[Archive] BFL trolling museum - page 130.

||bit

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Quote from: Bitcoin Oz on June 16, 2012, 03:11:44 AM

The smartest move would be to buy shares in BFL Cheesy

Sounds good, if it were possible. Also, just buying bitcoins might be a better move. Imagine when the difficulty starts to double, quadruple, 10x, 20x.... Miner will have fewer bitcoins to sell. Supply starts to shrink. Demand stays relatively the same [or increases after anything like QE3]. Econ 101.

Double your money faster than mining [perhaps] after BFL ships the ASIC hardware, then buy twice as much mining equipment.

dave3

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I'd expect the profit from one of the 40GH SC Singles will be similar to my pair of old Singles (old... I just got them).

I can make almost 1 BTC per day right now, so perhaps the SC Single will make about 1/2 BTC per day after the reward drops.

In other words, the dollar amount invested in hardware would still give similar profits. Of course if/when they drop the price on the ASIC hardware, then profits will probably go down similarly.

sadpandatech

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Quote from: BFL on May 27, 2012, 08:41:52 PM

Quote from: ice_chill on May 27, 2012, 07:08:26 PM

Buy in sound doggy ?

I assume you are not trading in the cost, but rather performance ? So you send them the MINI-RIG based on 17 modules, and they send you a single chip ASIC that has similar performance ?

Ice, the trade in upgrades are dollar for dollar not hash for hash. The objective is to ensure our customers suffer no hardware depreciation as a result of our new product release. Hash for Hash wouldn't achieve that goal unless it was Hash for Hash in a then and now relative basis... which we seriously considered as an alternate method. In the end, dollar for dollar is the simplest way to achieve the goal.

I was wrong. found a proper quote of BFL stating correctly. It was this original post that confused my simple mind.

cheers

nedbert9

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Inactive

Quote from: ice_chill on June 16, 2012, 08:54:16 AM

This leaves me in a depressing situation.

I have Mini-Rig on order, and it looks ridiculous now that you can have 40Ghash for $1300. However as they said from begining you can't cancel MiniRig orders.
This means I have to pay 20% import tax, wait until the MiniRig makes that back, then spend money sending it back, etc.

I feel like an idiot to be honest.

It was inevitable. Don't feel so bad. Either one is in the game or not.

bulanula

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Quote from: Vorksholk on June 16, 2012, 09:57:34 AM

It is dollar-for-dollar, Butterfly Labs said so themselves here: https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/bitforce-sc-full-custom-asic-83985

So basically one single right now is worth four Jalepeños.

Someone please tell me how many singles they sold up to now so I can calculate diff rise based upon them all getting 4 Jalapenos or 4*3.5 ghash/s so basically 14ghash/s rise in speed for every single ever sold ? How many singles did people buy

Unless BTC goes to like $100 good luck being profitable then even with magix ASICs

Vorksholk

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It is dollar-for-dollar, Butterfly Labs said so themselves here: https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/bitforce-sc-full-custom-asic-83985

So basically one single right now is worth four Jalepeños.

bulanula

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Quote from: Cablez on June 16, 2012, 09:55:12 AM

I thought it was $ for $ as well.

Yeah. Same here.

Who would swap 4 singles ( cost 2400 USD ) for a 150 USD Jalapeno 3.5 ghash/s device Huh

That be stuuupid if true.

cunicula

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Quote from: -ck on June 16, 2012, 05:34:54 AM

If BFL made just one of these, they could earn $40k per week as 1/15th of the current network, so why sell them?

Why not sell them? Assume that you control less than half of mining power and sell units for at least double the marginal cost of production. When you sell one unit, you use the associated profit to pay for one unit for company use. Continue doing this and the company will end up controlling exactly 50% of the network, the associated capital cost will be passed on to customers who control the other 50%. Alternatively, you could not sell any units and incur all of the capital cost of obtaining 50%. IF you're running a business, why would you throw money away like this?

Perhaps the question should be: why will customers buy them? As long as there is just one competitive hardware supplier, this supplier can expropriate their customers' mining investments at discretion.

Why is BFL offering trade-ins? Likely they realize they stand to gain more from safeguarding their reputation for the time being because the market is far from saturated. Now they are much better positioned to drive all GPU owners out and sell units en masse. Once the market is saturated, there will be no value left in preserving their reputation. Then, assuming they are good businessmen, they will expropriate.

