I agree with retro, their terms don't add up to some UK regulations that I've seen. I'm not a UK resident, but I know enough to contact the UK authorities. If I lived there, I would also talk to a lawyer and see if they'll pro-bono look over the terms to see if there are any ways it can be attacked.
And, I keep saying it, I'd go camp out at their business address and harass them (legally). I'm surprised so few people are interested in face to face discussions. People are possibly going to lose tens, thousands of dollars. Wouldn't you want to follow these folks home to see where the money is going?
And hell, who knows, on the speculative side of things, maybe those couple of folks months ago were right and the money did get laundered to "horrible purposes". All we know is none of this looks proper. None of it.
Topic: Alpha Technology Litecoin (Scrypt) ASIC Miner Order Batch 1 Now! - page 172. (Read 529096 times)
July 01, 2014, 01:51:06 PM
July 01, 2014, 01:48:37 PM
What do you think?
Is that the same "leading law firm" that wrote their extremely amateurish original terms and conditions? The same "leading law firm that has re-written them 3 times? The same "leading law firm" that failed to mention anywhere on the website that this is a B2B purchase? This is some kind of joke. You could drive a bus through the holes in that argument. I really can't believe the nerve of these guys.
Alpha customers are pretty screwed whatever happens as the people running this company seem to have no regard for the law or their customers. It seems you'll have to drag them through the courts to get anything out of them.
I've made several posts regarding the illegality of their refund policy and how to fight it. I suggest you give them a read, then contact Citizens Advice and start a small claims action..
https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.7371136
https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.7368036
https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.7290648
https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.7293210
July 01, 2014, 01:38:22 PM
In an ideal world, the people who will be ripped off here would serve as a reminder to others not to purchase ASICs on pre-orders from companies who have zero history or track record.
In reality though, this will just be another notch on the belt, and the scamming companies will keep popping up and stealing from their "customers".
Move along, nothing new to see here!
In reality though, this will just be another notch on the belt, and the scamming companies will keep popping up and stealing from their "customers".
Move along, nothing new to see here!
July 01, 2014, 01:08:38 PM
I can assure you that our legal matters are dealt with by a leading law firm in the UK. I can assure you that the terms of order are completely legal in the UK. Our terms were typed up by solicitors who specialize in this area of law. They have advised us that all our customers will be legally classed as businesses for many reasons and one reason being that the hardware we are selling can only be used for either mining cryptocurrencies or for resale unless the customer can prove anything other in court which is of course not possible as our devices have no other use.
Wow! This has gone ugly. They started to wipe their mugs with "solicitors". That means they have taken some steps to rip off customers that wanted to get refunds. The message is clear, a specially in context that they claimed to have 70% of all the money collected and production fully funded.
Anyway on the same basis Blizzard can claim their WOW subscribers to be businesses because they can farm gold and even sell it online.
July 01, 2014, 12:45:15 PM
This is what I received upon cancellation request:
"Hello there,
I am very sorry but as per our cancellation policy which is legally binding it has been longer than 5 months since you placed your order therefore you are no longer eligible for a refund. We must say we have been very clear and open with our terms of order, it was released as a news update, it is easily available on our website and you are requested to view it on the product page before you order. I can assure you that our legal matters are dealt with by a leading law firm in the UK. I can assure you that the terms of order are completely legal in the UK. Our terms were typed up by solicitors who specialize in this area of law. They have advised us that all our customers will be legally classed as businesses for many reasons and one reason being that the hardware we are selling can only be used for either mining cryptocurrencies or for resale unless the customer can prove anything other in court which is of course not possible as our devices have no other use.
Best Regards,
Alpha Technology Team"
What do you think?
"Hello there,
I am very sorry but as per our cancellation policy which is legally binding it has been longer than 5 months since you placed your order therefore you are no longer eligible for a refund. We must say we have been very clear and open with our terms of order, it was released as a news update, it is easily available on our website and you are requested to view it on the product page before you order. I can assure you that our legal matters are dealt with by a leading law firm in the UK. I can assure you that the terms of order are completely legal in the UK. Our terms were typed up by solicitors who specialize in this area of law. They have advised us that all our customers will be legally classed as businesses for many reasons and one reason being that the hardware we are selling can only be used for either mining cryptocurrencies or for resale unless the customer can prove anything other in court which is of course not possible as our devices have no other use.
Best Regards,
Alpha Technology Team"
What do you think?
July 01, 2014, 10:10:42 AM
Our money is gone! Fuck!
July 01, 2014, 09:21:54 AM
Hashfast was hilarious. And did anyone see photos of the "CEO" ? I wouldn't trust him with a broken pencil.
July 01, 2014, 09:21:36 AM
Just don't be one of those people who doesn't see the writing on the wall, here.
