Topic: #1 RATINGS and REVIEWS of SPORTS BOOKS thread. Poster input appreciated. - page 33. (Read 89572 times)

Hi trytrytry- If you log into their website, they have nice support that will work with you.

steer me to any of your books in your network that also offer horse racing options.  PM me any details

"Yeah, most of those are just credit pph's.  you wont find any 'ratings' on them."

Yes, an agent showed me "1 BetVegas" in the past.
I thought I remember it as a skin of Legendz, but I guess I'm remembering incorrectly if it's still up.

"Cointeller is stating that they are agents for books and other agents. I'm much more comfortable when Cointeller is dealing with just a sportsbook and not an agent."

Agree.



"Gogo- I wouldn't put too much stock in the ratings over at SBR."

I agree. But it's a start.

We offer accounts directly into books and accounts under a number of agents, all of whom have been vetted as part of the process to join the network.  We would be happy to steer customers toward one or the other based on customer preference, this is part of conversation held between the customer and their VIP host upon joining Cointeller (along with matching based on line offerings and other features on a book by book basis).

Cointeller is stating that they are agents for books and other agents. I'm much more comfortable when Cointeller is dealing with just a sportsbook and not an agent.


Gogo- I wouldn't put too much stock in the ratings over at SBR.

Yeah, most of those are just credit pph's.  you wont find any 'ratings' on them.

this is a great thread..tons of info here.

Some of those listed above may be skins. I'll PM them to see if they would like to address any questions guys may have such as do they pay us if the book goes under.

Of the 9 books they are agents for, only 2 are even listed at SBR:

ABCIslands  = Rated C

InstantActionSports  = Rated C

"SBR recommends players choose sportsbooks with a minimum rating of B+"

"C- to C+    Average service and some risk to players funds."

Cointeller just opened. They work in the same way that SBOBitcoin works although they have a wider range of books.

Nice work by both gogo and Anonibet working together. It's good to see a book take our opinions seriously.

OK I see your point now. You might be right, we shall remove it from our T&C.

We have set this rule in order to prevent large amounts of BTC kept in Anonibet. Bitcoin is very attractive for hackers and we do not want to attract "bad guys" thinking we keep large amounts of BTC. This was the only purpose really. We do not even charge withdraw fees, we pay the network fee at each withdraw so that our customers receive the exact amount they have withdrawn from Anonibet.

Regards,
Michael

Info@Anonibet - [Re: statement in T&C that withdrawing without 1x play through will be charged 5%]

"Dear Gogo ppp,

Thank you for your comment. As I have already explained, we do not want to become a safe box. We have never applied this rule so far. I do not understand why this disturbs you..."




Michael - Since you said you don't understand...


I leave a few coins in various books that I feel comfortable with, in case I find a bet I would like to make in the future and can save time this way.

I would feel comfortable doing this with Anonibet, except I don't want to be charged 5% if I decide to withdraw (a few coins). Part of the positives of bitcoins is they can be moved for a few pennies, not 5%.

So it makes me uncomfortable for that reason. Yours is the only book where I see that charge.
If I leave 4 coins valued at ~$500 usd each it will cost me $100 if you change your mind/someone other than you applies the charge, etc.

You say the charge has never been applied.
But then, as I asked, why not remove the language, and give individual warnings that you will apply the 5% charge in the future to people you feel are using Anonibet as a safe box.

So this is why it disturbs me and why I mentioned it for a 2nd time.

Bitcoinlivebets should be an F.

Reasons:

1) People have to post on their thread here to get their bets graded.

2) Any "sportsbook" which is asking the customers to invest in it is a scam and is going down in the future.
An automatic F should be awarded to any "sportsbook" doing this.

Ponzi.

BOOKMAKER (Jetwin): "Our bonus TC contain standard points which can be found in TC of a number of companies. Here are just a few examples from bookies with SBR rating A- & A+:..."
  



