Topic: [ANN] POPULOUS WORLD - Invoice trading platform - PPT - page 189. (Read 277234 times)

updated website:
"With the combination of extracted XBRL data and the Altman Z-Score formula we have not only bypassed the need to use an external credit reference agency, but have also gained a technological and financial edge over our competitors."

First of all, XBRL data is available to everyone with minimum programming skills to use data scraping. Second, external credit reference agency is needed for up-to-date financials and recent events. The data received from XBRL is already min. 6 or maximum 18 months old. How will you handle this issue?

Is there any one received XBPL at his wallet yet,what is specified date for POPULOUS airdrop?

This was a pretty good summary, but I'd add a couple of points:

1) According to the team, there's not a fixed price for PPT (relative to fiat or Pokens). It's been a while since I looked at the whitepaper, so I'm not sure if this is contradictory at all. I'm basing my comments on what the team says now since things may have evolved.

To that point, the more your PPT increases in value, the more Pokens you should be able to buy. So you could buy $1,000 worth of PPT today and if it doubles in price, you'll be able to use the tokens to invest in $2,000 of invoices. This doesn't really answer your question about how PPT tokens derive value, but it's still an important point because it encourages people to hold on to their tokens. Also, the purpose of the buyback program is to reduce the number of tokens in circulation. PPT tokens have an advantage over fiat in the system, so there is real utility. As long as there are invoices to available to invest in, there should be demand for the tokens. Reducing the supply should increase the price per token.

So, it's a combination of the supply of invoices and size of the liquidity pool that should drive value because that's what drives the utility. Now recall my earlier point that PPT value isn't tied to the value of fiat or tokens. Even if you pay twice as much per token as the last person, you're still able to invest at the value you bought in at. For example, let's say Person 1 (P1) buys PPT at $1.00 per token and Person 2 (P2) buys PPT at $2.00 per token. Each owns 1000 tokens. They will both be able to buy $2,000 worth of invoices. P1 is advantaged because he bought in earlier, but it doesn't come at a disadvantage to P2 who is still able to also buy $2,000 worth of invoices (the same amount he invested). It's not a zero sum game, but there are benefits to being an earlier investor.

Again, this only works if there's enough of a supply of invoices, so you have to believe that the team can successfully attract invoice sellers.

I hope that makes sense...

When can we expect distribution of XBRL airdrop?

Hello ecivfesrire and SemiSeriousInvestor,

Very good content and very impressed with the patience and effort in both of your communications. Even though I enjoy reading some of the funny stuff I like better to see good collaborative discovery process that benefits the whole community. I don't post much but read a great deal and soak up much. Maybe I should be SpongeBigglesSquarePants instead?

Anyway SemiSeriousInvestor - 5.2 "The exact value that is unlocked by the PPT will be announced in a future announcement." to possibly share my take on the PPT white paper section and most likely over-simplify the nature of the concept I have about it...

It seems possible the PPT "token" could have a reference value (poken exchange value) assigned to it for serving a function on the platform itself without necessarily translating that same value outside the system. Maybe the PPT could have a small/minor leverage advantage? This is just a guess but it would be possible (it's crypto after all) that pokens converted via PPT have a different translatable value outside the system but an advantage within when utilized for the purpose the platform is created for. Pokens obtained via fiat could potentially have a different conversion value back into PPT so as not to backdoor into PPT cheaper and still honor the equivalent fiat value at purchase. I think it's great that the platform is not closed to only PPT, and this gives me confidence in inherent future value of the token alone. Seriously though - this is just a guess. These guys are way smarter than me.

However, I believe the intent of Populous is to serve a function that mutually benefits both borrower/lender and the intent is for the main revenue to be generated from invoice factoring and not the speculation of the token. The tokens and platform are the mechanism for many little guys to realize the benefits from both directions for the sake of good business. I believe it will serve users even better the larger they can grow their lending ability if they are not whales at the start.

