0.25 BTC Bounty - Show me a Mt Gox USD Withdrawal :) - page 7.

OhShei8e

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Quote from: St.Bit on July 17, 2013, 04:30:32 PM

Nevertheless this is very alarming and if Mt.Gox really gets insolvent it will have a huge impact on the demand of bitcoins.

The insolvency of Gox is total bullshit. You have to be blinded by fear to believe this. In two weeks no one talks about this thing and all flow back to Gox. Greedy and stupid as ever.

OhShei8e

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Quote from: St.Bit on July 17, 2013, 04:30:32 PM

Without a possible way to arbitrage there is no way to reduce that premium without a huge longterm investment so I wouldn't say risk has so much to do with it since even if this way were riskfree those 10% couldn't vanish easily since a lotof people want out.

Gox has enough Bitcoins to use the abitrage if they want and they probably do. There's so much blind panic. Who sells currently on Gox larger stocks if not even Gox? If the people fall into panic, Gox can sell at high prices. They have hundreds of thousands in the back. Your bankruptcy scheme is logically not conclusive. Gox can not be killed by a bank run. People only hurt themselves when they behave irrationally. If you want to punish Gox, forget it.

St.Bit

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Quote from: zeroblock on July 17, 2013, 03:44:36 PM

And that risk has been quantified in the 10% premium for USD (buying BTC on Gox & selling on Bitstamp).

Without a possible way to arbitrage there is no way to reduce that premium without a huge longterm investment so I wouldn't say risk has so much to do with it since even if this way were riskfree those 10% couldn't vanish easily since a lotof people want out.

Nevertheless this is very alarming and if Mt.Gox really gets insolvent it will have a huge impact on the demand of bitcoins.

gizmoh

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Quote from: zeroblock on July 17, 2013, 03:44:36 PM

Quote from: abrkn on July 17, 2013, 03:23:37 PM

Quote from: Spaceman_Spiff on July 17, 2013, 03:19:27 PM

Quote from: abrkn on July 17, 2013, 03:16:56 PM

Is this why BTCUSD is higher on Gox than on Stamp/Btce?

In all likelihood, yes.

So a USD is worth less on Gox than on Stamp, implying they may not cash you out? At this time, the difference is so large we're not talking future value of money, but a scare of never being able to fully withdraw?

Precisely. And that risk has been quantified in the 10% premium for USD (buying BTC on Gox & selling on Bitstamp). I see that spread jumping in the next week or two as traders realize that Gox is insolvent. It will happen suddenly. And when it does, a huge spread will develop between Gox and Bitstamp prices, until BTC on Gox reaches $1,000-$10,000 USD as no one is willing to sell BTC.

What Gox could be doing is having an account open at Bitstamp, buying BTC there, selling BTC on their own exchange, then cycling the profits back to their Bitstamp account. Rinse, repeat. And as the price gets higher and higher on their own exchange, they could be selling BTC they acquired on Bitstamp to the desperate buyers on Gox, forcing everyone to liquidate fiat for BTC right into Gox's wallet. While this may keep Gox liquid, they will still be unable to process USD as they do not have their money transmitter license.

And then what, close business! cause clients would leave Gox if they let this situation persist without further clarification.
No doubt this will be seen by the pro's and denounced. For the moment there is no large buys going on Bitstamp,until then we can conclude this to be science fiction.

zeroblock

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Quote from: abrkn on July 17, 2013, 03:23:37 PM

Quote from: Spaceman_Spiff on July 17, 2013, 03:19:27 PM

Quote from: abrkn on July 17, 2013, 03:16:56 PM

Is this why BTCUSD is higher on Gox than on Stamp/Btce?

In all likelihood, yes.

So a USD is worth less on Gox than on Stamp, implying they may not cash you out? At this time, the difference is so large we're not talking future value of money, but a scare of never being able to fully withdraw?

Precisely. And that risk has been quantified in the 10% premium for USD (buying BTC on Gox & selling on Bitstamp). I see that spread jumping in the next week or two as traders realize that Gox is insolvent. It will happen suddenly. And when it does, a huge spread will develop between Gox and Bitstamp prices, until BTC on Gox reaches $1,000-$10,000 USD as no one is willing to sell BTC.

