[ANN][XRB]Cryptocurrency's killer app: RaiBlocks micropayments - page 604.

clemahieu

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Quote from: HostFat on April 05, 2016, 09:43:18 AM

Quote from: clemahieu on April 05, 2016, 09:35:41 AM

Even if we could divide the faucet amount down there's still the situation that people who pay others to click for them will get >95% of everything that comes out of it which is why I'm very confused why this is such a popular wish.

Because some of them are naive and don't understand this problem, and the others are waiting to exploit it as you wrote Wink

Probably, some very vocal users that have posted recently private messaged me recommending I put everything on the faucet with no limit and distribute it within a week, somehow this was viewed as fair to them.

jokumat

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Activity: 249

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Coins always go to those who are wealthy enough to buy them. This is inevitable. The "distribution to human workers" idea was naive. Yes, maybe some percentage can go through the faucet. But more like marketing, not as a way to distribute "fairly".

On the other side longterm distribution can be a good idea. Maybe. Because nobody will feel he "missed the boat". But the price must be set as sharply rising, maybe in "investment" rounds. There should be incentives to hold now. No real coin can exist without speculation

cyberhacker

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Activity: 1330

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if you want to true fairness. then drop to all BTC/ltc/doge holder

or do Proof of Burn.

cyberhacker

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Activity: 1330

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Quote from: clemahieu on April 05, 2016, 09:35:41 AM

Even if we could divide the faucet amount down there's still the situation that people who pay others to click for them will get >95% of everything that comes out of it which is why I'm very confused why this is such a popular wish.

this is free market.

what is the problem that ppl click and trade for money.

You can't play god. in a free market.

HostFat

staff

Activity: 4256

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I support freedom of choice

Quote from: clemahieu on April 05, 2016, 09:35:41 AM

Even if we could divide the faucet amount down there's still the situation that people who pay others to click for them will get >95% of everything that comes out of it which is why I'm very confused why this is such a popular wish.

Because some of them are naive and don't understand this problem, and the others are waiting to exploit it as you wrote Wink

Cryptorials

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Activity: 690

Merit: 505

Cryptorials.io

Quote from: clemahieu on April 05, 2016, 09:35:41 AM

I'd like it to be around too, the issue I see is the proposals out there for retaining the faucet would make it almost useless to new users. A 1 or 12 hour timer means we need to wait that long from when the session starts to when the user can first hit the faucet, otherwise someone can drain it simply clearing browser cache and attempting again.

Your using a cookie or something for the timer? Why not log user IP? I know that can still be gamed but there are plenty of faucets around who seem to be able to operate without it being a major issue.

TheBomber999

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"shh, he's coding..."

Quote from: Flomess on April 05, 2016, 09:35:25 AM

137 MIL (remaining) to be distributed the first year. It means that AT BEST 280 investors will hold ALL the coins in circulation by October 2016...
Please, please just do an ICO / IPO

+1

This is the way to destroy this coin

clemahieu

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Activity: 238

Merit: 122

Quote from: Cryptorials on April 05, 2016, 09:21:53 AM

I haven't read everything that's been said about the distribution but just to put my two cents in: I would like to retain the faucet in some way.

The reason for this is because I am going to use the micropayments to allow users to view my site with all the ads blocked. It would be great it people who have never heard of RAI could go and get some free coins to do this with, rather than having to go through all the hassle of buying them (which nobody will do - limiting the use of this to people who already own some Mrai).

I know that's a selfish reason for me, but I think the same principle will apply for anybody else who does this on their site / app.

I'd like it to be around too, the issue I see is the proposals out there for retaining the faucet would make it almost useless to new users. A 1 or 12 hour timer means we need to wait that long from when the session starts to when the user can first hit the faucet, otherwise someone can drain it simply clearing browser cache and attempting again.

The recommendation to just let it empty for the day also means the legion of people who will be pounding it when its filled up will get everything and an average user who arrives and wants to try will always find it empty.

Even if we could divide the faucet amount down there's still the situation that people who pay others to click for them will get >95% of everything that comes out of it which is why I'm very confused why this is such a popular wish.

Flomess

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Activity: 705

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Quote from: TheBomber999 on April 05, 2016, 09:13:47 AM

Quote from: clemahieu on April 05, 2016, 09:11:36 AM

Quote from: TheBomber999 on April 05, 2016, 06:07:52 AM

Quote from: cryptoboy.architect on March 29, 2016, 08:28:49 AM

I think 475k Mrai per lot is to much

This was the distribution schedule.

2^128 initial, 50% first year, 365 days per year, 10^30 per Mrai.

2^128 / 2 / 365 / 10^30 = 466,140 per day.

No, you don't understand. It's to much to sell 475k (0,13% of total coin) to only one person.

*

137 MIL (remaining) to be distributed the first year. It means that AT BEST 280 investors will hold ALL the coins in circulation by October 2016...
Please, please just do an ICO / IPO

Cryptorials

hero member

Activity: 690

Merit: 505

Cryptorials.io

Quote from: MALCOM X X X on April 05, 2016, 09:26:59 AM

Quote from: Cryptorials on April 05, 2016, 09:21:53 AM

I haven't read everything that's been said about the distribution but just to put my two cents in: I would like to retain the faucet in some way.

