[XMR] Monero - A secure, private, untraceable cryptocurrency - page 837.

fluffypony

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GetMonero.org / MyMonero.com

Quote from: smfuser on July 28, 2015, 01:54:09 AM

Quote from: smooth on July 27, 2015, 08:47:14 PM

The original code apparently had nearly all the comments programmatically stripped out. (I have no idea how well commented it was before they were stripped, of course.)

What is the evidence that nearly all the comments were programmatically stripped out?

Also when they used our payment_id / RPC code and merged it back to their repo they stripped out all our explanatory comments.

newb4now

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Everyone please join
http://www.reddit.com/r/Monero/

and

https://forum.getmonero.org

Better organization of information and less trolling

smooth

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Quote from: smfuser on July 28, 2015, 01:54:09 AM

Quote from: smooth on July 27, 2015, 08:47:14 PM

The original code apparently had nearly all the comments programmatically stripped out. (I have no idea how well commented it was before they were stripped, of course.)

What is the evidence that nearly all the comments were programmatically stripped out?

There are very few comments, and little to nothing the way of design documents or notes, so either nearly all of these were removed from the tree (though "programmatically" is just a theory -- they could also have been removed by hand) or the code was never properly documented in the first place (ugh).

As further evidence for the latter, there are some modules that have been identified as being from other open source libraries with the attributions and comments removed, but again it is still possible those comments were removed but the rest of the code was never commented.

smfuser

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Quote from: smooth on July 27, 2015, 08:47:14 PM

The original code apparently had nearly all the comments programmatically stripped out. (I have no idea how well commented it was before they were stripped, of course.)

What is the evidence that nearly all the comments were programmatically stripped out?

elrippo

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Hy guys

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please do not forget to vote DAILY on cryptopia to get Monero listed!
Vote, Vote, Vote!!!

smooth

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Quote from: Hueristic on July 27, 2015, 09:06:32 PM

Quote from: smooth on July 27, 2015, 08:57:16 PM

Quote from: Hueristic on July 27, 2015, 08:52:52 PM

Quote from: smooth on July 27, 2015, 08:47:14 PM

Quote from: Hueristic on July 27, 2015, 08:36:51 PM

BTW, I am not knocking the contributions made as just by my cursory looks at the code it is a daunting task to be able to contribute anything code wise. I am just pointing out the Documentation HAS to be added as the work progresses and kept up to date for proper project management. this really doesn't need to be said though. Every programmer knows this.

This has been done. The new code has extensive comments, including block comments that describe design and implementation issues and decisions. Several other areas of the code have had comments added (by various project contributors). The original code apparently had nearly all the comments programmatically stripped out. (I have no idea how well commented it was before they were stripped, of course.) We have to do the best we can with that.

Good to know, are the code portions that have been fixed been commented as well? As soon as there is a flowchart the task of absorbing this project may be to the level where I can manage it.

Getting old and forgetful is a real bitch. :|

You should really try using doxygen to create graphs. It won't create a flowchart of the whole thing down to the individual statement level but it does create call graphs, class heirarchy graphs, usage graphs, etc.

Quote

pull request

We use the same git source code control for documentation and the web site itself.

What this means is that if there is something in terms of documentation or the web content you think should be added, changed, improved, etc. you don't need to ask someone else to do it, you can (and should) do it yourself. Even small pieces are helpful.

So I put this in the wrong place?
https://github.com/monero-project/monero-site/issues/49

No that's fine. monero-site includes the "knowledge base" and within that "developer guides" which could include that sort of documentation.

Of course better would be a pull request: "Here's a flowchart I created to add to the knowledge base. I couldn't fill in all the details so I left many parts blank." Then others can add to it...

Hueristic

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Quote from: smooth on July 27, 2015, 08:57:16 PM

Quote from: Hueristic on July 27, 2015, 08:52:52 PM

Quote from: smooth on July 27, 2015, 08:47:14 PM

Quote from: Hueristic on July 27, 2015, 08:36:51 PM

BTW, I am not knocking the contributions made as just by my cursory looks at the code it is a daunting task to be able to contribute anything code wise. I am just pointing out the Documentation HAS to be added as the work progresses and kept up to date for proper project management. this really doesn't need to be said though. Every programmer knows this.