Cablez

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I owe my soul to the Bitcoin code...

I thought it was $ for $ as well.

wogaut

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Quote from: sadpandatech on June 16, 2012, 09:51:30 AM

Quote from: P4man on June 16, 2012, 04:22:47 AM

Quote from: Turbor on June 16, 2012, 04:12:58 AM

It doesn't matter to me. Sending them back cost me more than what their entry products cost.

But as I understand it, you wouldnt get the entry product, but the price equivalent of what you have now. IOW, if you would send in two FPGA singles you should get ~1 SC single @40GH. I dont see why you wouldnt take a (nearly) free ~25 fold increase in hashrate. It may be a band-aid on a wooden leg, but better than nothing and Id be surprised if it wouldnt at least cover shipping fees.

noo. they stated they are trading 'hash for hash'. Meaning one jalepeno would cost you 3.5GH/850MH in singles.. Or 4 singles + $60~ for those bad at math. Or $2460 for one jalepeno if you trade in your singles.....

cheers

Seriously? Can you find that quote? I was certain it was $ for $.

sadpandatech

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Quote from: P4man on June 16, 2012, 04:22:47 AM

Quote from: Turbor on June 16, 2012, 04:12:58 AM

It doesn't matter to me. Sending them back cost me more than what their entry products cost.

But as I understand it, you wouldnt get the entry product, but the price equivalent of what you have now. IOW, if you would send in two FPGA singles you should get ~1 SC single @40GH. I dont see why you wouldnt take a (nearly) free ~25 fold increase in hashrate. It may be a band-aid on a wooden leg, but better than nothing and Id be surprised if it wouldnt at least cover shipping fees.

noo. they stated they are trading 'hash for hash'. Meaning one jalepeno would cost you 3.5GH/850MH in singles.. Or 4 singles + $60~ for those bad at math. Or $2460 for one jalepeno if you trade in your singles.....

cheers

wogaut

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Quote from: organofcorti on June 16, 2012, 09:40:14 AM

From the PR release:

Quote

Because our first and second generation equipment is expected to be outpaced very quickly by the new hardware, customers who have purchased earlier generation products will be able to trade them in at 100% of their value toward the purchase of SC-generation hardware.

They will be spending half a year just replacing outdated hardware at no extra cost. Why not just go with cunicula and (quietly) own the whole bitcoin network. Hm...

Need to watch closely...

organofcorti

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Poor impulse control.

Quote from: Paladin69 on June 16, 2012, 09:36:53 AM

So there is absolutely no way to cancel the mini-rig order? But I am allowed to receive the shipment, and then send it back for a partial refund?

From the PR release:

Quote

Because our first and second generation equipment is expected to be outpaced very quickly by the new hardware, customers who have purchased earlier generation products will be able to trade them in at 100% of their value toward the purchase of SC-generation hardware.

Steve

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Quote from: bulanula on June 16, 2012, 08:51:29 AM

What makes you think companies are in for the idea too ? LOL. Companies are all for the $$$ ...

I don't think that and I didn't say that. Companies are in it for the money. Bitcoin and its security model are what make it attractive. If Bitcoin could help low margin companies like Amazon.com double their earnings (and it can), and it can be trivially secured (by applying hardware to it), I can tell you that is worth billions of dollars to them. This is why I say that people are looking at it the wrong way. People worry about the 51% attack, but I think it's relatively straightforward to protect Bitcoin from such an attack and that's what companies are going to find very attractive.

Paladin69

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So there is absolutely no way to cancel the mini-rig order? But I am allowed to receive the shipment, and then send it back for a partial refund?

MrTeal

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Quote from: bulanula on June 16, 2012, 09:28:14 AM

Quote from: Tinua on June 16, 2012, 09:10:14 AM

Quote from: ice_chill on June 16, 2012, 08:54:16 AM

This means I have to pay 20% import tax, wait until the MiniRig makes that back, then spend money sending it back, etc.

I feel like an idiot to be honest.

Send it back with RMA!!!
With that, you have not to pay import tax again ! Or i'm wrong?

Nice way to avoid import taxes. Now, what happens if you are caught like the criminal you are ?