July 01, 2014, 09:06:01 AM
https://forum.alpha-t.net/index.php?topic=708.25
Fiaz:
"Right so your concern is if we don't have the processor up before shipment. This is something that I cannot possibly give you our response to at this time, it is something we are considering as we really appreciate where you're coming from but we will cross this bridge when we get there and will make no decisions yet."
Alpha just went from "next week", "any day now", "any hour" to "maybe never" about the CC processor.
Fiaz:
"Right so your concern is if we don't have the processor up before shipment. This is something that I cannot possibly give you our response to at this time, it is something we are considering as we really appreciate where you're coming from but we will cross this bridge when we get there and will make no decisions yet."
Alpha just went from "next week", "any day now", "any hour" to "maybe never" about the CC processor.
Lol. I thought they were supposed to be transparent. This is why I feel things have reached critical mass at alpha tech. They were posting every step in the design process. Then announce chips are ready to ship and they want money. Now all of a sudden it is silent with a few vague announcements and statement about nothing at this time. And it's been over a month. And then recently the company starts scaling back is Internet presence.
Hashfast did the same thing. I give it about 2 weeks before bankruptcy rumors and another 3 weeks before you see an official filling of bankruptcy.
July 01, 2014, 09:04:58 AM
Totally contradicting himself too.. he promised it upon his own well being that they would have it by the end of June. Remember they guaranteed it by the end of June, without question?
Also, pay particular attention to their wording in their last update (Source), especially the highlighted:
"And we are sorry the payment processor keeps getting delayed we are doing everything we can to get it to you as fast as possible, rest assured we are committed to it so it will happen but some things are just outside of our control; as soon as it’s up we will email you. It could in fact be any day now but do note this is an issue separate to production and does not affect our schedule. We will be producing as many units as ordered without waiting for card customers to pay thus if you have not yet paid your order will still be manufactured regardless. Therefore our development isn’t delayed by this and if we end up with extra units they will first be offered to existing customers and if they still haven’t been taken up they will then be put up for sale to the public. "
Having read that, keep this in mind:
1. Most folks signed on because they offered credit processing (the bait)
2. They're going to make the same amount of machines regardless of who's paid (the distraction)
3. They have no method to take credit
4. If your account is unpaid, they will offer your machine to someone else (the switch)
5. Your deposit isn't refundable, ergo, they got a free loan
This isn't to say this was the plan from the beginning (could've been, but not necessarily), however, the way they're posturing themselves, they apparently almost seem to benefit from not having a credit processing method. In their minds, they don't have to issue refunds on unfulfilled orders (their T&C saying their faults do not constitute default). If you had planned to use a CC to pay this whole time, you'd be bum out of luck, and your order would go to someone else.
Consider for a moment how many chips they would have to have ordered to complete the project. The original systems were what, 5 and 20? The new systems are 50 and 250. Going on their estimate of 1.4mh per chip, batch 1 of 1,200 orders for each (I think that was right, correct me if wrong):
5mh @ 1.4mh/ch = 4 chips
20mh @ 1.4mh/ch = 15 chips
That's 19 chips total. 1,200 orders each = 22,800 chips. Most smart OEMs will order 25% extra for spares/issues/etc. So that's 28,500 chips. Now consider, according to their timeline, they began the foundry process without telling us, sometime in April. This is before they promised more and more hashpower for folks. So their order was placed and done.
How then, can they achieve these results with 28,500 chips:
50mh @ 1.4mh/ch = 36 chips (43,200 chips required)
250mh @ 1.4mh/ch = 179 chips (214,800 chips required)
215 chips at 1,200 orders = 258,000 chips. In other words, they're promising to deliver ten times the hashpower, despite locking in their order at 1/10th the capacity. UNLESS of course, they originally planned to order 1,000% more chips. Even the 10% gain in efficiency doesn't make up for it.
With even more chips than they likedly ordered, let's say 30,000, they still couldn't fulfill just the 50mh orders.
The only way to make any of this even close to working, is to prevent many people from getting their orders, and/or to raise more money to keep the foundry pumping out chips. There's also possibilities not covered here.
This is all speculative, but when you run the numbers--there's lots of math not adding up. A promise of tenfold increase in delivered product, after locking in their foundry order, with only a 10-20% increase in chip efficiency.