This has been done. The new code has extensive comments, including block comments that describe design and implementation issues and decisions. Several other areas of the code have had comments added (by various project contributors). The original code apparently had nearly all the comments programmatically stripped out. (I have no idea how well commented it was before they were stripped, of course.) We have to do the best we can with that.

Good to know, are the code portions that have been fixed been commented as well? As soon as there is a flowchart the task of absorbing this project may be to the level where I can manage it.

Getting old and forgetful is a real bitch. :|

You should really try using doxygen to create graphs. It won't create a flowchart of the whole thing down to the individual statement level but it does create call graphs, class heirarchy graphs, usage graphs, etc.

Quote

pull request

We use the same git source code control for documentation and the web site itself.

What this means is that if there is something in terms of documentation or the web content you think should be added, changed, improved, etc. you don't need to ask someone else to do it, you can (and should) do it yourself. Even small pieces are helpful.

So I put this in the wrong place?
https://github.com/monero-project/monero-site/issues/49

My mind is stuck in top down structure so it it painful although not impossible for me to use other methodologies. That is why I need that. I will try to use doxygen when time allows, I took a look at it when ginger posted it. I find it hard to believe no one has this done already.

smooth

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Quote from: Hueristic on July 27, 2015, 08:52:52 PM

Quote from: smooth on July 27, 2015, 08:47:14 PM

Quote from: Hueristic on July 27, 2015, 08:36:51 PM

BTW, I am not knocking the contributions made as just by my cursory looks at the code it is a daunting task to be able to contribute anything code wise. I am just pointing out the Documentation HAS to be added as the work progresses and kept up to date for proper project management. this really doesn't need to be said though. Every programmer knows this.

This has been done. The new code has extensive comments, including block comments that describe design and implementation issues and decisions. Several other areas of the code have had comments added (by various project contributors). The original code apparently had nearly all the comments programmatically stripped out. (I have no idea how well commented it was before they were stripped, of course.) We have to do the best we can with that.

Good to know, are the code portions that have been fixed been commented as well? As soon as there is a flowchart the task of absorbing this project may be to the level where I can manage it.

Getting old and forgetful is a real bitch. :|

You should really try using doxygen to create graphs. It won't create a flowchart of the whole thing down to the individual statement level but it does create call graphs, class heirarchy graphs, usage graphs, etc.

Quote

pull request

We use the same git source code control for documentation and the web site itself.

What this means is that if there is something in terms of documentation or the web content you think should be added, changed, improved, etc. you don't need to ask someone else to do it, you can (and should) do it yourself. Even small pieces are helpful.

Hueristic

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Doomed to see the future and unable to prevent it

Quote from: smooth on July 27, 2015, 08:48:52 PM

Quote from: Hueristic on July 27, 2015, 08:47:48 PM

Quote

This is a list of the daemon and wallet RPC calls, along with their inputs and outputs.

According to this comment that should be the entire list, if my English comprehension is not failing me.

Yes that is clearly the intent. If you find some missing you can open issues or better yet a pull request with a fix.

That is another thing that has been confusing me, I keep seeing "Add a Pull request" and my understanding of pull requests are Code changes.

Hueristic

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Doomed to see the future and unable to prevent it

Quote from: smooth on July 27, 2015, 08:47:14 PM

Quote from: Hueristic on July 27, 2015, 08:36:51 PM

BTW, I am not knocking the contributions made as just by my cursory looks at the code it is a daunting task to be able to contribute anything code wise. I am just pointing out the Documentation HAS to be added as the work progresses and kept up to date for proper project management. this really doesn't need to be said though. Every programmer knows this.

This has been done. The new code has extensive comments, including block comments that describe design and implementation issues and decisions. Several other areas of the code have had comments added (by various project contributors). The original code apparently had nearly all the comments programmatically stripped out. (I have no idea how well commented it was before they were stripped, of course.) We have to do the best we can with that.

Good to know, are the code portions that have been fixed been commented as well? As soon as there is a flowchart the task of absorbing this project may be to the level where I can manage it.

