Topic: Axiocoin: Unique Miner - No ASIC/Multipool - Donating@Home - JUST LAUNCHED - page 27. (Read 16143 times)

Next 2 days for sure.

nice coin .. I will follow ..

When you mine through our mining client you're really mining on a BTC multipool.

50% of the BTC raises goes to charity
50% goes toward coin development

Based on your hashrate and some other factors we calculate your payment in Axiocoin and send it to your Axio wallet. By mining Axio you'll be earning Axiocoin, giving money to charities, and helping the Axio economy grow.

@VekTorr
 
There are programs that handle obfuscation. Obfuscation can be cracked but virtualization cannot.
http://www.gapotchenko.com/eazfuscator.net
You can download a trial here, virtualize & obfuscate some code, then try to pull apart with De4Dot or some other program.

Assuming this coin reaches popularity equal to other new successful coins (Vericoin for example) I would probably be able to dump 10-15 BTC worth before the market begins to panic sell.

You don't have to trust anything when you can monitor the blockchain and complain when information isn't posted (about new devs, marketplaces, etc)

The rest of your post is you tearing up anything you can. Much of what you write can be said about any coin ever. This is a simple solution to wasteful mining.

If you believe this is a scam or a crap coin then so be it. Maybe if the concern is large enough we'll release bits of the code that can't be exploited.


I won't be responding to more argumentative posts from you. You've made your point and successfully communicated it in the thread.

I did not really get this ‘theoretical mining’/ ‘useful mining’ thing.
The OP says one will be doing actual mining  and the proceeds will go for donations.

And yet the end users are supposed to expect that someone who doesn't even know how to use Alt-PrintScreen to screencap an individual window is going to be so skilled in code obfuscation and virtualization that none of the HF hackers will be able to reverse-engineer what's been done and destroy the whole system anyway?

There is no such thing as long-term successful security through obscurity.  You either make it truly open source and rely on many eyes to uncover flaws before they can be exploited, or you try to keep it at least partially closed via obfuscation and hope that no one skillful enough considers it worthwhile to take over your system.


A damned terrible way to make money by scamming? It looks like you can't possibly lose.  100% of all actual mining power from the first moment goes into mining altcoins paying out solely to addresses that are 100% in your control, which are then converted into bitcoins at addresses that you also 100% control.  You say that 50% of the proceeds will go towards charities, based on voting that we apparently cannot audit in any way.  Let's say that you do, in fact, choose to take half of the free money that you've been given and donate it to charity.  It would probably even be in your best interest to do so (at least for a while).  50% of a stack of free money is still free money that is 100% in your control, and 100% free from auditing on our part.

That money will be spent to "grow the coin" and attract talent, you claim.  It's still money that was freely dropped on your head out of the sky.  Oh, but in exchange you'll give us Axiocoins out of the 100% pre-mined "vault", which are currently worthless, but not to worry because you've told us you'll be spending the actual money that we gave you (via 100% control over the proceeds of our mining efforts) on turning the currently-zero-worth Axiocoins into something having some actual value.

Tell me again, how is it that you can possibly lose in this circumstance?  Is there any point at which you couldn't simply walk away and keep anything up to 100% of the actual money from the first-half portion of the allocation process (the part where we mine altcoins for you which become bitcoins which become cash)?  You've got a vault full of 100% pre-mined Axiocoins that are worth zero today.  You can't possibly drop below that valuation, so even if the whole thing eventually collapses from accusations of scamming, etc, you've still got control over everything up to that point on the actually-Scrypt-mined leg of the value production chain.

How is that a "terribly bad way" to scam people?  How is this anything other than an IPO of a 100% pre-mined PoS coin where you've spread the IPO out over time, and forced people to incrementally buy into the IPO by donating hashing power to addresses you control, using no permissible client other than the one with code that you've chosen to obfuscate?
 
You've identified your client as "efficient" and yet also completely "plug and play" with no tuning at all.  If you've come up with some magical way to automatically determine the perfect CGMiner 3.7.2 settings for any possible rig that it's run upon, regardless of hardware configuration, then you really do have an innovation there which might be worthy of basing a coin around... but I think it's quite likely that you don't.  So if it's not end-user tunable, then it is inefficient when run on anyone's system where they know parameters for their system which produce a higher MH/s.

But don't worry, it isn't possible that the non-tunable system using obfuscated code is REPORTING a different hash rate than is actually being produced, with some of the difference being allocated to other purposes or anything like that.  We know that because... well, because we just have to trust you.

We also need to trust that 50% is the proper split between charity and "coin growth efforts" that are 100% controlled and decided by you.  We need to trust that the "talent" being "hired" which justifies half of all the incoming revenue isn't simply you when you choose to wear a blue hat instead of a green hat.

If the total amount going to charity is only equal to the amount needed to spend on "growing the coin", it seems to me that either the charities are getting a relatively miniscule amount, or your personally-controlled fund for turning the currently-worthless Axiocoin vault into something quite valuable is heavily over-funded.