The reason for this is because I am going to use the micropayments to allow users to view my site with all the ads blocked. It would be great it people who have never heard of RAI could go and get some free coins to do this with, rather than having to go through all the hassle of buying them (which nobody will do - limiting the use of this to people who already own some Mrai).

I know that's a selfish reason for me, but I think the same principle will apply for anybody else who does this on their site / app.

I think DEV wont hear about faucet right now.. he is collecting money right now..

Maybe we could make this coin worthless again.. Grin

Lol, maybe.

I do find it a bit strange that the guy was happy to give people this coin for free and then a bunch of people came along and complained about that, but they seem to be happy to pay for it instead. Who are all these people who don't like free stuff?

jokumat

sr. member

Activity: 249

Merit: 250

Quote from: clemahieu on April 05, 2016, 09:22:46 AM

Quote from: jokumat on April 05, 2016, 09:14:31 AM

Quote from: clemahieu on April 05, 2016, 12:12:44 AM

I know I can't convince people of this though the point of the auction isn't for me to get paid, it's to distribute them in a manor that requires the least effort and has low skepticism. Even with the faucet people were pointing out that it could be unfair because there's no way to prove we're not funneling out of the faucet through shell accounts.

I would be perfectly happy buying them on the open market but that's not the situation we're in, to my dismay.

There is also proof of burn distribution like Counterparty did. Fair and not really complicated. Most trustworthy. But brings no money to the devs.

If you want a long distribution (a year or more), you MUST set the price as sharply rising with time.

Of course if you need money you have to go with some sort of crowdsale. But it goes against the spirit of this coin.

But your idea of permanent auction is very bad. You promise to distribute new coins whatever the price is - even if the price is falling. This is destructive, really destructive. I don't believe this promise can be kept. You will be forced to make changes all the time. As a result people will not believe you, they will lose trust in the coin

And the idea to distribute to 7 highest offers is really awful

In your view what does proof or burn offer in the way of fairness this way doesn't? Most of people's concerns are with not being able to pay for them i.e. they wouldn't be able to prove burn.

The timelines can be adjusted but as far as I can tell that barely register's on people's issue list.

auction - if the auction is longterm it kills the expectations of a price rise in the future
- if you (as a dev) are a scammer you can always win the auction because you offer the money to yourself. You risk nothing. People will always suspect this.
There is no way how to pull such scam in proof of burn

clemahieu

full member

Activity: 238

Merit: 122

Quote from: TheBomber999 on April 05, 2016, 09:13:47 AM

Quote from: clemahieu on April 05, 2016, 09:11:36 AM

Quote from: TheBomber999 on April 05, 2016, 06:07:52 AM

Quote from: cryptoboy.architect on March 29, 2016, 08:28:49 AM

I think 475k Mrai per lot is to much

This was the distribution schedule.

2^128 initial, 50% first year, 365 days per year, 10^30 per Mrai.

2^128 / 2 / 365 / 10^30 = 466,140 per day.

No, you don't understand. It's to much to sell 475k (0,13% of total coin) to only one person.

It could be divided up in to smaller units though very few people seem to think anything about it is valid.

MALCOM X X X

sr. member

Activity: 297

Merit: 250

Quote from: Cryptorials on April 05, 2016, 09:21:53 AM

I haven't read everything that's been said about the distribution but just to put my two cents in: I would like to retain the faucet in some way.

The reason for this is because I am going to use the micropayments to allow users to view my site with all the ads blocked. It would be great it people who have never heard of RAI could go and get some free coins to do this with, rather than having to go through all the hassle of buying them (which nobody will do - limiting the use of this to people who already own some Mrai).

I know that's a selfish reason for me, but I think the same principle will apply for anybody else who does this on their site / app.

I think DEV wont hear about faucet right now.. he is collecting money right now..

Maybe we could make this coin worthless again.. Grin

clemahieu

full member

Activity: 238

Merit: 122

Quote from: jokumat on April 05, 2016, 09:14:31 AM

Quote from: clemahieu on April 05, 2016, 12:12:44 AM

I know I can't convince people of this though the point of the auction isn't for me to get paid, it's to distribute them in a manor that requires the least effort and has low skepticism. Even with the faucet people were pointing out that it could be unfair because there's no way to prove we're not funneling out of the faucet through shell accounts.

I would be perfectly happy buying them on the open market but that's not the situation we're in, to my dismay.

There is also proof of burn distribution like Counterparty did. Fair and not really complicated. Most trustworthy. But brings no money to the devs.

If you want a long distribution (a year or more), you MUST set the price as sharply rising with time.

Of course if you need money you have to go with some sort of crowdsale. But it goes against the spirit of this coin.

But your idea of permanent auction is very bad. You promise to distribute new coins whatever the price is - even if the price is falling. This is destructive, really destructive. I don't believe this promise can be kept. You will be forced to make changes all the time. As a result people will not believe you, they will lose trust in the coin

And the idea to distribute to 7 highest offers is really awful

In your view what does proof or burn offer in the way of fairness this way doesn't? Most of people's concerns are with not being able to pay for them i.e. they wouldn't be able to prove burn.

