Topic: [ANN] Ethereum: Welcome to the Beginning - page 818. (Read 2006403 times)
Microsoft Azure only on ETH
Two things I noticed on the web site. First, the site does not mention that principles include allowing thieves to keep their ill-gotten gains and that investors can trust that their investments will be completely depleted if taken by thieves - which the blockchain will tolerate. The code is the law which mean investors have to trust the code will not be exploited for nefarious purposes. I am not sure how you can claim you want it to be trustworthy at the same time, but maybe other investors can figure that out.
I also noticed you take donations in ETH. How ironic.
I also noticed you take donations in ETH. How ironic.
You seem to be lying, I don't take donations.
When I said "you take donations from ETH" I meant the ETC foundation or whatever you call it - I assumed since you posted the link you represented the foundation. In any case the website has an address for ETH donations. That's no lie.
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Wasn't it a platform bug in the solidity compiler that was exploited and allowed the DAO theft to occur in the first place? Wasn't there plenty of warning that the DAO and ETH are beta and in under current development?
ETC is nothing more than an attempt to derail ETH development and justify theft.
It is not compelled by law enforcement to hard fork, it is compelled by the community. Did you see the vote?
I did, it was low turnout and contentious. The amount of hashrate in ETC as well as its exchange rate reflects the dissent. Why is it that ETH supporters still seem to have a problem with ETC? I'm trying to understand that since my first post in this thread but I'm not getting any closer. The "law and order" argument clearly doesn't make sense since ETH didn't really follow the law. Community was split since before the fork. What else?
From the mining hash, you can say that 90% of the miners support the ETH. But miners chase profits.
It is not compelled by law enforcement to hard fork, it is compelled by the community. Did you see the vote?
I did, it was low turnout and contentious. The amount of hashrate in ETC as well as its exchange rate reflects the dissent. Why is it that ETH supporters still seem to have a problem with ETC? I'm trying to understand that since my first post in this thread but I'm not getting any closer. The "law and order" argument clearly doesn't make sense since ETH didn't really follow the law. Community was split since before the fork. What else?
So if ETC is forced to hard fork will exchanges start listing the old chain as Ethereum Classic Original (ECO)?
ETC will never hard fork, it is their principle. If it hard fork, it will be a dead coin. So it will have only one chain.
That's how I perceive their attitude as well. Which means they can't copy/paste Ethereum much longer. Nor will it be easy to find dedicated devs.
Except that it's not actually true:
https://ethereumclassic.github.io/
Quote
We believe in decentralized, censorship-resistant, permissionless blockchains. We believe in the original vision of Ethereum as a world computer you can't shut down, running irreversible smart contracts. We believe in a strong separation of concerns, where system forks are only possible in order to correct actual platform bugs, not to bail out failed contracts and special interests. We believe in censorship-resistant platform that can be actually trusted - by anyone.
Two things I noticed on the web site. First, the site does not mention that principles include allowing thieves to keep their ill-gotten gains and that investors can trust that their investments will be completely depleted if taken by thieves - which the blockchain will tolerate. The code is the law which mean investors have to trust the code will not be exploited for nefarious purposes. I am not sure how you can claim you want it to be trustworthy at the same time, but maybe other investors can figure that out.
I also noticed you take donations in ETH. How ironic.
Wasn't it a platform bug in the solidity compiler that was exploited and allowed the DAO theft to occur in the first place? Wasn't there plenty of warning that the DAO and ETH are beta and in under current development?
ETC is nothing more than an attempt to derail ETH development and justify theft.
Two things I noticed on the web site. First, the site does not mention that principles include allowing thieves to keep their ill-gotten gains and that investors can trust that their investments will be completely depleted if taken by thieves - which the blockchain will tolerate. The code is the law which mean investors have to trust the code will not be exploited for nefarious purposes. I am not sure how you can claim you want it to be trustworthy at the same time, but maybe other investors can figure that out.
I also noticed you take donations in ETH. How ironic.
I also noticed you take donations in ETH. How ironic.
You seem to be lying, I don't take donations.
The "thieves" argument is moot in the case of ETH/ETC. The Ethereum foundation was not compelled by any kind of law enforcement to take action against those "thieves" and it doesn't appear that any due process took place. The fork is an attempt to have it both ways: "let's do law and order like IRL", but also "we will use the code as law to bring justice and move the tokens the way we feel is right".
Here is what should have happened it this wasn't a huge mess of overlapping interests between investors, bagholders, the foundation, slock.it, etc:
The DAO investors find out their investment is at risk. They ask ETH to help. ETH says either "sorry, not our problem, talk to slock.it" or - if they're feeling polite that day - "sorry, there is something we could do (a fork) but it's against our own rules". At which point the DAO investors sue the foundation and/or slock.it, get a court order (or not), fork happens (or not). Not that it would be much less controversial but at least the "law and order" argument would make more sense.
But that sounds slow and inefficient, so fuck it, let's just do justice our own way. Right?
It is not compelled by law enforcement to hard fork, it is compelled by the community. Did you see the vote?
