ASICMINER: Entering the Future of ASIC Mining by Inventing It - page 1109.

michaelGedi

sr. member

Activity: 364

Merit: 250

"to be or not to be, that is the bitcoin"

Quote from: ?? on ??

Quote from: Dexter770221 on May 13, 2013, 07:00:22 AM

BFL is calculated at 400TH. Bitfury first batch is estimated at 200TH and half of this power is sold to 100TH mine: https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/picostocks-100ths-bitcoin-mine-100th-140366. If bitfury succeed, 100TH/month will be added with no hassle, IMHO. Friedcat must deploy 200TH quickly. Fascinating times are comming Wink

Didn't know of this... thanks for sharing. I can understand this is OT and all, but calling someone who's saying there's competition out there seems too much to me. It is good that every investor know there are alternatives coming, don't be greedy.

Yes of course it's helpful to know this, but I think MPOE-PR has a reputation of desperately wanting to say "I told you so" at some point in the future, and at every opportunity makes sure the bases are covered to enable that potential power trip somewhere along the line... the general negative attitude takes precedence over any valuable information you may glean from his posts. This is my assumption after reading about 5 of them and seeing the shiny yellow ignore button. That said, a healthy dose of cynicism never hurt anyone.

OnTopic

None of this should distract from the fact that ASICMINER are currently the best investment in terms of ROI at this point in time (correct me if I'm wrong please), and probably for some time ahead in the near future.

lophie

hero member

Activity: 924

Merit: 1003

Unlimited Free Crypto

Quote from: velacreations on May 13, 2013, 08:58:36 AM

Quote from: John (John K.) on May 13, 2013, 08:16:25 AM

Oh, please keep the Bitfury OT posts out of here. Undecided

yeah, guys, if you want to reply to MPOE-PR , do so on one of his threads, don't feed the trolls on this one. Grin

Hey I don't mind a dancing troll with a very pretty cooknut babe avatar

velacreations

sr. member

Activity: 476

Merit: 250

Quote from: John (John K.) on May 13, 2013, 08:16:25 AM

Oh, please keep the Bitfury OT posts out of here. Undecided

yeah, guys, if you want to reply to MPOE-PR , do so on one of his threads, don't feed the trolls on this one. Grin

Franktank

hero member

Activity: 560

Merit: 500

Quote from: John (John K.) on May 13, 2013, 08:16:25 AM

Oh, please keep the Bitfury OT posts out of here. Undecided

I'm invested in many mining shares, and AM is the best performing one so far. Getting the chips is just a small part of the equation for a large scale mining farm - imagine the job required to set them up and maintain them, not to mention the specialized infrastructure needed to house them effectively. Friedcat could pump out a lot of hashes chip-wise, but is limited by the space and infrastructure. That's why he started to sell them for a profit of the shareholders and everyone involved.

+1

John (John K.)

legendary

Activity: 1288

Merit: 1227

Away on an extended break

Oh, please keep the Bitfury OT posts out of here. Undecided

I'm invested in many mining shares, and AM is the best performing one so far. Getting the chips is just a small part of the equation for a large scale mining farm - imagine the job required to set them up and maintain them, not to mention the specialized infrastructure needed to house them effectively. Friedcat could pump out a lot of hashes chip-wise, but is limited by the space and infrastructure. That's why he started to sell them for a profit of the shareholders and everyone involved.

MPOE-PR

hero member

Activity: 756

Merit: 522

Quote from: JimiQ84 on May 13, 2013, 06:43:11 AM

Quote from: MPOE-PR on May 13, 2013, 06:37:44 AM

Quote from: SmiGueL on May 13, 2013, 05:23:30 AM

And don't forget the 14+ TH/s on BTCGuild Tongue

'Real-time' graphs website can be found here or clickable versions here.

Actually the BitFury people just announced something to the order of 400 Th as a first batch:

Quote from: baloo_kiev on May 13, 2013, 04:58:23 AM

Quote

Translation: In general, there's almost no limits for sane chip production volumes. One wafer ~4412 chips (how many of them working is still unknown). Maximal production volume which is not hard to order (no extraordinary production planning) is <=2000 wafers per month. Factory will be glad! That's 22 PETAHASH per month. It would be cool to grow to these limits... So there will be no chip crisis. Well, some local crisis may exist, for example we might wait for 2-3 months. We cannot increase number of wafers in an already ordered batch. One of Metabank's goals is to give us a bulk order in June, so we can order right amount of wafers.

