Topic: [ANN] ChipMixer.com - Bitcoin mixer / Bitcoin tumbler - mixing reinvented - page 80. (Read 92708 times)

Question about the mixing internals. Are internal tumblers used at ChipMixer? What does a chain analysis through ChipMixer look like?  I tried by hand, and got lost in the weeds, but most analysts will be more clever than I.  So to illustrate my question, here's what I imagine happen, but would like some confirmation.

• [1] User Bob deposits 0.0031 BTC to ChipMixer address 1BoB...wVFR
• [2] ChipMixer tumbles 1BoB...wVFR with other deposits and creates outputs of 1, 4, 32... mBTC
• [3] User Carol deposits 0.0052 BTC to ChipMixer address 1CaroL...LnGu
• [4] ChipMixer tumbles 1CaroL...LnGu with other deposits and creates outputs of 2, 8, 16... mBTC
• [5] Carol withdrawals a 4-chip and 1-chip (possibly from tumbler [2] transaction)

Is this close to correct?  Are there tumblers guaranteed between deposits and withdrawals or are one user's deposits sometimes passed directly to another user's withdrawal without a tumbler in between?  If someone made a deposit of exactly 0.001, 0.002, 0.004, could those be passed on without tumbling?

Perhaps (if internal tumblers aren't guaranteed) this is a motive for people to tip and make odd shaped deposits, so that they won't end up in someone else's future transaction history.

I think you're confused by the names used. In short:
Import: add a private key to a wallet without moving the funds.
Sweep: use the private key to move the funds from the old address to a new address in your own wallet.

"Import" happens off-chain.
"Sweep" happens on the blockchain.

Long version: See for instance 99bitcoins.com.

@hcp:

ok i thought sth. i didnt get it


1. u made the mixining on chipmixer and  

2. then sweep the private keys to a new wallet

so where is the connection between 1 and 2 related to the blockchain  ?

in the faq's it is mentioned it just like an normal mixing step if u do this in that way

regards moejoejay

They aren't admins; they're part of an advertising campaign ran by ChipMixer. ChipMixer is the only official admin account.

@TheQuin, @Thirdspace, @HCP,
   My adblocker had nix'd your sigs so looking back through the thread it looks like you guys might be ChipMixer admins.  My apologies for not realizing it earlier.  I was looking for an official response and here were many.  Anyway, I get the layout and now follow the intent of the FAQ.  Thanks to all for helping straighten it out.  Overall been pleased with the service.  Been using the onion so didn't get hit with the SSL hickup earlier.  Thanks for providing Tor access BTW.

You mean after you get your private key from ChipMixer?

If so, of course... it is a private key, you can do with it what you like... Import or sweep... or they'll even send the funds to an address for you if you really want.

is it possible after an export from an private key  to sweep afterwards too ?


best regards moejoejay 

 

The FAQ answer makes three statements to the question "What will happen if I send less than lowest chip?":
1. Since we don't have chips lower than 0.001 BTC, your deposit will be treated as donation.
2. Be aware that if you send 0.0015 BTC, you will receive one 0.001 BTC chip.
3. Sending 0.0015 BTC twice will result in three 0.001 BTC chips.

The way I read it, the actual answer is 1 and that "rule" is what will count for amounts less than 0.001 BTC. Unfortunately, they then added statements 2&3 to the same answer... when I think it should be a separate case (what happens to amounts that are not exact chip size).

Statement 2, is trying to indicate that when you send in an amount (over the minimum), they will "round down" to minimum chip size... 0.0015, 0.0028, 0.0034 and 1.2349 will all be rounded DOWN to nearest 0.001. (0.001, 0.002, 0.003 and 1.234 respectively)
Statement 3, is trying to tell you, that if you deposit multiple amounts (that are not counted as donations)... they'll be summed BEFORE the rounding occurs.

I'd agree that the current example is a little confusing... and can certainly understand why you thought it would work that way. I think the ChipMixer admins should tidy that FAQ section up a little to make it a bit more obvious.

---

Personally, I would split it out into two separate cases like this:
"What will happen if I send less than lowest chip?":
- Any deposit less than 0.001 BTC will be regarded as a donation, even if you make multiple small deposits that total more than 0.001.

"What will happen if I send an amount that isn't an exact chip size? ie. 0.00143787":
- Any amount deposited over the minimum chip size, will be rounded down to the minimum chip size (ie. rounded down to 0.001 btc).
Examples:
Deposit 0.00143787 -> rounded down to 0.001
Deposit 0.0015 -> rounded down to 0.001
Deposit 1.0249 -> rounded down to 1.024

- However, if you make multiple deposits (over minimum chip size) they will be summed together before rounding.
Examples:
Deposit 0.0015 + 0.0016 -> summed to 0.0031 -> rounded down to 0.003
Deposit 0.0011 + 0.0011 + 0.0019 -> summed to 0.0041 -> rounded down to 0.004

you misunderstood the example in the faq,
the minimum amount per deposit (1mbtc) is still intact
the minimum amount rule applies to each deposit (utxo), NOT total amount of deposit

that statement gives an example condition of 2 deposits over 1mbtc each
the example simply explains that you won't lose the fraction if they sum up to a full mbtc

I don't think it's very easy for the novice users to understand the process 0here and it does take a bit of working out.

From what I remember two deposits of the same size will be added together if you remain on step 1 until both confirm (disabling no script obviously). You might be able. To go to step 2 but that's as far as you'll want to go, going any further will compromise the addition of more funds AFAIK. This can be resolved by sending an email, a dialogue box could be added to. The java script though which might make it nicer (I.e. "input received, are you waiting for. More chips or do you want to continue"?

Understood, but the final statement asserting merging seems to overwrite the previous statements, or that is a general reading in english.

If that is indeed the design, the wording chosen is not appropriate.

Or at least that's my take.

That A: seems to have been abbreviated from


In the example of two 0.0015 deposits, both are above the minimum chip size. In your example, the second deposit is below the minimum chip size and is therefore treated as a donation.

@ChipMixer,
  Your FAQ implies that partial deposits are merged.  Mine was not.  I feel your FAQ is very clear in what should have happened and would prefer to have the unexpectedly missing chip restored to me.  I think you may also want to review your FAQ for accuracy or examine your back-end code to see where things went wrong.

@BitcoinTalkCommunity,
  Please let me know if you feel my reading of the FAQ linked (and archived) below is reasonable.

I've removed and changed some information below, but here is my basic complaint.  I have already sent and email with accurate and complete information to [email protected]

You can deposit with SegWit addresses (nested and bech32 both should work), but the chips you get are legacy. IIRC ChipMixer planned on switching to SegWit chips but ran into issues with redeeming them.

You can use segwit wallet to send ur funds to the mixer, but it's still obvious if you can use segwit for output transaction. If it's not mentioned in the faq, then preferely to only use legacy addresses until getting the confirmation from the team.
I made a search about this but also didn't find answer so better to wait for manager's response, he is very active here.

Please mention in the first post if its possible to use segwit wallet or not

there is no info about this even in the faq's no entry for this.

best regards moejoejay

Chips has been refiled. You can redeem your vouchers now. Sorry for delay.

I have finally received my BTC.

There is another solution: cheap SSL certificates costing less then 10 USD and expiration time is a year or more.

Let's Encrypt is OK, but admin needs to check his site, sometimes.

But I don't really care about SSL expiration, it's over 24 hours since I'm waiting for my Bitcoin ("chips")

They had that but it seems to have stopped working. If they remember it's probably not much or an issue to just keep manually renewing it every three months.