Topic: ANTMINER S7 is available at bitmaintech.com with 4.86TH/s, 0.25J/GH - page 158. (Read 527808 times)

I meant no offense at all. I was poking fun with the . Sorry if I came across badly. I'd be happy to be proven wrong since I'd be able to add another 40A of gear in my garage. Unfortunately, I know I won't be because I've done extensive research and my master electrician father-in-law has confirmed the 80% rule to me in the past.

That's the best thing you can do. If there were a fire in your house, even non electrical, your insurance would deny your coverage if they see an improper electrical setup.

Prelude,

Ease up, please...

You cannot see my face or hear my tone, because I have no "tone."  Don't think this is a fighting match or an argument cause it's not.  I told you if you are correct, I will agree.  Yet, you continue to have "tone."  Or at least it appears that way.

I'm not looking for anything to "contradict," Sir.  I'm looking to see if it says what you posted.  If it does, then I will agree.  It's that simple.  I might learn something here.  Ease up.

The 270A rating is for inrush, or peak current before tripping I believe. Has nothing to do with the breakers 200A rating, or it's 80% derating.

You'll be reading for a while, Dave. You won't find anything contradicting what I've said about derating the MSB.

Are you currently running your MSB maxed out at 200A?

Sounds good.  Better safe than sorry.  I couldn't find but portions of Article 220 online.  So, I just bought NEC 2014 for kindle.  I'm about to read it from there now.

On the MSB, MSP thread with Prelude, I am also consulting my electrician if everything is in order, just to be 100% ok.

Sure...

However, I'm still reading NEC 220.  It's long as hell.

Thanks Dave for the detailed explanation.

My electrician setup 5 x 240v/20amp, 2-pole; with advise that only 2 or max 3 x S7 per point.
After reading your post, 10 x S7s should be good to go, even with the 75%/80% load safe zone.
Thanks again for the guide and keep us posted on the 600amp setup.

The only breakers and MSP's I've ever used are Square D QO.  I've always been told I can run these at 100%.  This is what I have now.  I'm still reading Article 220

Here is my 200 Amp breaker.  Notice the rating for tripping?  However, this does not mean other breakers must be limited to 80% if used at 100% for more than 3 hours.  I'm still reading to see if what Prelude has provided is correct.

Can confirm. All breakers have to be run at NEC (80% of nameplate rating) for continuous loads. Nothing you will install will be rated otherwise.

It's taking me a while.  I'm still reading Article 220

You're talking about an MSP. An MSP = main service panel. PANEL. MSB = main service breaker. All breakers are to be derated to 80% if used 100% for more than 3 hours, unless specifically rated for 100% use 24/7. Why do you need to know what page it is? Why are you so reluctant to admit that everyone is right and you're wrong about the MSB? (seems this isn't the first time you've argued about this judging from your earlier comment)

Instead of asking me for more proof and telling me you don't want opinions, prove to me that a MSB doesn't have to be derated. Your opinion doesn't count. I want cold hard facts as proof. Until then, please don't endanger people with advice that you're not 100% sure about, and please consider your own safety in regards to running your own MSB at 100%.

I assume this means you're running you main breaker at 100% load, please don't. You're risking your life. Also, please don't advise people to do so, you could cost them their lives, not to mention their families. Derate to 80%. If you aren't 100% sure, tell them to talk to an electrician.

I thought this was coming up again.  As I've mentioned before, I want someone to show me in the NEC the Main Service Panel (MSP) must be derated to 75 or 80 percent.  You will see in several places to derate "circuits" connected to the service panel but not the MSP itself.

If you can provide a link to it saying this in the NEC, I'm all for it and will admit I'm wrong.

EDIT:  Don't provide an "opinion" from someone.  I want to see it in the NEC.

Also, show me a photo of a label for an MSP that is rated for a particular amperage that says to derate what it is rated for.

The "de-rating" only concerns circuits and their wiring.  Not the MSP those circuits are connected to.  This definitely applies to old wiring in old houses with a cloth shield instead of polyethylene.  However, there is still plenty of modern made shielding that needs to be derated.