Let's assume that you're successful beyond everyone's wildest hopes.  You spend all 50% of those funds that we create for you in the best possible way, and the other 50% reliably goes to the charities exactly as the users want.   Now you've got 100% personal control over a vault of Axiocoins that are now quite valuable, not to mention whatever Axiocoins got allocated to "end user" addresses that you control. Now you liquidate, take the money and run... and no one could do a thing about it except complain after the fact.

All you'd be able to do is "destroy your hard work"?  I'm sure the pile of actual cash that others earned along the way for you wouldn't be able to console you from such a loss.

When do you think you can confirm the launch date?

Interesting idea that will revolutionize the world of Crypto

Interesting concept. New ideas always bring FUD

Thank you, combining mining and charity was a daunting mental challenge. The rest was actually pretty straight forward.

I believe Curecoin goes through the Folding@home pool middleman.

Our solution is much more simple and allows us to donate towards several charities as well as putting back into the economy.

My mistake. By "green" I meant the electricity spent during mining actually did something beyond paying miners off.

In response to the middleman argument:


I think we can both agree that making money while giving to charities is an amazing concept.

The only counter I can really give you about the central aspects is what I listed in the thread. All coins are centralized to an extent, an alarming extent I may add. Up until recently +40-50% of Bitcoin's mining infrastructure was controlled by Ghash and let's not even bring up Gox.

We're not doing any IPOs or personal premines (amounts excluded from total mining for devs). If we make a single malicious move it will be near instantaneously spotted. The worst we can do is destroy our hard work.

I'm sarcastically calling you out on the talking out of both sides of your mouth, with your apparent desire to talk about whichever half of the story benefits the talking point you're addressing at the time, while ignoring the other half of the story which contradicts that same talking point.  You're trying to have your cake after having already eaten it through your design choices.  The only sort of "confidence" that behavior inspires is the belief that it's a confidence game... a scam.

It's a good idea but I prefer Curecoin's implementation where the GPU work goes directly to the charity instead of a middleman.

If we wanted to support charity, why wouldn't we cut out the middleman and simply do multi-pool scrypt mining and donate whatever portions of the proceeds we like to exactly the charities we think are most worthy, without having to go through the highly limited choices of your "voting" portal.

You have an intriguing premise, which seems fatally riddled with holes.

If you really wanted something "green", why not use a proof-of-burn on something like BitCoin as an initial allocation method, and run a truly green PoS algorithm afterwards?  The extra energy consumed from both the initial allocation and the ongoing PoS security would be minimized.

This approach does nothing at all to reduce energy consumption and heat production... it just moves the reason for burning the same energy and creating the same waste heat from the control of the end user to your own control instead, and then we're supposed to trust you that you'll fairly allocate the new PoS coin which has been "technically 100% pre-mined" to the end users.

It's 100% in your personal control, with accountability removed through obfuscated code.

Yes, I get that you want money in order to be able to grow and promote the coin.  Why burn extra electricity to make that money when you want to end up with a PoS coin?

If we don't protect the miner code any semi-skilled user from HF could come in and destroy the whole system.

About the other stuff, you can follow the movement of money on the blockchain. So as long as you trust that you're good.

About the hashrate you can compare the money we claim to make and the profitability rates at https://www.multipool.us/


I can see why you think this might be a scam but it's a damn terrible way to make money by scamming especially since we're giving away over half to coin efforts + charity.  

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I assume you're trolling with the rest but we can easily incorporate x11/scrypt-n by giving users the option to mine on those types of multipools. In fact, you'll probably see it in the first update (don't quote me on that lol).

About the anti-ASIC bit. ASICs need specialized mining clients (modified versions of cgminer). Our miner only runs cgminer 3.7.2 (GPU only)

So you're going to obfuscate portions of the code for "security" reasons.

And we're supposed to trust you that 100% of the hashing power that we'll be supplying entirely to your control is going to be allocated to nothing but mining altcoins, which are all 100% transparently accountable to the end-user (because you say so), and that nothing will be diverted via the multi-pool sales to Bitcoin addresses OTHER THAN the ones you publish (because... trust you).

And then we're to trust you that the centralized servers that you have total control over are going to properly account for and allocate the equivalent of that amount of hashing power to the end user's new currency creation, which is not pre-mined and also 100% pre-mined at the same time (because... trust you), and that the figures for the particular share of total hashing power that you're getting aren't distorted by false reporting of hash rates from dummy sockpuppet accounts controlled by you (because... trust you).

And we should trust you that the contradictions between whether it's entirely ASIC-resistant because you're only running Scrypt (but will also support X11 and Scrypt-N but not support it because those will devolve into CPU-only eventually) are no big deal, nor is it an issue that you're marketing it as a "green" coin while simultaenously turning GPUs into giant space heaters in the middle of summer (which is about as anti-green as you can get) by committing to only running (and not only running) Scrypt.

Yeah.  Definitely sounds legit.

Yeah, I can see why it's so important to obfuscate what the code does. 

Yes, I'm in! Cant wait til launch..

Keep work Dev..

Clever as shit


Don't screw up the launch pls

There is no IPO or premine here.

The BTC addresses will be made public.

50% gets donated
http://axiocoin.org/vote.html
50% goes towards exchanges, marketplaces, and buy support

Mining this coin makes you money and helps us inject funds back into the economy + we give half towards charities