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Topic: [XMR] Monero - A secure, private, untraceable cryptocurrency - page 735. (Read 4670673 times)

8XMR

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Activity: 88

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Quote from: GingerAle on December 02, 2015, 02:10:04 PM

Quote from: papa_lazzarou on December 02, 2015, 12:54:04 PM

THIS IS GENTLEMEN!

moneroblocks.eu now shows the participating outputs in each ring signature. Enjoy.

marvelous work!

now its blatantly obvious how opaque monero transactions really are. There'll be a tip coming your way!!!

This update help make easier to explain Monero transactions to beginners.

smooth

legendary

Activity: 2968

Merit: 1198

Quote from: DeathProxyX on December 05, 2015, 12:00:12 AM

Quote from: smooth on December 04, 2015, 11:58:25 PM

Quote from: newb4now on December 04, 2015, 11:48:09 PM

Quote from: smooth on December 04, 2015, 11:26:35 PM

Quote from: iCEBREAKER on December 04, 2015, 09:43:42 PM

Quote from: smooth on December 03, 2015, 11:20:04 PM

Quote from: iCEBREAKER on December 03, 2015, 11:18:58 PM

Would it be possible or desirable to create/construe customized blocks to tie up such loose ends, along with any possibly malignant 0 mixin leftovers?

No because they belong to many different people.

What about a script/utility for every ~~wallet~~ account owner to use for cleaning up the dust/0mixins under their control?

Yes, its called sweep_dust (already implemented).

I like that feature. Is there a technical definition I can read to define "dust"?

I guess just in the code. https://github.com/monero-project/bitmonero/blob/master/src/simplewallet/simplewallet.cpp#L1846

https://github.com/monero-project/bitmonero/blob/master/src/simplewallet/simplewallet.cpp#L1846 is not a technical definition.

You are correct, that is a URL

DeathProxyX

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Activity: 252

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Earn by Forex. Try our services

Quote from: smooth on December 04, 2015, 11:58:25 PM

Quote from: newb4now on December 04, 2015, 11:48:09 PM

Quote from: smooth on December 04, 2015, 11:26:35 PM

Quote from: iCEBREAKER on December 04, 2015, 09:43:42 PM

Quote from: smooth on December 03, 2015, 11:20:04 PM

Quote from: iCEBREAKER on December 03, 2015, 11:18:58 PM

Would it be possible or desirable to create/construe customized blocks to tie up such loose ends, along with any possibly malignant 0 mixin leftovers?

No because they belong to many different people.

What about a script/utility for every ~~wallet~~ account owner to use for cleaning up the dust/0mixins under their control?

Yes, its called sweep_dust (already implemented).

I like that feature. Is there a technical definition I can read to define "dust"?

I guess just in the code. https://github.com/monero-project/bitmonero/blob/master/src/simplewallet/simplewallet.cpp#L1846

https://github.com/monero-project/bitmonero/blob/master/src/simplewallet/simplewallet.cpp#L1846 is not a technical definition.

smooth

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Activity: 2968

Merit: 1198

Quote from: newb4now on December 04, 2015, 11:48:09 PM

Quote from: smooth on December 04, 2015, 11:26:35 PM

Quote from: iCEBREAKER on December 04, 2015, 09:43:42 PM

Quote from: smooth on December 03, 2015, 11:20:04 PM

Quote from: iCEBREAKER on December 03, 2015, 11:18:58 PM

Would it be possible or desirable to create/construe customized blocks to tie up such loose ends, along with any possibly malignant 0 mixin leftovers?

No because they belong to many different people.

What about a script/utility for every ~~wallet~~ account owner to use for cleaning up the dust/0mixins under their control?

Yes, its called sweep_dust (already implemented).

I like that feature. Is there a technical definition I can read to define "dust"?

I guess just in the code. https://github.com/monero-project/bitmonero/blob/master/src/simplewallet/simplewallet.cpp#L1846

To me it looks like just outputs of below a given size, currently 0.01.

newb4now

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Activity: 686

Merit: 500

Quote from: smooth on December 04, 2015, 11:26:35 PM

Quote from: iCEBREAKER on December 04, 2015, 09:43:42 PM

Quote from: smooth on December 03, 2015, 11:20:04 PM

Quote from: iCEBREAKER on December 03, 2015, 11:18:58 PM

Would it be possible or desirable to create/construe customized blocks to tie up such loose ends, along with any possibly malignant 0 mixin leftovers?

No because they belong to many different people.

What about a script/utility for every ~~wallet~~ account owner to use for cleaning up the dust/0mixins under their control?

Yes, its called sweep_dust (already implemented).