(edited to fix typo in numbers)
Also, pay particular attention to their wording in their last update (Source), especially the highlighted:
"And we are sorry the payment processor keeps getting delayed we are doing everything we can to get it to you as fast as possible, rest assured we are committed to it so it will happen but some things are just outside of our control; as soon as it’s up we will email you. It could in fact be any day now but do note this is an issue separate to production and does not affect our schedule. We will be producing as many units as ordered without waiting for card customers to pay thus if you have not yet paid your order will still be manufactured regardless. Therefore our development isn’t delayed by this and if we end up with extra units they will first be offered to existing customers and if they still haven’t been taken up they will then be put up for sale to the public. "
Having read that, keep this in mind:
1. Most folks signed on because they offered credit processing (the bait)
2. They're going to make the same amount of machines regardless of who's paid (the distraction)
3. They have no method to take credit
4. If your account is unpaid, they will offer your machine to someone else (the switch)
5. Your deposit isn't refundable, ergo, they got a free loan
This isn't to say this was the plan from the beginning (could've been, but not necessarily), however, the way they're posturing themselves, they apparently almost seem to benefit from not having a credit processing method. In their minds, they don't have to issue refunds on unfulfilled orders (their T&C saying their faults do not constitute default). If you had planned to use a CC to pay this whole time, you'd be bum out of luck, and your order would go to someone else.
Consider for a moment how many chips they would have to have ordered to complete the project. The original systems were what, 5 and 20? The new systems are 50 and 250. Going on their estimate of 1.4mh per chip, batch 1 of 1,200 orders for each (I think that was right, correct me if wrong):
5mh @ 1.4mh/ch = 4 chips
20mh @ 1.4mh/ch = 15 chips
That's 19 chips total. 1,200 orders each = 22,800 chips. Most smart OEMs will order 25% extra for spares/issues/etc. So that's 28,500 chips. Now consider, according to their timeline, they began the foundry process without telling us, sometime in April. This is before they promised more and more hashpower for folks. So their order was placed and done.
How then, can they achieve these results with 28,500 chips:
50mh @ 1.4mh/ch = 36 chips (43,200 chips required)
250mh @ 1.4mh/ch = 179 chips (214,800 chips required)
215 chips at 1,200 orders = 258,000 chips. In other words, they're promising to deliver ten times the hashpower, despite locking in their order at 1/10th the capacity. UNLESS of course, they originally planned to order 1,000% more chips. Even the 10% gain in efficiency doesn't make up for it.
With even more chips than they likedly ordered, let's say 30,000, they still couldn't fulfill just the 50mh orders.
The only way to make any of this even close to working, is to prevent many people from getting their orders, and/or to raise more money to keep the foundry pumping out chips. There's also possibilities not covered here.
This is all speculative, but when you run the numbers--there's lots of math not adding up. A promise of tenfold increase in delivered product, after locking in their foundry order, with only a 10-20% increase in chip efficiency.
(edited to fix typo in numbers)
July 01, 2014, 09:00:22 AM
I am kind of at a loss as to what removing their online presence would do at this point. Its not like the community does not know who/where they are and what was said previously. There are a lot of excellent trolls and scam hawks roaming around the forum. If it made its way onto the internet you have lost control of it....period.
Someone unleash PG!!!!
Someone unleash PG!!!!
Because fix used a lot of outlets to spread the word he is cleaning them all up to reduce the chance of someone finding some nugget that will destroy their defense in court. It is a desperate move and even if it seams futile it might help in some ways. Lot at what the us irs is doing. Shading hard drives and not backing anything up. Fiaz is hoping for a bungling court at this point.
July 01, 2014, 07:48:21 AM
https://forum.alpha-t.net/index.php?topic=708.25
Fiaz:
"Right so your concern is if we don't have the processor up before shipment. This is something that I cannot possibly give you our response to at this time, it is something we are considering as we really appreciate where you're coming from but we will cross this bridge when we get there and will make no decisions yet."
Alpha just went from "next week", "any day now", "any hour" to "maybe never" about the CC processor.
Fiaz:
"Right so your concern is if we don't have the processor up before shipment. This is something that I cannot possibly give you our response to at this time, it is something we are considering as we really appreciate where you're coming from but we will cross this bridge when we get there and will make no decisions yet."
Alpha just went from "next week", "any day now", "any hour" to "maybe never" about the CC processor.
July 01, 2014, 07:11:35 AM
I am kind of at a loss as to what removing their online presence would do at this point. Its not like the community does not know who/where they are and what was said previously. There are a lot of excellent trolls and scam hawks roaming around the forum. If it made its way onto the internet you have lost control of it....period.
Someone unleash PG!!!!
Someone unleash PG!!!!
July 01, 2014, 05:07:15 AM
yes, if you agree or agree by not disagreeing (i forget the actual term) they can use that against you legally.
'assumed consent' maybe?
kinda off-topic but this is why the TV licence vermin can only come up to your door until you tell them they cant - and then they legally can NOT.
you might be surprised how many people live in fear of the TV license people, unaware that a simple 'you are trespassing/not welcome' is enough to legally force them to comply.
'assumed consent' maybe?
kinda off-topic but this is why the TV licence vermin can only come up to your door until you tell them they cant - and then they legally can NOT.
you might be surprised how many people live in fear of the TV license people, unaware that a simple 'you are trespassing/not welcome' is enough to legally force them to comply.