" bookmaker.eu: All bonuses must comply with a 4-time rollover requirement before any withdrawal is made. BookMaker reserves the right to modify or terminate this promotion at any time without prior notice."

Can you tell me where to find this info on their website?
I see nothing about bonuses - none offered, no info on rollover.
They only appear to offer BetPoints, a loyalty program.


"betonline.ag: Player agrees not to request a withdrawal prior to meeting all stipulations, including rollover requirements. Bonuses are for recreational players. BetOnline reserves the right to deny and/or cancel bonuses and/or winnings from said bonuses if management determines a player to be non-recreational, an arbitrage bettor, a scalper, or part of a syndicate - without further explanation. BetOnline reserves the right to take away any bonus at any time without explanation."

BetOnline does have the above copy mixed into their terms.

It also states under the "Bonus" rules:



"12. Players that accept a bonus and do not wager any portion of the bonus, may request a withdrawal and have the bonus removed from their account."


However, I see no rules for what qualifies for rollover in the "Bonus" section of their rules.

In the "Freeplay" rules, it does give some guidelines:

 "Free Plays can only be wagered on:

    FOOTBALL (NFL / NCAA / CFL / ARENA)
    BASKETBALL (NBA / NCAA / WNBA)
    MLB Major League Baseball
    NHL
    CRICKET
    SOCCER
    BOXING
    UFC (MIXED MARTIAL ARTS)
    TENNIS

    Free Plays can be used only in the Sportsbook on straight bets, parlays and teasers (no round robins).
    No point-buying is allowed.
    Free Plays lose when a push or tie results."
__________________________________________________________

"When calculating “rollover”, we use the lower of the risk/reward value as the effective value. For example, if you bet $500 on Team A to win $450, and you bet $400 on Team B to win $350, and you bet $250 on Team C to win $50, the total action applied toward fulfilling the rollover requirement would be $850 ($450 + $350 + $50)."
_______________________________________________________________________________ ___________


Contrast this to your rules - You will only count up to $75 per bet toward rollover; you don't count the lower of risk/reward of a bet but instead only accept bets with certain odds, etc.

Also, if I'm reading this correctly - the customer must bet the entire bonus amount in one single parlay bet,  at least once , with additional requirements as to the odds that can be offered and simultaneous start times for the events parlayed.
Congratulations on coming up with the most onerous condition I've ever seen for a rollover!

I've never seen rules anywhere close to as difficult as yours are for completing a rollover.
Can you find another book with similar rules?
Is there any book in the Universe which requires the entire bonus amount to be wagered in one parlay?
But that's not enough for you - you then require only certain odds, and simultaneous start times for at least 2 of the events.

As you are well aware, the player is a favorite to lose the parlay and thus the entire bonus amount in that one bet.
But they are then committed to your book for the rollover, locking them in for a long time with your $75 rollover limit.
Ridiculous.


I'd also like to point out that your handle "BOOKMAKER" rather than "Jetwin" is confusing, since as you know there is a reputable online sportsbook named "Bookmaker".

All points of Terms & Conditions mentioned above have already been repeatedly discussed here on the message board, and we tried to explain in detail our position in regard to this issue. Due to various reasons our users pose questions related to TC again. That’s why I’ll try to highlight the most crucial issues and give explanations:

Welcome Bonus
   - All bonuses are optional. If you do not want to comply with any rollover requirement, don't submit the code during Sign-Up.

   - Both parts of Bonus TC (General & Specific)  are found in the same section and are available to each user in any place of the website where the bonus is mentioned. If the user has questions in regard to bonus TC, our support team will always give a very detailed explanation.

   - Scam, is to offer 200% bonus amounting to thousands and sometimes to tens of thousands of dollars with easier rollover requirements. We offer an adequate bonus sum with conditions which can be realistically fulfilled by client. The system of rollover accounting is completely automatized, and a player can follow the rollover fulfillment straight in his/her account.