A main breaker absolutely has to be derated to 80% unless it's indicated on it that is capable of a 100% continuous load in an appropriate enclosure with proper dimensions, which residential panels basically never do. Where did you hear that they don't have to be derated?

100A = 80A continuous
200A = 160A continuous

I just got back from a birthday party.  I'll answer you properly in a PM.  Give me a little time.  I also need to know which batch S7's you have at present.  Depending on the batch, some may consume more watts (power) than others.

Also, the 80% is only limited to each individual circuit and not the Main Service Panel.  For instance, lets say you could spare 100 amps x 240 volts = 24,000 watts from you Main Service Panel (MSP).  The MSP is not limited to 80% but each individual circuit is.  This means you will simply have to add more circuits to reap the full benefits of the 24,000 watts available from your MSP in order to be safe.

If each of your circuits are 240V / 30A, that is a total of 7,200 watts.  80% of 7,200 watts = 5,760 watts.  IF each S7 you have is 1,210 watts each, you could have 4.76 S7's on each 30A/240V circuit.  So, not quite 5 x S7's.  If each of your S7's are 1,293 watts each, that would be 4.45 x S7's for each 30A/240V circuit if kept at 80%.  Most say to keep at 75% and many local electrical ordinances say 75%.  Also many insurance companies for Data Centers demand for them to keep each circuit to 75% instead of 80%.  I would imagine there is some lead way.  Meaning, the insurance company might say, "Keep each circuit to 75% +/- 1% or 2%.  It's best just to keep each circuit at 75%.  This simply means you add more circuits while keeping only 4 x S7's on each 30A/240V circuit to be on the safe side.

If you had 4 x S7's at 1,293 watts each, that would be 5,172 watts of the 24,000 watts available from your 24,000 watt setup with 100A service.  This equals 4.6 circuits.  Which means you cannot quite have 4 x S7's on that fifth circuit.  5,172 watts x 60% = 3,103 watts.  This means your fifth (5th) circuit can only have 2 x S7's on it.

Now, look at this:  You say you already have 4 x S7's at 1210 watts each.  That's a total of 4,840 watts. If we subtract that from 24,000 watts available, that leaves 19,160 watts.  Well, the only S7's available now are batch 8 @ 1,293 watts.  19,160/1,293 = 14.8 x S7's.  If we divide this by 4 x S7's for each circuit, this leaves 3.7 more circuits.  So, again, not quite 5 circuits with 4 x S7's on each circuit.  However, that ".7" of "3.7" means something:  If you had 3 x S7's batch 8 @ 1,293 each = 3,879 watts.  If we had 4 x S7's batch 8 on a circuit, that would be 5,172 watts.  That ".7" [or 70%] of 5,172 watts = 3,620 watts.  We just saw that 3 x S7's batch 8 @ 1,293 each = 3,879 watts.  So, still not quite enough available there for 3 x S7's batch 8 on that 5th circuit.

I personally believe you will be limited to 4 x 30A/240V circuits running at 75% on each circuit.  Then have only 2 x S7's batch 8 on the final circuit.  This will leave enough power (watts) remaining for one or two large fans.  One for out-take to suck heat out.  The other to suck air into the structure for good airflow and to offset static pressure.  I have two 7,400 CFM fans [One for out-take and one for in-take to reduce static pressure in my house and to provide good airflow.  Each one of these fans are 120V/2.5A (300 watts) each.  If yours is or will be similar, that is another 600 watts needed anyway for fans to keep your rigs cool.

So, in conclusion, I see 4 x 240V/30A circuits running @ 75% with 4 x S7's on each circuit = 16 x S7's.  And, another 2 x S7's running on a 5th circuit that can simply be a 20A 2 pole breaker at 75%.  Then you can have one or two circuits {doesn't matter} at 20A/120V for your in-take and out-take fans, modem, switch, etc.  