Two things I noticed on the web site. First, the site does not mention that principles include allowing thieves to keep their ill-gotten gains and that investors can trust that their investments will be completely depleted if taken by thieves - which the blockchain will tolerate. The code is the law which mean investors have to trust the code will not be exploited for nefarious purposes. I am not sure how you can claim you want it to be trustworthy at the same time, but maybe other investors can figure that out.
I also noticed you take donations in ETH. How ironic.
I also noticed you take donations in ETH. How ironic.
You seem to be lying, I don't take donations.
The "thieves" argument is moot in the case of ETH/ETC. The Ethereum foundation was not compelled by any kind of law enforcement to take action against those "thieves" and it doesn't appear that any due process took place. The fork is an attempt to have it both ways: "let's do law and order like IRL", but also "we will use the code as law to bring justice and move the tokens the way we feel is right".
Here is what should have happened it this wasn't a huge mess of overlapping interests between investors, bagholders, the foundation, slock.it, etc:
The DAO investors find out their investment is at risk. They ask ETH to help. ETH says either "sorry, not our problem, talk to slock.it" or - if they're feeling polite that day - "sorry, there is something we could do (a fork) but it's against our own rules". At which point the DAO investors sue the foundation and/or slock.it, get a court order (or not), fork happens (or not). Not that it would be much less controversial but at least the "law and order" argument would make more sense.
But that sounds slow and inefficient, so fuck it, let's just do justice our own way. Right?
So if ETC is forced to hard fork will exchanges start listing the old chain as Ethereum Classic Original (ECO)?
ETC will never hard fork, it is their principle. If it hard fork, it will be a dead coin. So it will have only one chain.
That's how I perceive their attitude as well. Which means they can't copy/paste Ethereum much longer. Nor will it be easy to find dedicated devs.
Except that it's not actually true:
https://ethereumclassic.github.io/
Quote
We believe in decentralized, censorship-resistant, permissionless blockchains. We believe in the original vision of Ethereum as a world computer you can't shut down, running irreversible smart contracts. We believe in a strong separation of concerns, where system forks are only possible in order to correct actual platform bugs, not to bail out failed contracts and special interests. We believe in censorship-resistant platform that can be actually trusted - by anyone.
Two things I noticed on the web site. First, the site does not mention that principles include allowing thieves to keep their ill-gotten gains and that investors can trust that their investments will be completely depleted if taken by thieves - which the blockchain will tolerate. The code is the law which mean investors have to trust the code will not be exploited for nefarious purposes. I am not sure how you can claim you want it to be trustworthy at the same time, but maybe other investors can figure that out.
I also noticed you take donations in ETH. How ironic.
tomothy pointed me to this article:
http://motherboard.vice.com/read/the-ethereum-hard-fork-spawned-a-shaky-rebellion-ethereum-classic-etc-eth
So if ETC is forced to hard fork will exchanges start listing the old chain as Ethereum Classic Original (ECO)?
ETC will never hard fork, it is their principle. If it hard fork, it will be a dead coin. So it will have only one chain.
That's how I perceive their attitude as well. Which means they can't copy/paste Ethereum much longer. Nor will it be easy to find dedicated devs.
Except that it's not actually true:
https://ethereumclassic.github.io/
Quote
We believe in decentralized, censorship-resistant, permissionless blockchains. We believe in the original vision of Ethereum as a world computer you can't shut down, running irreversible smart contracts. We believe in a strong separation of concerns, where system forks are only possible in order to correct actual platform bugs, not to bail out failed contracts and special interests. We believe in censorship-resistant platform that can be actually trusted - by anyone.
Yes it is. That is how I perceive the attitude of the community. Whether it's their official policy or not.
So if ETC is forced to hard fork will exchanges start listing the old chain as Ethereum Classic Original (ECO)?
ETC will never hard fork, it is their principle. If it hard fork, it will be a dead coin. So it will have only one chain.
That's how I perceive their attitude as well. Which means they can't copy/paste Ethereum much longer. Nor will it be easy to find dedicated devs.
Except that it's not actually true:
https://ethereumclassic.github.io/
Quote
We believe in decentralized, censorship-resistant, permissionless blockchains. We believe in the original vision of Ethereum as a world computer you can't shut down, running irreversible smart contracts. We believe in a strong separation of concerns, where system forks are only possible in order to correct actual platform bugs, not to bail out failed contracts and special interests. We believe in censorship-resistant platform that can be actually trusted - by anyone.
So if ETC is forced to hard fork will exchanges start listing the old chain as Ethereum Classic Original (ECO)?
ETC will never hard fork, it is their principle. If it hard fork, it will be a dead coin. So it will have only one chain.
i think thats would be difficult with mining difficulty bomb, they need to use pos or remove diff bomb. i want to hear what feasible option besides HF
The mining bomb will happen in October or November this year. So it will be a dead coin by that time.
So if ETC is forced to hard fork will exchanges start listing the old chain as Ethereum Classic Original (ECO)?
