Topic: B - page 8. (Read 21961 times)

"Shady" is reserved name by Shakaru, have to come up with something else :-)

I simply get annoyed when people use words like TERMS, LAWYERS, and LAWS without have a clue about them. Remember our first altercation.


Disclaimer: I don't any money with Goat. I've dealt with him once awhile ago.

+1. Just let this fiasco end.

No. It's also not reasonable to threaten to close all the assets (after fairly quickly freezing them) when Goat's already said he's not liable for you creating terms of service out of thin air, then denying service for not complying with those made-up terms. You'd effectively ensure his assets "default." Already, prices of his assets have been plummeting over this, which personally affects me.

This is a silly argument and the stakes are too high. What's more ridiculous is that Goat's already provided gov't ID to investors (honestly, I'm surprised nobody's just submitted them to Nefario behind Goat's back, yet). Neither Goat's nor Nefario's arguments are reasonable given the stakes, and the whole thing's meaningless. Both Nefario and Goat are set in their ways, and the lines have been drawn. Nobody's going to change -- you've both dug in. Either GLBSE or Goat-related assets will lose credibility, and most likely, both will, quite significantly. In either case, they both negatively affect each other, which negatively affects me -- this's gone on long enough.


Goat: Please just upload your gov't ID. IIRC, you do not need to provide anything beyond that. You've provided it to others without this drama. Granted, they didn't freeze your accounts anywhere and create a lot of FUD through that action, but it's detrimental to allow it to continue. I swear to the King of All Fuck I will stop investing in your projects if you don't submit ID to Nefario within a timely manner.

Nefario: Please don't allow these situations to happen in the future. State in the terms you demand ID prior to asset creation, and demand it from all current asset-creators, not just when the asset's become large in your mind and you suddenly have a whim to collect ID on the asset-creator. I swear to the King of All Fuck I will stop investing in assets listed on your site if you don't unfreeze Goat's assets within a timely manner.

I question your unconditional support of Goat's shady actions...
Happened before, it's happening now again.

From Nefario, there is recent attempts to break into his account. That would be partially regarded as suspicious IMHO.For what I know, the actual Goat might be sleeping while the hacker are using his account.   I don't see why Nefario has a motive to cheat here; it's not like he gets all the proceeds from Goat's account. He is even ruining his own business as Goat is the biggest asset issuer on GLBSE. Think of the fees he'll lose if everyone's apprehensive to trade Goat's stocks.

Goat, just verify and get over with it. This is starting to sound bad for everyone.

I question legality of GLBSE. In which country did you register the company. Do you understand that when you deal with IPO (at least in USA), you need to have all kinds of approvals, licenses and etc?

The guy has taken thousands of BTC of investors money, there were recent attempts to break into his account, he is the largest asset issuer on GLBSE. Is it so unreasonable to ask for proof of ID?

Are you sure. Did you check the sign up process, did at any point of time did you agree to the terms? The link on the bottom isn't a valid agreement.

The ones defending Goat and his immaturity will all be scammed... And I won't feel sorry for them.

"These terms and conditions are subject to change without notice."

You have agreed to that too.

Because the term were changed less than a month and most likely weren't communicated to customers. He can change terms tomorrow at his will.

Where is "Bitcoin Global" registered?


Not in Ireland - http://www.cro.ie/search/CompanySearch.aspx

I see no violation of the terms. And can hardly believe Goat is still not complying. If I was a shareholder, my trust in him would be low now too.

It clearly states "We may at our discretion, ask asset creators to provide proof of identity, address, phone number and more, until we are sufficiently satisfied. Said information will be held securely offline and not shared with any third party. We reserve the right to freeze trading of the asset and the asset creators account for failure to provide requested details or in the event of suspected fraud."

He hasn’t failed yet or been suspected to be a fraudster by Nefario, has he?

So what exactly is the problem?

Goat, I think you should just show your id to Nefario.
You are causing too big a deal over nothing.
If your BTC gets distributed to us, then its a bad deal as we only get 0.02 per share, and you lose your bitcoins. Its a lose-lose situation.

So Nefario, you are violating the terms of your own site?  You haven't stopped the trading in any of the TyGrr assets.

Further, you can't really say it's voluntary - as your terms say, you can demand whatever until you are "sufficiently satisfied" - you can demand pictures of his dog if you want!  If verification is truly voluntary, you should unlock his account right now since he doesn't want to send you his personal information.  If it's not voluntary, stop pretending that it is and just state in your terms that asset creators must be verified.  If thats the case, you should lock all the non-verified asset creation accounts immediately.  Otherwise this is nothing more than an obvious crusade against Goat because he hurt your feelings.

This whole thing is ridiculous.  You are two grown men, and you'd think you'd be able to figure out some sort of compromise.  Meanwhile the investors in various TyGrr products sit here and watch our money circle the drain.  

That bitcoin belongs to your shareholders. And if you don't comply that is where it will be returned to.

Since December last year I have been warning GLBSE users and asset issuers that ID verification will be introduced for asset issuers, on a voluntary basis.

From our terms, that have included this for nearly a month.

Who is stealing?

Since his public announcement goat has not contacted me.

What to do if he sits there with his arms crossed?

Goat didn't care about the legality of using GLBSE when he started, so if any law has been broken it has already been so for months.

But seriously, what would you advise me to do if he doesn't comply or communicate the issue?

I'm open to suggestions.

I hadn't gotten around to mentioning this in the locked thread, but it is relevant now based on the posted action.  This quote from the GLBSE 2.0 thread:and the full text from GLBSE 2.0:This doesn't look like it was written by someone who speaks any form of English as their primary language, and it lacks important grammar and punctuation.  However, my understanding of it was that it meant something like this:You really need to edit this before you even consider taking any action like the one mentioned earlier in this thread (and quoted first in this post), and even then, considering the system was still worded like this well after Goat's account was locked, you need to be very cautious about any decision regarding his account.

Don't get me wrong, your resolution seems reasonable if he stops communicating completely or tells you to implement it as he will be abandoning GLBSE (in which case I would assume that he would certainly pay, but don't see how TyGrr [which actually has non-BTC assets involved] could be properly and fairly handled [whereas TyGrr-Bank and TyGrr-BOT are just bonds and as such should be possible to pay off at face value]).