Quote from: MrTeal on June 16, 2012, 09:11:34 AM

Quote from: ice_chill on June 16, 2012, 08:54:16 AM

This leaves me in a depressing situation.

I have Mini-Rig on order, and it looks ridiculous now that you can have 40Ghash for $1300. However as they said from begining you can't cancel MiniRig orders.
This means I have to pay 20% import tax, wait until the MiniRig makes that back, then spend money sending it back, etc.

I feel like an idiot to be honest.

They say you can't cancel Minirig orders, but that doesn't mean you aren't able to. In many jurisdictions that would go against consumer protection laws. They're usually pretty specific about being able to cancel due to non-delivery. BFL might argue that they don't sell to consumers, but for most miners that would be a difficult proposition. Call them and tell then you want to cancel, if they tell you no tell them you'll take it up with your CC company.

I doubt he used a CC to pay $15 000. Probably a bank TX so that can't be reversed easily at all.

Also, to all the non believers this is real and not some fake BS. See OP and also website talked about June announcement.

Why would you pay $500 for Yahoo PR to troll us ( unless you are eldentyrell ) ?

I would if it's an option. Double points. Wink

I don't think this is BS either, just FUD. If I had to place money on it, I'd say they have the design done with simulated performance numbers. They won't have the mask set done until they collect money from the preorder, and product won't start shipping until 2013 at the earliest assuming they don't run into any problems. Any issues that come up during fab will delay the product with no reimbursement. Whether the silicon will perform as well as the simulations remains to be seen.

bulanula

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Quote from: cunicula on June 16, 2012, 09:33:11 AM

Well, if this is true. The CEO of BFL (or the VCs who may be able to replace him) can own the network at trifling cost and there is jack shit anyone can do about it. You deluded idiots and your precious decentralization. What a fucking joke.

Shhh, don't spoil the beans mate !

Keeping dreaming the dream zzzz "bitcoin" zzzzzz "decentralized" zzz "currency" zzzzz "impossible to attack" zzz "screw the government" zzzzz "worship the butterfly" ( bilderberg symbol Grin

)

cunicula

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Well, if this is true. The CEO of BFL (or the VCs who may be able to replace him) can own the network at trifling cost and there is jack shit anyone can do about it. You deluded idiots and your precious decentralization. What a fucking joke.

bulanula

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Activity: 518

Merit: 500

Quote from: Tinua on June 16, 2012, 09:10:14 AM

Quote from: ice_chill on June 16, 2012, 08:54:16 AM

This means I have to pay 20% import tax, wait until the MiniRig makes that back, then spend money sending it back, etc.

I feel like an idiot to be honest.

Send it back with RMA!!!
With that, you have not to pay import tax again ! Or i'm wrong?

Nice way to avoid import taxes. Now, what happens if you are caught like the criminal you are ?

Quote from: MrTeal on June 16, 2012, 09:11:34 AM

Quote from: ice_chill on June 16, 2012, 08:54:16 AM

This leaves me in a depressing situation.

I have Mini-Rig on order, and it looks ridiculous now that you can have 40Ghash for $1300. However as they said from begining you can't cancel MiniRig orders.
This means I have to pay 20% import tax, wait until the MiniRig makes that back, then spend money sending it back, etc.

I feel like an idiot to be honest.

They say you can't cancel Minirig orders, but that doesn't mean you aren't able to. In many jurisdictions that would go against consumer protection laws. They're usually pretty specific about being able to cancel due to non-delivery. BFL might argue that they don't sell to consumers, but for most miners that would be a difficult proposition. Call them and tell then you want to cancel, if they tell you no tell them you'll take it up with your CC company.

I doubt he used a CC to pay $15 000. Probably a bank TX so that can't be reversed easily at all.

Also, to all the non believers this is real and not some fake BS. See OP and also website talked about June announcement.

Why would you pay $500 for Yahoo PR to troll us ( unless you are eldentyrell ) ?

Paladin69

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Activity: 784

Merit: 1000

Wow I feel like canceling my mini-rig now. The Jalapeno is so cheap and the singles are 40 giga hashes for only twice the price of the current singles? holy jesus...

Topic: [Archive] BFL trolling museum - page 130. (Read 69394 times)