What Gox could be doing is having an account open at Bitstamp, buying BTC there, selling BTC on their own exchange, then cycling the profits back to their Bitstamp account. Rinse, repeat. And as the price gets higher and higher on their own exchange, they could be selling BTC they acquired on Bitstamp to the desperate buyers on Gox, forcing everyone to liquidate fiat for BTC right into Gox's wallet. While this may keep Gox liquid, they will still be unable to process USD as they do not have their money transmitter license.

Nagle

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Quote from: abrkn on July 17, 2013, 03:23:37 PM

So a USD is worth less on Gox than on Stamp, implying they may not cash you out? At this time, the difference is so large we're not talking future value of money, but a scare of never being able to fully withdraw?

Exactly. And the spread between Mt. Gox and the other exchanges is growing. Last week it was around 5%. Now it's around 10%.

This is going to create a Bitcoin price distortion as more suckers become aware that Mt. Gox has defaulted. Mt. Gox prices may continue to rise. But they're not real prices at which you can sell Bitcoins, because you can't get the money out. Bitcoin to USD prices are only real on exchanges where you get paid when you sell.

notme

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Quote from: zby on July 17, 2013, 03:20:56 PM

Quote from: notme on July 17, 2013, 03:15:56 PM

No, I don't find it odd that people wiring money out of Gox don't come report to you. Their money is non of your business. You guys are paranoid.

But, let's assume you are right for a second. What are you going to do? If I believed what you believe, I would cancel my withdrawal request, buy bitcoins, and get as far away from MtGox as possible. If you still have money at MtGox with your beliefs you are an idiot. If you don't have money with MtGox, then why the fuck are you trying to whip people into a panic instead of going about your business. Or is trading on MtGox the only reason you are here? If so, go find something productive to do to help develop the bitcoin economy or GTFO.

It is not about believing or not - it is about assigning probability to this event. The probability grows and it makes me uncomfortable - I did move out most of my funds already and I am pretty happy with my overall profits, but this situation is still rather unnerving for me.

Then don't use Gox.... you've been around long enough to know their history. This shouldn't surprise you.

abrkn

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TsuyokuNaritai

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Quote from: abrkn on July 17, 2013, 03:16:56 PM

Is this why BTCUSD is higher on Gox than on Stamp/Btce?

Yes. The BTC themselves are basically the same, it's the dollars that the market has decided are worth less right now if they're on Gox.

zby

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Quote from: notme on July 17, 2013, 03:15:56 PM

No, I don't find it odd that people wiring money out of Gox don't come report to you. Their money is non of your business. You guys are paranoid.

But, let's assume you are right for a second. What are you going to do? If I believed what you believe, I would cancel my withdrawal request, buy bitcoins, and get as far away from MtGox as possible. If you still have money at MtGox with your beliefs you are an idiot. If you don't have money with MtGox, then why the fuck are you trying to whip people into a panic instead of going about your business. Or is trading on MtGox the only reason you are here? If so, go find something productive to do to help develop the bitcoin economy or GTFO.

It is not about believing or not - it is about assigning probability to this event. The probability grows and it makes me uncomfortable - I did move out most of my funds already and I am pretty happy with my overall profits, but this situation is still rather unnerving for me.

Spaceman_Spiff

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Quote from: abrkn on July 17, 2013, 03:16:56 PM

Is this why BTCUSD is higher on Gox than on Stamp/Btce?

In all likelihood, yes.

abrkn

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notme

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Quote from: zby on July 17, 2013, 04:31:35 AM

Quote from: Delerium on July 17, 2013, 03:13:21 AM

Video from Roger Ver on MtGox Finances to ease the communitys misplaced fears on MtGox Insolvency - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UP1YsMlrfF0

So he repeats the old story that the problem is the amount of transfers - but we have seen that for last month there were 0 transfers executed from MtGox - how that fits the story?

0 transfers eh?

Let's go back one page in this very thread:

Quote from: abcehmumhecba on July 16, 2013, 06:40:32 AM

i just made another successful domestic withdrawl to my Japanese bank account. Took only a day or 2 as usual.

(i know this doesn't count, but just thought i'd let you guys know)

0 USD transfers that were initiated after withdrawals were resumed (7/4) might be accurate.

Quote from: ab8989 on July 17, 2013, 06:09:40 AM

Quote from: notme on July 16, 2013, 01:50:52 PM

Right... a bounty for a withdrawal started less than 8 business days ago when MtGox said it would take several weeks to get caught on on the queue before they can deal with new requests.

Yes, this bounty was created for withdrawals initiated after 7/4/2013, but don't you find it a little odd that there are no reports to be found anywhere for any kind of success in receiving USD for any kind of withdrawal requests?