You see? They can produce practically any number of chips. So if tomorrow a huge investor or a group of them walk into his place and gives cash for 22 petahash/s... we might see them online in September-October.

That guy has also plunked down an unprecedented $15,000 on a delivery bet with a one month deadline, and yes this is significantly more on a dollar basis than the bet that made Josh Zerlan famous.

For those of you who can't do math (the majority, as we well know), ASICMINER's actually deployed hashing is under 5% of 400TH (more like 3% but hey), and under 0.1% of 22 PH. Which means that if nobody else joins the fray you will be looking at a grandiose under 0.1% of total hashing power by Christmas. Which means about 25 Bitcoin in total revenue per week, distributed over 400,000 shares = 0.000063 BTC per (minus, of course, expenses, which you will provide out of pocket).

The window is closing. Sorry to burst everyone's bubble.

So, you're saying that BitFury will deploy 400TH by themselves? And ruin whole bitcoin thus zeroing their investment? Or they'll sell some 200TH to third party? How long will that take?

I am saying you can't read, at this point. Try again.

SebastianJu

legendary

Activity: 2674

Merit: 1083

Legendary Escrow Service - Tip Jar in Profile

Quote from: lame.duck on May 13, 2013, 07:56:48 AM

Quote from: ?? on ??

I dont see any problem in a volatile share price. Its always good for someone. For seller or for buyer. And i doubt that friedcat has to value his company on shareprice. The pts arent even official.

The problem is: a decreasing share price means decreasing dividends in the future.

oO The shareprice isnt connected to dividends. Why do you think its another way?

Quote from: lame.duck on May 13, 2013, 07:56:48 AM

Quote from: ?? on ??

Reinvesting for creating lower than 130nm doesnt make sense now too. Simply because its very costly to create and then its costly to build such asics. Its way more efficient to build the actual asics in bigger quantities instead building better asics.

Do you 'feel' that or did you some calculations on that? It's also 'efficient' for bitfury to produce 'asics in bigger quantities' so i guess ASICMINER should start the development early to use prototype services for testing to reduce the risk of a nonworking first batch.

I read other persons, that are more informed, opinion about that. Im sure friedcat and his team already thought about the possibilities and it looks that its not worth at the moment to develop a better asic.
Regarding bitfury... first they have to develop... that takes time... and then they can build. Its open how the hashrate of the net will be then and how much return this will yield.

Quote from: lame.duck on May 13, 2013, 07:56:48 AM

Quote from: ?? on ??

Its not needed to keep BTC for future investments now. Everything is paid and its very easy to pay future things with coming dividends.

Do you plan to sell your shares in the near future? Wink

Nope...

at least i wont think about that until AM has nearly 50% hashpower of the network...

lame.duck

legendary

Activity: 1270

Merit: 1000

Quote from: ?? on ??

I dont see any problem in a volatile share price. Its always good for someone. For seller or for buyer. And i doubt that friedcat has to value his company on shareprice. The pts arent even official.

The problem is: a decreasing share price means decreasing dividends in the future.

Quote from: ?? on ??

Reinvesting for creating lower than 130nm doesnt make sense now too. Simply because its very costly to create and then its costly to build such asics. Its way more efficient to build the actual asics in bigger quantities instead building better asics.

Do you 'feel' that or did you some calculations on that? It's also 'efficient' for bitfury to produce 'asics in bigger quantities' so i guess ASICMINER should start the development early to use prototype services for testing to reduce the risk of a nonworking first batch.

Quote from: ?? on ??

Its not needed to keep BTC for future investments now. Everything is paid and its very easy to pay future things with coming dividends.

Do you plan to sell your shares in the near future? Wink

bitfair

sr. member

Activity: 362

Merit: 250

Quote from: stripykitteh on May 13, 2013, 07:01:23 AM

Quote from: bitfair on May 13, 2013, 06:42:38 AM

Quote from: Mausini on May 13, 2013, 06:28:36 AM

- Reinvest. It might be a good time to move away from 130 nm now and invest in next-gen chips. With the available amount of money, AM could develop products that would put everyone alse out of competition.

+1

Need to keep that competitive edge - this mono/oligo-poly situation will not last forever, and it would be smart to stay ahead of the curve...

I can recommend to anyone who is new to Bitcoin (like me), read *all* of friedcat's posts on this forum, from oldest to newest. He is in this for the long haul; and he knows that the game will change as new generations of hardware appear. If the trolls on this forum have noticed that AM have competition, he predicted what, who, when and why months ago, and is too capable not to have planned a response.

Agreed. And if that "planned response" requires retaining some of the revenue, then it would be most prudent to do so.

[I have joined in on the collective man-crush on friedcat - he can retain my earnings any time! Wink

]

stripykitteh

legendary

Activity: 1176

Merit: 1001

CryptoTalk.Org - Get Paid for every Post!

Quote from: SebastianJu

Sorry but i wont vote for keeping divs only for the matter of holding the shareprice stable.

I dont see any problem in a volatile share price. Its always good for someone. For seller or for buyer. And i doubt that friedcat has to value his company on shareprice. The pts arent even official.

Reinvesting for creating lower than 130nm doesnt make sense now too. Simply because its very costly to create and then its costly to build such asics. Its way more efficient to build the actual asics in bigger quantities instead building better asics.

Its not needed to keep BTC for future investments now. Everything is paid and its very easy to pay future things with coming dividends.

By the way im a shareholder...

I agree. I advocate for rational management. By that, I mean management that acts in the best interests of shareholders. If the company can get a high return from reinvestment, do whatever is necessary to achieve that. If it can't, then return the capital to shareholders, and let the share price do what it wants. If people want to speculate on the short term price of the security, that's their business, but long term holders should be indifferent to the share-price day-to-day.

michaelGedi

sr. member

Activity: 364

Merit: 250

"to be or not to be, that is the bitcoin"

Quote from: lophie on May 13, 2013, 07:09:34 AM

MPOE-PR is here. Eating popcorn and try not to choke on my coke while laughing Cheesy

. I don't really care if all his predictions came to be even though I am a shareholder. I just hope it happens the other way around just to invoke more rant posts <3 Tongue

"sorry to burst everyone's bubble"

the bubble already burst mate... don't try claim credit for that

lophie

hero member

Activity: 924

Merit: 1003

Unlimited Free Crypto

MPOE-PR is here. Eating popcorn and try not to choke on my coke while laughing Cheesy

. I don't really care if all his predictions came to be even though I am a shareholder. I just hope it happens the other way around just to invoke more rant posts <3 Tongue

stephwen

member

Activity: 83

Merit: 10

Quote from: MPOE-PR on May 13, 2013, 06:37:44 AM

Quote from: SmiGueL on May 13, 2013, 05:23:30 AM

And don't forget the 14+ TH/s on BTCGuild Tongue

'Real-time' graphs website can be found here or clickable versions here.

Actually the BitFury people just announced something to the order of 400 Th as a first batch:

Quote from: baloo_kiev on May 13, 2013, 04:58:23 AM

Quote

Translation: In general, there's almost no limits for sane chip production volumes. One wafer ~4412 chips (how many of them working is still unknown). Maximal production volume which is not hard to order (no extraordinary production planning) is <=2000 wafers per month. Factory will be glad! That's 22 PETAHASH per month. It would be cool to grow to these limits... So there will be no chip crisis. Well, some local crisis may exist, for example we might wait for 2-3 months. We cannot increase number of wafers in an already ordered batch. One of Metabank's goals is to give us a bulk order in June, so we can order right amount of wafers.

You see? They can produce practically any number of chips. So if tomorrow a huge investor or a group of them walk into his place and gives cash for 22 petahash/s... we might see them online in September-October.

That guy has also plunked down an unprecedented $15,000 on a delivery bet with a one month deadline, and yes this is significantly more on a dollar basis than the bet that made Josh Zerlan famous.

For those of you who can't do math (the majority, as we well know), ASICMINER's actually deployed hashing is under 5% of 400TH (more like 3% but hey), and under 0.1% of 22 PH. Which means that if nobody else joins the fray you will be looking at a grandiose under 0.1% of total hashing power by Christmas. Which means about 25 Bitcoin in total revenue per week, distributed over 400,000 shares = 0.000063 BTC per (minus, of course, expenses, which you will provide out of pocket).

The window is closing. Sorry to burst everyone's bubble.

It's actually pretty funny to read your rant/wrong predictions from a few months ago on the other topic.
Obviously, as of today, you're still mad that ASICMINER didn't use mpex since it's better performing better than mpex "all stars" like s.dice (which has been going down for the past 6 months).

Aside from that, you're clearly not objective, as shown in the other topic, since you work for mpex, and you evidently resent ASICMINER for refusing to use mpex and grant you btc.

stripykitteh

legendary

Activity: 1176

Merit: 1001

CryptoTalk.Org - Get Paid for every Post!

Quote from: bitfair on May 13, 2013, 06:42:38 AM

Quote from: Mausini on May 13, 2013, 06:28:36 AM

- Reinvest. It might be a good time to move away from 130 nm now and invest in next-gen chips. With the available amount of money, AM could develop products that would put everyone alse out of competition.

+1

Need to keep that competitive edge - this mono/oligo-poly situation will not last forever, and it would be smart to stay ahead of the curve...

I can recommend to anyone who is new to Bitcoin (like me), read *all* of friedcat's posts on this forum, from oldest to newest. He is in this for the long haul; and he knows that the game will change as new generations of hardware appear. If the trolls on this forum have noticed that AM have competition, he predicted what, who, when and why months ago, and is too capable not to have planned a response.

Dexter770221

legendary

Activity: 1029

Merit: 1000

BFL is calculated at 400TH. Bitfury first batch is estimated at 200TH and half of this power is sold to 100TH mine: https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/picostocks-100ths-bitcoin-mine-100th-140366. If bitfury succeed, 100TH/month will be added with no hassle, IMHO. Friedcat must deploy 200TH quickly. Fascinating times are comming Wink

JimiQ84

sr. member

Activity: 406

Merit: 250

Quote from: MPOE-PR on May 13, 2013, 06:37:44 AM

Quote from: SmiGueL on May 13, 2013, 05:23:30 AM

And don't forget the 14+ TH/s on BTCGuild Tongue

'Real-time' graphs website can be found here or clickable versions here.

Actually the BitFury people just announced something to the order of 400 Th as a first batch:

Quote from: baloo_kiev on May 13, 2013, 04:58:23 AM

Quote

Translation: In general, there's almost no limits for sane chip production volumes. One wafer ~4412 chips (how many of them working is still unknown). Maximal production volume which is not hard to order (no extraordinary production planning) is <=2000 wafers per month. Factory will be glad! That's 22 PETAHASH per month. It would be cool to grow to these limits... So there will be no chip crisis. Well, some local crisis may exist, for example we might wait for 2-3 months. We cannot increase number of wafers in an already ordered batch. One of Metabank's goals is to give us a bulk order in June, so we can order right amount of wafers.

You see? They can produce practically any number of chips. So if tomorrow a huge investor or a group of them walk into his place and gives cash for 22 petahash/s... we might see them online in September-October.

That guy has also plunked down an unprecedented $15,000 on a delivery bet with a one month deadline, and yes this is significantly more on a dollar basis than the bet that made Josh Zerlan famous.

For those of you who can't do math (the majority, as we well know), ASICMINER's actually deployed hashing is under 5% of 400TH (more like 3% but hey), and under 0.1% of 22 PH. Which means that if nobody else joins the fray you will be looking at a grandiose under 0.1% of total hashing power by Christmas. Which means about 25 Bitcoin in total revenue per week, distributed over 400,000 shares = 0.000063 BTC per (minus, of course, expenses, which you will provide out of pocket).

The window is closing. Sorry to burst everyone's bubble.

So, you're saying that BitFury will deploy 400TH by themselves? And ruin whole bitcoin thus zeroing their investment? Or they'll sell some 200TH to third party? How long will that take?

bitfair

sr. member

Activity: 362

Merit: 250

Quote from: Mausini on May 13, 2013, 06:28:36 AM

- Reinvest. It might be a good time to move away from 130 nm now and invest in next-gen chips. With the available amount of money, AM could develop products that would put everyone alse out of competition.