As for your other concern - 5.2.1 Buyback mechanism...
The way I take that is the people which envisioned this entire ecosystem have the vision to see the future of this platform. It strikes me that they already believe in it's potential and knew the capital it would take to ensure it's success. Additionally that they see the long term potential - not just a few years. They state upfront a unique business methodology of regaining the golden tickets from the open market (not destroying) which is the exact opposite of share dilution. If the PPT is on the open market nobody will know who is buying - or if that PPT will ever return to the market. I personally don't think the platform will suffer with less individual lenders though - and I bet the invoice factoring will grow steadily. There is probably a price at which I will sell mine - dunno yet - but not now. Without this platform I would never have the access to play in this sandbox. I am very eager to watch it evolve and learn as I do it.

Anyway guys, it was great to see good discussion going on. I hope my contribution is useful in some way.

These are very good questions, but you're understanding of how the system works is off. Part of that is because they've provided more info since the whitepaper was published.

It's late for me right now, but I'll try to explain how this works tomorrow if no one else responds. You can also ask your questions in the Telegram or Slack group. You'll find a lot of helpful people there.

I am just over cautiously, cause I have been in 2 token scenarios now (other ICO's) where we eventually found out the token was just an extra incentive to initial investors, kind of a "thank you gift" for funding our development so to speak. I believe in Populous Platform as a whole and I am sure it will do well. The PPT token on the other hand is still too cloaked in shadow at the moment. Also, It's not just PPT that can earn passive income. If you are a holder of Bitcoin, you can just deposit Bitcoin into Populous Platform and then earn passive income on the Bitcoin. How that will work is anybody's guess. Cause If your bitcoins are converted to a USD or GBP peg when you deposit your Bitcoins, what happens if Bitcoin doubles in price? Upon exit do you get initial Bitcoin amount plus interest? Or do you get the USD / Bitcoin at time of deposit plus interest?

I think you definitely have a point. The point being that initially they may not be able to value PPT at a high price even if they mean to. Populous only has so much in the fiat liquidity pool right now because the business isn't going yet. I try to think more in terms of being able to make passive income and use the xbrl to access the data for free. Not many cryptos let you make the passive income.

I totally get what you are saying, and that is my initial thought as well. Until I keep digging into these PPT tokens. They are not Stock. They are not Equity. In fact, it seems to me that they are a "gift" to investors in the ICO. Populous will hopefully "reward" these investors later by assigning a "value" to the PPT token that would be satisfactory to initial investors.

Now what does that exactly mean? If the PreSale ICO price was 30 cents, Populous could just assign any value greater than ICO and that would return more than initially invested. Could that be 1 dollar? 3 dollar? 10? Who knows. It is not dependent on the entire market cap of Populous as a whole. I believe Populous will be a phenomenal company. Only problem is the way these PPT tokens exist and the vague mention of them makes one kind of question their value. And also, the way the buyback is worded, it seems Populous just wants to buy them all back so they don;t exist anymore, as to not clutter the platform with too many tokens. Of Course Populous could just come out and say they will value the PPT token at 20x respective poken. Which means if you have a PPT, whatever your respective currency Poken is, you can claim 20x. So 1 PPT = 20 USD Pokens. Or, They could also just say 1PPT = 3 USD Pokens.

See what I am getting at here? The wording in their business plan states they will just assign an arbitrary value to PPT at a later date. The value could be good to those that bought low, and bad to those that bought high.

Hey Semiserious investor. I'll tell you what I know, but I guarantee that it will won't completely answer your questions.

The most recent twitter post from populous features them replying to a comment: "clif high discussing #PPT overtaking #ETH in value by mid 2018." Whomever runs the populous twitter responds "it's scary to know @clif_high knows how we think." Now if you're like most people you probably want to take that w/ a grain of salt because it's PR people talking. However: even if populous is doomed for success it's not a good idea to hurt the investors after posting how their tokens are going to go up. If your investors can't trust you, why should anyone trust to use the platform? I don't think they're going to run us over like that after we helped them make their company. That's just bad business.