July 01, 2014, 04:44:39 AM
July 01, 2014, 03:37:20 AM
Fiaz has now removed his photo from his Alpha Technologies forum user avatar...the slow but deliberate decline into anonymity continues.
They're not, they're acting like they want their money back because they didn't get what they were promised, and that is wrong how?
Buying something before it is invented is a high risk venture. The odds are that it will fail so why are people acting surprised?
They're not, they're acting like they want their money back because they didn't get what they were promised, and that is wrong how?
July 01, 2014, 02:23:05 AM
Buying something before it is invented is a high risk venture. The odds are that it will fail so why are people acting surprised?
July 01, 2014, 01:55:23 AM
bumface. lol. 
July 01, 2014, 12:03:09 AM
edgar: this thread is not the time and the place....
and you cant go around accusing people of being thieves and liars, i dont work for btc-e im simply a chat mod.i never stole a cent from anybody there,and i haven`t lied
and i actually cant afford to loose it,that money is all i got.That money was from the UTC IPO, and those asics have to fund developements, and my company.it was a long term desicion.However IF i loose it, i did not endanger my rent,food or family matters such as christmas
when your logic fails you resort to name calling and that is a shame.This is not how gentlemen talk.
so again,wishing that i loose my money shows very little character and a disproportional anger for a chat ban that transpired 9 months ago,a ban that you deserved because you broke the rules stated under terms (rules that i did not make).
But if you want to live your life hating the big and mean world, thats your choice....
Life is alot nicer when you dont think of people as your enemys,you also need to know that your words are hurtfull,and that im a human being just like you.Imagine getting horrible PM`s like you used to send frequently.people who are incapable of admitting they broke the rules so they decide to lash out in a personal way.The lowest form of communication is personal attack.
and i remind you again that this is a thread about alpha technology, not a platform for your misguided frustration.
and you cant go around accusing people of being thieves and liars, i dont work for btc-e im simply a chat mod.i never stole a cent from anybody there,and i haven`t lied
and i actually cant afford to loose it,that money is all i got.That money was from the UTC IPO, and those asics have to fund developements, and my company.it was a long term desicion.However IF i loose it, i did not endanger my rent,food or family matters such as christmas
when your logic fails you resort to name calling and that is a shame.This is not how gentlemen talk.
so again,wishing that i loose my money shows very little character and a disproportional anger for a chat ban that transpired 9 months ago,a ban that you deserved because you broke the rules stated under terms (rules that i did not make).
But if you want to live your life hating the big and mean world, thats your choice....
Life is alot nicer when you dont think of people as your enemys,you also need to know that your words are hurtfull,and that im a human being just like you.Imagine getting horrible PM`s like you used to send frequently.people who are incapable of admitting they broke the rules so they decide to lash out in a personal way.The lowest form of communication is personal attack.
and i remind you again that this is a thread about alpha technology, not a platform for your misguided frustration.
'dont blame others'
'accept responsibility for your own actions'
'dont invest more than you can afford to lose'
dont be a hypocrite & a liar & dont twist facts into garbage to suit your ignorance.
my complaint was you banned me when i was asking for support, NOT when i RETALIATED to your little gang of internet thugs wrt a PREVIOUS NON RELATED issue (trolling & the allowance of mod 'friends' to troll/swear/abuse at will)
but i agree, not the time nor the place.
deep down i DO hope you get your money back (next january) but now you know how it feels to have your money & life fucked with by dishonesty & greed.
karmas a bitch aint it...
as for LTC, shes breaking my balls!!
June 30, 2014, 09:45:16 PM
Something is afoot at alpha tech. Fiaz deleting accounts on bitcointalk and litecointalk and editing alpha tech forum posts. No removing photos.
Assuming he has inside information that he has not reported to contenders yet I think that things are not going well inside the company and they are piling on the Sand bags preparing for the shirt storm when they have to announce that either they can't get a payment processor up and running, the foundry will not send them chips until they remit payment or both.
Imagine the backlash when that happens. So fiaz is going through all the old posts deleting all his "guarantees" and anything that he could be held liable for in a court of law. It's only July 1st, wait a week or two to see what a mess this thread will be.
Where are the chips fiaz!!! Post a photo with you and them in hand with today's newspaper!
Assuming he has inside information that he has not reported to contenders yet I think that things are not going well inside the company and they are piling on the Sand bags preparing for the shirt storm when they have to announce that either they can't get a payment processor up and running, the foundry will not send them chips until they remit payment or both.
Imagine the backlash when that happens. So fiaz is going through all the old posts deleting all his "guarantees" and anything that he could be held liable for in a court of law. It's only July 1st, wait a week or two to see what a mess this thread will be.
Where are the chips fiaz!!! Post a photo with you and them in hand with today's newspaper!
Jump to: