Topic: [Aug 2022] Mempool empty! Use this opportunity to Consolidate your small inputs! - page 15. (Read 88277 times)

I think I should have stood my ground with "brutal".

Bigger blocks aren't going to resolve this. Spammers (or maybe just 1 spammer) can pay 1000+ sats/vbyte for 1.5 MB blocks. Let's assume blocks would be unlimited: for the same price, he could pay 1 sat/vbyte and create 1.5 GB blocks! That would be good for the rest of us, as we could make transactions again, but it would add 80 TB per year to the blockchain. It would also mean downloading and verifying 1.5 GB every 10 minutes, and it would mean chainstate will quickly grow to hundreds of GB (which requires that much RAM to run Bitcoin Core). It would destroy decentralization as we know it, I'd be forced to give up running a full node, and even many of the Electrum servers wouldn't be able to keep up.
As much as I hate it, we can't get rid of spam by giving them more block space.

CRAZY! I have no other word for it.

If bitcoin will ever be intended to use on a global scale I have a hard time seeing how can Ordinals (and Runes now) contribute for the adoption. We are seeing unreal amount of transaction fees ever since the halving and this will likely continue for a while considering the novelty of Runes (and the persistent presence of Ordinals I guess). How can we convince people to use the network when they'll have to pay 12,042 sats/vB for their transactions? I wonder how satoshi would feel now seeing what is currently going on with the blockchain.

Perhaps I'm short sighted - I reckon I haven't read fully what Ordinals propose to do (and Rune) other than my suspicions that they want to bandwagon on Bitcoin ecosystem and try to create value in fungible tokens that they hope will get valuable over time - but I can't see how this implementation actually helps the network nor improves it.

Yesterday when I was watching the halving I though that it was expected to be high fees near the block #840.000 since some people would pay a premium to have their transactions on that block, but I never imagined that the fees alone would reach ~ 37.6 bitcoin[1].

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[1]https://mempool.space/block/0000000000000000000320283a032748cef8227873ff4872689bf23f1cda83a5

Reminds me of modern video game loot crap in RPGs (this loot is rare/purple, this one is common etc.)

Gamification has invaded BTC...

I have never been more pro censorship or some type of restriction than right now, and at this point, I am not even ashamed to admit it. A solution has to be found or else the big-blocker monkey men have won. It's going to become impossible to recommend to new people to use Bitcoin and explain the benefits of it. When the obvious question appears, how much does it cost to send a bitcoin transaction, you can throw all your decentralization and control of your money arguments out of the window.

"You can fool all the people some of the time and some of the people all the time, but you cannot fool all the people all the time".

You mean you can't tell?    Big yes.

Because, "halving sats" are more precious than "ordinary sats". Just as the very first Ordinal sat is deemed as rare, I think. It doesn't make any sense, but often times, people don't use their reasoning when buying and selling stuff. Probably why billions of dollars are gambled every month, or coins are thrown on fountains as wishes.

The altcoins market cap is about a trillion dollars. That's what you're looking for.

These transaction fees give me an existential crisis, what a crazy world we live in.

This is the halving block: https://mempool.space/block/0000000000000000000320283a032748cef8227873ff4872689bf23f1cda83a5
Short info: 1 input, 1 output, paid fee - 6.7 BTC ($429,818), overpaid 18024x. Guess who paid this crazy fee? Ordinals guy. Every fee that ViaBTC lost because of their free transaction accelerator service, now is back in one block They collected ‎37.626 BTC fees.

No one is going to remove ordinals, they are making money from it. Bitcoin failed as a P2P transaction method but it successfully send JPEG images. I am out of explanation, I don't understand why it worth for every ordinals users to pay such a ridiculously high transaction fees, is there demand really that high on ordinals? Once fees go down (if they'll ever), I'll try and start inscribing ordinals.

Does anyone know why were ordinals trying to get their inscription in halving block? Does anyone cares about that too? Holy moly


People don't know how to download Electrum wallet, how to create a wallet, how to save seeds, how to send coins, how to set correct fee and so on. Now I am confused, how is there such a high demand on ordinals? If they don't know such a basic things, how are these people able to inscribe ordinals and then buy it on auction. I think this process should be very confusing for many but it's the opposite.
@BlackHatCoiner There can't be so many fools and fools don't have millions of dollars in their pockets. I have never met a fool that is willing to give me a dollar in nothing. Actually, rich guys are too thrifty. I think that someone has to be too fool to pay a single cent in ordinals but at the same time, such a fool shouldn't really be able to buy ordinals because it might be too complicated process for them. I am really confused.

At $100 million per day, I don't think it's a fool. The fools are the people who fall for the Ordinal scam, but since this has been going on for a year, it must be big business. I even heard it on the radio recently, they were explaining that every first satoshi in every block is "special", and the first satoshi after the halving is even more "special". Whoever made this up to get rich is a genius. Evil, but a genius!

Hopefully, "a fool and his money are soon parted".

That's it. I declare Bitcoin broken at the moment
Bitcoin Core recommends 12.04268 mBTC/kvB (12,042 sats per vbyte) to be confirmed within 2 blocks.

You can see the block reward halving reflecting in the transaction fees:


Mempool Goggles shows what caused this:


Blocks now have a 3.125 BTC block reward and 10 BTC transaction fees. And as the above image shows: only a few percent is used by normal Bitcoin users with normal transactions. Spammers literally pay 4 million dollars per hour now to create meaningless Bitcoin dust.

And don't forget that they have been earning much more from transaction fees ever since the Ordinals spam began. And that is going to continue after the halving, plus with the added spam from RUNES. I do agree with NapHappy's logic that some older and unprofitable miners will be shut down. Let's just hope it won't have too big of an impact.

The pre-halving fees have been pretty volatile lately as well. We have had periods where you needed 100 to 150 sat/vByte for a quick confirmation, but right now that's down to 60 sat/vByte.

I guess also the higher fees will mean less miners will turn off after the halving.

Still, I'll bet that the average fees for the 2 weeks post halving will be 50% higher than the average fees for the 2 weeks pre-halving.

Miners must have already calculated in the drop in block reward. Some of them may turn off their older hardware at that point, but I don't expect a significant impact. Besides, it's less than 50% they're "losing". Earlier drops in Bitcoin price (around 80%) had a much larger effect on their earnings. Blocks will be fine.

My logic is that
1. We will see a drop in the hash rate once the halving occurs due to mining being unprofitable for inefficient miners, this will lead to longer block times until the difficulty is adjusted 4 days later. Longer block times means people paying higher fees to get into the next block.

2. At the same time, Runes come into play, also driving up the fees.

3. We are already in a high fee environment, this is just adding to it.

"Brutal" is a subjective term, I just see things getting even worse for a while due to the above.

I haven't been around long enough to understand the nuances of what will drive the difficulty up or down, but if BTC stays above $60k I agree that the difficulty drop won't be drastic.

Why?
First, the difficulty has nothing to do with the amount of spam those guys throw at the chain.
If you think that there will be a massive block slowdown that won't happen in 5 days either, because 2/3 of the period has passed, so even if we are going to see something like 20% down instantly it will only last 6 days out of which 4 are doing the weekend.
Costly, a big clog, maybe, but in no way brutal.

Plus I'm not even convinced about that 20%, we just had 4% up previously, and even right now we're 2% in the green with faster blocks,  as I said in the speculation topic, my bet is on at max 10% during the first adjustment.


Did the same, 14 out of 15 were funded 2 days prior and the only activity on those addresses was one funding tx.
So maybe a casino/cex/something collecting user deposits?

The days after the halving tomorrow and before the difficulty adjustment in about 5 days will be brutal for fees with the Runes added in. It will likely take some weeks after the difficulty adjustment for fees to settle out to a new normal.

The monkey boys have calmed down a bit and the transaction fees are more than twice as cheap right now. But I am not optimistic for the near future. The halving is coming and with it a new monkey protocol on the day of the halving. Bananas will again raise the fees to make Bitcoin unusable for normal people. We will have to wait a long time I am afraid for the perfect opportunities to carry out proper consolidations.

I think that many people don't know about transaction inputs and outputs and when they make a transaction from their wallet, instead of using a coins control feature, they click on max button and send all the coins together.

Probably he needed money, didn't have enough patience to wait for fees to fall down and put all the inputs to send money (I have done that only once when I was super upset about fees and was forced to use Bitcoin).
To be honest, it makes me curious, why people pay so much fees to create ordinals inscriptions. Are thousands of ordinals sold each day? And are they sold so expensively that it worth to pay hundreds and thousands in transaction fees? I have seen ordinals pay x100 and more than its recommended to pay to get transaction confirmed.

Maybe there is a secret sauce that we miss here.

My first assumption was that it's someone who doesn't know what he's doing. It happens: someone has been collecting dust inputs for years, and when he finally decides to spend it, his wallet automatically decides to add a very large transaction fee.

However, in this case, I checked some of the inputs, and all of them were funded earlier this month. It makes me curious why someone would waste so much money this way.

Financial reasons perhaps (ironically), as infrastructure for creating Segwit wallets and transactions is still severely lacking even in 2024 and most companies can't be arsed to hire more engineers to update their systems.

It's one of the things that ZPyWallet tries to solve, but admittedly it's going to take much more than a Python library to create a framework where people can easily use Segwit addresses.