Getting old and forgetful is a real bitch. :|

smooth

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Quote from: Hueristic on July 27, 2015, 08:47:48 PM

Quote

This is a list of the daemon and wallet RPC calls, along with their inputs and outputs.

According to this comment that should be the entire list, if my English comprehension is not failing me.

Yes that is clearly the intent. If you find some missing you can open issues or better yet a pull request with a fix.

Hueristic

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Doomed to see the future and unable to prevent it

Quote

This is a list of the daemon and wallet RPC calls, along with their inputs and outputs.

According to this comment that should be the entire list, if my English comprehension is not failing me.

smooth

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Quote from: Hueristic on July 27, 2015, 08:36:51 PM

BTW, I am not knocking the contributions made as just by my cursory looks at the code it is a daunting task to be able to contribute anything code wise. I am just pointing out the Documentation HAS to be added as the work progresses and kept up to date for proper project management. this really doesn't need to be said though. Every programmer knows this.

This has been done. The new code has extensive comments, including block comments that describe design and implementation issues and decisions. Several other areas of the code have had comments added (by various project contributors). The original code apparently had nearly all the comments programmatically stripped out. (I have no idea how well commented it was before they were stripped, of course.) We have to do the best we can with that.

smooth

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Quote from: Hueristic on July 27, 2015, 08:36:51 PM

Quote from: smooth on July 27, 2015, 08:32:50 PM

...

Hueristic, did you see the commit MoneroMooo posted which adds RPC definitions to the Developer Guide on the web site? That's work-in-progress, so not there yet, but on the way.

I haven't, is it a full list? From the posts it seemed it was not, maybe I misread the conversation?

Here's what I see there now. I don't know if it is complete but it looks close:

https://github.com/moneromooo-monero/monero-site/blob/wallet-rpc/knowledge-base/developer-guides/wallet-rpc.md

Quote from: Hueristic on July 27, 2015, 08:36:51 PM

This is what I was referring to.

Quote from: smooth on July 27, 2015, 05:01:11 AM

...
There is not completely RPC documentation that is up to date

So now we know (which I didn't know earlier) there is active work-in-progress on it.

Hueristic

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Quote from: smooth on July 27, 2015, 08:32:50 PM

...

Hueristic, did you see the commit MoneroMooo posted which adds RPC definitions to the Developer Guide on the web site? That's work-in-progress, so not there yet, but on the way.

I haven't, is it a full list? From the posts it seemed it was not, maybe I misread the conversation?

ADDED:

This is what I was referring to.

Quote from: smooth on July 27, 2015, 05:01:11 AM

...
There is not completely RPC documentation that is up to date, unfortunately. The best place to look is the code, which in that respect is quite readable.

https://github.com/monero-project/bitmonero/blob/master/src/wallet/wallet_rpc_server_commands_defs.h
https://github.com/monero-project/bitmonero/blob/master/src/rpc/core_rpc_server_commands_defs.h

BTW, I am not knocking the contributions made as just by my cursory looks at the code it is a daunting task to be able to contribute anything code wise. I am just pointing out the Documentation HAS to be added as the work progresses and kept up to date for proper project management. this really doesn't need to be said though. Every programmer knows this.

Hueristic

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Quote from: GingerAle on July 27, 2015, 08:31:17 PM

i assume you're referring to Dr. Moo, aka Moneromoo, and technically he's a funded part-time developer.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ll6LLGePYwM

My bad, part time. Well any programmer worth his salt that knows the code should be able to kick out a flowchart in no time. It's simple.

smooth

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Quote from: medusa13 on July 27, 2015, 12:21:40 PM

hey i think you mix two differen things up:

he was asking for RPC documentation. This means he just want to see a place where he can see what parameters he has to give to a function and what he will be getting back. the best solution to do this IS looking inside the code, since even people that can not code could read it if they know what they are looking for.

Yes that's exactly what I meant. Specifically the RPC definitions in the code. You don't even need to understand the code to read them.