   - Our bonus TC contain standard points which can be found in TC of a number of companies. Here are just a few examples from bookies with SBR rating A- & A+:
   betonline.ag: Player agrees not to request a withdrawal prior to meeting all stipulations, including rollover requirements. Bonuses are for recreational players. BetOnline reserves the right to deny and/or cancel bonuses and/or winnings from said bonuses if management determines a player to be non-recreational, an arbitrage bettor, a scalper, or part of a syndicate - without further explanation. BetOnline reserves the right to take away any bonus at any time without explanation.
   bookmaker.eu: All bonuses must comply with a 4-time rollover requirement before any withdrawal is made. BookMaker reserves the right to modify or terminate this promotion at any time without prior notice.


General T&C
   - Due to a high number of our users’ requests we have implemented anonymous accounts. It is impossible to apply a number of our TC sections to them due to various reasons.
   - Some points indeed contain rather one-sided information and will be reconsidered during this week.

Finally, I would like to add that we put all efforts to provide our users with safe and competitive product which not only uses all advantages of bitcoin, but also contributes to the development and popularization of bitcoin-community.

This was the original review of Jetwin. We did grill them once in this thread and they shrugged it off. gogo is right in that the rules should go. I'll PM them to see if they would like to address what gogo has posted one more time.

Gogo is doing some serious research into Jetwin and found some serious dirt! I wonder if they will change their terms suddenly or simply shrug it off. Most interesting.

I never paid attention to Coinbet, but a new book offering a 200% bonus, a statement that anyone posting negative info about them would have their account closed and funds confiscated, and from the day they opened they had statements on their website stating that they are an "award winning" book - !!!

Likewise for Jetwin, they open with the most onerous rollover conditions I've ever seen, including it's necessary to bet the bonus in a parlay!
I would make them an F - reread the terms - enormous red flag. Sounds like the terms were written by the Coinbet people as far as same mindset.



 
"JETWIN General Promotion Terms and Conditions

1. These terms and conditions apply to all promotion.
2. Below are the standard promotion terms and conditions:

Bit Entertainment S.A. (hereafter the "Company" or "JETWIN") is the operator of the website www.jetwin.com (hereafter the "Website") through which the Company provides its online sports betting services.

Standard promotion terms and conditions
The following are the terms and conditions governing all the promotion under this Website. All customer applications of the promotion under this website are subject to and governed by these terms and conditions.

    Customer is over the age of 18, or the age of consent in the customer's home jurisdiction, whichever is higher and has the mental capacity to take responsibility for the Customer's own actions and be bound by these terms and conditions. JETWIN shall reserves the right at any and all times to void any transactions involving minors.  

    All bonuses offered are intended for recreation customers only. Betting “Steam Plays” or “Moves”, engaging in arbitrage or hedge betting, shall all be considered irregular gaming for bonus play-through requirement purposes. Accounts identified or suspected as irregular gaming type are subject to have their status changed to ‘PFD Trading’. ‘PFD Trading’ status does not allow an account holder to place any bets except Multi Bets, where odds of each event are not less than 1/2 (1,50), and at least two events have an identical start time.  

    JETWIN will only offer one bonus per person, family, household address, email address, telephone number.
 
    In all promotions, strict rules will be enforced on multiple accounts abuse. JETWIN shall in its sole discretion decide on what activity constitutes multiple account abuse.  

   After a bonus has been credited to a customer’s betting account, any funds are unavailable for withdrawal. As soon as a customer fulfills bonus rollover requirements, the restriction will be cancelled.
  
    Only wagers that generate a win/loss return will contribute to the promotional rollover requirement.  
    Bets placed on «Outright» markets do not count towards any rollover requirement. Multi Bet which contains selection belonging to the above-mentioned bet type similarly will not be counted towards the rollover requirements.  
    Bets made below (Decimal Odds 1.5; US Odds -200; Fractional Odds 1/2) and void, tie, cancelled will not be counted towards the rollover requirements.
 
    All deposit bonuses must be turned over on any bet, with a maximum bet amount of $75 (or currency equivalent: EUR 55; GBP 45; CAD 75; SEK 475; mBTC 75). If the bet is worth more than $75, only $75 will be counted towards the wagering requirement.  