This means 18 x S7's at stock settings [Not over clocked] total with all of your peripherals.  If you over clock, it's a total different story.

EDIT:  I'm not sure how well the S7's under clock?  Meaning, they may still consume pretty much the same amount of voltage even when under clocked without a PSU that you can adjust the output voltage.  I mention this because you might consider under clocking to add more rigs.

Something else, you need to know for sure the exact voltage provided by your transformers.  2 pole or phase voltages can vary from 208 to 240.  It all depends on how the power company is providing the power to your house.  I'm assuming you have 2 poles (phases) in your Main Service Panel and not 3 poles (phases)?  If you had 3 poles 100 amp, you would have more power (watts) available than what I've mentioned.

How would you KNOW exactly how many volts is provided on two poles combined [208 to 240]?  You need a multi-meter with lower internal resistance than normal when measuring AC/DC voltage.  I recommend the following meter to measure your voltage across 2 poles:  The Triplett Model 310.  It doesn't matter if it's 310A, B, C or D.  

http://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_from=R40&_trksid=p2060353.m570.l1313.TR0.TRC0.H0.XTriplett+model+310.TRS0&_nkw=Triplett+model+310&_sacat=0

Most digital meters have a higher internal resistance [When measuring voltage] and will give a higher reading.  Meaning, if you see 240 Volts with a digital meter, you might actually have only 220 Volts.  Using the Triplett Model 310 [With a much lower internal resistance] will give a more accurate reading of the actual Source Voltage you have.  If it turns out you have only 220 Volts, it may be the power company has installed a transformer that's capable of stepping up the voltage to 240 by simply terminating your feeder cable at a different position on the coils in the transformer.

EDIT #2:  Also, if you have only 220 Volts instead of 240 Volts, these figures I've come up with will change in terms of how many watts available for a certain number of rigs.

It's possible I could have overlooked something.  Anyone else is welcome to chime in.  I PROMISE, I won't bite.  

David

PS- I'll add what I'm doing in within another hour.  I just wanted to get posted what you needed to know first.

I'm working on that reply.  I just got back from a birthday party.  I'm about 10 minutes into my reply.

Dmwardjr,
I am looking at your setup and just completed my 100amps setup at my outdoor shed.
My electrical knowledge is limited and need some advise.
I measured that each S7 draws about 5-6amps @ 1200watts each.
I use Bitmain 1600 PSUs for all the S7s I have currently.
I have 4 x S7s and intend to setup 6 more S7s.
10 x S7s is my maximum that I can afford for electricity.
How many S7s can I hookup with 80% load?
How many S7s will you hookup to your 600amp monster?

Thanks
TMT

first rule     : You cannot remove white alu heatsinks with black bonding adhesive from like B2 4,66th machine.
second rule : You cannot remove otherside of pcb brown chromium plated heatsinks, these are soldered.
                    (i replated these with Boron Nitride because they have different voltages and high conductive,
                      when white heatsinks dropped on these BOOOM SHORT CIRCUIT !)
third rule    : Do NOT USE BRUTE FORCE

now, 3 main rules for happy faces
-inspect pcb and be sure its a white glue between heatsink and chip
-set your "smd heat gun" (not heatgun) to 220 C
-cover thin flat watchmaker screw driver with kapton tape (for nice force)
-put screwdriver between heatsink and pcb and dont push
-put smdhg to top of the heatsink and wait 15sec.
-slowly push and check heatsink and make a little angle difference
finally some ones easyly drops...
-find a metal bath, fill with cellulosic thinner
-immerse pcb in it and use brush for remove white al2o3 particles
-you can use plastic thing to remove hardest epoxy on center of chip. (center is very hard to remove)
finally you can use F800 sandpaper for polish heatsinks
i said again, if you dont have electronic skills DONT DO THAT. because maybe you can broke chip solderings...

Thx for testing that. If that worked for Batch 3 & 5, it should be the same for Batch 1.

I think we should be able to run 2 or 3 Batch 8s off one controller. I'll know by Tuesday.