Quote

how to deal with it? the funding page needs more content anyway and people at monero forum are trying to define a work package for the "monero about" page (https://forum.getmonero.org/7/open-tasks/346/about-monero-page-content). this would be the right way to go if your intention to change this should bear fruits one day . maybe we could inculde it there ?

Yes I agree, crowdfunding is a good approach to this.

Hueristic, did you see the commit MoneroMooo posted which adds RPC definitions to the Developer Guide on the web site? That's work-in-progress, so not there yet, but on the way.

GingerAle

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Quote from: Hueristic on July 27, 2015, 08:23:31 PM

Quote from: medusa13 on July 27, 2015, 12:21:40 PM

hey i think you mix two differen things up:

he was asking for RPC documentation. This means he just want to see a place where he can see what parameters he has to give to a function and what he will be getting back. the best solution to do this IS looking inside the code, since even people that can not code could read it if they know what they are looking for.

the thing you are talking about is documentation about cryptonode internal functionallity like ring signatures, stealth addresses etc. i agree documentation on this things are not good enough for the common public, but this was not the right way to bring this issue up since smooths answer was the best one to give.

how to deal with it? the funding page needs more content anyway and people at monero forum are trying to define a work package for the "monero about" page (https://forum.getmonero.org/7/open-tasks/346/about-monero-page-content). this would be the right way to go if your intention to change this should bear fruits one day . maybe we could inculde it there ?

the problem is, there are not a lot people who really know how all this works. only the devs can make such graphs

I actually was just pointing out that even something as simple as the rpc list should be easily accessible and updated as a matter of course and good programming practices.

Since there is a full time developer now wouldn't it be a good idea to create a flow chart?

https://github.com/monero-project/monero-site/issues/49

As much fun as the cryptonote whitepaper is to read a programmer has no need for the theory behind but rather the implementation of such. That is what is sorely lacking ATM.

i assume you're referring to Dr. Moo, aka Moneromoo, and technically he's a funded part-time developer.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ll6LLGePYwM

Hueristic

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Quote from: medusa13 on July 27, 2015, 12:21:40 PM

hey i think you mix two differen things up:

he was asking for RPC documentation. This means he just want to see a place where he can see what parameters he has to give to a function and what he will be getting back. the best solution to do this IS looking inside the code, since even people that can not code could read it if they know what they are looking for.

the thing you are talking about is documentation about cryptonode internal functionallity like ring signatures, stealth addresses etc. i agree documentation on this things are not good enough for the common public, but this was not the right way to bring this issue up since smooths answer was the best one to give.

how to deal with it? the funding page needs more content anyway and people at monero forum are trying to define a work package for the "monero about" page (https://forum.getmonero.org/7/open-tasks/346/about-monero-page-content). this would be the right way to go if your intention to change this should bear fruits one day . maybe we could inculde it there ?

the problem is, there are not a lot people who really know how all this works. only the devs can make such graphs

I actually was just pointing out that even something as simple as the rpc list should be easily accessible and updated as a matter of course and good programming practices.

Since there is a full time developer now wouldn't it be a good idea to create a flow chart?

https://github.com/monero-project/monero-site/issues/49

As much fun as the cryptonote whitepaper is to read a programmer has no need for the theory behind but rather the implementation of such. That is what is sorely lacking ATM.

luigi1111

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Quote from: dnaleor on July 27, 2015, 04:42:14 PM

Quote from: smooth on July 27, 2015, 04:21:35 PM

Quote from: dnaleor on July 27, 2015, 03:48:52 PM

My question isn't really answered yet:

how can a spectator know that the image key is associated with at least on of the inputs in the transaction?

See the whitepaper section 4.4, step VER.

thx, will reread it more carefully

Yes indeed, was going to point you there, but hadn't refreshed forum in a while (so smooth already answered).

Quote from: dnaleor on July 27, 2015, 03:48:52 PM

edit2: the transaction private key is never used, am I right? It's only used to calculate the transaction public key?

It is used, but only by the transaction creator. It's how they create a "shared secret" with the receiver.

ECDH(receiverViewPub, txPriv) == ECDH(txPub, receiverViewSec)

Topic: [XMR] Monero - A secure, private, untraceable cryptocurrency - page 837. (Read 4671660 times)