr. member

Activity: 305

Merit: 250

Vod I will continue to plead my case, but it falls on your deaf ears.

Just because I chase to utilize a different website that you wish to control.
I quit, and you can leave your feedback for all I care anymore.
I'm sorry that I did not follow YOUR rules for how I use my own personal time on other sites.

If others wish to take a gamble and invest that is their wish on BTCjam, not here.
All I see is abuse of the Trust system over here. So far I have been true to my word on BTCjam by paying back my 2 loans well early.
My loans have helped me trade what I needed to when I needed it, which is why I did not wait until the 15th as I saw an opportunity to make back my earnings now.

So do what you wish... I'll let the community decide how far I need to fight you to prove my innocence and my keep my own rep.
Cause all this for a guy that is a scam artist that doesnt care about rep, it sure looks like I dont care doesnt it!

Vod

legendary

Activity: 3668

Merit: 3010

Licking my boob since 1970

Quote from: SavellM on May 29, 2015, 12:01:02 PM

Quote from: Tomatocage1 on May 29, 2015, 11:59:42 AM

I've always been of the opinion that Vod does a good job of outting scammers, but should probably fine-tune his alert threshold. Also needs to be a lot more diligent about going back and reviewing past cases and reevaluating whether they still warrant a negative rating. I'm not beyond editing my Trust list to remove those who clearly and consistently get out of hand.

I agree, and this is all I am asking.

I have reviewed the case. Here is what I found, based on this thread and the original one now in Archive.

1) SavellM asked for a 7.5 btc loan without collateral
2) Vod tagged SavellM with negative trust for asking for such a large loan without collateral
3) SavellM begged Vod to remove negative trust and said he would not ask for another loan until June 15
4) Based on that, Vod agreed to remove the negative trust, even though his policy was to wait 30 days
5) SavellM: "Then I realized why the fuck should I listen to you?"
6) SavellM then unilaterally changed the terms and asked for another loan, nullifying the agreement.
7) Vod re-added the negative trust.

What you did is basically the same as a kid coming to the door, offering to mow someone's lawn for $100 and asking for the money up front to buy a lawn mower. Once he gets the money he thinks "fuck that guy, I'm not going to do all that work" and spends the money on bubblegum and candy.

The negative trust will stay on for now. You screwed up once, I gave you more than a second chance - I trusted you and removed the negative trust before my 30 day policy. You screwed up again. There is no reason to give you a third chance, esp when it's an open and shut case that you are a liar.

Paying off your current loan on BTCJam is just to build trust so you can scam more later. As evidenced from your original jump from 1btc to 7.5btc. Undecided

You're going to have to keep your scam on BTCJam^TM.

legendster

hero member

Activity: 1778

Merit: 764

www.V.systems

lol MZ bro stop fighting Vod's battles for him. Jam's loan request system doesnt ask for a collateral deposit. Its a choice based investment platform. If Vod's action has to be justified then anyone asking for a loan on Jam or Blc or BTCpop or Prosper etc are frauds and scammers.

Topic: VOD should be removed from default trust for systematic abuse of his position - page 26. (Read 55295 times)