The timelines can be adjusted but as far as I can tell that barely register's on people's issue list.

Cryptorials

hero member

Activity: 690

Merit: 505

Cryptorials.io

I haven't read everything that's been said about the distribution but just to put my two cents in: I would like to retain the faucet in some way.

The reason for this is because I am going to use the micropayments to allow users to view my site with all the ads blocked. It would be great it people who have never heard of RAI could go and get some free coins to do this with, rather than having to go through all the hassle of buying them (which nobody will do - limiting the use of this to people who already own some Mrai).

I know that's a selfish reason for me, but I think the same principle will apply for anybody else who does this on their site / app.

cyberhacker

legendary

Activity: 1330

Merit: 1000

Quote from: jokumat on April 05, 2016, 09:14:31 AM

Quote from: clemahieu on April 05, 2016, 12:12:44 AM

I know I can't convince people of this though the point of the auction isn't for me to get paid, it's to distribute them in a manor that requires the least effort and has low skepticism. Even with the faucet people were pointing out that it could be unfair because there's no way to prove we're not funneling out of the faucet through shell accounts.

I would be perfectly happy buying them on the open market but that's not the situation we're in, to my dismay.

There is also proof of burn distribution like Counterparty did. Fair and not really complicated. Most trustworthy. But brings no money to the devs.

If you want a long distribution (a year or more), you MUST set the price as sharply rising with time.

Of course if you need money you have to go with some sort of crowdsale. But it goes against the spirit of this coin.

But your idea of permanent auction is very bad. You promise to distribute new coins whatever the price is - even if the price is falling. This is destructive, really destructive. I don't believe this promise can be kept. You will be forced to make changes all the time. As a result people will not believe you, they will lose trust in the coin

And the idea to distribute to 7 highest offers is really awful

great idea!!!!

Proof of burn like XCP, IF WE NEED PURE FAIR

if dev need funds. then ICO.

jokumat

sr. member

Activity: 249

Merit: 250

Quote from: clemahieu on April 05, 2016, 12:12:44 AM

I know I can't convince people of this though the point of the auction isn't for me to get paid, it's to distribute them in a manor that requires the least effort and has low skepticism. Even with the faucet people were pointing out that it could be unfair because there's no way to prove we're not funneling out of the faucet through shell accounts.

I would be perfectly happy buying them on the open market but that's not the situation we're in, to my dismay.

There is also proof of burn distribution like Counterparty did. Fair and not really complicated. Most trustworthy. But brings no money to the devs.

If you want a long distribution (a year or more), you MUST set the price as sharply rising with time.

Of course if you need money you have to go with some sort of crowdsale. But it goes against the spirit of this coin.

But your idea of permanent auction is very bad. You promise to distribute new coins whatever the price is - even if the price is falling. This is destructive, really destructive. I don't believe this promise can be kept. You will be forced to make changes all the time. As a result people will not believe you, they will lose trust in the coin

And the idea to distribute to 7 highest offers is really awful

TheBomber999

legendary

Activity: 1274

Merit: 1001

"shh, he's coding..."

Quote from: clemahieu on April 05, 2016, 09:11:36 AM

Quote from: TheBomber999 on April 05, 2016, 06:07:52 AM

Quote from: cryptoboy.architect on March 29, 2016, 08:28:49 AM

I think 475k Mrai per lot is to much

This was the distribution schedule.

2^128 initial, 50% first year, 365 days per year, 10^30 per Mrai.

2^128 / 2 / 365 / 10^30 = 466,140 per day.

No, you don't understand. It's to much to sell 475k (0,13% of total coin) to only one person.

clemahieu

full member

Activity: 238

Merit: 122

Quote from: TheBomber999 on April 05, 2016, 06:07:52 AM

Quote from: cryptoboy.architect on March 29, 2016, 08:28:49 AM

I think 475k Mrai per lot is to much

This was the distribution schedule.

2^128 initial, 50% first year, 365 days per year, 10^30 per Mrai.

2^128 / 2 / 365 / 10^30 = 466,140 per day.

Flomess

hero member

Activity: 705

Merit: 500

Quote from: hakanbalta577 on April 05, 2016, 08:40:32 AM

Quote from: Flomess on April 05, 2016, 08:34:10 AM

Quote from: hakanbalta577 on April 05, 2016, 08:28:54 AM

Quote from: Flomess on April 05, 2016, 08:24:19 AM

There should be a way to block the BTCs that one puts into his bid; some kind of escrow that holds the bids i guess... if i were to be the highest bidder, i whould never pay, since 6 people are getting way better prices.

How can it happen especially there will be maybe hundreds bids in the last minutes?

I.E. Sending the btc to an escrow address is considered a bid; losing bids will be returned.

So noone can make 10 or 20 bids in the last minutes? Where is the aucation?

Why not? Every btc sent before a given time whould be considered a valid bid. You won't be able to see the last minute bids but atleast they whould be real. Unlike now.

Topic: [ANN][XRB]Cryptocurrency's killer app: RaiBlocks micropayments - page 604. (Read 775150 times)