ETC will never hard fork, it is their principle. If it hard fork, it will be a dead coin. So it will have only one chain.
i think thats would be difficult with mining difficulty bomb, they need to use pos or remove diff bomb. i want to hear what feasible option besides HF
So if ETC is forced to hard fork will exchanges start listing the old chain as Ethereum Classic Original (ECO)?
who will force them ? vitalik and co? and how ? etc already said no to a hf when vitalik asked them.thats about how to deal with it as i understand one has to hf again
https://medium.com/@timonrapp/how-to-deal-with-the-ethereum-replay-attack-3fd44074a6d8#.z46p3gmbh
When the BTC Core fans ditch etc you will have to appeal to eth users. And they will probably find that they had a lot of etc and lost them. If that is not a worry for the ETC team then that should be a red flag for anyone looking into it.
So if ETC is forced to hard fork will exchanges start listing the old chain as Ethereum Classic Original (ECO)?
ETC will never hard fork, it is their principle. If it hard fork, it will be a dead coin. So it will have only one chain.
That's how I perceive their attitude as well. Which means they can't copy/paste Ethereum much longer. Nor will it be easy to find dedicated devs.
So if ETC is forced to hard fork will exchanges start listing the old chain as Ethereum Classic Original (ECO)?
ETC will never hard fork, it is their principle. If it hard fork, it will be a dead coin. So it will have only one chain.
So if ETC is forced to hard fork will exchanges start listing the old chain as Ethereum Classic Original (ECO)?
who will force them ? vitalik and co? and how ? etc already said no to a hf when vitalik asked them.thats about how to deal with it as i understand one has to hf again
https://medium.com/@timonrapp/how-to-deal-with-the-ethereum-replay-attack-3fd44074a6d8#.z46p3gmbh
So if ETC is forced to hard fork will exchanges start listing the old chain as Ethereum Classic Original (ECO)?
http://www.altcointoday.com/chinese-exchange-yunbi-lost-40000-etc/
Chinese Exchange Yunbi Lost 40,000 ETC Over Chain Vulnerability
the Ethereum Foundation which employs countless of experienced developers working on sharding, Casper and other applications has come out in support of ETH:
We will focus our resources and attention on the chain which is now called ETH (ie. the fork chain)
Ethereum users and dapp developers can, therefore, fully ignore ETC and be safe from relay attacks if they transact on only one chain allowing the two communities to freely co-exist and compete in their chosen path.
etc HF or die...
that nice of them pumpy but why didnt they help earlier ? i thought the ethereum foundation was built only to develop ethereum ? Chinese Exchange Yunbi Lost 40,000 ETC Over Chain Vulnerability
the Ethereum Foundation which employs countless of experienced developers working on sharding, Casper and other applications has come out in support of ETH:
We will focus our resources and attention on the chain which is now called ETH (ie. the fork chain)
Ethereum users and dapp developers can, therefore, fully ignore ETC and be safe from relay attacks if they transact on only one chain allowing the two communities to freely co-exist and compete in their chosen path.
etc HF or die...
if they come out now what did they do befor?
i thought they put already all resuces on the problem ? beginning from the doa desaster to the hf and now to solve this replay attack?
and pumpy the skype leak showed that the devs themself picked up the etc and sold them or am i wrong ?
see read
https://imgur.com/a/DHexx#4I1WrPY
and they talk about the replay .........unbelivebal
this guys now come in to save it ? havent they been coding the hf?
the advice for the masses to stay safe from a replay attack is to stay away from etc.
but the devs already collected there free money in etc and sold them
but if every one does that now its a risk for there project ?
Quite amazing what I've been seeing. Comes down to the pure hatred of Etherium to the point of trying to use it against itself, and people stupid enough to give away their money to a thief and the like, utterly amazing.
It's like inviting a thief into your home and watching him pick out whatever they want and waving goodby with a smile on your face.
Vitalik has as nicely as he possibly can said goodby to all that to move on with Ethereum.
It has become quite apparent that Ethereum will move on with the continued development and all the backing of what is being developed on it and all else will be left behind in what they have so wanted.
It's like inviting a thief into your home and watching him pick out whatever they want and waving goodby with a smile on your face.
Vitalik has as nicely as he possibly can said goodby to all that to move on with Ethereum.
It has become quite apparent that Ethereum will move on with the continued development and all the backing of what is being developed on it and all else will be left behind in what they have so wanted.
This IS amazing and its the first time I have seen something like this with any coin. Other coins that have forked killed the old fork. IMO, they should never have allowed this to happen. Allowing forks to split the currency devalues the currency and hurts investors. The community voted for the hard fork and that should be the only ETH left in existence. I think in the long run it still will be but the infighting that is taking place now is embarrassing to the Etherium community - and I think that is the intent of some people.
For me personally, I could care less. I take my profits where I can. But the biggest problem in this entire alt-coin world is the lack of regulation and authority. From the pumping and dumping to the disinformation and scams, it all makes this entire environment untrustworthy. This stuff would result in criminal charges if it existed in a regulated investment system. In this system , people are actually rooting for the thieves, although I think that is limited to thieves stealing from someone else and not them.
I agree.. how many coins havent you had the message "MANDATORY UPDATE - HARDFORK"..
This one invited the old chain to live on by giving each user an option.
Is this by accident?
I think not.
Never attribute to malice that which is adequately explained by sheer incompetence.
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