I like that feature. Is there a technical definition I can read to define "dust"?

smooth

legendary

Activity: 2968

Merit: 1198

Quote from: iCEBREAKER on December 04, 2015, 09:43:42 PM

Quote from: smooth on December 03, 2015, 11:20:04 PM

Quote from: iCEBREAKER on December 03, 2015, 11:18:58 PM

Would it be possible or desirable to create/construe customized blocks to tie up such loose ends, along with any possibly malignant 0 mixin leftovers?

No because they belong to many different people.

What about a script/utility for every ~~wallet~~ account owner to use for cleaning up the dust/0mixins under their control?

Yes, its called sweep_dust (already implemented).

iCEBREAKER

legendary

Activity: 2156

Merit: 1072

Crypto is the separation of Power and State.

Quote from: smooth on December 03, 2015, 11:20:04 PM

Quote from: iCEBREAKER on December 03, 2015, 11:18:58 PM

Would it be possible or desirable to create/construe customized blocks to tie up such loose ends, along with any possibly malignant 0 mixin leftovers?

No because they belong to many different people.

What about a script/utility for every ~~wallet~~ account owner to use for cleaning up the dust/0mixins under their control?

smooth

legendary

Activity: 2968

Merit: 1198

Quote from: Rias on December 04, 2015, 08:46:28 AM

If someone sends an outstandingly large amount of Monero, she may create the outputs of the uniquely large size that haven't been created before by anyone.

Yes if you do that you won't be able to mix when you spend it (obviously). You will still be able to spend it though.

Maybe we will add some kind of warning to the wallet, or an option to generate multiple smaller outputs. That is not done yet.

Quote from: smooth on December 03, 2015, 06:00:40 PM

There is an exception for that.

Is it anything interesting, or simple rule checking? Will this exact output in a transaction be just excluded from the rule?

I don't understand what you mean about "this exact output".

The rule is somewhat complicated, and I don't even remember the details. There are some conditions about how mixable and non-mixable inputs can be combined. The idea is limit use of non-mixed inputs but also not prevent people from spending their coins. There is also a sweep_dust command in the wallet to help combine large amounts of dust into a mixable (and more usable) form easily.

Rias

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Activity: 373

Merit: 250

Quote from: iCEBREAKER on December 03, 2015, 11:18:58 PM

I thought CN/XMR already did the powers of ten thing. Where did the fiddly bits come from?

Would it be possible or desirable to create/construe customized blocks to tie up such loose ends, along with any possibly malignant 0 mixin leftovers?

The most common case is dust as smooth mentioned. Although I'm unaware whether XMR has made any adjustments to what is defined as dust.

I might be incorrect, but I believe there's also another option. If someone sends an outstandingly large amount of Monero, she may create the outputs of the uniquely large size that haven't been created before by anyone.

Quote from: smooth on December 03, 2015, 06:00:40 PM

There is an exception for that.

Is it anything interesting, or simple rule checking? Will this exact output in a transaction be just excluded from the rule?

smooth

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Activity: 2968

Merit: 1198

Quote from: iCEBREAKER on December 03, 2015, 11:18:58 PM

Quote from: smooth on December 03, 2015, 11:13:58 PM

Quote from: LucyLovesCrypto on December 03, 2015, 11:12:34 PM

Quote from: smooth on December 03, 2015, 06:00:40 PM

Quote from: Rias on December 03, 2015, 09:11:10 AM

If I recall the proposal correctly, it imposes a new rule on outputs. They cannot be spent in the next transaction unless a minimum mixin is provided. Correct me if I'm wrong. But what about the case when certain inputs cannot be mixed due to absence of ringsig partners?

There is an exception for that.

Also, non-standard outputs can't be created any more, so they will eventually be "used up".

What would be the reason for an absence of ring sig partners? I thought there were large numbers of mixins available for all but the largest size transactions (amounts higher than 99% of us even own). I cant find the link but somewhere I saw a listing of avaible mixins but value and there were many. Available mixins only increase over time right?

There are outputs with uneven amounts such as 0.0002452113 that won't necessarily match any other outputs.

In the future every output will be a multiple 1-9 of a power of ten, and indeed there are only a limited number of those (roughly 150, though the number in common use will be much smaller) and all except the very largest amounts will have many available.

I thought CN/XMR already did the powers of ten thing. Where did the fiddly bits come from?

It wasn't enforced, and the power-of-ten denominations weren't used below a certain value threshold.

Quote

Would it be possible or desirable to create/construe customized blocks to tie up such loose ends, along with any possibly malignant 0 mixin leftovers?

No because they belong to many different people.

iCEBREAKER

legendary

Activity: 2156

Merit: 1072

Crypto is the separation of Power and State.