+1

Need to keep that competitive edge - this mono/oligo-poly situation will not last forever, and it would be smart to stay ahead of the curve...

MPOE-PR

hero member

Activity: 756

Merit: 522

Quote from: SmiGueL on May 13, 2013, 05:23:30 AM

And don't forget the 14+ TH/s on BTCGuild Tongue

'Real-time' graphs website can be found here or clickable versions here.

Actually the BitFury people just announced something to the order of 400 Th as a first batch:

Quote from: baloo_kiev on May 13, 2013, 04:58:23 AM

Quote

Translation: In general, there's almost no limits for sane chip production volumes. One wafer ~4412 chips (how many of them working is still unknown). Maximal production volume which is not hard to order (no extraordinary production planning) is <=2000 wafers per month. Factory will be glad! That's 22 PETAHASH per month. It would be cool to grow to these limits... So there will be no chip crisis. Well, some local crisis may exist, for example we might wait for 2-3 months. We cannot increase number of wafers in an already ordered batch. One of Metabank's goals is to give us a bulk order in June, so we can order right amount of wafers.

You see? They can produce practically any number of chips. So if tomorrow a huge investor or a group of them walk into his place and gives cash for 22 petahash/s... we might see them online in September-October.

That guy has also plunked down an unprecedented $15,000 on a delivery bet with a one month deadline, and yes this is significantly more on a dollar basis than the bet that made Josh Zerlan famous.

For those of you who can't do math (the majority, as we well know), ASICMINER's actually deployed hashing is under 5% of 400TH (more like 3% but hey), and under 0.1% of 22 PH. Which means that if nobody else joins the fray you will be looking at a grandiose under 0.1% of total hashing power by Christmas. Which means about 25 Bitcoin in total revenue per week, distributed over 400,000 shares = 0.000063 BTC per (minus, of course, expenses, which you will provide out of pocket).

The window is closing. Sorry to burst everyone's bubble.

Mausini

full member

Activity: 177

Merit: 100

Quote from: ?? on ??

Quote from: Franktank on May 13, 2013, 12:26:46 AM

Quote from: davecoin on May 13, 2013, 12:15:20 AM

Excited for div day.

I wouldn't expect the entire gross estimate; better to have friedcat and co. to keep some to keep that hash power up and running. Anything from 0.02-0.025 would be good enough, use the rest to ensure those payouts stay high and consistent.

Thats the beauty in this business. Its already paid with very few bitcoins needed. Of course it can happen that something other has to be paid but there are no big piles of bitcoins needed. There would no way to invest it now because the 200TH are paid already too.

Im really looking forward to the div... when no investment goes away from it it will be the biggest div ever.

I believe it would not be wise to pay out such a huge divend at once. Even if i dont care about PT share value that much, we would have a lot of pump and dump activity on the exchanges which would add unwanted volatility. Volatility is not something large sharholders and friedcat himself would desire, because for them PT share value is useful as an indicator of company value.

IMO it would be desirable to keep dividends at a constant, slowly growing level. There are two options to go:
- Reinvest. It might be a good time to move away from 130 nm now and invest in next-gen chips. With the available amount of money, AM could develop products that would put everyone alse out of competition.
- Keep BTC in cash for future investments or to pay out later

I'm sure friedcat has figured everything out already. Anyway, I'd really like to read some shareholder opinions about that.

SmiGueL

sr. member

Activity: 322

Merit: 252

Quote from: organofcorti on May 13, 2013, 05:18:20 AM

Quote from: gigantic on May 13, 2013, 05:03:39 AM

Can someone point on the total hash rate of AM ?

I notices someone is on top, while AM is second on Bitminter Huh

No, realasicminer is top on BitMinter with 5Thps.

And don't forget the 14+ TH/s on BTCGuild Tongue

'Real-time' graphs website can be found here or clickable versions here.

Topic: ASICMINER: Entering the Future of ASIC Mining by Inventing It - page 1109. (Read 3917568 times)