    For wagering purposes only the first bet qualifies in one single event. Example on the match Arsenal vs Chelsea only the first bet qualifies and “following bets” will not count towards the rollover requirements.  

    In order to fulfill promotional rollover requirements a player is to place one or several Multi Bets in the amount that should equal the sum of the bonus received. These bets have to contain at least two events which simultaneously meet the following criteria: they start at the same time; odds of each event are not less than 1,50 (US Odds -200; Fractional Odds 1/2).  


   Obligation to bonus terms, rules and restrictions is fulfilled when an account balance is less than the minimum stake amount allowed (i.e. $0.20). Note that total account balance includes pending sports bets.  

    JETWIN reserves the right to ask any customer to provide sufficient documentation for us to be satisfied in our absolute discretion as to the customer's identity prior to us crediting any bonus to his account.  

    Where any term of the offers or promotions have not been fulfilled by eligible account holders; are breached; are abused; or there is any evidence of a series of bets placed by a customer or group of customers irrespective of the outcome; or there is collusion in any other forms; or from the usage of multiple accounts; which due to a promotion bonus or any other promotional offer resulted in customer's profits, whether individually or as part of a group; JETWIN reserves the right to withhold, cancel or reclaim the bonus plus all winnings and to levy a charge on the customer's or customers' accounts up to the value of the deposit bonus to cover administrative costs. As a punitive deterrent and preceding to the deduction of such bonus or bonus plus winnings and administrative cost, the remaining balance in any or all accounts will be subjected to a 100% turnover respectively, before any withdrawal is allowed.
  
   Should disputes arise in all matters relating to the awarding of the bonus and/or the Terms and Conditions in the Promotion, the final decision shall lies with JETWIN. The decision made will be binding and shall not be subject to review or appeal by any customer or third party.

    By participating in the Promotion, the customer agrees to release, discharge and hold harmless, the Company, JETWIN, their legal representatives, their affiliates, subsidiaries, agencies and their respective officers, directors, employees and agents from any damage incurred or losses suffered or sustained, whether directly or indirectly related to the Promotion.  

    Employees and relatives of employees of JETWIN and any entities affiliated or related to JETWIN are not permitted to participate in the Promotion. For these purposes, "relative" shall mean spouse, partner, parent, child or sibling.  

   JETWIN further reserves the exclusive right, exercisable in its sole discretion, to modify, alter, discontinue, cancel and/or void this promotion at any time without any notice.  

    In the event of any discrepancy between the meanings of Non-English versions of these Promotions the Specific Terms and Conditions, the meaning of English language version shall prevail.  

These terms and conditions were last changed 09:00 GMT 11th of February 2014."


These people are scammers - the copy above screams this out.

After Coinbet, there is no excuse for ignoring something so obvious.



From Jetwin's T&C:

" 2.5
   

The Customer warrants that the Customer will not attempt to attack, hack, make unauthorized alterations to, or introduce any kind of malicious code to the Website. As such, the Customer will not, without limitation, (a) reverse engineer or decompile (in whole or in part) any software available through the Website; or (b) make copies, modify, reproduce, transmit, alter, use or distribute all or any part of the Website or any material or information contained on it; or (c) disclose account information to any third party; or (d) contravene any of the provisions stated herein specially but not limited to Clause 6 below; or (e) cheat, deceive, trick, misinform or defraud the Company in any way through use or abuse of the Company's services or this Website. Should the Company suspect that the Customer has failed to abide by the terms of this provision, the Company shall have, in addition to any other remedy, the right to freeze or suspend the Customer's account with the Company in order to carry out further investigations which if confirm the Customer's failure to abide by the terms of this provision will result in the termination of the Services to the Customer, closure of the Customer's account and forfeiture by the Company of any amounts in the Customer's account."


So if a Jetwin customer posts on this forum that they're not getting paid, the company will keep their account funds.
Nice...