Quote from: smooth on December 03, 2015, 11:13:58 PM

Quote from: LucyLovesCrypto on December 03, 2015, 11:12:34 PM

Quote from: smooth on December 03, 2015, 06:00:40 PM

Quote from: Rias on December 03, 2015, 09:11:10 AM

There is an exception for that.

Also, non-standard outputs can't be created any more, so they will eventually be "used up".

smooth

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Activity: 2968

Merit: 1198

Quote from: LucyLovesCrypto on December 03, 2015, 11:12:34 PM

Quote from: smooth on December 03, 2015, 06:00:40 PM

Quote from: Rias on December 03, 2015, 09:11:10 AM

There is an exception for that.

Also, non-standard outputs can't be created any more, so they will eventually be "used up".

LucyLovesCrypto

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Activity: 414

Merit: 251

Quote from: smooth on December 03, 2015, 06:00:40 PM

Quote from: Rias on December 03, 2015, 09:11:10 AM

There is an exception for that.

Also, non-standard outputs can't be created any more, so they will eventually be "used up".

Hueristic

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Activity: 3836

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Doomed to see the future and unable to prevent it

Quote from: smooth on December 03, 2015, 04:44:48 PM

Quote from: Hueristic on December 03, 2015, 03:45:51 PM

Quote from: GingerAle on December 03, 2015, 08:17:22 AM

...

Another interesting improvement is change of the base cryptography to the actual standard, as opposed to the cryptonote version of the cryptography. ...

Do you have a link for a more detailed explanation on this?

The original crypto code was taken from Daniel J. Bernstein's library without attribution, slightly modified (though the modifications have been reviewed and were not nefarious).

The copied/modified code has been replaced by the actual, original Danlel J. Bernstein crypto library, which makes more clear the source and integrity of the crypto library. It will also make it easier to incorporate upstream patches to the crypto library if any are released.

Thx

dEBRUYNE

legendary

Activity: 2268

Merit: 1141

Quote from: aerbax on December 03, 2015, 06:40:02 PM

I remember reading a while back that 0MQ is in one of the developmental branches. If I wanted to play around with that, which branch/repo should I clone?

If I recall correctly, this one -> https://github.com/monero-project/bitmonero/tree/development

aerbax

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I remember reading a while back that 0MQ is in one of the developmental branches. If I wanted to play around with that, which branch/repo should I clone?

smooth

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Activity: 2968

Merit: 1198

Quote from: Rias on December 03, 2015, 09:11:10 AM

There is an exception for that.

Also, non-standard outputs can't be created any more, so they will eventually be "used up".

smooth

legendary

Activity: 2968

Merit: 1198

Quote from: Hueristic on December 03, 2015, 03:45:51 PM

Quote from: GingerAle on December 03, 2015, 08:17:22 AM

...

Another interesting improvement is change of the base cryptography to the actual standard, as opposed to the cryptonote version of the cryptography. ...

Do you have a link for a more detailed explanation on this?

dEBRUYNE

legendary

Activity: 2268

Merit: 1141

Quote from: xa4 on December 03, 2015, 02:06:54 PM

Hi GingerAle,

Thanks for your summary.

Two things I don't quite understand.

Quote

Blocktimes will also be changed to 2 minutes in order to try and fix the amount of reorgs that occur.

What are reorgs ?

Quote

Ring-confidential transactions will also be in the development branch at some point, which means that now the amount of a transaction will also be private

What do you mean it will be private ? Isn't it already private (with mixin) ? Am I wrong or are Confidential Transaction more obscure than current implementation ?

Here is an ELI5 for if it's not clear for you after reading the other comments:

ELI5: Next to hidden origins and destinations that are inherent to the Monero protocol (provided by ring signatures + stealth addresses), this will also hide amounts, while viewkeys will still work, and of course it will still be auditable.

dEBRUYNE

legendary

Activity: 2268

Merit: 1141

Quote from: Hueristic on December 03, 2015, 03:45:51 PM

Quote from: xa4 on December 03, 2015, 02:06:54 PM

Quote

Ring-confidential transactions will also be in the development branch at some point, which means that now the amount of a transaction will also be private

What do you mean it will be private ? Isn't it already private (with mixin) ? Am I wrong or are Confidential Transaction more obscure than current implementation ?

Amounts of transactions are not hidden.

http://moneroblocks.eu/

Quote from: GingerAle on December 03, 2015, 08:17:22 AM

...

Another interesting improvement is change of the base cryptography to the actual standard, as opposed to the cryptonote version of the cryptography. ...

Do you have a link for a more detailed explanation on this?

See this particular commit -> https://github.com/monero-project/bitmonero/commit/0a4bc84b2f681dfd89b501648f65a951d876e2d8

Basically, Shen Noether included the reference code used by Bernstein et. al. (http://ed25519.cr.yp.to/ed25519-20110926.pdf)