A PPT essentially is stock in the populous company. I find it hard to believe that populous would want to tank the value of their stock on purpose. Populous have done good faith things for their investors that would lead me to believe they don't want to screw us. For instance: xbrl airdrop for token holders. They have delivered on the promises to get this platform going and website. Furthermore I couldn't tell you how many companies have legitly screwed people that just came into existence after populous came out then blew up before today.

Populous doesn't need to scam investors to be successful and in fact they're not nor ever have! They airdrop you tokens for holding the stock/initial token. Additionally: invoice finance is a very profitable business model especially if it can be globalized. They're going to make much more money bringing people together around their model. If they anger investors that would only fuel would-be competitors.

OK I finally found mention of PPT tokens in their Business Plan. It states:

5.0 Operations

5.1 PPT and Pokens

There are two types of digital currencies in the Populous platform – Populous Platform Tokens (PPT) and
Pokens. Both digital currencies play a different role and have different mechanism.

5.2 PPT

PPT was the token issued during the Pre-ICO to raise funds. From the discounts issued in the Pre-ICO,
there is a total of 41 million PPTs in circulation currently, with a limited supply of 53 million. PPT will also
allow access to the Populous platform, serving as an avenue to exchange Pokens and purchase invoices.
The exact value that is unlocked by the PPT will be announced in a future announcement.



It states that what a holder of PPT can actually do with a PPT token will be announced at a LATER date. Uh, say what? What exactly does this mean? Does this mean that Populous team can just assign some arbitrary value to PPT token in the future? Does this not concern anyone here? What is to stop Populous team from assigning the value of PPT to be EXACTLY equal to Pre-Sale price?

Also there is the issue of PPT Buyback as stated here:

5.2.1 Buyback mechanism
The buyback mechanism serves a few purposes. Firstly, the buyback mechanism acts as an indicator that
the platform has generated enough working capital to repurchase the tokens and utilize a portion of the
cash and cash equivalent. Upon the buyback, there will be fewer tokens available in circulation, which
enables easier transactions with the PPT in the platform as there will be lesser congestion in the
network.

-If Populous were to buy back these PPT tokens and Populous will assign the value of a PPT token at a later date, Isn't it in Populous best interest to assign as low of value as possible so it's easier to buy them back?

I find these unanswered questions quite concerning. I believe in Populous and believe that it will be a HIGHLY successful company, however I am very suspect in the value that a PPT token will have.  Basically, market price of PPT token at present could be totally off from what Populous team says later on. Please can someone clarify. Thanks

OK, I just read through the whitepaper again TWICE, and I went through the first 50 pages of this forum. I still have NO CLUE as to how specifically the PPT token is used and how it fits into the grand scheme of things. This mainly because the whitepaper makes ZERO mentions of PPT. White paper only mentions stable pegged pokens. I am really wanting to invest at least 50k into this project via PPT tokens, so I need definitive clarification. Can someone that knows definitively answer the below questions?


-Is PPT the exclusive currency within the platform? For instance whether an investor has fiat, bitcoin, litecoin, etc. When the investor makes a deposit, what happens? Are they given PPT tokens equivalent to the market rate of PPT/USD, PPT/BTC, PPT/ETH, PPT/GBP, etc?

-Borrowers get pokens because they want a stable funds. Investors however want a floating currency (PPT?) so they can capture the rise (or fall) in currency rate (PPT/USD), while also obtaining interest passive income. Is this correct?