I am quite sure that some happy customer that got their very old USD withdrawal finally coming through would show up also on this thread. Or in some other thread. Anywhere.

I cannot think of any other explanation for this lack of any kinds of success except that they are not really processing the queue at all.

If you listen carefully to what Roger Ver is saying on the video and especially what he is NOT saying , even he is not telling us of any kind of achieved progress in processing the withdrawals at all.

No, I don't find it odd that people wiring money out of Gox don't come report to you. Their money is non of your business. You guys are paranoid.

But, let's assume you are right for a second. What are you going to do? If I believed what you believe, I would cancel my withdrawal request, buy bitcoins, and get as far away from MtGox as possible. If you still have money at MtGox with your beliefs you are an idiot. If you don't have money with MtGox, then why the fuck are you trying to whip people into a panic instead of going about your business. Or is trading on MtGox the only reason you are here? If so, go find something productive to do to help develop the bitcoin economy or GTFO.

bennybong

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Quote from: EPiSKiNG on July 17, 2013, 12:07:50 PM

Is there still a bounty? Mine came through.

-EP

You're the winner if you just provide a screenshot! Cheesy

Spaceman_Spiff

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Quote from: Evolvex on July 17, 2013, 01:30:44 PM

Quote from: el_rlee on July 17, 2013, 09:24:11 AM

Quote from: gizmoh on July 17, 2013, 09:10:12 AM

I have the impression the background is blurred intentionally..One can't be certain if its filmed from Gox headquarters or this guy's workplace.
And where is Karpeles? No word from him on this issues for more than 10 days!

You call this "focus"

SOMEONE ON THE INTERNET WAS WRONG, MUST CORRECT THEM.....

You dont actually, you call it "depth of field" (at least in the photography world...)

His comment is actually relevant to the situation, yours is nitpicking over something that isn't even wrong.

Evolvex

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Quote from: el_rlee on July 17, 2013, 09:24:11 AM

Quote from: gizmoh on July 17, 2013, 09:10:12 AM

I have the impression the background is blurred intentionally..One can't be certain if its filmed from Gox headquarters or this guy's workplace.
And where is Karpeles? No word from him on this issues for more than 10 days!

You call this "focus"

SOMEONE ON THE INTERNET WAS WRONG, MUST CORRECT THEM.....

You dont actually, you call it "depth of field" (at least in the photography world...)

fabrizziop

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Quote from: zeroblock on July 17, 2013, 11:28:33 AM

Quote from: fabrizziop on July 17, 2013, 11:07:37 AM

Quote from: zeroblock on July 17, 2013, 10:42:06 AM

Mt.Gox uses Mizuho Bank, one of the biggest banks in the world. MtGox represents an absolutely tiny fraction of the total volume that bank processes. So we are supposed to beleive that a major bank can't process MtGox withdraws after volume dropped signficantly but deposits are no problem? Sounds like a stall tactic to refresh deposits.

So another more ominous conspiracy that I saw on reddit.....

"There is definitely an incentive for MtGox to act like this; withholding fiat withdrawals to pup up the price, and then start buying coins on other exchanges while selling them on their own with 5+% profit. After a month or two, they can just re-start processing of the withdrawals, saying 'sorry' like nothing ever happened, though being so much richer at that point already. And who is going to prove them any wrongdoing? It would also explains a high volume, despite of the fact that they have not been an actual exchange, for far over a month already, but only a service that sells bitcoins, at a price 5-10% higher from the market."

I think the problem is more with the bank services API, that would explain Mt.Gox not automating wires. IMO the bank changed the API or something and Mt.Gox hasn't adapted.

And what gives you reason to think that?

The description of the current situation, I think they're processing large wires manually but I doubt the guys with one million dollars at mtgox will claim a 1 BTC bounty. I'm assuming they're acting in good faith.

zeroblock

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Let's see the screenshot. USD withdraw?

EPiSKiNG

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Is there still a bounty? Mine came through.

-EP

OhShei8e

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Quote from: cedivad on July 17, 2013, 08:07:15 AM

They actually did stop SEPA withdrawn, since that noone has received one in the last 2 weeks at least...

My SEPA withdrawal from the 4th of June goes to "pending" today.

Topic: 0.25 BTC Bounty - Show me a Mt Gox USD Withdrawal :) - page 7. (Read 48857 times)