- So basically is PPT the only means of accessing the platform? And regarding page 15 of the Whitepaper, where does PPT fit in? If PPT is one of a dozen ways to access and trade invoices on the platform, I am not so sure about the value that PPT gives. However if ANY investor holding ANY currency wishes to trade invoices MUST obtain PPT, then I can see how the PPT token is going to soar....Can someone with definitive answers clarify? THanks

_ as well, the new website also makes ZERO mention of PPT tokens. I seriously do not want to be holding PPT tokens unless I know exactly what gives them value and holds that value over time

I have made it a rule of thumb, after investing in a few dud Tokens, to question the existence of the token itself. Why is there a need for this token and why it MUST go up. Everyone claims their token will increase in value as more people use their product. Well, yes and no.

So regarding PPT, I have a little at the moment but still question why it has to increase in value at all. So until I see some demonstration I might refrain from investing more. If anyone has a clear answer to why PPT must go up for Populous to be successful, please chime in. I am just afraid Populous can be wholly successful and PPT stays stagnant or goes down in value

As far as I understand that's a good summary. Don't take my word for it, I have very little financial experience and understanding. I just like cryptos  

So PPT is basically an inhouse currency that gives you a few extra perks on the platform. OK, I understand now. I kept thinking PPT is a tradable derivative backed by the invoice financing loans. So putting the blockchain lending aside, the main attraction of PPT is it allows any investor anywhere in the world quick and easy access to passive interest, correct?

PPT Tokens are nor crucial or an afterthought.

Even if you are a Fiat Investor, Populous Business will be happening by Smart Contracts on the Ethereum blockchain. If you deposit $50 USD fiat to the Populous Platform, it will be converted to Pokens (a token, (not PPT)) before you can invest in invoices. Populous will charge a 0.8%(?) conversion fee.

If you deposit PPT to the Populous Platform, it needs to be converted to Pokens before you can invest in invoices, but conversion fee is 0%

Using PPT also has other advantages over fiat:
PPT investors have 'First Bidding Preference' bidding on high yield invoices. Fiat investos have Secondary Bidding preference.
PPT investors can bid on 30 Day, 60 Day and 90 Day terms. Fiat investors 60 and 90 days only.
Fiat investors will be unable to invest in high yield invoice terms (max 6%). PPT investors max 10%.
PPT will convert to any Poken. Fiat is limited to £ GBP and ¥ Yuan Pokens (British and Chinese Invoices).
No KYC needed for PPT investors. Fiat investors has KYC requirements.
PPT investors can create bidding groups. Fiat investors can't.
+
+
+

Basically are PPT tokens a representation of the entire value of loans plus interest made on the Populous Platform? Whitepaper says when an investor invests money, they are issued PPT. This PPT can be held or traded. Is this true of ALL funds entering the Populous system? Or is there a scenario where say an investor wants to invest 1000 at 10% interest. This investor is then issued an IOU receipt rather than PPT?

And also, if and when an investor is issued PPT in exchange for their investment, where does this PPT come from? Does Populous have to purchase PPT on open market equivalent to the Investor's investment amount and then give this to the investor?

I am just having a real hard time uderstanding #2 above.

This is what I am referring to on page 18 of the whitepaper:

DEPOSIT OF FUNDS
When the actor deposits funds into the platform, an equivalent amount of tokens is minted
and deposited into his account. A different token is used depending on the currency of the
deposited funds:
1.7.3. Deposit worldwide government’s currency
The actor receives the same amount of the corresponding tokens. For example, if the actor
deposits 8 USD, he will receive 8 Populous USD tokens.
1.7.4. Deposit stable Populous tokens
If the actor has access to tokens in one of the external token contracts, he can deposit
them into the platform. Upon deposit, the tokens are destroyed from the external token
contract and minted in the platform’s internal ledger.
1.7.5. Deposit BTC




Where does the PPT token fit into all of this?

I'm quite familiar with Etherdelta, but my point is say a guy with 10 million dollars is seeking yield and bank interest is close to nothing. He is interested in trading invoices on Populous platform to earn interest per year. What is stopping him from bypassing the PPT token alltogether? For instance, the Ethereum platform would not work without paying Ether. Is the PPT token crucial to the Populous platform or is it an afterthought?